Electric Cars

cafcfan said:

BTW you can currently get an effectively brand new pre-registered Lotus Emeya with a staggering £46K knocked off the list price which is unreal. https://quotes.carwow.co.uk/deals/e2661583067b2495bae964b245255e77

Times move on. An electric car is the most relaxing drive I've had. Still loved my v6 Jag, but can drive far further in the electric before feeling tired. (Range is the same)

I think the point is being missed in some posts. Even if you don't do jobs yourself, many new cars are far more difficult for your average local mechanics to work on, even impossible where they have been designed to be repaired by in house people. When you had a rear bearing go in the past you could replace it for £20 plus not too much time in terms of labour. They are now sealed in a unit with will cost 100s, possibly more. It is like washing machines where bearings are sealed in the drum for only one reason. To limit the life of the product. The use of plastics in places where plastics shouldn't be used means they have a shorter life and they are not cheap to replace. Peugeot have introduced a gear box that can't be repaired, it has to be replaced. Cost about £6k. BMW have introduced screws that there is no screw driver to unscrew them, apart from ones their dealers hold.  If you have a minor knock to your bumper and the sensors need realigning, this is a very expensive job which can only be done by manufacturer's equipment in many new cars. If a minor part goes wrong, you can't just replace it, even a bulb in some cars, the car's computer needs reprogramming, which most mechanics can't do as they don't have the software.

Cars that have been bought new will have repairs under warranty of course, but when that is finished, who is going to want to buy them? That impacts the new car buyer as the market for a lot of these cars will be very limited and it is bad for the environment as far more new cars will need to be built. We are already seeing an increasing market for certain 20 year old cars and prices have gone up to boot. It is about common sense really, not about nostagia. This is all cars, but I think EVs have contributed as it is creating an atmosphere where a car only lasts 8 to 10 years and that is going to be the future norm. Currently, the AVERAGE age of cars on UK roads is 9 years 10 months so this will make a real difference when the older cars get uneconomical to own although I suppose it may have a counter pressure of more golden era cars being kept on the road.

My 25 year old son still has the, now 18 year old, Fiat Panda 1.3 multijet he had when he was 17. It is very economical (65 mpg) and the engine will last forever as long as it is looked after. That may be an exageration, but 300,000 miles is not unheard of. The rest of the car will fall apart before then of course. It has a timing chain, not a belt and has a lot of torque and is fun to drive and easy to park. He is nearing the time when he will have to change it but he is in no hurry to do so. 

2012 was about the peak mechanically with a lot of cars give or take a couple of years for change up to 2017. Repairs and replacement was night and day in terms of being budget friendly 

Carter said:

@bobmunro makes a valid point 

Up until 2008 I had cars that I could service myself and do so to varying degrees of ease but very doable DIY all the same. 

A volkswagen I had required 20 plus grub screws to be removed just to get the engine cover off then didn't matter how good you were at servicing and mechanical work full stop, without telling the computer you had serviced it or replaced a sensor the car didn't believe you 

I think that up until about 2018 combustion engine vehicles were at their zenith. Very repairable, would give long and loyal service if cared for and none were heaps of shit straight out if the factory. Now I think sadly motor manufacturers have gone the same way as a lot of things and built their vehicles to have defined lifespans not over 10 years. Works for them, works for dealers, works for everyone except the customer. 

Those stupid screens in every new car now piss me off, I think people who use mobile phones when driving should be fed to pigs and don't see how those screens are any different. The next step was the fuckers removing knobs, switches and dials from cockpits under the guise of streamlining but really to save the manufacturing costs of putting knobs, switches, buttons and dials in dashboards 

Anyway. Must go, need to charge the van up so I can drive to Folkestone and do my job on Monday morning 

Apparently it’s progress mate !

I just had to buy a replacement wing mirror for one of our Nissan vans… £560.00 !!!! That just buying the fucking thing 

valleynick66 said:

This seemingly built in obsolescence is across numerous products and makes a mockery of any ‘green’ claims it feels. 

Governments globally need ideally to find a way of mandating longevity of products as part of our efforts to be ‘green’. 

You have put that a lot more succinctly than I have been trying to 

I absolutely agree. Cars made in the last 20 years should be able to last 20 years if looked after. Big caveat I know but we are talking about basics, staying on top of servicing, getting noises investigated, putting decent tyres on. The leaps forward in tyre technology aren't discussed enough, decent tyres degrade slower than the budget ones so by definition are better for the environment and also can squeeze a few more MPG out 

R0TW said:

AddicksAddict said:

gringo said:

Hex said:

You can have too many controls on a steering wheel.  

impossible!

I want to know why that steering wheel isn’t square.

guinnessaddick said:

AddicksAddict said:

gringo said:

Hex said:

You can have too many controls on a steering wheel.  

impossible!

I want to know why that steering wheel isn’t square.

I think the word wheel gives it away.

Not if you worked in British Leyland design department.
Think all agro.

