I hope that the sweaty's all vote Yes & then the moaning f***kers can then all leave England and settle back in cold Jocko land. After 6 months they'll wonder why the voted to go it alone, seeing as they will have no money, food or living.
Good riddance I say.
Must take alot of effort to clearly hate another nation, can I ask why?
Don't feed the trolls mate, it's fairly easy to make an educated guess on their feelings regarding a broad range of subjects and then deduce that they are incapable of a reasoned debate on issues such as these because they are beyond their comprehension.
I make you right mate.
I really wasn't going to look at this thread as I knew there would be embarrassing anti-Scottish elements going on. But thankfully it has been over powered by actual thought, decent debate and rational opinion.
My parents moved to England 30 years ago to start a family etc. They have never moaned or been bitter about living here, infact they have done very well, worked bloody hard and are thankful that both me and my sister have managed to have a good life which we may not have had if they had stayed up in Scotland. Yes they are proud of being Scottish and rightfully so, why wouldn't they be.
I have no other family in England, so is always interesting to see what my other family members think. It appears most of them fancy Scotland should be voting No for both reasons of 'all as one' or 'too much of an unknown/gamble'. As many have said independence is a nice idea, but it has to be practical, which I don't think it is.
You have exactly the same family background as me (except I lived there for a few years) however all of my family are voting "yes" !
If the Scots sod off, what will we do when we need a war fighting? There's always been a ready stream of Scottish nutcases to send in to take on the locals when we need to wipe someone out, and it seems to me that the SAS is pretty much entirely made up of small, wiry Scotsmen and chinless ponces.
Based on?
Almost as ridiculous a statement as some of the anti Scottish ones on here
The further north that I travelled in Scotland, the more I came to understand the resentments felt toward their governance. In the Orkneys, the way of life is more in tune with the Scandinavian countries.
Well, perhaps you didn't really understand it. Many in the Highlands & Islands are distinctly (and quite rightly) worried about the hiatus during transition. Because they are only too well aware that their businesses, particularly farming, will go belly up very quickly indeed if the EU/Westminster subsidies suddenly stop arriving on their door mats, delivered by the heavily subsidised Royal Mail service via the heavily subsidised ferries and air services. The "No" vote is well up in the North East of Scotland with around two thirds support. And Orkney & Shetland is a Lib Dem heartland of course with Labour and SNP only getting 22% of the vote combined!
Isn't there some sort of saying from the Scottish islands something along the lines of 'In Westminster they ignore us but in Edinburgh they hate us.'
Yep. There is a fairly established position in Orkney (and Shetland) that if Scotland becomes independent then they should seek independence from that independent Scotland - given the high proportion of oil reserves located in Orkney's waters that would be a disaster for the fledgling Scottish economy.
If the Scots sod off, what will we do when we need a war fighting? There's always been a ready stream of Scottish nutcases to send in to take on the locals when we need to wipe someone out, and it seems to me that the SAS is pretty much entirely made up of small, wiry Scotsmen and chinless ponces.
Is this based on conversations you've had with a drunk asking for money?!
On a serious note we do have a lot of nuclear subs based in Scotland. Shame this thread hasn't taken the very serious issue seriously.
The further north that I travelled in Scotland, the more I came to understand the resentments felt toward their governance. In the Orkneys, the way of life is more in tune with the Scandinavian countries.
Well, perhaps you didn't really understand it. Many in the Highlands & Islands are distinctly (and quite rightly) worried about the hiatus during transition. Because they are only too well aware that their businesses, particularly farming, will go belly up very quickly indeed if the EU/Westminster subsidies suddenly stop arriving on their door mats, delivered by the heavily subsidised Royal Mail service via the heavily subsidised ferries and air services. The "No" vote is well up in the North East of Scotland with around two thirds support. And Orkney & Shetland is a Lib Dem heartland of course with Labour and SNP only getting 22% of the vote combined!
Isn't there some sort of saying from the Scottish islands something along the lines of 'In Westminster they ignore us but in Edinburgh they hate us.'
