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How Likely Are You To Take The Covid Vaccine?
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On what basis are your friends and family attributing their ill health to the jab? How have they established a causal link between the jabs and these health issues? Or does it all fall into the traditional 'Well, it stands to reason dunnit' argument?WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.4 -
What you have proposed to do is good but it will not protect you from a novel virus, you have no natural immunity. As for your family and friends. I sorry for them if at all true but you have just proved the rule of conspiracy theorists that I mentioned earlier. They always know or know of someone who has suffered from the vaccine.WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.
You are not a messenger being shot, unless you can in some way back up you claims with something other than wordy nonsense.1 -
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How do explain the below? Air is cleaner now than in 1770?WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.
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It's on Facebook mate and the bloke down the pub said.Rizzo said:
On what basis are your friends and family attributing their ill health to the jab? How have they established a causal link between the jabs and these health issues? Or does it all fall into the traditional 'Well, it stands to reason dunnit' argument?WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.2 -
That's almost word for word what my friend said immediately before Covid got him. RIP Dave.WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.0 -
I prefer to too, we all do. In real life though we’ve found we need to intervene. Like the way measles cases have gone up massive since people started to become vaccine sceptics again. Odd that innit!?WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.
Also, to counter your claims none of my friends and family have any health issues they are attributing to the jab - not one. Though I have had good work performance since I had my jabs, and multiple pay rises and bonuses, so this must be a positive side effect of the jab. That’s how it works isn’t it?5 -
Many of your friends attribute their ill health to to “the jab” !!! Well of course I take you at your word but I’m sure I probably know about as many people as you do and I don’t know a single one that has voiced an opinion that the jab has caused them issues. Hard to square that circle isn’t it. Maybe my circle of acquaintances are more healthy than yours ?WellingWill said:I prefer to rely on my natural immune system which l look after with diet,fresh air and excersise.l will not compromise it with experimental drugs.l have never had covid although many of my friends and family are now having ill health which they attribute to the jab.lt seems that people would rather shoot the messenger than admit they have been had.6 -
Must admit I had my first reaction to the moderna vaccine last week, think that's how it's spelt, anyway it will not put me off in the future.0
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Peanuts and a couple of others have posted what are routinely dismissed as ‘anti-vax’ comments on here, the content of which has resulted in the mod who started the thread to consider closing it as well as others who have suggested the same.Peanuts, in particular, has been subjected to the usual crass and thoughtless accusations of Conspiracy Theorist; disappeared down a rabbit hole; did a horse kick you in the head nonsense simply because he an alternative view to the indignant majority.
The lazy and desperate discrediting of any post that offends the majority as ‘Fake News’ is rife.In the past on the now defunct Covid thread, I would post data from the Government’s ONS site, but as the stats could sometimes prove to be unsettling for some, they would be lolled. Facts. From the Government’s ONS site…
Professors of medicine, infinitely more qualified than anyone on here, were maligned by the mob because they failed to comply with the vaccine orthodoxy. And still are as evidenced on this thread.
Fake news: Safe and effective.There is nothing new in this collective hounding of an alternative stance, but that people are talking of censorship - which the closing down of the thread would effectively be - then that is a different matter.
What I fail to understand is why anyone who is so confident in their own position and finds that of the ‘opposition’ so preposterous that it can be summarily dismissed as being the thoughts of a deluded, Flat Earther, ‘anti vaxxer’ etc should feel sufficiently threatened to demand their views are censored.
And spare me the simpering, pearl-clutching view that a post on a football forum that is sceptical/critical of anything vaccine related is in any way remotely dangerous. It is not, and only a person of no mettle and prone to bouts of public histrionics would find it so.If any danger exists, it is in the talk of censorship.9 - Sponsored links:
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Is the Earth flat?
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Seems to me that peanuts was posting an alternative view that got destroyed by reasoned argument, not just the ad hominem attacks and censorship you are suggesting6
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Why not respond to the points raised rather than play the victim?6
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I have done in the past on the Covid thread but realised that it was ultimately as pointless a process as trying to convince me to have a supposed vaccine that prevented neither contagion nor transmission of a virus.Friend Or Defoe said:Why not respond to the points raised rather than play the victim?
As for the hoary old cliché of playing the victim, I have said more than once than I do not consider myself a victim; it is the people who have been coerced, threatened, lied to and frightened into taking a ‘vaccine’ whom I consider the victims.They’ve been had through no fault of their own.3 -
Boris Johnson asked scientists if hair dryer could kill Covid, says ex-aide https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67287003
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The current events at the Covid enquiry are genuinely shocking.
I imagine everybody who voted for him were comforted back then when Johnson said his government were going to put their arms around the nation.
They would repeat he got the big calls right.
