How Likely Are You To Take The Covid Vaccine?

Garrymanilow said:

Redskin said:

Peanuts and a couple of others have posted what are routinely dismissed as ‘anti-vax’ comments on here, the content of which has resulted in the mod who started the thread to consider closing it as well as others who have suggested the same.

Peanuts, in particular, has been subjected to the usual crass and thoughtless accusations of Conspiracy Theorist; disappeared down a rabbit hole; did a horse kick you in the head  nonsense simply because he an alternative view to the indignant majority.

The lazy and desperate discrediting of any post that offends the majority as ‘Fake News’ is rife. 

In the past on the now defunct Covid thread, I would post data from the Government’s ONS site, but as the stats could sometimes prove to be unsettling for some, they would be lolled. Facts. From the Government’s ONS site…
Professors of medicine, infinitely more qualified than anyone on here, were maligned by the mob because they failed to comply with the vaccine orthodoxy. And still are as evidenced on this thread.
Fake news: Safe and effective.

There is nothing new in this collective hounding of an alternative stance, but that people are talking of censorship - which the closing down of the thread would effectively  be - then that is a different matter.
 

What I fail to understand is why anyone who is so confident in their own position and finds that of the ‘opposition’ so preposterous that it can be summarily dismissed as being the thoughts of a deluded, Flat Earther, ‘anti vaxxer’ etc should feel sufficiently threatened to demand their views are censored.
And spare me the simpering, pearl-clutching view that a post on a football forum that is sceptical/critical of anything vaccine related is in any way remotely dangerous. It is not, and only a person of no mettle and prone to bouts of public histrionics would find it so.

If any danger exists, it is in the talk of censorship.

Peanuts has been maligned because he posts individual links and videos every few days claiming that they show the vaccine is bad. Every single one of those has been debunked, with the 'experts' being outed as either completely out of their mind and unqualified or obviously financially motivated to downplay the effective vaccine in favour of their own brand. Peanuts never, ever responds to the debunking, just ignores it and rolls on posting the same type of stuff and never acknowledging the responses. He has responded exactly once on this thread with a link to a journal. That journal was then completely eviscerated by another poster and surprise surprise Peanuts went quiet again. That's why people get laughed at, because it's been nearly four years and loons are still posting easily debunked garbage and claiming it's a fact. I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum. It's because there aren't any facts in favour of your argument, and as you evidenced in your next post . That's why you lot get lols and we're genuinely concerned a horse has been on a head-kicking rampage. It's not censorship, it's the realisation that we are going to have to hear these daft theories forever because apparently a characteristic of being the type of person to fall for them is the inability to acknowledge any response and learn something new.

ME14addick said:

Strange that some people are willing to think that a vaccine is the cause of their ill health, but refuse to consider that it might be the virus itself that has caused their health to deteriorate.

SARS-Cov-2 is a new virus and less than 4 years in circulation, it's far too soon to be able to rule out that it won't cause illness in future, in those who have had a Covid infection.

This week's revelations from the Covid Inquiry are breath taking and it should really result in charges against those who caused far too many unnecessary deaths by their dreadful decisions and indecision.

Redskin said:

Garrymanilow said:

Redskin said:

Peanuts and a couple of others have posted what are routinely dismissed as ‘anti-vax’ comments on here, the content of which has resulted in the mod who started the thread to consider closing it as well as others who have suggested the same.

Peanuts, in particular, has been subjected to the usual crass and thoughtless accusations of Conspiracy Theorist; disappeared down a rabbit hole; did a horse kick you in the head  nonsense simply because he an alternative view to the indignant majority.

The lazy and desperate discrediting of any post that offends the majority as ‘Fake News’ is rife. 

In the past on the now defunct Covid thread, I would post data from the Government’s ONS site, but as the stats could sometimes prove to be unsettling for some, they would be lolled. Facts. From the Government’s ONS site…
Professors of medicine, infinitely more qualified than anyone on here, were maligned by the mob because they failed to comply with the vaccine orthodoxy. And still are as evidenced on this thread.
Fake news: Safe and effective.

There is nothing new in this collective hounding of an alternative stance, but that people are talking of censorship - which the closing down of the thread would effectively  be - then that is a different matter.
 