Yep. There is a fairly established position in Orkney (and Shetland) that if Scotland becomes independent then they should seek independence from that independent Scotland - given the high proportion of oil reserves located in Orkney's waters that would be a disaster for the fledgling Scottish economy.
this is very true, family friend lives in edinburgh and has said this will be the case.
I'll take it seriously. I make Salmond right. If he gets independance he wants Trident removed from Scotland within five and a half years. IMO they should not be moved but scrapped and not replaced. Why spend billions on WMD that we can never use? Unless we wish to destroy the whole planet. None of which changes the fact, i want the Scots to vote 'Yes'
I think that Salmond probably has at least half an eye on using a close run 'loss' to drive through Devo-max which was what he really wanted the whole time.
I have no issue with the Scots having their cake but devo-max does seem a bit like them wanting it and eating it too.
Completely understand why the Scots would feel disillusioned by the political system, England and London will always be a huge suck on the attention of Westminster and often the major factor in its policy making. The Scots rarely even get to have any influence over which party are in power. Only natural to want to have some influence over your own affairs. If they do go that way then I'm not sure why resources would be pooled though, with that influence comes the responsibility and economic reality, it's not a game, it's not for the UK to underwrite spending and policy over which they have no influence. I fear that the ideological vote would see them struggle with the practicalities - so much of their budgeting is based upon oil revenues which seem to have significantly variable forecasts (and which Alex Salmond calls a 'bonus' despite them being one of the major contributors to his plans).
It's a shame that the vote is becoming about personalities too as a devolved Scotland which didn't involve Salmond (who is a particularly jingoistic and dislikable individual) would be a much more palatable proposition. A vote for devolution is just that, it's not actually a vote for Salmond.
As for being better together. Are we? Maybe I'm guilty of the lack of economic understanding that Fiish alluded to earlier but I'm yet to read a particularly convincing argument that says that the UK as a whole is better together. Scotland may well be better as a part of the UK but I'm not sure how your average Londoner for example benefits from the union? Not to say that we don't, just that I don't understand how we do.
If the Scots sod off, what will we do when we need a war fighting? There's always been a ready stream of Scottish nutcases to send in to take on the locals when we need to wipe someone out, and it seems to me that the SAS is pretty much entirely made up of small, wiry Scotsmen and chinless ponces.
Is this based on conversations you've had with a drunk asking for money?!
On a serious note we do have a lot of nuclear subs based in Scotland. Shame this thread hasn't taken the vary serious issue seriously.
The Andrew Neil documentary on the other week about how it will affect the rest of the UK was frightening. Might still be on iPlayer but it discussed the nuclear issue in a fair bit of depth. Basically an independent Scotland would have to go against the wishes of the Americans as they would want to retain the British nuclear deterrent in the North Sea.
If the Scots sod off, what will we do when we need a war fighting? There's always been a ready stream of Scottish nutcases to send in to take on the locals when we need to wipe someone out, and it seems to me that the SAS is pretty much entirely made up of small, wiry Scotsmen and chinless ponces.
Is this based on conversations you've had with a drunk asking for money?!
On a serious note we do have a lot of nuclear subs based in Scotland. Shame this thread hasn't taken the vary serious issue seriously.
On the subs debate and Faslane/Coalport. My kid brother is just in the process of leaving the Navy (25 yrs in). The whole independence process has really knocked the bollocks out of the property market on the west coast due to uncertainty over a yes/no vote. He and a lot of his mates are in serious negative equity as a result.
Having lived there most of last year I can categorically state, the Jocks are not stupid and have long memories. When the Yanks closed their base at Holy Loch in the 70's, old heads up there state that overnight it wiped 75% off of the value of housing stock around that part of Scotland and the whole of the community, not just services and ex-pats took a good shoeing and it took decades to shake out. Which makes me think the West side of the country, which depends on the MOD and satellite industries will definitely vote a resounding No. The East Coast, Borders and Highlands are a completely different kettle of fish. Going to be a lot closer when the whole of Scotland is taken into account.