RIP Seb Lewis. I often remember you with a smile.7 -
Ironic that the majority of Tory voters are the same demographic as those their beloved Boris callously attempted, some would say succeeded, to abandon to the tender mercies of Darwin.1
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The death rate in British care homes was 13 x higher than in German care homes. That’s a stat I’m going to investigate further. If it stands up to scrutiny then I think a charge of criminal negligence could be justified against Matt Hancock at the very least.6
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No one is claiming it prevents transmission. If you read the counter arguments they're saying it's lowers the chance of death and the vaccine doesn't causing cardiovascular issues to everyone that receives it.Redskin said:
I have done in the past on the Covid thread but realised that it was ultimately as pointless a process as trying to convince me to have a supposed vaccine that prevented neither contagion nor transmission of a virus.Friend Or Defoe said:Why not respond to the points raised rather than play the victim?
As for the hoary old cliché of playing the victim, I have said more than once than I do not consider myself a victim; it is the people who have been coerced, threatened, lied to and frightened into taking a ‘vaccine’ whom I consider the victims.They’ve been had through no fault of their own.6 -
I do have evidence, but it goes to another school…you stopped posting facts because they got lol’d? Talk about a lack of mettle.As for censorship, it was mentioned by two posters then dismissed.2
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It’s impossible to prevent someone contracting a virus. Being infected is as simple as breathing in and with some viruses even less. Stopping spread is not the primary purpose of a vaccine. The primary purpose is to prep the bodies own immune system to more speedily recognise the virus and produce antibodies to therefore hopefully stop it taking complete hold and minimise its pathogenic effect. That’s exactly what we saw with the Covid vaccines. The severity of infection has a myriad of complications ranging from viral load to the individual’s own immune response. Do some people experience adverse reactions to the vaccines, yes, we knew that but there are more that suffer worse both short and long term morbidities from having had Covid.20
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My wife's niece was involved in setting up and running of the clinical trials of one of the vaccines for a university. She is one of the brightest, yet most down to earth, open and honest people I know.
She has a young family of her own but she worked all the hours available, with her team, during the vaccine development to run the trials that would normally take them years to set up and run. No corners were cut whatsoever, but the funding (and volunteers) that might normally not be there or take ages to source now was. We threw the kitchen sink at the pandemic.
The idea the she is part of some evil, widespread conspiracy to con the public into taking something she knew, or saw, was harming them is as stupid as it is insulting to her, her colleagues and everyone else involved in the development and delivery of vaccines that have so self evidently saved millions of lives.
I'm sorry, but anyone undermining the extraordinary effort of all those involved is deserving of every moment of scorn for their dangerous views.27 -
Not likely unless there is some huge surge in cases alongside a super evil variant.
This is still the correct thread for this answer, isn't it?1 -
Peanuts has been maligned because he posts individual links and videos every few days claiming that they show the vaccine is bad. Every single one of those has been debunked, with the 'experts' being outed as either completely out of their mind and unqualified or obviously financially motivated to downplay the effective vaccine in favour of their own brand. Peanuts never, ever responds to the debunking, just ignores it and rolls on posting the same type of stuff and never acknowledging the responses. He has responded exactly once on this thread with a link to a journal. That journal was then completely eviscerated by another poster and surprise surprise Peanuts went quiet again. That's why people get laughed at, because it's been nearly four years and loons are still posting easily debunked garbage and claiming it's a fact. I notice you haven't posted a single fact up there in your big 'everything is so unfair, why do people point out lies are lies, it's censorship' tantrum. It's because there aren't any facts in favour of your argument, and as you evidenced in your next post you still don't actually understand the purpose of the vaccine despite nearly four years of people trying to explain it to you. That's why you lot get lols and we're genuinely concerned a horse has been on a head-kicking rampage. It's not censorship, it's the realisation that we are going to have to hear these daft theories forever because apparently a characteristic of being the type of person to fall for them is the inability to acknowledge any response and learn something new.Redskin said:Peanuts and a couple of others have posted what are routinely dismissed as ‘anti-vax’ comments on here, the content of which has resulted in the mod who started the thread to consider closing it as well as others who have suggested the same.Peanuts, in particular, has been subjected to the usual crass and thoughtless accusations of Conspiracy Theorist; disappeared down a rabbit hole; did a horse kick you in the head nonsense simply because he an alternative view to the indignant majority.
The lazy and desperate discrediting of any post that offends the majority as ‘Fake News’ is rife.In the past on the now defunct Covid thread, I would post data from the Government’s ONS site, but as the stats could sometimes prove to be unsettling for some, they would be lolled. Facts. From the Government’s ONS site…
Professors of medicine, infinitely more qualified than anyone on here, were maligned by the mob because they failed to comply with the vaccine orthodoxy. And still are as evidenced on this thread.
Fake news: Safe and effective.There is nothing new in this collective hounding of an alternative stance, but that people are talking of censorship - which the closing down of the thread would effectively be - then that is a different matter.