What I fail to understand is why anyone who is so confident in their own position and finds that of the ‘opposition’ so preposterous that it can be summarily dismissed as being the thoughts of a deluded, Flat Earther, ‘anti vaxxer’ etc should feel sufficiently threatened to demand their views are censored.
And spare me the simpering, pearl-clutching view that a post on a football forum that is sceptical/critical of anything vaccine related is in any way remotely dangerous. It is not, and only a person of no mettle and prone to bouts of public histrionics would find it so.

If any danger exists, it is in the talk of censorship.

Peanuts has been maligned because he posts individual links and videos every few days claiming that they show the vaccine is bad. Every single one of those has been debunked, with the 'experts' being outed as either completely out of their mind and unqualified or obviously financially motivated to downplay the effective vaccine in favour of their own brand. Peanuts never, ever responds to the debunking, just ignores it and rolls on posting the same type of stuff and never acknowledging the responses. He has responded exactly once on this thread with a link to a journal. That journal was then completely eviscerated by another poster and surprise surprise Peanuts went quiet again. That's why people get laughed at, because it's been nearly four years and loons are still posting easily debunked garbage and claiming it's a fact. I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum. It's because there aren't any facts in favour of your argument, and as you evidenced in your next post . That's why you lot get lols and we're genuinely concerned a horse has been on a head-kicking rampage. It's not censorship, it's the realisation that we are going to have to hear these daft theories forever because apparently a characteristic of being the type of person to fall for them is the inability to acknowledge any response and learn something new.

I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum

Let’s deal with this puerile, ad hominem doggerel : firstly, this isn’t what I wrote and bears no relation to anything I wrote in the post, so don’t put it  in quotation marks. 

You’ve obviously  failed to grasp the very simple point made with regard to people lolling posts I made that contained data/stats from the Government ONS site, so here it is made simple:
vaxxer reads data on ONS site that confirms his bias - all good
Vaxxer reads data on ONS site posted by someone who chose not to be vaccinated that confounds his bias. He experiences mild cognitive dissonance, doesn’t like the feeling so hits the lol button and is later comforted by the fact that others have done the same.

As for still not understanding the purpose of the vaccine,  I understand it only too well. Its purpose wasn’t to prevent transmission or contagion, just, like, if you got it the symptoms 
wouldn’t be as bad and you won’t die, probably, it’s saved millions of lives, etc

SAVE your granny/lives/ the NHS; ring any bells? the inference is writ large…

That oft quoted ‘saved millions of lives’ may or may not be true, but as it is a wholly unsubstantiated claim with no empirical data to support it and is dependent on nothing more than modeling… 

As for censorship on here, I realise it no longer matters; the Covid thread was effectively censored, but so what? I am as entrenched in my position as the vaxxers are in theirs and it’s become as tiresome as it is futile, so I will censor myself. Good luck, all

Friend Or Defoe said:

buckshee said:

ME14addick said:

Strange that some people are willing to think that a vaccine is the cause of their ill health, but refuse to consider that it might be the virus itself that has caused their health to deteriorate.

SARS-Cov-2 is a new virus and less than 4 years in circulation, it's far too soon to be able to rule out that it won't cause illness in future, in those who have had a Covid infection.

This week's revelations from the Covid Inquiry are breath taking and it should really result in charges against those who caused far too many unnecessary deaths by their dreadful decisions and indecision.

Also strange that people think the main reason for their ill health is Covid rather than their poor health levels in the first place. 

Also strange that our government and others worldwide would rather lecture people on the benefits of a almost totally untested vaccine than on the benefits of living a healthy lifestyle and that just simply taking vitamin D may well help. 

There was a claim above that it showed cardiovascular side effects during phase 2/3 of clinical trials. That got taken to pieces. Now you're clamming it was almost totally (??) untested.

Plenty of examples of fit and healthy people dying of covid.

buckshee said:

Friend Or Defoe said:

buckshee said:

ME14addick said:

Strange that some people are willing to think that a vaccine is the cause of their ill health, but refuse to consider that it might be the virus itself that has caused their health to deteriorate.

SARS-Cov-2 is a new virus and less than 4 years in circulation, it's far too soon to be able to rule out that it won't cause illness in future, in those who have had a Covid infection.