The Allegro gets a hard deal. Square,ror at least flat at the bottom steering wheels are desirable now. Who would have thought they all aggro would become such an ugly, unlikely style icon

MuttleyCAFC said:

I think the point is being missed in some posts. Even if you don't do jobs yourself, many new cars are far more difficult for your average local mechanics to work on, even impossible where they have been designed to be repaired by in house people. When you had a rear bearing go in the past you could replace it for £20 plus not too much time in terms of labour. They are now sealed in a unit with will cost 100s, possibly more. It is like washing machines where bearings are sealed in the drum for only one reason. To limit the life of the product. The use of plastics in places where plastics shouldn't be used means they have a shorter life and they are not cheap to replace. Peugeot have introduced a gear box that can't be repaired, it has to be replaced. Cost about £6k. BMW have introduced screws that there is no screw driver to unscrew them, apart from ones their dealers hold.  If you have a minor knock to your bumper and the sensors need realigning, this is a very expensive job which can only be done by manufacturer's equipment in many new cars. If a minor part goes wrong, you can't just replace it, even a bulb in some cars, the car's computer needs reprogramming, which most mechanics can't do as they don't have the software.

Cars that have been bought new will have repairs under warranty of course, but when that is finished, who is going to want to buy them? That impacts the new car buyer as the market for a lot of these cars will be very limited and it is bad for the environment as far more new cars will need to be built. We are already seeing an increasing market for certain 20 year old cars and prices have gone up to boot. It is about common sense really, not about nostagia. This is all cars, but I think EVs have contributed as it is creating an atmosphere where a car only lasts 8 to 10 years and that is going to be the future norm. Currently, the AVERAGE age of cars on UK roads is 9 years 10 months so this will make a real difference when the older cars get uneconomical to own although I suppose it may have a counter pressure of more golden era cars being kept on the road.

My 25 year old son still has the, now 18 year old, Fiat Panda 1.3 multijet he had when he was 17. It is very economical (65 mpg) and the engine will last forever as long as it is looked after. That may be an exageration, but 300,000 miles is not unheard of. The rest of the car will fall apart before then of course. It has a timing chain, not a belt and has a lot of torque and is fun to drive and easy to park. He is nearing the time when he will have to change it but he is in no hurry to do so. 

Why? I like to keep a car a long time (but I accept not everyone else does). 

Here's my answer to disposable car ownership and getting value for money!



Daily used car. Simple to fix myself (servicing, brakes, exhaust, bearings, head gasket) at the roadside. 
Cost me £500 7 years ago. Insurance £165 and 50+ mpg. 

Not everyone would settled for an old car, BUT, in consideration of sustainability, not allowing for petrol use as an environmental issue, it is 30 years old and so has outlasted many a car built in the years since. 

It's my youngest car as I also have a 39 year-old and 41 year old car. Also buttons to maintain and running costs. Sadly our disposable living attitude, is often based on fashion as opposed to usable lifespan. 

Carter said:

R0TW said:

AddicksAddict said:

gringo said:

Hex said:

You can have too many controls on a steering wheel.  

impossible!

I want to know why that steering wheel isn’t square.

guinnessaddick said:

AddicksAddict said:

gringo said:

Hex said:

You can have too many controls on a steering wheel.  

impossible!

I want to know why that steering wheel isn’t square.

I think the word wheel gives it away.

Not if you worked in British Leyland design department.
Think all agro.

The Allegro gets a hard deal. Square,ror at least flat at the bottom steering wheels are desirable now. Who would have thought they all aggro would become such an ugly, unlikely style icon

Never thought I would hear this car described as “style icon”, and yes I had one.

I'll back up whoever raised the point regarding wet belts, especially those ridiculous 1 and 1.5 litre engines that are absolutely fine in superminis but a very expensive blown up, worn out engine waiting to happen in larger vehicles. 

Son's learning to drive and i only had a van which was too big. We fancied a Civic and the choice was a 1.0l wet belt petrol that had 'expensive engine rebuild' written all over it as we were going for a 7 year old motor. Ended up with the 1.6l diesel which will have its own issues but not the wet belt which is a very poor idea indeed

or just...you know...remap and shove a pipe through the DPF

Dodge are bringing the new Dodge Charger to Europe!

Anything being sold that isn't a blobby SUV box is worth celebrating

What the manufacturers did with wet belts was design them so they would last through the warranty. I can't believe this policy as surely it will ultimately affect the reputation of the company but I have warned a few people who were about to buy wet belted cars because the knowledge isn't fully out there yet. It is the fault of governments too, so silly changes like stop start and wet belts were introduced to save a tiny bit in terms of economy whereas they life limit the car. And look at the LED light clusters. Apart from annoying me to see LED strips of lights all over the rear of cars, when they go wrong it isn't just going to be a bulb from Halfords. Buyers of older cars really need to clue themselves up on how easy to fix and how cheap the parts are going to be on any car they buy. And a lot of the new cars on the road won't be touched with barge poles when people work it out.