I'd add that since 1969, in London we've had the Jubilee Line (plus major extension), completion of the Victoria line and on a smaller scale, Docklands Light Railway and East London Line extension.
Well If I listed what Paris has added in that time, it would open a new page in the thread, so I’ll just post the link
At the moment it takes me as long to get from Heathrow to Eltham by public transport as it does for the plane to get from Prague to Heathrow, and a lot more knackering too, especially in summer. And costs me £30 one way if I use the Heathrow Express. CrossRail will, one day, make it all a bit better but will still rely on my sister picking me up in Woolwich. And I really thought it had been agreed that Heathrow would be part of the zone system on Crossrail, whereas you say it will not be? Why on earth not? I cannot think of another European city where the local airport has some “ “special” price outside the citywide tariff.
London is way behind the curve on public transport, and shows no sign of catching up.
Watching those updates, you can see Mark Wild demeanour change from someone who looks like he's been sent to hell, to someone who looks like he's happy again
He'll be out of work once it opens.
He'll be a shoe-in for a big job on a transit network anywhere in the world
That airport is a national disgrace, and the average German will readily agree with that. It's not entirely clear why it has been such a fiasco.
On the other hand, Crossrail is basically the equivalent of a Paris RER line. And as always, I feel the need to remind people Crossrail was first mooted in 1974. If you take a look at the history of the RER it's a bit difficult to compare directly; they actually started building one in 1969, but that alone shows the vision in Paris that has been sadly missing in London for years. There are now FIVE of them, and the most recent was already running in 1999. 382 miles of track, 258 stations...but Crossrail, complex, connecting with existing lines, blah, blah. But hidden in the Wiki page is an interesting insight into how the RER is funded: A local tax on business. Can't have that in London, can we, old boy, that's..that's soshulism !
1. Only a small part of the construction of RER was funded by that tax (it continues in place and pays for some transport opertaional costs).
2. 25% of Crossrail was funded directly by business. Most of that was from a specific business rate levy, with about £1bn coming from taxes on development.
Well I know no more than what I read on Wikipedia, whereas you may well feel you do, but in that case maybe you should update the Wikipedia page. 25% is better than nothing, but the Wiki entry reads as if the tax paid the lions share of the more recent lines. And more significant to my previous post, at the time the Paris RERs were financed and built, we know who was in power here, and what she and her lot thought about rail, don’t we?
Either way, they have five of the things, running so long that they look pretty tatty, and we still don’t have one. For a long time, when my buddy worked on it, they boasted that it would be delivered “on time and on budget in 2018”. My buddy really believed it. (He fell ill though and passed away in 2019)
Well that's because we're shit, we do things here in a shit way and everything they do in Europe is so much better. We know. You've told us before.
I'd add that since 1969, in London we've had the Jubilee Line (plus major extension), completion of the Victoria line and on a smaller scale, Docklands Light Railway and East London Line extension.
Well If I listed what Paris has added in that time, it would open a new page in the thread, so I’ll just post the link
At the moment it takes me as long to get from Heathrow to Eltham by public transport as it does for the plane to get from Prague to Heathrow, and a lot more knackering too, especially in summer. And costs me £30 one way if I use the Heathrow Express. CrossRail will, one day, make it all a bit better but will still rely on my sister picking me up in Woolwich. And I really thought it had been agreed that Heathrow would be part of the zone system on Crossrail, whereas you say it will not be? Why on earth not? I cannot think of another European city where the local airport has some “ “special” price outside the citywide tariff.
London is way behind the curve on public transport, and shows no sign of catching up.
A fixed day single ticket can cost as little as £5.00 bought in advance.
I'd add that since 1969, in London we've had the Jubilee Line (plus major extension), completion of the Victoria line and on a smaller scale, Docklands Light Railway and East London Line extension.
Well If I listed what Paris has added in that time, it would open a new page in the thread, so I’ll just post the link
At the moment it takes me as long to get from Heathrow to Eltham by public transport as it does for the plane to get from Prague to Heathrow, and a lot more knackering too, especially in summer. And costs me £30 one way if I use the Heathrow Express. CrossRail will, one day, make it all a bit better but will still rely on my sister picking me up in Woolwich. And I really thought it had been agreed that Heathrow would be part of the zone system on Crossrail, whereas you say it will not be? Why on earth not? I cannot think of another European city where the local airport has some “ “special” price outside the citywide tariff.
London is way behind the curve on public transport, and shows no sign of catching up.
A fixed day single ticket can cost as little as £5.00 bought in advance.
