[cite]Posted By: cafcdan18[/cite]Watched this game with an armchair Arsenal fan tonight who was close to tears at the end. (what a bell end)
Think he nearly hit me when I was checking scores on a very slow phone and joked- "my phone says it is still 0-0 so maybe it still is"
I noticed Goonfans weeping in the stands, during the league cup final. They should change their badge to a big bellend.
[cite]Posted By: Exiled_Addick[/cite]Absolute joke sending off. RVP isn't my favourite character in world football but he's very unlucky to have been booked for either of those offences, let alone both and be sent off.
I like to think the ref had seen RVP's incredible double strike in our premiership relegation season, a game in which he should have doubtlessly been sent off earlier in the tie, but Mark "Big Club/Big Player - No Decision" Clattenburg decide to cheat on Arsenal's behalf that day. Yesterday's ref was just proving the runny crap that spews out of the mouth of various big club fans (that poor decisions always "even themselves out over the course of the [four] seasons", is in fact true.
[cite]Posted By: Exiled_Addick[/cite]Absolute joke sending off. RVP isn't my favourite character in world football but he's very unlucky to have been booked for either of those offences, let alone both and be sent off.
I cant agree, he knew he was offside so being on a yellow he shouldn't have kicked the ball away. I dont buy that "i didn't hear the whistle" crap the defenders next to him heard it and if you look at his finish you'll see he knew he was off. That is a bookable offence so the only real joke was rvp for being such a fool.
[cite]Posted By: Exiled_Addick[/cite]Absolute joke sending off. RVP isn't my favourite character in world football but he's very unlucky to have been booked for either of those offences, let alone both and be sent off.
I cant agree, he knew he was offside so being on a yellow he shouldn't have kicked the ball away. I dont buy that "i didn't hear the whistle" crap the defenders next to him heard it and if you look at his finish you'll see he knew he was off. That is a bookable offence so the only real joke was rvp for being such a fool.
I understand what Uncle is saying but the real question is would the referee have sent off Messi for doing the same thing at the other end?
I think we know the answer to that one.
Got to apply some common sense sometimes and there was no need for that to be a red card, it shows the inconsistencies of the game that Carragher stayed ON despite that shocking tackle on Nani and RVP walks for supposedly time wasting.
There's no supposedly about it. He heard the whistle. Do you seriously believe if van Rapey had shanked a shot wide of goal having been clean through he'd not have had his head in his hands? He knew exactly what he was doing and was booked, correctly. Unfortunate for the first yellow, but then again if he hadn't been rampaging around screaming in people's faces a few seconds earlier I'd suggest that it wouldn't have happened.
The reffing at the Man U match was absolutely consistent (although poor). He didn't send off JC and he didn't send of the Man U player that went in with a similar revenge lunge a minute later. There were no similar lunges in the game last night, so the comparison is invalid. More consistency is an over-used and under thought out moan.
What was particularly impressive was the patient way that Barca pass and play, we were praying that they did not score again as we had money on the scoreline, and Messi could and should have scored a hatrick!. At one stage he stood still and the Arsenal players did not know what to do,perhaps he was waiting for a bus!
They showed Arsenal what a great game of accurate passing and the lovely chips over the midfield were wonderfully timed!.
Barca are the best side the modern game has ever seen. Their fitness in hunting the ball down in the oppositions half, the pace at which they break and their first touch is amazing. They're absolute quality!
[cite]Posted By: McLovin[/cite]There's no supposedly about it. He heard the whistle. Do you seriously believe if van Rapey had shanked a shot wide of goal having been clean through he'd not have had his head in his hands? He knew exactly what he was doing and was booked, correctly. Unfortunate for the first yellow, but then again if he hadn't been rampaging around screaming in people's faces a few seconds earlier I'd suggest that it wouldn't have happened.
The reffing at the Man U match was absolutely consistent (although poor). He didn't send off JC and he didn't send of the Man U player that went in with a similar revenge lunge a minute later. There were no similar lunges in the game last night, so the comparison is invalid. More consistency is an over-used and under thought out moan.
Would the referee have sent off Messi or any other Barca player for the same offence at the other end? Would he bollocks, it was an outrageous "homer" decision and no way for a game like that to be settled.
If you think he would have sent off Messi for that in front of 95,000 screaming Catalans then you are incredibly naive.
[cite]Posted By: McLovin[/cite]There's no supposedly about it. He heard the whistle. Do you seriously believe if van Rapey had shanked a shot wide of goal having been clean through he'd not have had his head in his hands? He knew exactly what he was doing and was booked, correctly. Unfortunate for the first yellow, but then again if he hadn't been rampaging around screaming in people's faces a few seconds earlier I'd suggest that it wouldn't have happened.
The reffing at the Man U match was absolutely consistent (although poor). He didn't send off JC and he didn't send of the Man U player that went in with a similar revenge lunge a minute later. There were no similar lunges in the game last night, so the comparison is invalid. More consistency is an over-used and under thought out moan.
