We had virtually all the posession in the first half yet virtually every time they broke they had players running thirty-forty yards before a tackle could be put in. Barry had a poor tournament, but you can't have one midfielder trying to tackle or stay in position - granted he was sucked out of position enough times as well. We can not play with two midfielders in Gerrard and Lampard who don't want to show positional discipline. We had something like 61% possession in the first half yet Gerrard and Lampard wanted to play where Rooney was dropping off. If we're breaking down because everyone's going loco central, and getting in Rooney's way or not making space for him then Schweinsteiger and Ozil are past Barry in miliseconds. Terry and Upson are then damned to rush out of position.
From a throw on we had two central defenders fifty yards from goal on the left hand touchline. Why was that? Because Lampard and Gerrard were all over the place positionally. The commentator said Cappello was bawling at the ref, he wasn't both him and Pearce were bawling at Gerrard to stay wide. Yes Cappello chose an awful formation, but we need to play five in the middle. Would we be world beaters? No, but occasionally we'd make a semi-final as we did in 90 and 96 with five midfielders, and from there even an England side might get somewhere with luck.
I do think J. Cole, Gerrard, A Cole, Terry and Lampard are world tournament class. But unfortunately the premier league has affirmed the English percentage game, just with more supreme atheletes and technicians - many from abroad. Having said that if you think of the teams that have won World Cup's in the last twenty years how many of them played in the Premiership? Certainly none of the best technical players, mainly defensive mid's like Vierra and Gilberto flourished. There is no way an English team is winning any tournament playing with such a cavalier style.
I don't rate Germany very much but they are very well organised and play as a team. Our lot just beg to deceive. They have not really played great for years. I hope we now create a team England rather than try to include all our so called superstars, often out of position. Scotty would have been so much better than Barry but it is easy to be wise in hindsight.
The guy hadn't played for months yet was thrown straight into a world class tournament with no match fitness.
Ouzil (?spelling) totally embarrassed him the way he overhauled him from behind and then left him for dead but he has had little football. There are others far more culpable in my opinion. The fat, arrogant scouse chav for example whose whole demeanour and body language demonstrates that he doesn't want to be there as he has no regard whatever for his country.
When challenged as to his lack of effort he cries like a little girl and blames the fans!
Compare and contrast with the Mexicans at the moment and other nationalities too. They regard it as an honour to represent their country.
Old fashioned concept sneered upon in "modern" Britain but the results and performances speak for themselves.
haven't read any other posts...but we were embarrasing. back 4 were shocking and barry was a joke.....roony and defoe were woeful...drunk and going to bed now, actually not that gutted that we are out, argies would've really sorted us out next week anyway!!!!!!, as I type Tevez has just scored a screamer.....night all......we are sh*t!!!!!!!!!!
[cite]Posted By: LenGlover[/cite]One comment re the criticism of Barry.
The guy hadn't played for months yet was thrown straight into a world class tournament with no match fitness.
And yet knowing this Capello doesn't give Parker a sniff and decides to take both Wright-phillips and Lennon !!!
Bit like forgetting to pack your toothbrush but remembering to take two empty tubes of toothpaste on 'oliday
What a waste of time,over paid c##nts,waste everybodys time n if anyone on here thinks there worth there wages they must be on drugs,it makes me sick watching these pre madonas,people pay thousands to watch this crap,it's about time people saw it.
I agree with you Len on Barry. All too often fans and experts rush to criticise the player that is seen and 'in the thick of it'. Barry had a poor tournament - shame it wasn't his fourth major tourn instead of his first - but he was coming back from injury and he was the only cm trying to be disciplined. Most of my argument is attempting to point out even though he had a poor tournament, it is an impossible scenario when you have two midfield gamblers in L&G..... let alone when Milner's had width, width, width drummed into him. You can not blame the defensive midfielder when he has cavalier full backs and cavalier midfield partners around him.
Only Hargreaves with old fashioned smash 'em energy might have carried the water for others, but that would have papered over cracks where we try to force our best centrally minded cavaliers into flat formations requiring intense discipline. It was a tragedy we lost Scholes to this, looks like we'll be going round again for the next ten years.
Is there any evidence that the FA, PL, Sky or anybody puts pressure on the England manager to pick the "stars"? I know it is easy to think that as I can not understand a number of the decisions taken re. not subbing certain players, not giving new players (Parker, Bent, Johnson etc) enough of a chance and continuing the Gerrard/Lampard show (despite the world knowing it is does not work).
