It looks like the FA are going to try and make this as small as incident as possible so they remain blameless, so sadly I dont see Millwall getting a hefty fine or ban.
Millwall FCs response has to be stronger than saying they will ban any fans found guilty in the courts. They should be sorting out their own problems rather than asking the legal system to do it on their own behalf. If I were the FA/Football League I would stop them playing any games 9and make them forfeit the points) until they had made a serious attempt to identify and ban all the offenders from the pretty extensive video evidence. I know there are plent of decent Millwall fans, I even know a few, but until they can feel comfortable about raising their voices against the plant life in their midst this sort of rubbish is going to carry on - it is this form of self restraint that usually stops other clubs having rpblems with their nutters.
Mate saying that blokes near her were so pissed they could barely walk.
We possibly would've had the same no doubt, if we'd been on the piss til 5pm. Difference is that we wouldn't have started rucking amongst our own.
You say that, but I've witnessed 4 or 5 incidents in the last couple of years of addicks fighting their own. I was quite close to the incident in the cup game at Fulham and also one in the NW Quad, which I commented on here at the time and was offered out by some goon on this very site. Not trying to compare us with them; their support is riddled with lowlife - just saying it does happen
You can spot them a mile off GH. It's that combination of being being really cocky but at the same time, a total slob. Harder to pull off than it sounds
Apart from the extract from the Millwall blogger ( which seemed a very plausible account of what he could see happening from a close distance) I think a lot of was has been stated on this thread is simply wrong.
First let me say I accept that Millwall have more than their fair share of violent knuckle dragging supporters. In fact, as a proportion of their regular match attending fans it is significantly higher than any other club. Their history just attracts this element. But people are deluding themselves if they think that the club have not made significant and genuine efforts over the past 20 years to deal with this problem.
Based on what I have read and heard what happened at Wembley did not start as old style mindless football hooliganism. It certainly ended that way once the police tried to intervene but that was not the cause. In my view, the cause was the clash of the two football watching cultures, magnified by a factor of 100, that I use to see regularly at Charlton away matches in the premiership years when Charlton would sell their entire away allocation. At home games these cultures were kept apart because one sat in the East stand or the West stand or in parts of the North stand whilst the other stood in the North stand. I use to regularly see heated arguments (even scuffles) between members of one culture who wanted to sit in their allocated seat, and not have people standing in front of them, whereas members of the other culture thought their ticket gave them the right to stand throughout the game roughly in the area where their seat was situated and anyone who wanted to sit should move to the front.
The element at Millwall who think they have the right to stand throughout a game, and not necessarily in front of the seat allocated by their ticket, is much larger and thuggish than the Charlton equivalent. Plus, a large part of the Millwall crowd on Saturday were day trippers, not regular match goers (as would be the case if Charlton made it to a semi final) who were expecting to sit together with their family groups without seeing the children in those groups becoming separated and distressed because drunken yobs think they have the right to stand close to all their mates rather than in their allocated seat.
I have to say that alcohol was also a big contributor to the problem.
Why did it not happen with the Chelsea or Man City or Wigan fans or any other fans you might ask? Well in the case of Man City and Chelsea I would guess their entire allocation was sold to season ticket holders. There were no day trippers and significantly fewer big family groups trying to sit together. The two cultures amongst the Wigan fans did not clash because they could sit/stand together in their groups because there were so many empty seats.
Why did it not happen at the play off final? I don’t know. I only became aware of the ‘we are going to stand and if you don’t like it, tough’ element in the subsequent Premiership years. Obviously, one reason, as I stated above, is we have a significantly smaller proportion of this type of fan.
This is a genuine view point. I expect a lot of people to disagree. In fact I fully expect to be slaughtered by the usual people who seem to have a problem whenever Len Glover raises concerns about the recent trend for yobbish behaviour by Charlton fans. I don’t like the smugness on this thread, and with the increasing trend for yobbish behaviour by Charlton fans it really grates with me.
Red in SE8 Is more or less right. According to the millwall lad in his 50's who I work with (who's a judge and head of service in work, so no lowlife bullshitter) he saw it from close quarters and his explanation was:
"The problem was a 5.15 kick-off, too much beer and sniff. People coming back late from the 2nd half had a disagreement about who was sitting where and it went - two big groups of pissed up mates going at it.