Further to that the cost of moving the base down South could prove so expensive that in effect Scotland would be deciding whether a RoUK nuclear defence was feasible.
The way Salmond talked yesterday was like a wife who wants to divorce her husband and take absolutely everything they can and give nothing back, and knowing that despite the fact its not "cricket" they will get away with it anyway.
Complete bellend, and just such an unnecessary debate to be having.
Further to that the cost of moving the base down South could prove so expensive that in effect Scotland would be deciding whether a RoUK nuclear defence was feasible.
I heard there is already contingency to base the "bombers" in the States anyway. The Hunter Killers would need a new home and also Coalport is basically a hollowed out mountain with all sorts of nasty ordinance stored there. They would have to shift that too. Expensive stuff.
i dont buy the "we don't vote conservative so why should we be ruled by a conservative government" its called democracy. Because tunbridge wells never votes labour does that mean it can seek it's independance when another labour government comes into power?
this is all about salmond wanting more power and harnessing anti english xenophobia and nationalism than it is about actual policies and realism.
Further to that the cost of moving the base down South could prove so expensive that in effect Scotland would be deciding whether a RoUK nuclear defence was feasible.
I heard there is already contingency to base the "bombers" in the States anyway. The Hunter Killers would need a new home and also Coalport is basically a hollowed out mountain with all sorts of nasty ordinance stored there. They would have to shift that too. Expensive stuff.
Is there anywhere in the rUK which could house the subs ? I thought the west coast of Scotland was chosen because it couldn't be easily blockaded by sea, most of the coast of England and Wales could be quite easily which I would imagine geographically speaking leaves the northern coast of NI which is probably unpalatable for a number of reasons.
I would imagine if Scotland does become independent then the bases at Falsane etc will be leased to the UK on a long term basis as sovereign British territory (Cyprus/Guantanamo style) as a condition of Scotland's ascension to NATO. That way the UK keeps it's deterrent in a preferable location which would technically be on British soil and Scotland gets to join NATO whilst technically ridding itself of nuclear weapons.
i dont buy the "we don't vote conservative so why should we be ruled by a conservative government" its called democracy. Because tunbridge wells never votes labour does that mean it can seek it's independance when another labour government comes into power?
this is all about salmond wanting more power and harnessing anti english xenophobia and nationalism than it is about actual policies and realism.
Further to that the cost of moving the base down South could prove so expensive that in effect Scotland would be deciding whether a RoUK nuclear defence was feasible.
I heard there is already contingency to base the "bombers" in the States anyway. The Hunter Killers would need a new home and also Coalport is basically a hollowed out mountain with all sorts of nasty ordinance stored there. They would have to shift that too. Expensive stuff.
Is there anywhere in the rUK which could house the subs ? I thought the west coast of Scotland was chosen because it couldn't be easily blockaded by sea, most of the coast of England and Wales could be quite easily which I would imagine geographically speaking leaves the northern coast of NI which is probably unpalatable for a number of reasons.
I would imagine if Scotland does become independent then the bases at Falsane etc will be leased to the UK on a long term basis as sovereign British territory (Cyprus/Guantanamo style) as a condition of Scotland's ascension to NATO. That way the UK keeps it's deterrent in a preferable location which would technically be on British soil and Scotland gets to join NATO whilst technically ridding itself of nuclear weapons.
It was chosen for quick access to deep water and the fact that there is cloud cover virtually all year round (being as it's always raining in Scotland...). Barrow where the subs are built has similar access and is an expensive option. The problem is where to put all the nasties. All the other options in the South, Plymouth etc will be equally expensive and are of course close to greater centres of population. I hear someone mentioned jumping in with the Frogs but he was immediately drummed out of the service for obvious reasons ;0). We are going to have to pay (ie; whats left of the UK) either way if the Fishy Twins (Salmond and Sturgeon) get their way.
i dont buy the "we don't vote conservative so why should we be ruled by a conservative government" its called democracy. Because tunbridge wells never votes labour does that mean it can seek it's independance when another labour government comes into power?
this is all about salmond wanting more power and harnessing anti english xenophobia and nationalism than it is about actual policies and realism.