I honestly can not see Capello putting up with being told who to pick, but if he was where is the evidence? As it would explain an awful lot.
players like barry and milner are very average and even at their peak will never convince me they are good enough to represent england ...... but that's not their fault they are pony it's the manager for picking them .....
An absolute shambles of a WC for us from start to finish. The whole national team needs an overhaul and today should be the final straw. If England had performed like that under Mclaren he'd have been slaughtered, well that was worse than anything i saw under him. We're back to the Sven days of picking the best players and not the best team. Totally and utterly embarrassed by a side who included a number of younger players stepping up from their under 21s. Would we put in younger players or would we hold them back and say they don't have the experience? Ozil only made his debut last year, Muller only made his debut in March but they aren't afraid to put them in. Adam Johnson could've made an impact on the left but was left at home because "they don't have the experience". So what, if they're good enough play them. I am 100% positive Johnson would've performed better on the left than the shambles that was Gerrard playing (or not playing) out on the wing.
Rooney might as well have not been there, he was pathetic although i'm convinced he's not fit. What were the subs about as well, chasing a game and you take off Defoe and bring Emile f*cking Heskey on! And leave a defensive midfielder on who is breathing out of his arse and struggling badly. Why not take Barry off and stick Crouch up there who makes defences panic!
Rooney was awful again. We would have been better playing with ten men because in fact he acted as a twelfth man for German, giving the ball away on all but one occasion that I counted.
he was given so much great service wasn't he ? typical english tradition of when things go wrong dig out the most talented. Rooney was given 1 Ball of note in 4 games when the keeper made a good save against slovenia.But hey ho he's the easy option.During the entire worldcup he had to come into midfield to recieve the ball as we didn't have a midfielder to play a telling pass and haven't since gazza which is embarrassing.
[cite]Posted By: northstandsteve[/cite]he was given so much great service wasn't he ? typical english tradition of when things go wrong dig out the most talented. Rooney was given 1 Ball of note in 4 games when the keeper made a good save against slovenia.But hey ho he's the easy option.During the entire worldcup he had to come into midfield to recieve the ball as we didn't have a midfielder to play a telling pass and haven't since gazza which is embarrassing.
I've got no problem with that sentiment Steve - there's nothing the English like more than blaming talented players for the failure of the team - but in all honesty, Rooney was just rank dreadful the whole tournament. He is clearly either ridiculously unfit, carrying an injury or not right in the head.
like gazza not right in the head ,but the best we have got by a country mile, while I have to listen to how good Lampard,Gerrard and the reat of them are. BYE BYE GERRARD GOOD LUCK IN MADRID ( I HOPE THE ALLEDGED MAINTENANCE PAYMENTS ARE NOT TOO MUCH OF A DRAIN)
Rooney was rushed back by Man Utd when he wasn't fit and has paid the price. When he got injured away to Bayern he was on the top of his game scoring every week. 2-3 weeks out was the verdict. Suddenly he played in the 2nd leg 6 days later when he clearly shouldn't have and he hasn't been the same player since.
Starting with watching Argentina-Mexico this evening, both teams would have slaughtered England had we gotten through. The result to day flattered Germany, they took advantage of poor defending and hapless team-work but they'll have to play much better to get past Argentina.
I have been Englands biggest fan and stuck up for them over everything thats happened the last 2 weeks, i'll hold my hands up and say i was wrong. Today i finally fell out of love with football. This year has been a nightmare. Personally injured, Charlton fall at the second to last hurdle and England flatter to deceive. Im only 26 and i already feel like ive been thorugh enough to last me a life time.
Dont wanna go in to detail now cos i feel battered but im just so pissed off....
[cite]Posted By: BlackForestReds[/cite]I can start to enjoy the football now.
Starting with watching Argentina-Mexico this evening, both teams would have slaughtered England had we gotten through. The result to day flattered Germany, they took advantage of poor defending and hapless team-work but they'll have to play much better to get past Argentina.
I was thinking the same when we were 4-1 down. Spain/Portugal tomorrow night, Brazil tonight then next weekend
Uruguay/Ghana (Both like to attack)
Germany/Argentina
[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]I have been Englands biggest fan and stuck up for them over everything thats happened the last 2 weeks, i'll hold my hands up and say i was wrong. Today i finally fell out of love with football. This year has been a nightmare. Personally injured, Charlton fall at the second to last hurdle and England flatter to deceive. Im only 26 and i already feel like ive been thorugh enough to last me a life time.
Dont wanna go in to detail now cos i feel battered but im just so pissed off....
Keep your chin up Gary, you say you are personally injured so that is the most important thing because you need to look after your health mate, as for the rest of it, forget it as it is only a game.
