As long as he keeps winding the left up he can play act all he wants. Watching the pompous chumps froth at the mouth is tantamount to cringing over Saturday night trash television.
If there are too many people, there are too many people and jobs must go.
My ticket money is not there to keep excess people in employment - if there is not a requirement for them, then there will be redundancies. That is how the world works.
Who says there isn't a requirement for them? You? You really think your ticket money will go down if they get rid of these people?
The problem with Bobby Boy is its all the tin pot strikes etc that have gone on before years and years and years of em------------surely its a fundermental for a Union to represent its members when their jobs are on the line, in this case the RMT are right to be hard nosed-------get the best deal for those who will be going.
He is still a Marxist Smallwall scum bag who needs burning though.
GH. You didn't have anything to do with the demise of Joan of Arc did you? ;-)
I want to hate the fat Millwall communist. However, it's hard not to have a grudging respect for how he represents his members and the fact that he has a personal integrity. All that sniping because he lives in a council house and has a well paid job is ridiculous. As a left-winger he is being true to ideals and good luck to him if he's happy on the Council. They were also slating him this week because he's been on a cruise as if we are still living in the times of the Titantic. The bloke earns £150,000 as the leader of a huge organisation which considers it value for money for a man who has provided outstanding leadership and who has been very successful in defending the rights of his members. Fat Millwall commie.
Two points to make I work on London Underground for tubelines maintaining the stations tracks etc, ive got to take two nights off without pay due to there being no station supervisors on site to let us enter the stations. Secondly I'm currently undertaking survey work of all the ticket offices on the northern line so that work can begin in the near future to start stripping them out and turning them into retail outlets with amazon being majorly interested in taking them to distribute parcels to workers coming out the stations on there way home as nobody would be home to accept the parcel.
This basically says that it's a done deal otherwise why waste money do all the the surveys, drawings etc. so going on strike is pointless and time wasting as decisions have all ready been made to close them strike it no strike LUL ain't interested there mind is made up.
The train workers are lucky to have a union of any sort. I know many people in many industries where there are no unions and you wouldn't last long if you tried to introduce one. IMHO we have gone too far the other way. People are desperate for jobs and employers are taking advantage - reducing wages, increasing hours, taking away benefits.
And if that silent majority really object to Bob Crow why don't then stand up and vote him out?
Amazon great organisation. Pays hardly any taxes, zero hour contracts, poor wages, no security and those working have to have long security checks which is on their own time. A totally grim company to work for at the lower levels. Added into that they undermine shop jobs with better conditions. Maybe those that like that them would think differently if they were forced to work for them on a zero hours contract.
Usually I don't like him but this time I think he has a valied point. People could lose their jobs in this situation. I don't need to travel myself and even if I did I have a great deal of sympathy for the workers.
The removal of staff from stations makes for a more unsafe network. The woman in our families should feel safe to use the tube network at all times and removal of staff from a public area makes it more unsafe and more hazardous. No staff is great if there are no problems. If you are trying to sort out an Oyster card that has not been checked out properly and taken out the maximum out off your card, it is helpful to have staff who can sort it out rather than an 0845 number where you have to be on the phone for God knows how long.
Bob Crow stands up for his members and safety issues for the public. There is nothing wrong with that. It is not a surprise that the Daily Mail and Daily Express papers of this world don't like him for it.
It's not just Amazon, Asda are already using 6 stations as a test to have your shopping ready for you as you return home and more are being discussed.
As for Bob Crow, the man is doing the job he is paid for and getting the best possible deal he can for his members. And he has done it consistently over the years. As a commuter, he's a pain in the arse for me. As a union member, I wish my union (Unite) had a leadership that represented its' members as well as Crow does the RMT.
With regard to the LBC phone-in with Johnson, I take from that that LUL took the decision that this was a done deal. The RMT & TSSA are asking for that decision to be suspended for the moment and for them to be invited to discuss the future of the tube. If that was done they would call off the strikes.
That's a no-brainer surely. I have no doubt that the Unions would want the earth, wouldn't get it and another ballot would ensue, but why is that not at least a starting point? I can't see any reason why a sensible employer shouldn't engage with its' workforce in any industry.