This week's revelations from the Covid Inquiry are breath taking and it should really result in charges against those who caused far too many unnecessary deaths by their dreadful decisions and indecision.

Also strange that people think the main reason for their ill health is Covid rather than their poor health levels in the first place. 

Also strange that our government and others worldwide would rather lecture people on the benefits of a almost totally untested vaccine than on the benefits of living a healthy lifestyle and that just simply taking vitamin D may well help. 

There was a claim above that it showed cardiovascular side effects during phase 2/3 of clinical trials. That got taken to pieces. Now you're clamming it was almost totally (??) untested.

Plenty of examples of fit and healthy people dying of covid.

How long are vaccines usually tested for? I’m no expert but I’ll bet it’s a hell of a lot more than the couple of months these ones were so yes compared to all other ones pretty much untested. 

Big_Bad_World said:

ShootersHillGuru said:

Redskin said:

Garrymanilow said:

Redskin said:

Peanuts and a couple of others have posted what are routinely dismissed as ‘anti-vax’ comments on here, the content of which has resulted in the mod who started the thread to consider closing it as well as others who have suggested the same.

Peanuts, in particular, has been subjected to the usual crass and thoughtless accusations of Conspiracy Theorist; disappeared down a rabbit hole; did a horse kick you in the head  nonsense simply because he an alternative view to the indignant majority.

The lazy and desperate discrediting of any post that offends the majority as ‘Fake News’ is rife. 

In the past on the now defunct Covid thread, I would post data from the Government’s ONS site, but as the stats could sometimes prove to be unsettling for some, they would be lolled. Facts. From the Government’s ONS site…
Professors of medicine, infinitely more qualified than anyone on here, were maligned by the mob because they failed to comply with the vaccine orthodoxy. And still are as evidenced on this thread.
Fake news: Safe and effective.

There is nothing new in this collective hounding of an alternative stance, but that people are talking of censorship - which the closing down of the thread would effectively  be - then that is a different matter.
 

What I fail to understand is why anyone who is so confident in their own position and finds that of the ‘opposition’ so preposterous that it can be summarily dismissed as being the thoughts of a deluded, Flat Earther, ‘anti vaxxer’ etc should feel sufficiently threatened to demand their views are censored.
And spare me the simpering, pearl-clutching view that a post on a football forum that is sceptical/critical of anything vaccine related is in any way remotely dangerous. It is not, and only a person of no mettle and prone to bouts of public histrionics would find it so.

If any danger exists, it is in the talk of censorship.

Peanuts has been maligned because he posts individual links and videos every few days claiming that they show the vaccine is bad. Every single one of those has been debunked, with the 'experts' being outed as either completely out of their mind and unqualified or obviously financially motivated to downplay the effective vaccine in favour of their own brand. Peanuts never, ever responds to the debunking, just ignores it and rolls on posting the same type of stuff and never acknowledging the responses. He has responded exactly once on this thread with a link to a journal. That journal was then completely eviscerated by another poster and surprise surprise Peanuts went quiet again. That's why people get laughed at, because it's been nearly four years and loons are still posting easily debunked garbage and claiming it's a fact. I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum. It's because there aren't any facts in favour of your argument, and as you evidenced in your next post . That's why you lot get lols and we're genuinely concerned a horse has been on a head-kicking rampage. It's not censorship, it's the realisation that we are going to have to hear these daft theories forever because apparently a characteristic of being the type of person to fall for them is the inability to acknowledge any response and learn something new.

I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum

Let’s deal with this puerile, ad hominem doggerel : firstly, this isn’t what I wrote and bears no relation to anything I wrote in the post, so don’t put it  in quotation marks. 

You’ve obviously  failed to grasp the very simple point made with regard to people lolling posts I made that contained data/stats from the Government ONS site, so here it is made simple:
vaxxer reads data on ONS site that confirms his bias - all good
Vaxxer reads data on ONS site posted by someone who chose not to be vaccinated that confounds his bias. He experiences mild cognitive dissonance, doesn’t like the feeling so hits the lol button and is later comforted by the fact that others have done the same.