The strange thing was the ob just stood and watched it develop for 20mins so that people who were trying to calm it down got dragged into it. When the ob finally arrived they randomly struck out at anyone within reach, which provoked a reaction from those who were nothing to do with the original actual incident, hence the girl shown crying on tv.
All in all a day to forget"
I trust the lad 100% - hopefully that at least puts to bed the silly but predictible crap about. other clubs being involved.
don't know why you'd even bother to analyse it. Scummy club, scummy fans. As a Club they don't care. If they did they would only have sold to season ticket holders/members and been content with 15,000 genuine fans there. Instead they put them on general sale. As they say 'we don't care' and it shows.
Comments
I was quite close to the incident in the cup game at Fulham and also one in the NW Quad, which I commented on here at the time and was offered out by some goon on this very site.
Not trying to compare us with them; their support is riddled with lowlife - just saying it does happen
Looks like some more violence today during the derby. Might take some of the focus away from Millwall
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=TlD2p0vRG9I
http://www.millwall.vitalfootball.co.uk/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=104378&posts=9
'I think we're being stereotyped like the slaves in the 50's, or the jews to hitler'
They want a bit of that scouse victimhood to be bestowed on themselves.
eh?
Remember these ones should be applauded as they can turn on a computer, or maybe their mummy did it for them.
'We aint not done nuffink, you mug'
LOL
First let me say I accept that Millwall have more than their fair share of violent knuckle dragging supporters. In fact, as a proportion of their regular match attending fans it is significantly higher than any other club. Their history just attracts this element. But people are deluding themselves if they think that the club have not made significant and genuine efforts over the past 20 years to deal with this problem.
Based on what I have read and heard what happened at Wembley did not start as old style mindless football hooliganism. It certainly ended that way once the police tried to intervene but that was not the cause. In my view, the cause was the clash of the two football watching cultures, magnified by a factor of 100, that I use to see regularly at Charlton away matches in the premiership years when Charlton would sell their entire away allocation. At home games these cultures were kept apart because one sat in the East stand or the West stand or in parts of the North stand whilst the other stood in the North stand. I use to regularly see heated arguments (even scuffles) between members of one culture who wanted to sit in their allocated seat, and not have people standing in front of them, whereas members of the other culture thought their ticket gave them the right to stand throughout the game roughly in the area where their seat was situated and anyone who wanted to sit should move to the front.
The element at Millwall who think they have the right to stand throughout a game, and not necessarily in front of the seat allocated by their ticket, is much larger and thuggish than the Charlton equivalent. Plus, a large part of the Millwall crowd on Saturday were day trippers, not regular match goers (as would be the case if Charlton made it to a semi final) who were expecting to sit together with their family groups without seeing the children in those groups becoming separated and distressed because drunken yobs think they have the right to stand close to all their mates rather than in their allocated seat.
I have to say that alcohol was also a big contributor to the problem.
Why did it not happen with the Chelsea or Man City or Wigan fans or any other fans you might ask? Well in the case of Man City and Chelsea I would guess their entire allocation was sold to season ticket holders. There were no day trippers and significantly fewer big family groups trying to sit together. The two cultures amongst the Wigan fans did not clash because they could sit/stand together in their groups because there were so many empty seats.
Why did it not happen at the play off final? I don’t know. I only became aware of the ‘we are going to stand and if you don’t like it, tough’ element in the subsequent Premiership years. Obviously, one reason, as I stated above, is we have a significantly smaller proportion of this type of fan.
This is a genuine view point. I expect a lot of people to disagree. In fact I fully expect to be slaughtered by the usual people who seem to have a problem whenever Len Glover raises concerns about the recent trend for yobbish behaviour by Charlton fans. I don’t like the smugness on this thread, and with the increasing trend for yobbish behaviour by Charlton fans it really grates with me.
According to the millwall lad in his 50's who I work with (who's a judge and head of service in work, so no lowlife bullshitter) he saw it from close quarters and his explanation was:
"The problem was a 5.15 kick-off, too much beer and sniff. People coming back late from the 2nd half had a disagreement about who was sitting where and it went - two big groups of pissed up mates going at it.
The strange thing was the ob just stood and watched it develop for 20mins so that people who were trying to calm it down got dragged into it. When the ob finally arrived they randomly struck out at anyone within reach, which provoked a reaction from those who were nothing to do with the original actual incident, hence the girl shown crying on tv.
All in all a day to forget"
I trust the lad 100% - hopefully that at least puts to bed the silly but predictible crap about. other clubs being involved.