[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]are you telling me the w*nkers we've had to put up with the last 3/4 years (this season has been a little bit better) care about this club. turn it in.
No I didn't say that at all did I. We're comparing whether you'd rather club success or country success.
Next season you could introduce a few young players, they could form a spine of a team that takes you back into the Championship and gets you settled back up there. You'll see these youngsters come in naive, green but talented, giving their all. You'll see them mess up, make mistakes, you'll see them do some brilliant things, you'll see them start to improve, to cut out the bad side of their game, you'll see them develop and you'll feel an affiliation with them as they will feel with the crowd.
You said you can't relate to Charlton players, but if you were becoming successful surely you'd relate to them more than Heskey, Milner and Terry? Would watching your team develop again and achieve success would bring you more joy/excitement than England winning this summer?
Its ENGLAND. To be honest i couldnt care who is playing...as long as we win. I cant stand Rugby, Tennis, Motor Racing....but if theres an Englishman playing then i want him to spank whoever he's up against. Can i relate to him, of course i cant!!
Fair enough if you prefer Charlton, I can understand that. But not liking England cos of the players, to me seems ludicrous.
[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]are you telling me the w*nkers we've had to put up with the last 3/4 years (this season has been a little bit better) care about this club. turn it in.
No I didn't say that at all did I. We're comparing whether you'd rather club success or country success.
Next season you could introduce a few young players, they could form a spine of a team that takes you back into the Championship and gets you settled back up there. You'll see these youngsters come in naive, green but talented, giving their all. You'll see them mess up, make mistakes, you'll see them do some brilliant things, you'll see them start to improve, to cut out the bad side of their game, you'll see them develop and you'll feel an affiliation with them as they will feel with the crowd.
You said you can't relate to Charlton players, but if you were becoming successful surely you'd relate to them more than Heskey, Milner and Terry? Would watching your team develop again and achieve success would bring you more joy/excitement than England winning this summer?
i wasnt talking to you. You posted while i was typing. Edited my post now.
[cite]Posted By: Dave Rudd[/cite]I must have a gene missing.
I rarely watch England. Didn't see the recent Mexico game. Didn't know there was a game against Japan until one of my sons came home and asked me the score.
I just can't associate with Lampard, Terry etc in the same way that I can with Semedo and Dailly. I hope England do well, and I'll watch as much of the World Cup as I can, but really don't care who wins it.
[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]Mascot, are you telling me some of the w*nkers we've had to put up with the last 3/4 years (this season has been a little bit better) care about this club. turn it in. People like Terry & Rooney do care about England.
Alright Gary, chill out mate......
I suppose I was prob talking about this season, which for me has been the best of the last 4......
And good for Rooney(who I like) Terrys c&*( can fall off for all I care), Ashley cole is another one I have no interest in... Joe coles alright.. erm, gerrard, so what, Lampard...
I dont like these players, simple... I dont like them... I used to like the England team, I dont any more...
Id MUCH rather we got promoted or won a cup... than England win the world cup...
I used to associate with them... I dont any more... you tell me why if you like...
[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]Mascot, are you telling me some of the w*nkers we've had to put up with the last 3/4 years (this season has been a little bit better) care about this club. turn it in. People like Terry & Rooney do care about England.
Alright Gary, chill out mate......
I suppose I was prob talking about this season, which for me has been the best of the last 4......
And good for Rooney(who I like) Terrys c&*( can fall off for all I care), Ashley cole is another one I have no interest in... Joe coles alright.. erm, gerrard, so what, Lampard...
I dont like these players, simple... I dont like them... I used to like the England team, I dont any more...
Id MUCH rather we got promoted or won a cup... than England win the world cup...
I used to associate with them... I dont any more... you tell me why if you like...
Mascot, i wasnt shouting at ya mate.
I expect Charlton to get promoted out of this jank league. I dont expect England to win the world cup. Thats why my euphoria would be alot higher if the latter happened. I just dont understand how anyone couldnt care....it baffles me.