As for still not understanding the purpose of the vaccine,  I understand it only too well. Its purpose wasn’t to prevent transmission or contagion, just, like, if you got it the symptoms 
wouldn’t be as bad and you won’t die, probably, it’s saved millions of lives, etc

SAVE your granny/lives/ the NHS; ring any bells? the inference is writ large…

That oft quoted ‘saved millions of lives’ may or may not be true, but as it is a wholly unsubstantiated claim with no empirical data to support it and is dependent on nothing more than modeling… 

As for censorship on here, I realise it no longer matters; the Covid thread was effectively censored, but so what? I am as entrenched in my position as the vaxxers are in theirs and it’s become as tiresome as it is futile, so I will censor myself. Good luck, all

A very small observation here. You use the term “vaxxer” to describe those of an opinion opposed to yours. I don’t and although I can’t speak for anyone else consider myself a “vaxxer”. That seems to me to imply that I actively support vaccines in the same evangelical way you oppose them. I don’t. I follow the overwhelming scientific evidence and trust the science and scientists and more importantly the doctors who tell me that receiving the vaccine is a good idea. 

To be fair, the term anti-vaxxer has been used extensively to malign anyone that shows any push back against just the Covid vaccine, with nobody making the valid point you make above in defence of that group. It seems to have taken on a bit of a back slapping mindset.

It does work both ways but everyone seems okay with the 'anti-vax' label but not the 'vaxxer' labelling when the methodology apllied is identical.

FWIW I'm neither pro nor against. I'm abivalent to it all now, but it is interesting that one label is seen as okay and the other isn't.

Wheresmeticket? said:

I love it when people use phrases like "ad hominem" instead of "personal".  If your argument doesn't hold water, using Latin might impress, eh?

Redskin said:

Garrymanilow said:

Redskin said:

Peanuts and a couple of others have posted what are routinely dismissed as ‘anti-vax’ comments on here, the content of which has resulted in the mod who started the thread to consider closing it as well as others who have suggested the same.

Peanuts, in particular, has been subjected to the usual crass and thoughtless accusations of Conspiracy Theorist; disappeared down a rabbit hole; did a horse kick you in the head  nonsense simply because he an alternative view to the indignant majority.

The lazy and desperate discrediting of any post that offends the majority as ‘Fake News’ is rife. 

In the past on the now defunct Covid thread, I would post data from the Government’s ONS site, but as the stats could sometimes prove to be unsettling for some, they would be lolled. Facts. From the Government’s ONS site…
Professors of medicine, infinitely more qualified than anyone on here, were maligned by the mob because they failed to comply with the vaccine orthodoxy. And still are as evidenced on this thread.
Fake news: Safe and effective.

There is nothing new in this collective hounding of an alternative stance, but that people are talking of censorship - which the closing down of the thread would effectively  be - then that is a different matter.
 

What I fail to understand is why anyone who is so confident in their own position and finds that of the ‘opposition’ so preposterous that it can be summarily dismissed as being the thoughts of a deluded, Flat Earther, ‘anti vaxxer’ etc should feel sufficiently threatened to demand their views are censored.
And spare me the simpering, pearl-clutching view that a post on a football forum that is sceptical/critical of anything vaccine related is in any way remotely dangerous. It is not, and only a person of no mettle and prone to bouts of public histrionics would find it so.

If any danger exists, it is in the talk of censorship.

Peanuts has been maligned because he posts individual links and videos every few days claiming that they show the vaccine is bad. Every single one of those has been debunked, with the 'experts' being outed as either completely out of their mind and unqualified or obviously financially motivated to downplay the effective vaccine in favour of their own brand. Peanuts never, ever responds to the debunking, just ignores it and rolls on posting the same type of stuff and never acknowledging the responses. He has responded exactly once on this thread with a link to a journal. That journal was then completely eviscerated by another poster and surprise surprise Peanuts went quiet again. That's why people get laughed at, because it's been nearly four years and loons are still posting easily debunked garbage and claiming it's a fact. I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum. It's because there aren't any facts in favour of your argument, and as you evidenced in your next post . That's why you lot get lols and we're genuinely concerned a horse has been on a head-kicking rampage. It's not censorship, it's the realisation that we are going to have to hear these daft theories forever because apparently a characteristic of being the type of person to fall for them is the inability to acknowledge any response and learn something new.