1. In advance from where? TFL site?
2. That obviously does not include the Heathrow Express. So it involves (with luggage) tube to Green Park, change for Jubilee to Charing X or London Bridge and hang around there for 20 mins or so cos I just missed a Bexleyheath line.
Sorry for the rants. I’ve just had it up to here today with all things Britain
I'd add that since 1969, in London we've had the Jubilee Line (plus major extension), completion of the Victoria line and on a smaller scale, Docklands Light Railway and East London Line extension.
Well If I listed what Paris has added in that time, it would open a new page in the thread, so I’ll just post the link
At the moment it takes me as long to get from Heathrow to Eltham by public transport as it does for the plane to get from Prague to Heathrow, and a lot more knackering too, especially in summer. And costs me £30 one way if I use the Heathrow Express. CrossRail will, one day, make it all a bit better but will still rely on my sister picking me up in Woolwich. And I really thought it had been agreed that Heathrow would be part of the zone system on Crossrail, whereas you say it will not be? Why on earth not? I cannot think of another European city where the local airport has some “ “special” price outside the citywide tariff.
London is way behind the curve on public transport, and shows no sign of catching up.
A fixed day single ticket can cost as little as £5.00 bought in advance.
1. In advance from where? TFL site?
2. That obviously does not include the Heathrow Express. So it involves (with luggage) tube to Green Park, change for Jubilee to Charing X or London Bridge and hang around there for 20 mins or so cos I just missed a Bexleyheath line.
Sorry for the rants. I’ve just had it up to here today with all things Britain
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
Well that must be a Covid promo from Heathrow Express because pre Covid they hardly discounted at all. But fair play to them trying to get customers back. The opposite of Eurostar😡 I dont qualify for UK pensioner freebies, understandably. I’m a traitor 😉
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
Well that must be a Covid promo from Heathrow Express because pre Covid they hardly discounted at all. But fair play to them trying to get customers back. The opposite of Eurostar😡 I dont qualify for UK pensioner freebies, understandably. I’m a traitor 😉
Thought Eurostar was French owned. Bobing Rastards. UK pensioner freebies are paid for out of Taxation which even pensioners pay. Next rant please.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
Well that must be a Covid promo from Heathrow Express because pre Covid they hardly discounted at all. But fair play to them trying to get customers back. The opposite of Eurostar😡 I dont qualify for UK pensioner freebies, understandably. I’m a traitor 😉
Last time I travelled that route was in 2019 and the cost was £5.00. I noticed it has gone up to £5.50.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
Well that must be a Covid promo from Heathrow Express because pre Covid they hardly discounted at all. But fair play to them trying to get customers back. The opposite of Eurostar😡 I dont qualify for UK pensioner freebies, understandably. I’m a traitor 😉
Last time I travelled that route was in 2019 and the cost was £5.00. I noticed it has gone up to £5.50.
I just took a look at the offer. I too last used HE in autumn 2019, and I definitely have never seen it before, but it turns out to be a 90 day advance purchase anyway, and I never plan my London trips that far in advance.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
Well that must be a Covid promo from Heathrow Express because pre Covid they hardly discounted at all. But fair play to them trying to get customers back. The opposite of Eurostar😡 I dont qualify for UK pensioner freebies, understandably. I’m a traitor 😉
Thought Eurostar was French owned. Bobing Rastards. UK pensioner freebies are paid for out of Taxation which even pensioners pay. Next rant please.
Yeah, I know. Because I’m a UK pensioner, and I am still paying UK income tax.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
You old git!
Oi don't be rude......I got my Freedom Pass this week.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
You old git!
Oi don't be rude......I got my Freedom Pass this week.
The £5 advance ticket is for the Heathrow Express to Paddington. Bakerloo line to Charing Cross, Charing Cross to destination. I have a Freedom Pass so the journey from paddington is free.
You old git!
Oi don't be rude......I got my Freedom Pass this week.
It will be one of your greatest possessions. Don’t lose it.
That airport is a national disgrace, and the average German will readily agree with that. It's not entirely clear why it has been such a fiasco.
On the other hand, Crossrail is basically the equivalent of a Paris RER line. And as always, I feel the need to remind people Crossrail was first mooted in 1974. If you take a look at the history of the RER it's a bit difficult to compare directly; they actually started building one in 1969, but that alone shows the vision in Paris that has been sadly missing in London for years. There are now FIVE of them, and the most recent was already running in 1999. 382 miles of track, 258 stations...but Crossrail, complex, connecting with existing lines, blah, blah. But hidden in the Wiki page is an interesting insight into how the RER is funded: A local tax on business. Can't have that in London, can we, old boy, that's..that's soshulism !