Club all day long, I love the WC and want England to win but I invest more time and money in CAFC than England. On an aside, when the WC is on most of the country get the football bug, after the 04 Euros Mrs Bibbles sister said she understood how exciting football can be, I told here I feel like that every week I don't have to wait every couple of years!!
[quote][cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]I expect Charlton to get promoted out of this jank league. I dont expect England to win the world cup. Thats why my euphoria would be alot higher if the latter happened. I just dont understand how anyone couldnt care....it baffles me.[/quote]
Why not turn it the other way? Tell me why I should care. A random collection of players who I have no affinity with, managed by an Italian. What does it mean to you when an England team or a British tennis player (like ... err ... Andy Murray or Greg Rusedski) wins?
Do you feel the buzz because this represent a victory for you? For the country of your birth over Johnny Foreigner? Reflected glory?
Somehow I can manage without that. Maybe it baffles me as to why you seem to need that.
I am patriotic, went to Euro 04 and the last world cup and was at both penalty shoot out defeats.
BUT
Give me celebrating Charlton winning promotion and having a load of beer in a pub in Rochdale next season, singing Charlton songs with mates rather than singing football songs with a load of plastics with face paint and foam hands any day.
"Club easy. I'd swop England winning the World Cup for Charlton scoring a goal. "
LOL... That made me laugh..
Gary, yeah mate each to there own mate... I suppose Im not really that patriotic, as I said I used to have a proper affinity for the England team, but I just havnt anymore ... with Bent in it, BANG Im well up for them... even with Parker (a bit) ... but with Barry, and Lennon.. I dont know maybe it will grab me aas we go on...
Also Ill be getting up at the 4am and stuff to watch England play... I think Im a bit fairweather with England is all....
[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]I expect Charlton to get promoted out of this jank league. I dont expect England to win the world cup. Thats why my euphoria would be alot higher if the latter happened. I just dont understand how anyone couldnt care....it baffles me.
Why not turn it the other way? Tell me why I should care. A random collection of players who I have no affinity with, managed by an Italian. What does it mean to you when an England team or a British tennis player (like ... err ... Andy Murray or Greg Rusedski) wins?
Do you feel the buzz because this represent a victory for you? For the country of your birth over Johnny Foreigner? Reflected glory?
Somehow I can manage without that. Maybe it baffles me as to why you seem to need that.
Ive been brought up to be patriotic. I watched England before i watched Charlton. VHS of Gary Linekers 48 goals for England was basically on repeat in my room.
I was delighted when England won the Rugby world cup....it brought a sense of enormous pride, seeing the whole nation behind them.
I get the feeling that people that dont care about England are simply trying to make some kind of point.
So what if its 'reflected glory'....just get behind YOUR country.
Dave Rudd's first post on this thread is exactally the way i fel now i dont really even care about ENGLAND if i am not busy i will watch the WC but i will not go oout of my way for it as im just not that bothered. As many have said its all about Charlton going up and i would take that over the WC anyday.
I don't like Cole, Lampard, Gerrard, Defoe, Terry etc so will not be cheering them on.
I remember in 98 feeling disappointed when England got knocked out of the WC but thought then I would have taken the play off victory over a WC win without a seconds thought.
I am a patriot and care deeply about my country and its place in the world.
However in footballing terms the players no longer care a jot about England. Most of them don't even bother to sing the national anthem. I realise many of you on here hate Her Majesty and all the traditions of our great country from other discussion topics but if the players don't care about their country they won't give their all for it.
I therefore, in my turn, will devote my support to my club even though, under
Pardew and Dowie in particular, the players were often as disinterested as England's players.
In footballing terms my club needs me more than my country. There are unlimited plastic England fans. Not too many plastic Charlton fans in division 3.
[quote][cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]So what if its 'reflected glory'....just get behind YOUR country.[/quote]
You know what ... if either of the Sodje's had made the Nigeria squad, I'd probably be supporting them.
