I must say that in dealings with the Police I've always been pretty impressed. Got a call last year from my Mum on her mobile as they had just been hit by a hit and run driver. When I got there about ten minutes later not only had the Police arrived but they'd traced the car owner and had already gone to nick him. He tried to deny it but the fact the smashed up car was on his driveway was a bit of a giveaway.
[cite]Posted By: Medders[/cite]So, those here that feel so strongly about this... have any of you thought about signing up to be a special constable?
nope. but I know someone who is.
I bought a car at the weekend, and I can honestly say, I haven't broken a speed limit yet. hand on my heart.
if it helps people who get their sheds broken into then i've gotta do it! :-)
thing is you will though Suzi, it's impossible not to at some stage or another. I don't mind speed cameras if they are in the right place and for the right reason but most are not.
Suzi the consensus seems to be that most people would prefer to direct police away from traffic enforcement towards crimes that are seen to impact (no pun) more directly. I think you have every right to disagree with the majority but as it's our collective taxes that fund the police then the majority should be able to direct where they focus their resources. As a side note i think so much good will has gone up in smoke with regards to traffic policing with the blanket adoption of speed humps everywhere. A good idea on the worst streets or around schools has been unleashed everywhere largely to feather the nests of corrupt local officials and construction companies. Anway going back policing without the consent of the majority is going to fail and traffic policing seems to fall into that category.
Suzi they still havnt got back to me and my info could or couldnt be of use re the murder on Friday nite. Thats 48 hours and counting.
I think we have to agree to disagree about the OB its our life experiences that shape our opinions of the useless , do nothing, pumped up layabouts !!!!!
[cite]Posted By: Medders[/cite]
I bought a car at the weekend, and I can honestly say, I haven't broken a speed limit yet. hand on my heart.
That's only been a few days though.....give it time
I have been driving for 10 years. so its not a new thing. (only the car is!) I wouldn't possibly say that i've never broken the speed limit, but i've heard too many close to home stories about road accidents, and other stories, and i'm doing my bit.
[cite]Posted By: Charlton Dan[/cite]But the point is not whether a child has been knocked down by a driver doing 90 in a built up area, cos that obviously takes priority over garden gnomes. We're talking about getting nicked on an A Road doing 55 in a 50 by a camera thats hidden behind a road sign 500 yards from the nearest off ramp
I'm not Dan, you might be. who cares if the camera is hidden. if you're doing 55 in a 50 you shouldn't be. if it being there stops you from driving so fast down that road next time, then its done the job.
i dont think you understand that its preventative and trying to help people, rather than trying to stitch you up. its better to stop the people getting killed before they are, rather than saying afterwards "if there had been a speed camera here it would have saved that life as people would have obeyed it and not gone faster"
I fully comprehend that they are were brought in as a preventative measure, but if they want them as a pure deterrent then why hide them? How can something you not see be a deterrent?
[cite]Posted By: Goonerhater[/cite]Suzi they still havnt got back to me and my info could or couldnt be of use re the murder on Friday nite. Thats 48 hours and counting.
I think we have to agree to disagree about the OB its our life experiences that shape our opinions of the useless , do nothing, pumped up layabouts !!!!!
[cite]Posted By: Henry Irving[/cite]I agree with Suzi. Speeding is a crime and if we want the Police to stop "wasting" resources on it then we can all slow down by a few miles a minute. Maybe we be a little late for that meeting/TV show but perhaps we'd have safer and calmer roads and safer and calmer pavements.
It would only be a small step but even a journey of a thousand miles must start with one of those.
I was the one who raised the issue of Police and traffic offences to which Suzi, I'm sure unintentionally, implied that I didn't view speeding etc as a crime. Of course they are crimes and if they result in accidents where people are injured, then that should be dealt with by the Police. I was talking about the policing of speeding issues. I believe that policing works best when the Police are seen as representing the community. That way there is a general bond of trust between Police and the community and intelligence gathering is much easier because people don't feel alienated from them. A few months ago I was stopped for doing 31 mph in a 30 mph area. Do I feel more or less supportive of the Police after this incident? My solution is to cede this aspect of law enforcement to Traffic Wardens. It will therefore avoid breakdown in trust caused by "over zealous" Policing and let the Police get on with other aspects of crime prevention and detection.
[cite]Posted By: Charlton Dan[/cite] I fully comprehend that they are were brought in as a preventative measure, but if they want them as a pure deterrent then why hide them? How can something you not see be a deterrent?
because the rule is that you keep to the speed limit through the whole length of the road and do not just slow down when you see the camera?