1. Only a small part of the construction of RER was funded by that tax (it continues in place and pays for some transport opertaional costs).
2. 25% of Crossrail was funded directly by business. Most of that was from a specific business rate levy, with about £1bn coming from taxes on development.
Well I know no more than what I read on Wikipedia, whereas you may well feel you do, but in that case maybe you should update the Wikipedia page. 25% is better than nothing, but the Wiki entry reads as if the tax paid the lions share of the more recent lines. And more significant to my previous post, at the time the Paris RERs were financed and built, we know who was in power here, and what she and her lot thought about rail, don’t we?
Either way, they have five of the things, running so long that they look pretty tatty, and we still don’t have one. For a long time, when my buddy worked on it, they boasted that it would be delivered “on time and on budget in 2018”. My buddy really believed it. (He fell ill though and passed away in 2019)
Well that's because we're shit, we do things here in a shit way and everything they do in Europe is so much better. We know. You've told us before.
Bang on. Always the ones that leave that complain!
That airport is a national disgrace, and the average German will readily agree with that. It's not entirely clear why it has been such a fiasco.
On the other hand, Crossrail is basically the equivalent of a Paris RER line. And as always, I feel the need to remind people Crossrail was first mooted in 1974. If you take a look at the history of the RER it's a bit difficult to compare directly; they actually started building one in 1969, but that alone shows the vision in Paris that has been sadly missing in London for years. There are now FIVE of them, and the most recent was already running in 1999. 382 miles of track, 258 stations...but Crossrail, complex, connecting with existing lines, blah, blah. But hidden in the Wiki page is an interesting insight into how the RER is funded: A local tax on business. Can't have that in London, can we, old boy, that's..that's soshulism !
1. Only a small part of the construction of RER was funded by that tax (it continues in place and pays for some transport opertaional costs).
2. 25% of Crossrail was funded directly by business. Most of that was from a specific business rate levy, with about £1bn coming from taxes on development.
Well I know no more than what I read on Wikipedia, whereas you may well feel you do, but in that case maybe you should update the Wikipedia page. 25% is better than nothing, but the Wiki entry reads as if the tax paid the lions share of the more recent lines. And more significant to my previous post, at the time the Paris RERs were financed and built, we know who was in power here, and what she and her lot thought about rail, don’t we?
Either way, they have five of the things, running so long that they look pretty tatty, and we still don’t have one. For a long time, when my buddy worked on it, they boasted that it would be delivered “on time and on budget in 2018”. My buddy really believed it. (He fell ill though and passed away in 2019)
Well that's because we're shit, we do things here in a shit way and everything they do in Europe is so much better. We know. You've told us before.
Oh yes, of course I wrote that; And meanwhile the opening line of my first post on this topic "That airport is a national disgrace, and the average German will readily agree with that."was inserted in my absence by Basil Fawlty.
By the way, can you help me with something vaguely connected to your accusation? The morning after the referendum result, in the thread on the topic, one poster's contribution echoes around my head like no other from that day. I believe I can recall the exact words
" This is the first, and last, thing I will say on this thread.
This is not the country I thought it was".
A concise, devastating masterclass of a post. I have always admired it, and would love to credit the writer for it. By any chance, do you recall who it was?
That airport is a national disgrace, and the average German will readily agree with that. It's not entirely clear why it has been such a fiasco.
On the other hand, Crossrail is basically the equivalent of a Paris RER line. And as always, I feel the need to remind people Crossrail was first mooted in 1974. If you take a look at the history of the RER it's a bit difficult to compare directly; they actually started building one in 1969, but that alone shows the vision in Paris that has been sadly missing in London for years. There are now FIVE of them, and the most recent was already running in 1999. 382 miles of track, 258 stations...but Crossrail, complex, connecting with existing lines, blah, blah. But hidden in the Wiki page is an interesting insight into how the RER is funded: A local tax on business. Can't have that in London, can we, old boy, that's..that's soshulism !
1. Only a small part of the construction of RER was funded by that tax (it continues in place and pays for some transport opertaional costs).
2. 25% of Crossrail was funded directly by business. Most of that was from a specific business rate levy, with about £1bn coming from taxes on development.
Well I know no more than what I read on Wikipedia, whereas you may well feel you do, but in that case maybe you should update the Wikipedia page. 25% is better than nothing, but the Wiki entry reads as if the tax paid the lions share of the more recent lines. And more significant to my previous post, at the time the Paris RERs were financed and built, we know who was in power here, and what she and her lot thought about rail, don’t we?