Come on, you Super Eagles! Oh wait a minute. Not sure I should have said that after Palace's reprieve yesterday, but you get my drift, I'm sure.
As for the Rugby World Cup ... spare me. The whole nation behind them? Yeah, right. Fairweather 'plastic' rugby fans who were rugby fans for a week.
Fair play to you, ValleyGary, if being an England fan does the trick for you. I have no problem with that. Just don't expect the rest of us to tattoo our heads with the St George's cross and stack up the cases of Carlsberg ready for the BBQ.
This is a very interesting debate. If memory serves me right I've come in for a lot of stick over the ears on here and Rivals before it, for my club over country views (and I'd still take CAFC winning the Tin Pot Paint trophy over the WC any day).
Reading through here though there seems to be a major shift away from country first since the last World Cup which I think reflects the growing disinterest in the Premier League and 'top players' in general and coincides with our own downfall.
[cite]Posted By: Ketman[/cite]Club closely followed by Country, love going to England games. Charlton is getting more of a habit, enjoy the games less and less now.
Mate, if I went to Charlton just to enjoy the game, I'd have stopped going years ago!!
Always club, i take cafc over wales all the time. People who say country generally dont follow a club. As for country i always enjoy watching Argentina and they are my adopted country.
I would support Millwall before I would support Wales, but then we are all about 200 miles away from being born foreign.
I always find the national team nonsense slightly false. Spurs and Arsenal (etc etc) fans putting aside their real weekly passion to pretend to be the united fans of another team.
Yeah, great if they win, fine to watch in the pub, but I get enough disappointment supporting Charlton to be annoyed again when our overhyped, commercially prostituted national #ahem# heroes reach their true level of semi final losers, if we are lucky.
You know what ... if either of the Sodje's had made the Nigeria squad, I'd probably be supporting them.
i know what you mean , i went to the world cup in Japan 2002 and when Claus Jensen came on for Denmark when England were 3 up i was so proud that i was seeing an actual Charlton player in the World Cup i wouldn't have minded him scoring 4 against us ...
Comments
When we were in the Premier League, did you England fans really want Beckham, Owen etc to do well against Charlton?
Or, like me, were you hoping that Johansson, Bartlett and Kishishev would be good enough to turn them over?
No I didn't say that at all did I. We're comparing whether you'd rather club success or country success.
Next season you could introduce a few young players, they could form a spine of a team that takes you back into the Championship and gets you settled back up there. You'll see these youngsters come in naive, green but talented, giving their all. You'll see them mess up, make mistakes, you'll see them do some brilliant things, you'll see them start to improve, to cut out the bad side of their game, you'll see them develop and you'll feel an affiliation with them as they will feel with the crowd.
You said you can't relate to Charlton players, but if you were becoming successful surely you'd relate to them more than Heskey, Milner and Terry? Would watching your team develop again and achieve success would bring you more joy/excitement than England winning this summer?
Fair enough if you prefer Charlton, I can understand that. But not liking England cos of the players, to me seems ludicrous.
i wasnt talking to you. You posted while i was typing. Edited my post now.
This too
Alright Gary, chill out mate......
I suppose I was prob talking about this season, which for me has been the best of the last 4......
And good for Rooney(who I like) Terrys c&*( can fall off for all I care), Ashley cole is another one I have no interest in... Joe coles alright.. erm, gerrard, so what, Lampard...
I dont like these players, simple... I dont like them... I used to like the England team, I dont any more...
Id MUCH rather we got promoted or won a cup... than England win the world cup...
I used to associate with them... I dont any more... you tell me why if you like...
Mascot, i wasnt shouting at ya mate.
I expect Charlton to get promoted out of this jank league. I dont expect England to win the world cup. Thats why my euphoria would be alot higher if the latter happened. I just dont understand how anyone couldnt care....it baffles me.