And finally on Bob Crow. I will never forgive him for his comments on TV at a previous strike when he stood outside Liverpool Street Station and referred to the RBS Head Office. He slated the whole banking workforce, all rich & over-paid, but handily ignored the fact that the vast majority such as cashiers on £15k are on a helluva lot lower wages than he & his workforce. I wanted the leader of Unite to give him a dig over that. And...definitely a muggy spanner!!
I've travelled on tube/metro/underground systems across the UK, Europe & The World and there is nothing that the LU has that would make any of the others better. It's also by far the most expensive one. If you were to start the LU from scratch, you'd have driverless trains, automated ticket machines and a proper travelcard system (Oyster's system is frankly crap compared to one's elsewhere in the world). Every other system in the world usually has at least one member of staff visible at the stations and according to TFL or whoever this still isn't changing, it's just ticket offices they're shutting. Hong Kong is by far the best system I've used and considering I don't understand the language I find it just as easy to use as the LU and it's about the tenth of the price for a ticket. All stations are brightly lit and safe, at least the ones I went to (which was quite a few and not all of them were main stations).
The point is whenever there is the threat of any change, good or bad, Bob Crow throws a spanner in the works. He's living in the 1970s and the world has moved on. With the technology available today you could run the LU with the tenth of the workforce it currently has and for even less than a tenth of the cost. Of course Londoners can't have it both ways - if you want manned ticket offices and manned trains (despite many other cities embracing driverless trains with no complaints) then of course you're going to have to pay for it - what is it now, nearly a tenner for a return nowadays? I could feed a family of 4 on what a tube journey costs nowadays. Claiming Bob Crow is sticking to his socialist scruples is moot when hard-working families are directly negatively affected as a result of his belligerent actions - they either have to foot the bill for his demands or lose a day's wages because they can't go to work because he's called a strike. One day he will overplay his hand and leave a lot of the workers he represents in trouble, just like Unite did at Grangemouth - but at least he'll be OK as he's a millionaire and has a free house from the Government. I don't know any union that saved jobs by making it unaffordable to keep them employed, and that is fast what Bob Crow is doing. Resisting changes that make the cost of each employee cheaper is frankly suicide as far as job security is concerned.
I've travelled on tube/metro/underground systems across the UK, Europe & The World and there is nothing that the LU has that would make any of the others better. It's also by far the most expensive one. If you were to start the LU from scratch, you'd have driverless trains, automated ticket machines and a proper travelcard system (Oyster's system is frankly crap compared to one's elsewhere in the world). Every other system in the world usually has at least one member of staff visible at the stations and according to TFL or whoever this still isn't changing, it's just ticket offices they're shutting. Hong Kong is by far the best system I've used and considering I don't understand the language I find it just as easy to use as the LU and it's about the tenth of the price for a ticket. All stations are brightly lit and safe, at least the ones I went to (which was quite a few and not all of them were main stations).
The point is whenever there is the threat of any change, good or bad, Bob Crow throws a spanner in the works. He's living in the 1970s and the world has moved on. With the technology available today you could run the LU with the tenth of the workforce it currently has and for even less than a tenth of the cost. Of course Londoners can't have it both ways - if you want manned ticket offices and manned trains (despite many other cities embracing driverless trains with no complaints) then of course you're going to have to pay for it - what is it now, nearly a tenner for a return nowadays? I could feed a family of 4 on what a tube journey costs nowadays. Claiming Bob Crow is sticking to his socialist scruples is moot when hard-working families are directly negatively affected as a result of his belligerent actions - they either have to foot the bill for his demands or lose a day's wages because they can't go to work because he's called a strike. One day he will overplay his hand and leave a lot of the workers he represents in trouble, just like Unite did at Grangemouth - but at least he'll be OK as he's a millionaire and has a free house from the Government. I don't know any union that saved jobs by making it unaffordable to keep them employed, and that is fast what Bob Crow is doing. Resisting changes that make the cost of each employee cheaper is frankly suicide as far as job security is concerned.
Some good points there but a couple of corrections...