Either way, they have five of the things, running so long that they look pretty tatty, and we still don’t have one. For a long time, when my buddy worked on it, they boasted that it would be delivered “on time and on budget in 2018”. My buddy really believed it. (He fell ill though and passed away in 2019)
Well that's because we're shit, we do things here in a shit way and everything they do in Europe is so much better. We know. You've told us before.
Yeah, but only if you get to pick which European country each time
Watching those updates, you can see Mark Wild demeanour change from someone who looks like he's been sent to hell, to someone who looks like he's happy again
He'll be out of work once it opens.
He'll be a shoe-in for a big job on a transit network anywhere in the world
That’s the museum at the Romney Hythe & Dymchurch railway I think
That airport is a national disgrace, and the average German will readily agree with that. It's not entirely clear why it has been such a fiasco.
On the other hand, Crossrail is basically the equivalent of a Paris RER line. And as always, I feel the need to remind people Crossrail was first mooted in 1974. If you take a look at the history of the RER it's a bit difficult to compare directly; they actually started building one in 1969, but that alone shows the vision in Paris that has been sadly missing in London for years. There are now FIVE of them, and the most recent was already running in 1999. 382 miles of track, 258 stations...but Crossrail, complex, connecting with existing lines, blah, blah. But hidden in the Wiki page is an interesting insight into how the RER is funded: A local tax on business. Can't have that in London, can we, old boy, that's..that's soshulism !
1. Only a small part of the construction of RER was funded by that tax (it continues in place and pays for some transport opertaional costs).
2. 25% of Crossrail was funded directly by business. Most of that was from a specific business rate levy, with about £1bn coming from taxes on development.
Well I know no more than what I read on Wikipedia, whereas you may well feel you do, but in that case maybe you should update the Wikipedia page. 25% is better than nothing, but the Wiki entry reads as if the tax paid the lions share of the more recent lines. And more significant to my previous post, at the time the Paris RERs were financed and built, we know who was in power here, and what she and her lot thought about rail, don’t we?
Either way, they have five of the things, running so long that they look pretty tatty, and we still don’t have one. For a long time, when my buddy worked on it, they boasted that it would be delivered “on time and on budget in 2018”. My buddy really believed it. (He fell ill though and passed away in 2019)
We actually have an RER style service in the core section of Thameslink. Both have a similar capacity in terms of passengers moved per hour per track. RER A capacity = 2000 passengers per train * 20 trains an hour = 52000. Thameslink = 1750 * 24 = 42000
For context the jubilee line moves 29000 people an hour per direction, a well designed cycle lane can move 14000 people in an hour and a lane of car traffic can move 2000 people.
Comments
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Métro
At the moment it takes me as long to get from Heathrow to Eltham by public transport as it does for the plane to get from Prague to Heathrow, and a lot more knackering too, especially in summer. And costs me £30 one way if I use the Heathrow Express. CrossRail will, one day, make it all a bit better but will still rely on my sister picking me up in Woolwich. And I really thought it had been agreed that Heathrow would be part of the zone system on Crossrail, whereas you say it will not be? Why on earth not? I cannot think of another European city where the local airport has some “ “special” price outside the citywide tariff.
2. That obviously does not include the Heathrow Express. So it involves (with luggage) tube to Green Park, change for Jubilee to Charing X or London Bridge and hang around there for 20 mins or so cos I just missed a Bexleyheath line.
Sorry for the rants. I’ve just had it up to here today with all things Britain
UK pensioner freebies are paid for out of Taxation which even pensioners pay.
Next rant please.
Last time I travelled that route was in 2019 and the cost was £5.00. I noticed it has gone up to £5.50.
Don’t lose it.
By the way, can you help me with something vaguely connected to your accusation? The morning after the referendum result, in the thread on the topic, one poster's contribution echoes around my head like no other from that day. I believe I can recall the exact words
" This is the first, and last, thing I will say on this thread.
This is not the country I thought it was".
A concise, devastating masterclass of a post. I have always admired it, and would love to credit the writer for it. By any chance, do you recall who it was?
Crossrail: 'A journey from embarrassing farce to shiny railway'
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-60085498First look at the Crossrail trains under London
For context the jubilee line moves 29000 people an hour per direction, a well designed cycle lane can move 14000 people in an hour and a lane of car traffic can move 2000 people.
Design & Architecture: Woolwich Elizabeth line station