the no.1 bottleneck on any PC in most applications is the hard drive speed, yet people just dismiss it as a non-issue.
Yeah, but he's not trying to break any benchmark records, he just wants to surf the web and write the odd complaints letter to Katrien. SSDs are obviously the future but are currently a bit pricey for the relative lack of capacity.
I have a 6 year old computer sat on my desk right now that could run the applications he wants by adding a 50 quid graphics card.
A spinning hard drive will give him more than enough speed plus much more capacity for less cost. He'd be better spending more money now on the processor so it is still somewhat fast in a couple of years time, ready for a quick hard drive upgrade when the cost to capacity ratio for SSDs becomes a bit more favourable.
You lads disagreeing makes it so so hard knowing what to pick... Had another quote today...
Dear Matt,
As requested here is a good PC spec to start from, if you want to drop the price a bit we could remove the extra 1TB storage drive. This PC is super-fast at booting, it will boot and be ready in under 30 seconds and it has good graphics performance but if you need better you can upgrade it later. It should be more than good enough to play Football Manager without needing an upgrade. All prices are including VAT.
New Desktop PC
Windows 10 Home 64bit Intel Pentium Dual Core G3450 3.40GHz Kingston 4GB 1600MHz DDR3 Non-ECC CL11 DIMM Memory Kingston SSDNow V300 240GB SATA 3 2.5inch SSD Toshiba 1TB High-Performance Hard Drive DVD Writer, USB 3.0, VGA DVI HDMI
£493.49 (including VAT)
Optional Upgrade Options Change Processor to Core i3 from +£25 Change Processor to Core i5 from +£78 Change SSD to 480GB = +£80 Add 4GB RAM = +£18 Add Performance Graphics Card = +£80 Add Wireless Card = +£25
Optional Extras Microsoft Keyboard & Mouse +£27.60 Microsoft Wireless Keyboard & Mouse +£34.80 21.5’’ Acer Full HD LCD Monitor 1920 x 1080 +£88.99
Regards,
Dan Priest | IT Technician Phone: 01935 434243 | Email: dan@wessexcomputers.com | Web: www.wessexcomputers.com
the no.1 bottleneck on any PC in most applications is the hard drive speed, yet people just dismiss it as a non-issue.
Yeah, but he's not trying to break any benchmark records, he just wants to surf the web and write the odd complaints letter to Katrien. SSDs are obviously the future but are currently a bit pricey for the relative lack of capacity.
I have a 6 year old computer sat on my desk right now that could run the applications he wants by adding a 50 quid graphics card.
A spinning hard drive will give him more than enough speed plus much more capacity for less cost. He'd be better spending more money now on the processor so it is still somewhat fast in a couple of years time, ready for a quick hard drive upgrade when the cost to capacity ratio for SSDs becomes a bit more favourable.
It's a false enconomy for the extra cost. Would you buy an HD Ready TV?
An additional would be a graphics card. An SSD is an essential. Unless you have a tight budget that stipulates otherwise. Also if you are not computer savvy you save on the cost of transferring data later on.
When the UK finally sorts it's dark fibre out and upgrades its wifi / cell networks, people will no longer look at hard drive sizes as it will be irrelevant, all will all be cloud based. Your own device will literally boot and that's it.
the no.1 bottleneck on any PC in most applications is the hard drive speed, yet people just dismiss it as a non-issue.
Yeah, but he's not trying to break any benchmark records, he just wants to surf the web and write the odd complaints letter to Katrien. SSDs are obviously the future but are currently a bit pricey for the relative lack of capacity.
I have a 6 year old computer sat on my desk right now that could run the applications he wants by adding a 50 quid graphics card.
A spinning hard drive will give him more than enough speed plus much more capacity for less cost. He'd be better spending more money now on the processor so it is still somewhat fast in a couple of years time, ready for a quick hard drive upgrade when the cost to capacity ratio for SSDs becomes a bit more favourable.
It's a false enconomy for the extra cost. Would you buy an HD Ready TV?
An additional would be a graphics card. An SSD is an essential. Unless you have a tight budget that stipulates otherwise. Also if you are not computer savvy you save on the cost of transferring data later on.
When the UK finally sorts it's dark fibre out and upgrades its wifi / cell networks, people will no longer look at hard drive sizes as it will be irrelevant, all will all be cloud based. Your own device will literally boot and that's it.
I don't think you understand what the word essential means.