I notice you haven't posted a single faclt up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum

Let’s deal with this puerile, ad hominem doggerel : firstly, this isn’t what I wrote and bears no relation to anything I wrote in the post, so don’t put it  in quotation marks. 

You’ve obviously  failed to grasp the very simple point made with regard to people lolling posts I made that contained data/stats from the Government ONS site, so here it is made simple:
vaxxer reads data on ONS site that confirms his bias - all good
Vaxxer reads data on ONS site posted by someone who chose not to be vaccinated that confounds his bias. He experiences mild cognitive dissonance, doesn’t like the feeling so hits the lol button and is later comforted by the fact that others have done the same.

As for still not understanding the purpose of the vaccine,  I understand it only too well. Its purpose wasn’t to prevent transmission or contagion, just, like, if you got it the symptoms 
wouldn’t be as bad and you won’t die, probably, it’s saved millions of lives, etc

SAVE your granny/lives/ the NHS; ring any bells? the inference is writ large…

That oft quoted ‘saved millions of lives’ may or may not be true, but as it is a wholly unsubstantiated claim with no empirical data to support it and is dependent on nothing more than modeling… 

As for censorship on here, I realise it no longer matters; the Covid thread was effectively censored, but so what? I am as entrenched in my position as the vaxxers are in theirs and it’s become as tiresome as it is futile, so I will censor myself. Good luck, all

Redskin said:

Friend Or Defoe said:

Why not respond to the points raised rather than play the victim?

I have done in the past on the Covid thread but realised that it was ultimately as pointless a process as trying to convince me to have a supposed vaccine that prevented neither contagion nor transmission of a virus.
As for the hoary old cliché of playing the victim, I have said more than once than I do not consider myself a victim; it is the people who have been coerced, threatened, lied to and frightened into taking a ‘vaccine’ whom I consider the victims. 

They’ve been had through no fault of their own.

JiMMy 85 said:

misplaced trust in charlatans, fraudsters and maniacs. 

Scoham said:

charltonkeston said:

cafcfan said:

Friend Or Defoe said:

WellingWill said:

I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.

How do explain the below? Air is cleaner now than in 1770?

Shit, if I've read that graph right, I should be dead.

The average person didn't get get his/hers 3 score and ten for the best part of 200 years. Very grim even in most of our lifetimes.

The average was brought down by the high volume of infant deaths. For people who reached adulthood they had a good chance of living into old age.

Friend Or Defoe said:

Scoham said:

Scoham said:

charltonkeston said:

cafcfan said:

Friend Or Defoe said:

WellingWill said:

I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.

How do explain the below? Air is cleaner now than in 1770?

Shit, if I've read that graph right, I should be dead.

The average person didn't get get his/hers 3 score and ten for the best part of 200 years. Very grim even in most of our lifetimes.

The average was brought down by the high volume of infant deaths. For people who reached adulthood they had a good chance of living into old age.

That got a LOL - it's not something I've made up, there's plenty of evidence and explanations out there. As an example:

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/lifeexpectancies/articles/howhaslifeexpectancychangedovertime/2015-09-09

In the 1840s around 15% of babies died before their first birthday compared with 0.4% in 2011, demonstrating the vast improvements made in reducing infant mortality.

If you call making it 60 as living to old age, according to that graph if you make it to 18 in 2011 you are expected to live to 80.

buckshee said:

ME14addick said:

Strange that some people are willing to think that a vaccine is the cause of their ill health, but refuse to consider that it might be the virus itself that has caused their health to deteriorate.

SARS-Cov-2 is a new virus and less than 4 years in circulation, it's far too soon to be able to rule out that it won't cause illness in future, in those who have had a Covid infection.

This week's revelations from the Covid Inquiry are breath taking and it should really result in charges against those who caused far too many unnecessary deaths by their dreadful decisions and indecision.

Also strange that people think the main reason for their ill health is Covid rather than their poor health levels in the first place. 

Also strange that our government and others worldwide would rather lecture people on the benefits of a almost totally untested vaccine than on the benefits of living a healthy lifestyle and that just simply taking vitamin D may well help.