[cite]Posted By: bingaddick[/cite]My solution is to cede this aspect of law enforcement to Traffic Wardens. It will therefore avoid breakdown in trust caused by "over zealous" Policing and let the Police get on with other aspects of crime prevention and detection.
Agree with that.
Let's also not forget that the OB do people for not wearing seatbelts... surely time could be better spent than that?
The thing that gets me is this i have sped and been caught not near housing estates or schools but on the A10 doing 46 in a 40 happy to pay the fine and take the points i was wrong.
it wasnt a speed camera it was a car with on board camera
I go to court OB there dealing with the paperwork side 6 of them 2 per car covered M25 and A10 both ways that day 6 bloody police men with 20 people caught roughly all of us working men and women no young herberts why because they did it at 930am when most scumbags are sleeping.
In my house every night from 8ish the stretch of the A10 where i got caught is like a drag strip there is a 3 mile stretch with no Working camera. any OB there then No
Why did it take 6 officers to do the job when you could have done it with 3 why did it take 6 officers off the beat to go to the court and deal with the cases when it could have been done with 3.
those other 3 could have been on the beat for those 2 days how many other courts had the same amount of OB in them for the same thing.
times that on a daily basis by counties or towns across england and there is the reasons why people get pished off with them for Just doing their job as there is no mgmt structure within them to stop this blatent misuse of taxpayers money.
Yes speeding is a crime yes i would be pissed if my boy got hit by a speeding car but i would be just as pissed off if he was stabbed or beaten and there was no one about to stop it due to them having 2 OB in a car to stop people going to work when they could be on the nightshift stopping the violence like they joined up for.
We need more police doing the jobs that need to be done enabling the priorties to be shared more evenly and not so thinly
I
[cite]Posted By: Charlton Dan[/cite]I fully comprehend that they are were brought in as a preventative measure, but if they want them as a pure deterrent then why hide them? How can something you not see be a deterrent?
because the rule is that you keep to the speed limit through the whole length of the road and do not just slow down when you see the camera?
Indeed it is but that's rather idealistic to believe that's going to happen. If it were to happen we wouldn't need these hidden deterrents in the 1st place
I agree, there needs to be more police doing the job and shifting the priorities elsewhere. I do think though, that you would probably take more care when driving yourself in the future so you do'nt get caught again and go through all that rigmarole. despite it seeming like a lot of work and a lot of time for a lot of people, perhaps it would make people think twice about doing it again. doesn't make it right i agree.
[cite]Posted By: suzisausage[/cite]not if someone crashes and goes through the window and they would have been saved if they were wearing the seatbelt?
i don't understand why everyone thinks rules are there to be broken. seatbelts are law for a good reason, why why would you want to break the rule?
The thing that gets me is this i have sped and been caught not near housing estates or schools but on the A10 doing 46 in a 40 happy to pay the fine and take the points i was wrong.
it wasnt a speed camera it was a car with on board camera
I go to court OB there dealing with the paperwork side 6 of them 2 per car covered M25 and A10 both ways that day 6 bloody police men with 20 people caught roughly all of us working men and women no young herberts why because they did it at 930am when most scumbags are sleeping.
In my house every night from 8ish the stretch of the A10 where i got caught is like a drag strip there is a 3 mile stretch with no Working camera. any OB there then No
Why did it take 6 officers to do the job when you could have done it with 3 why did it take 6 officers off the beat to go to the court and deal with the cases when it could have been done with 3.
those other 3 could have been on the beat for those 2 days how many other courts had the same amount of OB in them for the same thing.
times that on a daily basis by counties or towns across england and there is the reasons why people get pished off with them for Just doing their job as there is no mgmt structure within them to stop this blatent misuse of taxpayers money.
Yes speeding is a crime yes i would be pissed if my boy got hit by a speeding car but i would be just as pissed off if he was stabbed or beaten and there was no one about to stop it due to them having 2 OB in a car to stop people going to work when they could be on the nightshift stopping the violence like they joined up for.
We need more police doing the jobs that need to be done enabling the priorties to be shared more evenly and not so thinly
I
[cite]Posted By: Charlton Dan[/cite]I fully comprehend that they are were brought in as a preventative measure, but if they want them as a pure deterrent then why hide them? How can something you not see be a deterrent?
because the rule is that you keep to the speed limit through the whole length of the road and do not just slow down when you see the camera?
Where do they now hide fixed cameras? Big signs telling you they are coming, warning on the sat nav.