Would the referee have sent off Messi or any other Barca player for the same offence at the other end? Would he bollocks, it was an outrageous "homer" decision and no way for a game like that to be settled.
If you think he would have sent off Messi for that in front of 95,000 screaming Catalans then you are incredibly naive.
Well he didn't give a blatant penalty for Diaby's lunge on Messi
He didn't send RVP off for his studs into shin "tackle" on Messi
He didn't send Koscielny off for a second bookable offence for the tackle that gave away the penalty when any player not already on a yellow would have been booked
It's not an open and shut case is it.
And as for any pretence that Arsenal would have prevailed... they had 0 shots on goal, on or off target for the entire time Van Persie was on the pitch. Conceding and a defeat was a matter of when not if. Outclassed.
Nice to see both our full backs had more shots on target last night than the entire Ars*nal team the night before but hey ;-)
Anyhow, back to the Ars*nal game. Wasnt going to comment on it until we'd played our game last night as it would have been tempting fate. For all the moaning about a clearly unfit Fabregas, the only player that really did miss in my opinion, not that I rate him at all, was Walcott. He's the only one in the Ars*nal side with explosive pace that could have exploited the Barca defence on the counter-attack. Had he been fit, Ars*nal would have had an outlet ball and maybe they could have forced some territorial advantage from it by getting further up the pitch and not defending so deep.
If RVP had the chance that fell to Bentdner in the last 5 mins, you know his first touch wouldnt have let him down, who knows what might of happened? Yes, it was a harsh second yellow but then he really shouldnt have got involved with the shanaligans in the first half. It was self-inflicted.
Cant criticise Ars*nal too much. Barcelona were exceptional and would have torn any team in the CL to shreds playing like that, Man Utd and Chelsea included. Barcelona v Spurs doesnt even bear thinking about lol.
Some would argue that this country could never produce a club side like Barcelona. We have a certain approach that is in our culture - it is outdated and we never win any international tournaments and never will. When Charlton actually try to keep posssession and play some sidewards or backward passess -50% of our crowd start spitting venom 'get it up- get it up'!!! The fact is, the Barcelona culture involves kids not playing competetive matches until they are older - we have them playing in leagues for 7 year olds. They look for the kid that 'lifts his head up' they teach them to be comfortable on the ball - we look for kid that is physically more developed or has a few gimmicky tricks so we can put them up front for mis- matches so some saddo youth coach can win some meaningless games.
I love to watch teams like Barcelona play but it also fills me with sadness, as has been said already - when you comapre with professional footballers like ours who cant play a 2 yard pass reliably and have as much vision as a mole!
Totally agree Muttley... in the modern era the likes of Jack Wilshere, Josh McEachran, Jonjo are diamonds in the rough.
In Spain, Holland, and more recently Germany with the emergence of Ozil, Muller, Kroos, Marin, Merkel etc, amongst others - youth football is an education, a religion, a dedication... it has its own rules, its own parameters and to all intents and purposes it is a game within a game.
You only have to look at the programmes of La Masia or Jong Ajax to see how it should be done. When Victorian England was world-leading, we set trends that others followed, adapted and arguably made better by borrowing the "best bits" and trying to provide solutions for the mistakes that we made. When something so obviously better is staring at us in the face, we turn our backs and try and do it our own way.
As a Barca fan, even I can admit that the 'love-in' over here for them has gotten a bit ridiculous. It's gratifying to see, of course - and certainly they play football in the 'right' way, but it isn't a club without problems. Barca aren't immune from accusations of poncing youngsters from other teams in Spain (and Latin America too), and sometimes the financial situation is a bit worrying (witness the recent need to finally accept shirt sponsorship). Add to this the fact that football in Spain is uncompetitive (Barca and Real are much, much further ahead of the rest of the league than Utd, Chelski, Arse and Citeh) along with the overall economic situation in Spain and you can see a real problem in a few years. However, there's no denying it is beautiful to watch the team play. The whole ethos of the way the club plays football is stamped on youngsters as soon as they join: "head up, receive, head up, pass, head up, move". Arsenal have been that way for a while now (pretty much since Wenger joined) but I don't think it will ever bear fruit in this country in the way it has for Barca because the shite, boring teams in Spain aren't full of insane pumped-up lunatics in midfield and massive, lumbering filthy centre halves at the back. Sadly, crowds here love the 'blood and thunder' that this style brings, so there would have to be a complete change of mindset from the average fan to accept a league like Spain's.
[cite]Posted By: JohnBoyUK[/cite]
For all the moaning about a clearly unfit Fabregas, the only player that really did miss in my opinion, not that I rate him at all, was Walcott.
I thought Song was a massive miss for Arsenal. When he is not playing, especially when Arsenal are playing against a team who are as capable of retaining possession as themselves, I realise what a vital role he plays in not only keeping possession but in winning it back as well.