Exactly this,
SNP is their UKIP and should be treated as such.
The hilarious thing is more Scots voted for Thatcher's Tories than they ever have for Salmond's nats.
Further to that the cost of moving the base down South could prove so expensive that in effect Scotland would be deciding whether a RoUK nuclear defence was feasible.
I heard there is already contingency to base the "bombers" in the States anyway. The Hunter Killers would need a new home and also Coalport is basically a hollowed out mountain with all sorts of nasty ordinance stored there. They would have to shift that too. Expensive stuff.
Is there anywhere in the rUK which could house the subs ? I thought the west coast of Scotland was chosen because it couldn't be easily blockaded by sea, most of the coast of England and Wales could be quite easily which I would imagine geographically speaking leaves the northern coast of NI which is probably unpalatable for a number of reasons.
I would imagine if Scotland does become independent then the bases at Falsane etc will be leased to the UK on a long term basis as sovereign British territory (Cyprus/Guantanamo style) as a condition of Scotland's ascension to NATO. That way the UK keeps it's deterrent in a preferable location which would technically be on British soil and Scotland gets to join NATO whilst technically ridding itself of nuclear weapons.
It was chosen for quick access to deep water and the fact that there is cloud cover virtually all year round (being as it's always raining in Scotland...). Barrow where the subs are built has similar access and is an expensive option. The problem is where to put all the nasties. All the other options in the South, Plymouth etc will be equally expensive and are of course close to greater centres of population. I hear someone mentioned jumping in with the Frogs but he was immediately drummed out of the service for obvious reasons ;0). We are going to have to pay (ie; whats left of the UK) either way if the Fishy Twins (Salmond and Sturgeon) get their way.
Brilliant, thanks for the information. So it has nothing to do with the places vulnerability to blockade ? Where on earth did I get that from !
i dont buy the "we don't vote conservative so why should we be ruled by a conservative government" its called democracy. Because tunbridge wells never votes labour does that mean it can seek it's independance when another labour government comes into power?
this is all about salmond wanting more power and harnessing anti english xenophobia and nationalism than it is about actual policies and realism.
Exactly this,
SNP is their UKIP and should be treated as such.
Not really in that the SNP want to remain in the EU whereas UKIP want out of it.
A fundamental difference in who they wish to govern and be governed by.
I hope that the sweaty's all vote Yes & then the moaning f***kers can then all leave England and settle back in cold Jocko land. After 6 months they'll wonder why the voted to go it alone, seeing as they will have no money, food or living.
Good riddance I say.
Must take alot of effort to clearly hate another nation, can I ask why?
I reckon Golfie has never broken 100 on any golf courses up there :-0
finished 5,5 on the Old Course when I had putts for par on both !!! gggrrrrr.
Its not that I hate the Scots - one of my best friends/work coleagues is from Jockoland (but he is now settled in deepest Kent so he is now Anglocised) - the fact is they HATE us. So, now they finally have the chance to get rid of us (and us of them) then I hope they put their money where their mouths are & vote YES..........and if they do, then someone had better tell them that the pound is the currency of the UK and if they aint a part of it, they cant have it. Just as they cant have the US Dollar. Feel free to sign up to Europe & have the Euro, but they cant have the pound.
I hope that the sweaty's all vote Yes & then the moaning f***kers can then all leave England and settle back in cold Jocko land. After 6 months they'll wonder why the voted to go it alone, seeing as they will have no money, food or living.
Good riddance I say.
Must take alot of effort to clearly hate another nation, can I ask why?
I reckon Golfie has never broken 100 on any golf courses up there :-0
finished 5,5 on the Old Course when I had putts for par on both !!! gggrrrrr.
Its not that I hate the Scots - one of my best friends/work coleagues is from Jockoland (but he is now settled in deepest Kent so he is now Anglocised) - the fact is they HATE us. So, now they finally have the chance to get rid of us (and us of them) then I hope they put their money where their mouths are & vote YES..........and if they do, then someone had better tell them that the pound is the currency of the UK and if they aint a part of it, they cant have it. Just as they cant have the US Dollar. Feel free to sign up to Europe & have the Euro, but they cant have the pound.