And so what if they are hidden or there are temporary cameras. You still shouldn't be speeding. Bit like a shoplifter saying "Let me off, there was no sign in the shop saying 'you are on CCTV' so they shouldn't have seen me nicking that cardigan".
Anyway the issue isn't, to my mind, about cameras/speeding/cyclist even id they should all be dealt with but the wider issue of respect for the Police and the law.
To be part of a civil society we have to either obey the laws or accept it's punishments or, if we think them unjust or too harsh, campaign against them just as the suffragettes, Gay rights activists, Trade unionists, etc, etc, etc did.
Yes, Chirpy as you well knew the Bird In Hand in Bromley is my "local". Been in there many times on a Sunday to enjoy a drink in the beer garden and meet friends. Nice beer but the food is expensiv for what it is.
[cite]Posted By: Charlton Dan[/cite]I fully comprehend that they are were brought in as a preventative measure, but if they want them as a pure deterrent then why hide them? How can something you not see be a deterrent?
because the rule is that you keep to the speed limit through the whole length of the road and do not just slow down when you see the camera?
Indeed it is but that's rather idealistic to believe that's going to happen. If it were to happen we wouldn't need thesehiddendeterrents in the 1st place
perhaps if more people lived in this 'ideal world' less incidents would happen. if people that were speeding by 5mph, thought that if they did something else that was slightly breaking the law and getting away with it, and pushed the personal limits a bit more is where we've got where we are today on the grander scale of things? its the smaller things that will make the difference eventually. going right back round to the kids going out with knives on them. probably started with a legal 3inch swiss army knife for a bit of show moving on to worse things in some cases perhaps...? who knows, i don't claim to understand that mentality, but you get what i mean. every push of the bounderys opens a whole new can of worms and if people stayed within the perimeters set, for our own good reason, then maybe things wouldn't be getting out of control now?
Carrying knives was made illigal during the Teddy Boy years because of all the gang fights and stabbings. So its not real new is it.
The SUS Laws were originaly stopped after pressure groups said they were "racist" as figures showed that more young black men were stopped than other sections of society. Depends on how you view this but it was either a truth and OB were abusingtheir power (o dear what a shock) or it was PC bollo*. I feel its from this that kids in general thought they where unlikely to be stopped and searched so they could get away with a knife.
I dont mind being stopped by OB ifthey explain why and its not just a statistical exercise. As it was when i was stopped under the prevention of terrorism act. Andthe OB are effective in doing it. Many years back i got stopped under SUS and was carrying and they never found it. Or they actually do bother to search you at all other than filling in the paper work as with the Section 60 on me and bother to even look in thebag im carrying.
PS Suzi had a think re Alll the OB thingy might let the dog off as i worked with her before she crossed the line !!
Comments
erm, no !!
nope. but I know someone who is.
I bought a car at the weekend, and I can honestly say, I haven't broken a speed limit yet. hand on my heart.
if it helps people who get their sheds broken into then i've gotta do it! :-)
thing is you will though Suzi, it's impossible not to at some stage or another. I don't mind speed cameras if they are in the right place and for the right reason but most are not.
Right place? they should be everywhere if it was viable.
I think we have to agree to disagree about the OB its our life experiences that shape our opinions of the useless , do nothing, pumped up layabouts !!!!!
I have been driving for 10 years. so its not a new thing. (only the car is!) I wouldn't possibly say that i've never broken the speed limit, but i've heard too many close to home stories about road accidents, and other stories, and i'm doing my bit.
I fully comprehend that they are were brought in as a preventative measure, but if they want them as a pure deterrent then why hide them? How can something you not see be a deterrent?
all of em tho? really, every single one?
I was the one who raised the issue of Police and traffic offences to which Suzi, I'm sure unintentionally, implied that I didn't view speeding etc as a crime. Of course they are crimes and if they result in accidents where people are injured, then that should be dealt with by the Police. I was talking about the policing of speeding issues. I believe that policing works best when the Police are seen as representing the community. That way there is a general bond of trust between Police and the community and intelligence gathering is much easier because people don't feel alienated from them. A few months ago I was stopped for doing 31 mph in a 30 mph area. Do I feel more or less supportive of the Police after this incident? My solution is to cede this aspect of law enforcement to Traffic Wardens. It will therefore avoid breakdown in trust caused by "over zealous" Policing and let the Police get on with other aspects of crime prevention and detection.
because the rule is that you keep to the speed limit through the whole length of the road and do not just slow down when you see the camera?
haha, fair do's!