What I fail to understand is why anyone who is so confident in their own position and finds that of the ‘opposition’ so preposterous that it can be summarily dismissed as being the thoughts of a deluded, Flat Earther, ‘anti vaxxer’ etc should feel sufficiently threatened to demand their views are censored.
And spare me the simpering, pearl-clutching view that a post on a football forum that is sceptical/critical of anything vaccine related is in any way remotely dangerous. It is not, and only a person of no mettle and prone to bouts of public histrionics would find it so.If any danger exists, it is in the talk of censorship.
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As far as I can see, no-one on the anti-vax side of the argument has ever posted any meaningful thoughts of their own. There's a seemingly endless succession of links to dodgy websites and twitter feeds that are accompanied by no more original thought than a scant covering statement like 'sums it up for me' or 'the evidence keeps coming'. Sometimes there's a valedictory for the person they are linking to that they are 'leading' or 'courageous'. Invariably they are neither.
In a very short space of time, these posts are thoughtfully tackled. The myths are debunked, true facts are posted, questions are asked and on many occasions the disingenuous originators of false information are unmasked like in a Scooby Doo cartoon. And the result? Nothing. No-one ever comes back to debate the points. None of the anti-vaxxers ever answer any of the questions. None ever engage beyond posting and running away. The true facts are not disputed; they are not ever acknowledged. The credentials of the discredited individuals they originally lauded are not backed up. There is silence. Like a submarine that has been located, it ceases to engage and dives down into the depths where it can't be seen. It then pops up again a few days later firing new missives from another incredible source and the whole game of anti-vax whackamole goes on.
Has anyone come back and conceded that the EU weren't discussing the vaccines, but that a far right Dutch party were? No
Has anyone explained the lower life expectancy 200 years ago when the air was cleaner? No
Has anyone conceded that the Germans in WWII acted in a more consistently fascistic manner than the Ukranians? No
Has anyone commented on the likelihood that low vaccine take up in the US is most likely to be driven by the cost? No
Has anyone ever apologised for insulting the people on this board and their relatives who were directly involved in vaccine development? No
Has anyone changed their opinion of the "RtHon" Andrew Bridgen MP? No
Has anyone conceded that there is a link between people believing Anti-Vax stuff and believing other conspiracy theories? No
Has anyone boasting of doing 'their own research' ever ventured to explain what they mean by that? No
Has anyone responded to the excellent post from kigelia about meta analysis with an example of meta analysis they've carried out? No
Has anyone come up with a reason for disputing the excess death figures published by the ONS or conceded that they are the best we have? No
Has anyone stated that they now understand how SARS was contained? No
Has anyone come up with a reason why we should believe that 'The International Journal of Vaccine Theory, Practice, and Research' would have any credibility? Or explained why it only started in 2020 by known anti-vaxxers? No.
No, no, no, no, no. It's always no. Because they either don't have the facts and they don't have the humility to accept and acknowledge that what was originally posted was fundamentally wrong. Are the anti-vaxxers being censored? Not by me, not by anyone else. The only censorship going on here is self-censorship, because they won't debate the points. It's an incredibly sad way of behaving, but it's all they that can do because they are incapable of engaging with either facts or logic. In a way, it can be quite funny witnessing this desperation to be different: Otherwise sensible people, posting absolute Tommy rot presumably with the aim of getting themselves noticed.
As far as Covid goes, it probably doesn't matter that much now. Unless there is another mutation which is worse than what's doing the rounds it's not going to be that big an issue for the majority. What is really worrying though is the damage that could be done next time there is an epidemic. That's why it is important to keep posting the truth and to keep having the argument to help ensure that these poisonous ideas do not spread.21 -
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Plea to mods:
Please don’t close down this thread, but please do consider deleting the posts that spread anti vax disinformation and conspiracy theories. As a publisher you have that right, in the same way as BBC News, ITN and Sky News do.
But failing that, don’t close the thread down, and allow the scientific debunking of all the nonsense that gets posted.2 -
Yeah, please only print one side of the arguement.JamesSeed said:Plea to mods:
Please don’t close down this thread, but please do consider deleting the posts that spread anti vax disinformation and conspiracy theories. As a publisher you have that right, in the same way as BBC News, ITN and Sky News do.8 -
Strange that some people are willing to think that a vaccine is the cause of their ill health, but refuse to consider that it might be the virus itself that has caused their health to deteriorate.
SARS-Cov-2 is a new virus and less than 4 years in circulation, it's far too soon to be able to rule out that it won't cause illness in future, in those who have had a Covid infection.
This week's revelations from the Covid Inquiry are breath taking and it should really result in charges against those who caused far too many unnecessary deaths by their dreadful decisions and indecision.1 -
FFS, it is a simple football forum, nothing more, nothing less.
As for those information centres you have referred to, you keep watching them.
They certainly tick your boxes.0
This discussion has been closed.