On a serious note we do have a lot of nuclear subs based in Scotland. Shame this thread hasn't taken the vary serious issue seriously.
I'll take it seriously. I make Salmond right. If he gets independance he wants Trident removed from Scotland within five and a half years. IMO they should not be moved but scrapped and not replaced. Why spend billions on WMD that we can never use? Unless we wish to destroy the whole planet. None of which changes the fact, i want the Scots to vote 'Yes' We can't get rid of Trident!
finished 5,5 on the Old Course when I had putts for par on both !!! gggrrrrr.
Its not that I hate the Scots - one of my best friends/work coleagues is from Jockoland (but he is now settled in deepest Kent so he is now Anglocised) - the fact is they HATE us. So, now they finally have the chance to get rid of us (and us of them) then I hope they put their money where their mouths are & vote YES..........and if they do, then someone had better tell them that the pound is the currency of the UK and if they aint a part of it, they cant have it. Just as they cant have the US Dollar. Feel free to sign up to Europe & have the Euro, but they cant have the pound.
"They" don't hate the English as a race. They just hate your football commentators for going on about 1966 for fifty bloody years.
I am for the union just so you know, Sparrows Lane Lion.
The SNP's ideas on cherry picking what they want to keep (the Queen, the Pound etc) seem similar to a stroppy 19 year old who is fed up of "being told what to do" so he leaves home.
But then he comes back every Sunday so his Mum can cook him dinner, and do his washing, and oh yeah - can he borrow the car on Wednesday...
The vast majority of Scots I have met over here on holiday are going to vote no.
And as a Scot who "emigrated" south at 21 after the benefits of a Scottish education, married an, English girl (regard myself a a missionary) have two lovely English boys and ended up being an Addick and have lived relatively happily in the garden of England for 28 years, I would vote "no" too. But then again I don't get a vote unlike a load of Eastern European and other assorted peeps who moved in six months ago (absolutely no racial slur intended whatsoever btw - good luck to them). Just don't call me "Scotch" (sits back and waits for the first....,,,,,)
i thought i was a stunner when the BBC had a bit on "what will happen to the EEU migrants in Scotland if there is a yes vote" they said all 120,000 0f em !! are you taking the piss ? we have more the that in Kidbrooke let alone the rest of England !!!!!!
i think it will be a yes vote---the 23% undecided will vote yes. We the English will cave in after the yes vote and give them everything Salmon wants-------who will actually stand up for the people in England ? no one---we pay and thats it.
I would rather they stayed with us but if they vote yes i hope they have the balls to give up the army units, the naval bases, the embassy protection, and if it works out , well with the open euro borders fecking good luck in holding back the tidal wave.
Comments
Almost as ridiculous a statement as some of the anti Scottish ones on here
Shame on you Leroy... ;0)
What are the elegibilty rules for voting? Is it just those on the electoral registers in Scottish constituencies who can vote?
On a serious note we do have a lot of nuclear subs based in Scotland. Shame this thread hasn't taken the very serious issue seriously.
IMO they should not be moved but scrapped and not replaced. Why spend billions on WMD that we can never use? Unless we wish to destroy the whole planet.
None of which changes the fact, i want the Scots to vote 'Yes'
I have no issue with the Scots having their cake but devo-max does seem a bit like them wanting it and eating it too.
Completely understand why the Scots would feel disillusioned by the political system, England and London will always be a huge suck on the attention of Westminster and often the major factor in its policy making. The Scots rarely even get to have any influence over which party are in power. Only natural to want to have some influence over your own affairs. If they do go that way then I'm not sure why resources would be pooled though, with that influence comes the responsibility and economic reality, it's not a game, it's not for the UK to underwrite spending and policy over which they have no influence. I fear that the ideological vote would see them struggle with the practicalities - so much of their budgeting is based upon oil revenues which seem to have significantly variable forecasts (and which Alex Salmond calls a 'bonus' despite them being one of the major contributors to his plans).