I see that in Cray Addick's latest post, he has been quoted to include both a small 240GB fast SDD and a much bigger but slower mechanical HDD.
For now IMO it's a decent compromise, putting your Operating System (eg Windows) and frequently used programmes on the SSD, using it as a boot drive - those will open really quickly.
All your other stuff can be stored on the mechanical disk, where there's plenty of storage.
You lads disagreeing makes it so so hard knowing what to pick... Had another quote today...
Dear Matt,
As requested here is a good PC spec to start from, if you want to drop the price a bit we could remove the extra 1TB storage drive. This PC is super-fast at booting, it will boot and be ready in under 30 seconds and it has good graphics performance but if you need better you can upgrade it later. It should be more than good enough to play Football Manager without needing an upgrade. All prices are including VAT.
New Desktop PC
Windows 10 Home 64bit Intel Pentium Dual Core G3450 3.40GHz Kingston 4GB 1600MHz DDR3 Non-ECC CL11 DIMM Memory Kingston SSDNow V300 240GB SATA 3 2.5inch SSD Toshiba 1TB High-Performance Hard Drive DVD Writer, USB 3.0, VGA DVI HDMI
£493.49 (including VAT)
Optional Upgrade Options Change Processor to Core i3 from +£25 Change Processor to Core i5 from +£78 Change SSD to 480GB = +£80 Add 4GB RAM = +£18 Add Performance Graphics Card = +£80 Add Wireless Card = +£25
Optional Extras Microsoft Keyboard & Mouse +£27.60 Microsoft Wireless Keyboard & Mouse +£34.80 21.5’’ Acer Full HD LCD Monitor 1920 x 1080 +£88.99
Regards,
Dan Priest | IT Technician Phone: 01935 434243 | Email: dan@wessexcomputers.com | Web: www.wessexcomputers.com
Processor is weak, I'd go for 8 mb of RAM. Having the two hard drives gives you the best of both worlds though, fast booting and plenty of storage space.
It's a shame that SSD is a right bottom of the range one but still better than a mechanical drive. The SSD + HDD combo is one I use and is a great compromise. If I were you @CrayAddick I'd get the i3 + SSD/HDD combo + graphics card (though a bit concerned that you haven't mentioned what card it is).
SSDs are as good as essential. They improve all day-to-day uses of a PC which i'm sure @CrayAddick will use it for 90% of the time.
When you go back to using a computer with a spinning disk, you want to chuck it out of the window
I get that, until I got my first car with air conditioning I was fine with opening the window, now I've experienced AC I'd want it on any car I buy in the future.
Cray hasn't had an SSD though so he won't know the difference. If he can get one for his money then he should, I just think there are other priorities when building a cheap(ish) machine for tasks that will not be particularly testing.
Essential in this case is defined as not wasting money. SSDs are not the future, SSDs are now. All OS software will be designed with SSDs in mind, probably has been for the last 2-3 years. Buying a conventional primary hard drive when an SSD is readily available and not outrageously priced is insanity.
Whatever you do, back it up. It's essential. A conventional hard drive for storing / backing up infrequently accessed files is fine as suggested above, but, if you are not computer savvy then you should just go for the one option. Installing software across disks will become cumbersome and eventually drive you insane.
OK. So we think he should upgrade to the i3, get the 480GB SSD and the mysterious unspecified GPU. I think that's sensible and will last Cray a good 5 years
OK. So we think he should upgrade to the i3, get the 480GB SSD and the mysterious unspecified GPU. I think that's sensible and will last Cray a good 5 years
If he gets the 480 he can probably ditch the 1TB drive and put some of the money saved towards the other upgrades. I'd want 8MB of ram too. Would be nice to know what speed i3 we're talking about.
The price is creeping up though... suspect you may be able to get it cheaper elsewhere.
I just went on Novatech.co.uk (A housemate of mine bought a PC from them and it's still going 5 years later so reputable).
They will give you:
CPU: Intel i3 6100 (very new and should be excellent) RAM: 8GB DDR4 Ram (More than enough and fast) Graphics: Nvidia GT730 2GB Graphics card SSD: Samsung 850 EVO 250GB Windows 10 Other: DVD drive
For £494 which is a much better deal than the one you've been quoted.
It has enough raw processing performance, a super quick hard drive, sufficient RAM, Latest version of windows and a dedicated graphics card.
Looks a decent spec. I still think 250 GB will fill up pretty fast with photos, music, videos etc but there's a fair amount of bang for your buck there.