1) Crow is on 140k, that doesn't make him anywhere near a millionaire!
2) His Council House is not free, he pays rent on it.
3) Resisting change which is against the interests of their members is what any lobby group or Union does, it's why they exist.
4) You are right about HK though, superb train system.
5) In terms of technology, you are right that modern tech could (and does) save money on ticketing side - but keeping LU going is still a MASSIVE engineering feat which requires a lot of man power.
If there are too many people, there are too many people and jobs must go.
My ticket money is not there to keep excess people in employment - if there is not a requirement for them, then there will be redundancies. That is how the world works.
Who says there isn't a requirement for them? You? You really think your ticket money will go down if they get rid of these people?
I am not expecting my ticket price to go down. I just don't think it is great to pay for staff that are not needed.
Perhaps half of Sunderland should strike cause of the pesky robots they use at Nissan on the assembly line taking the jobs of the workers that previously did that role.
If there are too many people, there are too many people and jobs must go.
My ticket money is not there to keep excess people in employment - if there is not a requirement for them, then there will be redundancies. That is how the world works.
Who says there isn't a requirement for them? You? You really think your ticket money will go down if they get rid of these people?
I am not expecting my ticket price to go down. I just don't think it is great to pay for staff that are not needed.
Perhaps half of Sunderland should strike cause of the pesky robots they use at Nissan on the assembly line taking the jobs of the workers that previously did that role.
Poor example! The difference at Nissan is that they brought jobs AND technology to an area that had lost thousands of jobs. They had access to a multi-skilled workforce and need specialist teams of engineers to maintain the technology as well.
The "robots" didn't take anyone's jobs in this case.
Lots have people have forgotten where their employee rights and benefits came from in the first place. Of course it was at the generosity of the employers who willingly introduced decent living wages, holiday pay, sickness benefit, equal opportunities and on and on. Was it bollox.
If there are too many people, there are too many people and jobs must go.
My ticket money is not there to keep excess people in employment - if there is not a requirement for them, then there will be redundancies. That is how the world works.
Who says there isn't a requirement for them? You? You really think your ticket money will go down if they get rid of these people?
I am not expecting my ticket price to go down. I just don't think it is great to pay for staff that are not needed.
Perhaps half of Sunderland should strike cause of the pesky robots they use at Nissan on the assembly line taking the jobs of the workers that previously did that role.
How many redundancies have Nissan made due to the introduction of new technology? I ask this because it was a green field site and always has had modern up to date production methods since it was built. Robots were there from the outset.
Bob Crow has a job to do for his members and he does it bloody well - that's why the Tory press hate him so much.
If Boris wants to take Crow on and smash his union then he could try and do so - except Boris would have to have the balls for a long and nasty fight which might damage him politically.
As for Crows house, if he lived in a mansion he'd be attacked for that too.
What really winds the press up is that Crow does not give a toss about them or what they write about him.
I've travelled on tube/metro/underground systems across the UK, Europe & The World and there is nothing that the LU has that would make any of the others better. It's also by far the most expensive one. If you were to start the LU from scratch, you'd have driverless trains, automated ticket machines and a proper travelcard system (Oyster's system is frankly crap compared to one's elsewhere in the world). Every other system in the world usually has at least one member of staff visible at the stations and according to TFL or whoever this still isn't changing, it's just ticket offices they're shutting. Hong Kong is by far the best system I've used and considering I don't understand the language I find it just as easy to use as the LU and it's about the tenth of the price for a ticket. All stations are brightly lit and safe, at least the ones I went to (which was quite a few and not all of them were main stations).
The point is whenever there is the threat of any change, good or bad, Bob Crow throws a spanner in the works. He's living in the 1970s and the world has moved on. With the technology available today you could run the LU with the tenth of the workforce it currently has and for even less than a tenth of the cost. Of course Londoners can't have it both ways - if you want manned ticket offices and manned trains (despite many other cities embracing driverless trains with no complaints) then of course you're going to have to pay for it - what is it now, nearly a tenner for a return nowadays? I could feed a family of 4 on what a tube journey costs nowadays. Claiming Bob Crow is sticking to his socialist scruples is moot when hard-working families are directly negatively affected as a result of his belligerent actions - they either have to foot the bill for his demands or lose a day's wages because they can't go to work because he's called a strike. One day he will overplay his hand and leave a lot of the workers he represents in trouble, just like Unite did at Grangemouth - but at least he'll be OK as he's a millionaire and has a free house from the Government. I don't know any union that saved jobs by making it unaffordable to keep them employed, and that is fast what Bob Crow is doing. Resisting changes that make the cost of each employee cheaper is frankly suicide as far as job security is concerned.