It's a shame that the vote is becoming about personalities too as a devolved Scotland which didn't involve Salmond (who is a particularly jingoistic and dislikable individual) would be a much more palatable proposition. A vote for devolution is just that, it's not actually a vote for Salmond.
As for being better together. Are we? Maybe I'm guilty of the lack of economic understanding that Fiish alluded to earlier but I'm yet to read a particularly convincing argument that says that the UK as a whole is better together. Scotland may well be better as a part of the UK but I'm not sure how your average Londoner for example benefits from the union? Not to say that we don't, just that I don't understand how we do.
Having lived there most of last year I can categorically state, the Jocks are not stupid and have long memories. When the Yanks closed their base at Holy Loch in the 70's, old heads up there state that overnight it wiped 75% off of the value of housing stock around that part of Scotland and the whole of the community, not just services and ex-pats took a good shoeing and it took decades to shake out. Which makes me think the West side of the country, which depends on the MOD and satellite industries will definitely vote a resounding No. The East Coast, Borders and Highlands are a completely different kettle of fish. Going to be a lot closer when the whole of Scotland is taken into account.
Complete bellend, and just such an unnecessary debate to be having.
this is all about salmond wanting more power and harnessing anti english xenophobia and nationalism than it is about actual policies and realism.
I would imagine if Scotland does become independent then the bases at Falsane etc will be leased to the UK on a long term basis as sovereign British territory (Cyprus/Guantanamo style) as a condition of Scotland's ascension to NATO. That way the UK keeps it's deterrent in a preferable location which would technically be on British soil and Scotland gets to join NATO whilst technically ridding itself of nuclear weapons.
SNP is their UKIP and should be treated as such.
A fundamental difference in who they wish to govern and be governed by.
Its not that I hate the Scots - one of my best friends/work coleagues is from Jockoland (but he is now settled in deepest Kent so he is now Anglocised) - the fact is they HATE us. So, now they finally have the chance to get rid of us (and us of them) then I hope they put their money where their mouths are & vote YES..........and if they do, then someone had better tell them that the pound is the currency of the UK and if they aint a part of it, they cant have it. Just as they cant have the US Dollar. Feel free to sign up to Europe & have the Euro, but they cant have the pound.
IMO they should not be moved but scrapped and not replaced. Why spend billions on WMD that we can never use? Unless we wish to destroy the whole planet.
None of which changes the fact, i want the Scots to vote 'Yes'
We can't get rid of Trident!
finished 5,5 on the Old Course when I had putts for par on both !!! gggrrrrr.
Its not that I hate the Scots - one of my best friends/work coleagues is from Jockoland (but he is now settled in deepest Kent so he is now Anglocised) - the fact is they HATE us. So, now they finally have the chance to get rid of us (and us of them) then I hope they put their money where their mouths are & vote YES..........and if they do, then someone had better tell them that the pound is the currency of the UK and if they aint a part of it, they cant have it. Just as they cant have the US Dollar. Feel free to sign up to Europe & have the Euro, but they cant have the pound.
"They" don't hate the English as a race. They just hate your football commentators for going on about 1966 for fifty bloody years.
;o)
The SNP's ideas on cherry picking what they want to keep (the Queen, the Pound etc) seem similar to a stroppy 19 year old who is fed up of "being told what to do" so he leaves home.
But then he comes back every Sunday so his Mum can cook him dinner, and do his washing, and oh yeah - can he borrow the car on Wednesday...
The vast majority of Scots I have met over here on holiday are going to vote no.
i think it will be a yes vote---the 23% undecided will vote yes. We the English will cave in after the yes vote and give them everything Salmon wants-------who will actually stand up for the people in England ? no one---we pay and thats it.
I would rather they stayed with us but if they vote yes i hope they have the balls to give up the army units, the naval bases, the embassy protection, and if it works out , well with the open euro borders fecking good luck in holding back the tidal wave.