VAR - are you a fan?

lordromford said:

@PeterGage
I generally read your posts on refereeing decisions with interest because you often illustrate a referee’s point of view, which can be illuminating.
I also appreciate that refereeing is a thankless task and referees are often damned if they do and damned if they don’t.

However, one thing that the addition of ex-referees to the teams of pundits on the tv has illustrated for me, is that teams of officials are literally that - a team. There is a huge reluctance for ex-refs to criticise refereeing decisions. I do understand why: These are people who are colleagues and peers. Often I imagine they are friends too. But the verbal gymnastics the likes of Dermot Gallagher and Howard Webb go through to avoid making direct criticisms is just not helpful.

The thing is, criticism should be constructive and useful. It’s ok to criticise a referee’s decision, but you can also clarify the difficulties in getting those decisions right.
Thats the thing with the Mbeumo decision. It was blatantly wrong. I’ve seen no real disagreement about that from anyone other than blinkered Man U fans and (no disrespect meant) referees and ex referees who are unwilling to criticise a peer too harshly. I know you mentioned the decision being subjective, but subjectivity and common sense are not mutually exclusive. By your logic, no decision can be blatantly wrong because if the decision was made, there must be a valid reason for that.

People make mistakes. Sometimes mistakes are absolute howlers. That’s ok. Everyone has made howlers in their life. Regardless of how he read the situation at the time, that ref had an absolute shocker with that decision. But that’s it. It’s over and we move on. I’m sure he’ll be perfectly ok next time he referees a match. 

The fact is, despite this ref making a huge mistake, the target of most people’s annoyance is with the VAR system, not the referees themselves. People understand that humans are flawed. So it’s frustrating when referees and ex-referees, (with an understandable air of authority), tell us that we’re wrong to frame an error as ‘blatant’ or similar.

Sometimes a decision is just wrong.

That’s life.

lordromford said:

the target of most people’s annoyance is with the VAR system, not the referees themselves.

PeterGage said:

MuttleyCAFC said:

I think the handball law has years of confusion built into it. I know when I was managing quite a few years ago and the ref gave a penalty when one of my players tried to hoof a ball clear with nobody near him and sliced it and it went up and hit his hand. I questioned the ref in relation to intent as Messi couldn't have performed such a skill and he told me he understood what I was saying. He told me he understood and sympathised with what I was saying but he had recently received guidance that such a thing was a penalty. This has been going on for years as the football authorities wanted consistent decisions rather than let the ref decide intent. This was never going to work.

As for the Man Utd goal, I thought that as the handball directly led to a goal, then it gave an advantage to Man Utd and shouldn't have been given which the authorities have pretty much confirmed, even though I can appreciate the player may not have had intent. Anyway, it is a mess and could easily be simplified rather this constant search for perfection that will never happen and we even have a difference in interpretation in this country to abroad which is ridiculous.

I don't think that incident was anything to do with VAR. The ref saw it hit his hand in open play and decided it was unintentional. But didn't interpret the unintentional handball led to the goal which is the error.

Your very last sentence does not coincide with the law (number 12). It clearly states that a goal is disallowed if scored DIRECT from the handball, even if the ref thought the handball was not deliberate.Thereafter a goal scored in the circumstances we are talking about is allowed if the ball struck the hand, which in the refs opinion, was in a natural position. That part of the law points out that the unnatural or natural position can vary, depending on a number of movements by the player concerned. In other words there is no single hand to ball scenario that fits all situations.