This 100%. 150k would be his "official" salary before other "perks" such a union credit card with monthly allowance, business class travel etc, etc. All paid for by members who would be better off employing an Independent Industrial Relations Service to help them with any grievance should one arise. Unions have long since passed their sell by date. They have become a hotbed of greed and corruption. They were relevant 50 years ago but the world has moved on and "jobs for life" is a concept consigned to history. Forcing up wages and imposing unreasonable conditions on employers simply forces businesses to relocate to cheaper parts of the world, or automate their operations and dispose of staff as we see happening here.
And just to prove my point: Paul Howes head of the huge Australian Workers Union (AWU) has just admitted "Excessive wages growth is "pricing some sectors out of the market" Wow, that's some change of tune for a man regarded by many as being a communist. Now Paul, that change of heart would have nothing to do with the soon to be announced Abbot Government Royal Commission into Union Corruption (which is likely to include the AWU scandal fraud in which one of the major players was former PM Julia Gillard when she was solicitor and girlfriend of the perpetrator, Union boss Bruce Wilson) would it now Paul?
If there are too many people, there are too many people and jobs must go.
My ticket money is not there to keep excess people in employment - if there is not a requirement for them, then there will be redundancies. That is how the world works.
Who says there isn't a requirement for them? You? You really think your ticket money will go down if they get rid of these people?
I am not expecting my ticket price to go down. I just don't think it is great to pay for staff that are not needed.
Perhaps half of Sunderland should strike cause of the pesky robots they use at Nissan on the assembly line taking the jobs of the workers that previously did that role.
Poor example! The difference at Nissan is that they brought jobs AND technology to an area that had lost thousands of jobs. They had access to a multi-skilled workforce and need specialist teams of engineers to maintain the technology as well.
The "robots" didn't take anyone's jobs in this case.
Fair enough, just trying to give example of how times can change and fewer jobs can be needed.
On bbc they have just said more offers of voluntary redundancy than needed so no compulsory redundancies anyway.
I have an old friend on LU with ten years service who has been offered £30k to leave. Another station supervisor with long service was offered £89k. No wonder so many have said "yes please!".
Actually to be fair bob crow yesterday said on LBC said they were striking on the basis of future passenger safety which I think is truly admirable that bob crow would think of little all us. I will not be so sympathetic however where concerns about future passenger safety are set aside for a future tube driver payout ;-).
At the end of the day Bob crow wants lots of well paid union members, if any leave his future holidays might have to be less 5* and more 4* and we can't have that.
This is a personal opinion but I would love to see all of these strikers sacked and new people put in their position like what they did in New York. I can't strike, if I strike, I resign. The only unions with any power are those who can hold the public to ransom.
It doesn't particularly bother me as I can just walk for an hour as part of my new fitness thing but it bothers me that the right on left can back these people up without a thought for those who rely on the tube network to get to/from work, especially late/early shift workers eg cleaners who now can't even get a tube to work.
The problem is a bleeding liberal heart will only bleed for the most obvious thing, and if argue LU staff are probably not the poorest or most underprivileged, it's just middle class people with a union attached, people see the union and back them.
Comments
You really think your ticket money will go down if they get rid of these people?
This basically says that it's a done deal otherwise why waste money do all the the surveys, drawings etc. so going on strike is pointless and time wasting as decisions have all ready been made to close them strike it no strike LUL ain't interested there mind is made up.
And if that silent majority really object to Bob Crow why don't then stand up and vote him out?
Bob Crow stands up for his members and safety issues for the public. There is nothing wrong with that. It is not a surprise that the Daily Mail and Daily Express papers of this world don't like him for it.