On an aside, when the WC is on most of the country get the football bug, after the 04 Euros Mrs Bibbles sister said she understood how exciting football can be, I told here I feel like that every week I don't have to wait every couple of years!!
CLUB
Why not turn it the other way? Tell me why I should care. A random collection of players who I have no affinity with, managed by an Italian. What does it mean to you when an England team or a British tennis player (like ... err ... Andy Murray or Greg Rusedski) wins?
Do you feel the buzz because this represent a victory for you? For the country of your birth over Johnny Foreigner? Reflected glory?
Somehow I can manage without that. Maybe it baffles me as to why you seem to need that.
BUT
Give me celebrating Charlton winning promotion and having a load of beer in a pub in Rochdale next season, singing Charlton songs with mates rather than singing football songs with a load of plastics with face paint and foam hands any day.
LOL... That made me laugh..
Gary, yeah mate each to there own mate... I suppose Im not really that patriotic, as I said I used to have a proper affinity for the England team, but I just havnt anymore ... with Bent in it, BANG Im well up for them... even with Parker (a bit) ... but with Barry, and Lennon.. I dont know maybe it will grab me aas we go on...
Also Ill be getting up at the 4am and stuff to watch England play... I think Im a bit fairweather with England is all....
Ive been brought up to be patriotic. I watched England before i watched Charlton. VHS of Gary Linekers 48 goals for England was basically on repeat in my room.
I was delighted when England won the Rugby world cup....it brought a sense of enormous pride, seeing the whole nation behind them.
I get the feeling that people that dont care about England are simply trying to make some kind of point.
So what if its 'reflected glory'....just get behind YOUR country.
I don't like Cole, Lampard, Gerrard, Defoe, Terry etc so will not be cheering them on.
I remember in 98 feeling disappointed when England got knocked out of the WC but thought then I would have taken the play off victory over a WC win without a seconds thought.
However in footballing terms the players no longer care a jot about England. Most of them don't even bother to sing the national anthem. I realise many of you on here hate Her Majesty and all the traditions of our great country from other discussion topics but if the players don't care about their country they won't give their all for it.
I therefore, in my turn, will devote my support to my club even though, under
Pardew and Dowie in particular, the players were often as disinterested as England's players.
In footballing terms my club needs me more than my country. There are unlimited plastic England fans. Not too many plastic Charlton fans in division 3.
You know what ... if either of the Sodje's had made the Nigeria squad, I'd probably be supporting them.
Come on, you Super Eagles! Oh wait a minute. Not sure I should have said that after Palace's reprieve yesterday, but you get my drift, I'm sure.
As for the Rugby World Cup ... spare me. The whole nation behind them? Yeah, right. Fairweather 'plastic' rugby fans who were rugby fans for a week.
Fair play to you, ValleyGary, if being an England fan does the trick for you. I have no problem with that. Just don't expect the rest of us to tattoo our heads with the St George's cross and stack up the cases of Carlsberg ready for the BBQ.
Reading through here though there seems to be a major shift away from country first since the last World Cup which I think reflects the growing disinterest in the Premier League and 'top players' in general and coincides with our own downfall.
I'll buy you a Nigerian beer, Gary!
I want Millwall to come first but I'll be cheering and supporting England non-stop this summer no matter what!
Mate, if I went to Charlton just to enjoy the game, I'd have stopped going years ago!!
I always find the national team nonsense slightly false. Spurs and Arsenal (etc etc) fans putting aside their real weekly passion to pretend to be the united fans of another team.
Yeah, great if they win, fine to watch in the pub, but I get enough disappointment supporting Charlton to be annoyed again when our overhyped, commercially prostituted national #ahem# heroes reach their true level of semi final losers, if we are lucky.
i know what you mean , i went to the world cup in Japan 2002 and when Claus Jensen came on for Denmark when England were 3 up i was so proud that i was seeing an actual Charlton player in the World Cup i wouldn't have minded him scoring 4 against us ...