Agree with that.
Let's also not forget that the OB do people for not wearing seatbelts... surely time could be better spent than that?
i don't understand why everyone thinks rules are there to be broken. seatbelts are law for a good reason, why why would you want to break the rule?
The thing that gets me is this i have sped and been caught not near housing estates or schools but on the A10 doing 46 in a 40 happy to pay the fine and take the points i was wrong.
it wasnt a speed camera it was a car with on board camera
I go to court OB there dealing with the paperwork side 6 of them 2 per car covered M25 and A10 both ways that day 6 bloody police men with 20 people caught roughly all of us working men and women no young herberts why because they did it at 930am when most scumbags are sleeping.
In my house every night from 8ish the stretch of the A10 where i got caught is like a drag strip there is a 3 mile stretch with no Working camera. any OB there then No
Why did it take 6 officers to do the job when you could have done it with 3 why did it take 6 officers off the beat to go to the court and deal with the cases when it could have been done with 3.
those other 3 could have been on the beat for those 2 days how many other courts had the same amount of OB in them for the same thing.
times that on a daily basis by counties or towns across england and there is the reasons why people get pished off with them for Just doing their job as there is no mgmt structure within them to stop this blatent misuse of taxpayers money.
Yes speeding is a crime yes i would be pissed if my boy got hit by a speeding car but i would be just as pissed off if he was stabbed or beaten and there was no one about to stop it due to them having 2 OB in a car to stop people going to work when they could be on the nightshift stopping the violence like they joined up for.
We need more police doing the jobs that need to be done enabling the priorties to be shared more evenly and not so thinly
I
Indeed it is but that's rather idealistic to believe that's going to happen. If it were to happen we wouldn't need these hidden deterrents in the 1st place
But that's no one's fault but their own....
I think that just about sums it up perfectly.
Where do they now hide fixed cameras? Big signs telling you they are coming, warning on the sat nav.
And so what if they are hidden or there are temporary cameras. You still shouldn't be speeding. Bit like a shoplifter saying "Let me off, there was no sign in the shop saying 'you are on CCTV' so they shouldn't have seen me nicking that cardigan".
Anyway the issue isn't, to my mind, about cameras/speeding/cyclist even id they should all be dealt with but the wider issue of respect for the Police and the law.
To be part of a civil society we have to either obey the laws or accept it's punishments or, if we think them unjust or too harsh, campaign against them just as the suffragettes, Gay rights activists, Trade unionists, etc, etc, etc did.
Have never played on the pool table
perhaps if more people lived in this 'ideal world' less incidents would happen. if people that were speeding by 5mph, thought that if they did something else that was slightly breaking the law and getting away with it, and pushed the personal limits a bit more is where we've got where we are today on the grander scale of things? its the smaller things that will make the difference eventually. going right back round to the kids going out with knives on them. probably started with a legal 3inch swiss army knife for a bit of show moving on to worse things in some cases perhaps...? who knows, i don't claim to understand that mentality, but you get what i mean. every push of the bounderys opens a whole new can of worms and if people stayed within the perimeters set, for our own good reason, then maybe things wouldn't be getting out of control now?
gang fights and stabbings. So its not real new is it.
The SUS Laws were originaly stopped after pressure groups said they were "racist" as figures showed that more young black men were stopped than other sections of society. Depends on how you view this but it was either a truth and OB were abusingtheir power (o dear what a shock) or it was PC bollo*. I feel its from this that kids in general thought they where unlikely to be stopped and searched so they could get away with a knife.
I dont mind being stopped by OB ifthey explain why and its not just a statistical exercise. As it was when i was stopped under the prevention of terrorism act. Andthe OB are effective in doing it. Many years back i got stopped under SUS and was carrying and they never found it. Or they actually do bother to search you at all other than filling in the paper work as with the Section 60 on me and bother to even look in thebag im carrying.
PS Suzi had a think re Alll the OB thingy might let the dog off as i worked with her before she crossed the line !!
what was the name of the bill they bought in to stop demonstrating outside government buildings,
i remember watching when the heavy handed OB ruffed taht poor guy up outside Houses of Parliment because his stuff was allegedly blocking the path,
prime example of a awaste of OB time and money there must have been 10 of them moving him on
Consider capital punishment for certain killings,just get shot of the evil bastards.
Lets be honest the softly softly approach has not worked.
Get tough on crime and tough on the causes of crime,f----joke,this governments done f-all.
And this is from an all life labour voter(apart from the last election)and a ex labour party member.