As for Bob Crow, the man is doing the job he is paid for and getting the best possible deal he can for his members. And he has done it consistently over the years. As a commuter, he's a pain in the arse for me. As a union member, I wish my union (Unite) had a leadership that represented its' members as well as Crow does the RMT.
With regard to the LBC phone-in with Johnson, I take from that that LUL took the decision that this was a done deal. The RMT & TSSA are asking for that decision to be suspended for the moment and for them to be invited to discuss the future of the tube. If that was done they would call off the strikes.
That's a no-brainer surely. I have no doubt that the Unions would want the earth, wouldn't get it and another ballot would ensue, but why is that not at least a starting point? I can't see any reason why a sensible employer shouldn't engage with its' workforce in any industry.
And finally on Bob Crow. I will never forgive him for his comments on TV at a previous strike when he stood outside Liverpool Street Station and referred to the RBS Head Office. He slated the whole banking workforce, all rich & over-paid, but handily ignored the fact that the vast majority such as cashiers on £15k are on a helluva lot lower wages than he & his workforce. I wanted the leader of Unite to give him a dig over that. And...definitely a muggy spanner!!
The point is whenever there is the threat of any change, good or bad, Bob Crow throws a spanner in the works. He's living in the 1970s and the world has moved on. With the technology available today you could run the LU with the tenth of the workforce it currently has and for even less than a tenth of the cost. Of course Londoners can't have it both ways - if you want manned ticket offices and manned trains (despite many other cities embracing driverless trains with no complaints) then of course you're going to have to pay for it - what is it now, nearly a tenner for a return nowadays? I could feed a family of 4 on what a tube journey costs nowadays. Claiming Bob Crow is sticking to his socialist scruples is moot when hard-working families are directly negatively affected as a result of his belligerent actions - they either have to foot the bill for his demands or lose a day's wages because they can't go to work because he's called a strike. One day he will overplay his hand and leave a lot of the workers he represents in trouble, just like Unite did at Grangemouth - but at least he'll be OK as he's a millionaire and has a free house from the Government. I don't know any union that saved jobs by making it unaffordable to keep them employed, and that is fast what Bob Crow is doing. Resisting changes that make the cost of each employee cheaper is frankly suicide as far as job security is concerned.
1) Crow is on 140k, that doesn't make him anywhere near a millionaire!
2) His Council House is not free, he pays rent on it.
3) Resisting change which is against the interests of their members is what any lobby group or Union does, it's why they exist.
4) You are right about HK though, superb train system.
5) In terms of technology, you are right that modern tech could (and does) save money on ticketing side - but keeping LU going is still a MASSIVE engineering feat which requires a lot of man power.
Perhaps half of Sunderland should strike cause of the pesky robots they use at Nissan on the assembly line taking the jobs of the workers that previously did that role.
The "robots" didn't take anyone's jobs in this case.
Wow, that's some change of tune for a man regarded by many as being a communist.
Now Paul, that change of heart would have nothing to do with the soon to be announced Abbot Government Royal Commission into Union Corruption (which is likely to include the AWU scandal fraud in which one of the major players was former PM Julia Gillard when she was solicitor and girlfriend of the perpetrator, Union boss Bruce Wilson) would it now Paul?
On bbc they have just said more offers of voluntary redundancy than needed so no compulsory redundancies anyway.
At the end of the day Bob crow wants lots of well paid union members, if any leave his future holidays might have to be less 5* and more 4* and we can't have that.
This is a personal opinion but I would love to see all of these strikers sacked and new people put in their position like what they did in New York. I can't strike, if I strike, I resign. The only unions with any power are those who can hold the public to ransom.
It doesn't particularly bother me as I can just walk for an hour as part of my new fitness thing but it bothers me that the right on left can back these people up without a thought for those who rely on the tube network to get to/from work, especially late/early shift workers eg cleaners who now can't even get a tube to work.
The problem is a bleeding liberal heart will only bleed for the most obvious thing, and if argue LU staff are probably not the poorest or most underprivileged, it's just middle class people with a union attached, people see the union and back them.