[cite]Posted By: MuttleyCAFC[/cite]Yes, they are players like Rooney that have something special in them - they emerge despite our system, not because of it.
But that's part of the problem. Players like Rooney just wouldn't prosper at Barca (and if he was in the youth setup he never would have made it through to senior level) because, basically, he's a lunatic. A sometime-talented lunatic, admittedly, but still a lunatic.
What part of the problem is it? - players like Rooney would emerge anyway but we need to produce intelligent players who can pass and find space and read the game - we value the wrong attributes and if we never undertand this we will never be a force again as a footballing nation.
Not disagreeing with you though Leroy - think you are 100% right. There are some more enlightened schemes in this country- Brazillian Soccer Schools being one.
Comments
I like to think the ref had seen RVP's incredible double strike in our premiership relegation season, a game in which he should have doubtlessly been sent off earlier in the tie, but Mark "Big Club/Big Player - No Decision" Clattenburg decide to cheat on Arsenal's behalf that day. Yesterday's ref was just proving the runny crap that spews out of the mouth of various big club fans (that poor decisions always "even themselves out over the course of the [four] seasons", is in fact true.
I cant agree, he knew he was offside so being on a yellow he shouldn't have kicked the ball away. I dont buy that "i didn't hear the whistle" crap the defenders next to him heard it and if you look at his finish you'll see he knew he was off. That is a bookable offence so the only real joke was rvp for being such a fool.
I understand what Uncle is saying but the real question is would the referee have sent off Messi for doing the same thing at the other end?
I think we know the answer to that one.
Got to apply some common sense sometimes and there was no need for that to be a red card, it shows the inconsistencies of the game that Carragher stayed ON despite that shocking tackle on Nani and RVP walks for supposedly time wasting.
The reffing at the Man U match was absolutely consistent (although poor). He didn't send off JC and he didn't send of the Man U player that went in with a similar revenge lunge a minute later. There were no similar lunges in the game last night, so the comparison is invalid. More consistency is an over-used and under thought out moan.
They showed Arsenal what a great game of accurate passing and the lovely chips over the midfield were wonderfully timed!.
The possession table says it all!.
And we are quids in!
Would the referee have sent off Messi or any other Barca player for the same offence at the other end? Would he bollocks, it was an outrageous "homer" decision and no way for a game like that to be settled.
If you think he would have sent off Messi for that in front of 95,000 screaming Catalans then you are incredibly naive.
Well he didn't give a blatant penalty for Diaby's lunge on Messi
He didn't send RVP off for his studs into shin "tackle" on Messi
He didn't send Koscielny off for a second bookable offence for the tackle that gave away the penalty when any player not already on a yellow would have been booked
It's not an open and shut case is it.
And as for any pretence that Arsenal would have prevailed... they had 0 shots on goal, on or off target for the entire time Van Persie was on the pitch. Conceding and a defeat was a matter of when not if. Outclassed.
Anyhow, back to the Ars*nal game. Wasnt going to comment on it until we'd played our game last night as it would have been tempting fate. For all the moaning about a clearly unfit Fabregas, the only player that really did miss in my opinion, not that I rate him at all, was Walcott. He's the only one in the Ars*nal side with explosive pace that could have exploited the Barca defence on the counter-attack. Had he been fit, Ars*nal would have had an outlet ball and maybe they could have forced some territorial advantage from it by getting further up the pitch and not defending so deep.
If RVP had the chance that fell to Bentdner in the last 5 mins, you know his first touch wouldnt have let him down, who knows what might of happened? Yes, it was a harsh second yellow but then he really shouldnt have got involved with the shanaligans in the first half. It was self-inflicted.
Cant criticise Ars*nal too much. Barcelona were exceptional and would have torn any team in the CL to shreds playing like that, Man Utd and Chelsea included. Barcelona v Spurs doesnt even bear thinking about lol.
Roll on the quarters/semi draw next Friday :-)
I love to watch teams like Barcelona play but it also fills me with sadness, as has been said already - when you comapre with professional footballers like ours who cant play a 2 yard pass reliably and have as much vision as a mole!
In Spain, Holland, and more recently Germany with the emergence of Ozil, Muller, Kroos, Marin, Merkel etc, amongst others - youth football is an education, a religion, a dedication... it has its own rules, its own parameters and to all intents and purposes it is a game within a game.
You only have to look at the programmes of La Masia or Jong Ajax to see how it should be done. When Victorian England was world-leading, we set trends that others followed, adapted and arguably made better by borrowing the "best bits" and trying to provide solutions for the mistakes that we made. When something so obviously better is staring at us in the face, we turn our backs and try and do it our own way.
I thought Song was a massive miss for Arsenal. When he is not playing, especially when Arsenal are playing against a team who are as capable of retaining possession as themselves, I realise what a vital role he plays in not only keeping possession but in winning it back as well.