I have been supporting Charlton for 44 years and seen a lot worse than this and as for England, dont even go there, they are not a good side and to be honest never really have been, the media hype up everything to do with England and make them out to be world beaters, when lets face it they are not.
One tournament win in 44 years tells its own story and lets face it we were hosting the bloody thing.
Get yourself fit, enjoy the summer and look forward to some football at the Valley in August.
[cite]Posted By: Rothko[/cite]BTW the overpaid stuff is a load of old toot. Are Torres, Tevez and Kyut, all on massive massive money in the Premiership overpaid?
Good point. I'm doubting that the likes of Ronaldo, Messi, Villa, Maicon, Robben, Iniesta and Messi - who all play outside the Prem; are on subsitence wages.
Comments
From a throw on we had two central defenders fifty yards from goal on the left hand touchline. Why was that? Because Lampard and Gerrard were all over the place positionally. The commentator said Cappello was bawling at the ref, he wasn't both him and Pearce were bawling at Gerrard to stay wide. Yes Cappello chose an awful formation, but we need to play five in the middle. Would we be world beaters? No, but occasionally we'd make a semi-final as we did in 90 and 96 with five midfielders, and from there even an England side might get somewhere with luck.
I do think J. Cole, Gerrard, A Cole, Terry and Lampard are world tournament class. But unfortunately the premier league has affirmed the English percentage game, just with more supreme atheletes and technicians - many from abroad. Having said that if you think of the teams that have won World Cup's in the last twenty years how many of them played in the Premiership? Certainly none of the best technical players, mainly defensive mid's like Vierra and Gilberto flourished. There is no way an English team is winning any tournament playing with such a cavalier style.
The guy hadn't played for months yet was thrown straight into a world class tournament with no match fitness.
Ouzil (?spelling) totally embarrassed him the way he overhauled him from behind and then left him for dead but he has had little football. There are others far more culpable in my opinion. The fat, arrogant scouse chav for example whose whole demeanour and body language demonstrates that he doesn't want to be there as he has no regard whatever for his country.
When challenged as to his lack of effort he cries like a little girl and blames the fans!
Compare and contrast with the Mexicans at the moment and other nationalities too. They regard it as an honour to represent their country.
Old fashioned concept sneered upon in "modern" Britain but the results and performances speak for themselves.
And yet knowing this Capello doesn't give Parker a sniff and decides to take both Wright-phillips and Lennon !!!
Bit like forgetting to pack your toothbrush but remembering to take two empty tubes of toothpaste on 'oliday
Only Hargreaves with old fashioned smash 'em energy might have carried the water for others, but that would have papered over cracks where we try to force our best centrally minded cavaliers into flat formations requiring intense discipline. It was a tragedy we lost Scholes to this, looks like we'll be going round again for the next ten years.
I honestly can not see Capello putting up with being told who to pick, but if he was where is the evidence? As it would explain an awful lot.
Rooney might as well have not been there, he was pathetic although i'm convinced he's not fit. What were the subs about as well, chasing a game and you take off Defoe and bring Emile f*cking Heskey on! And leave a defensive midfielder on who is breathing out of his arse and struggling badly. Why not take Barry off and stick Crouch up there who makes defences panic!
Bring on the new season
Thank god that's over and I can cheer on Ghana in my sweepstake
Starting with watching Argentina-Mexico this evening, both teams would have slaughtered England had we gotten through. The result to day flattered Germany, they took advantage of poor defending and hapless team-work but they'll have to play much better to get past Argentina.
Dont wanna go in to detail now cos i feel battered but im just so pissed off....
I was thinking the same when we were 4-1 down. Spain/Portugal tomorrow night, Brazil tonight then next weekend
Uruguay/Ghana (Both like to attack)
Germany/Argentina
Potentially Brazil vs Spain or Portugal
Some great games to come.
Keep your chin up Gary, you say you are personally injured so that is the most important thing because you need to look after your health mate, as for the rest of it, forget it as it is only a game.
I have been supporting Charlton for 44 years and seen a lot worse than this and as for England, dont even go there, they are not a good side and to be honest never really have been, the media hype up everything to do with England and make them out to be world beaters, when lets face it they are not.
One tournament win in 44 years tells its own story and lets face it we were hosting the bloody thing.
Get yourself fit, enjoy the summer and look forward to some football at the Valley in August.
Can only see James doing so. But surely Lampard, Gerrard & Heskey should also be considering it?
Good point.
Europe was the winner last night.
Let's get that Ryder Cup spirit going and get some EU flags flying from car windows.