I just went on Novatech.co.uk (A housemate of mine bought a PC from them and it's still going 5 years later so reputable).
They will give you:
CPU: Intel i3 6100 (very new and should be excellent) RAM: 8GB DDR4 Ram (More than enough and fast) Graphics: Nvidia GT730 2GB Graphics card SSD: Samsung 850 EVO 250GB Windows 10 Other: DVD drive
For £494 which is a much better deal than the one you've been quoted.
It has enough raw processing performance, a super quick hard drive, sufficient RAM, Latest version of windows and a dedicated graphics card.
@CrayAddick go for that novatech pc, it is alot better to get a company to build a pc for you rather than buy one from the likes of HP,Dell ect. More value for money.
Cray build your own its pretty easy, tons of guides online and this will be a top system for the money and will last for years. All parts listed and cheapest place to buy them. Heres link i found: http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/zPGmYJ
CPU: Intel Core i5-6400 2.7GHz Quad-Core Processor (£149.99 @ Ebuyer) Motherboard: Asus H110M-K D3 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£46.98 @ Ebuyer) Memory: Patriot Signature 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£27.99 @ Amazon UK) Storage: Sandisk Z400s 128GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£31.98 @ Novatech) Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£37.00 @ Amazon UK) Video Card: PowerColor Radeon R9 380X 4GB PCS+ Myst. Edition Video Card (£186.99 @ Ebuyer) Case: Fractal Design Core 1100 MicroATX Mini Tower Case (£28.49 @ Novatech) Power Supply: EVGA 500W 80+ Certified ATX Power Supply (£34.99 @ Novatech) Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 OEM (64-bit) (£59.99 @ Amazon UK) Wireless Network Adapter: TP-Link TL-WN725N 802.11b/g/n USB 2.0 Wi-Fi Adapter (£6.98 @ Novatech) Total: £611.38 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
or change video card for: EVGA GeForce GTX 750 Ti 2GB Superclocked Video Card (£99.98 @ Novatech) Total: £524.37
If still too expensive play around abit and create your own.
I find it unbelieveable, people recommending that Cray builds his own PC.
I doubt that most people would want to build their own PC. I know they are only trying to be helpful, but come on. If he hasn't a clue of which one to buy, he's hardly likely to build his own.
Comments
I have a 6 year old computer sat on my desk right now that could run the applications he wants by adding a 50 quid graphics card.
A spinning hard drive will give him more than enough speed plus much more capacity for less cost. He'd be better spending more money now on the processor so it is still somewhat fast in a couple of years time, ready for a quick hard drive upgrade when the cost to capacity ratio for SSDs becomes a bit more favourable.
Dear Matt,
As requested here is a good PC spec to start from, if you want to drop the price a bit we could remove the extra 1TB storage drive. This PC is super-fast at booting, it will boot and be ready in under 30 seconds and it has good graphics performance but if you need better you can upgrade it later. It should be more than good enough to play Football Manager without needing an upgrade. All prices are including VAT.
New Desktop PC
Windows 10 Home 64bit
Intel Pentium Dual Core G3450 3.40GHz
Kingston 4GB 1600MHz DDR3 Non-ECC CL11 DIMM Memory
Kingston SSDNow V300 240GB SATA 3 2.5inch SSD
Toshiba 1TB High-Performance Hard Drive
DVD Writer, USB 3.0, VGA DVI HDMI
£493.49 (including VAT)
Optional Upgrade Options
Change Processor to Core i3 from +£25
Change Processor to Core i5 from +£78
Change SSD to 480GB = +£80
Add 4GB RAM = +£18
Add Performance Graphics Card = +£80
Add Wireless Card = +£25
Optional Extras
Microsoft Keyboard & Mouse +£27.60
Microsoft Wireless Keyboard & Mouse +£34.80
21.5’’ Acer Full HD LCD Monitor 1920 x 1080 +£88.99
Regards,
Dan Priest | IT Technician
Phone: 01935 434243 | Email: dan@wessexcomputers.com | Web: www.wessexcomputers.com
An additional would be a graphics card. An SSD is an essential. Unless you have a tight budget that stipulates otherwise. Also if you are not computer savvy you save on the cost of transferring data later on.
When the UK finally sorts it's dark fibre out and upgrades its wifi / cell networks, people will no longer look at hard drive sizes as it will be irrelevant, all will all be cloud based. Your own device will literally boot and that's it.
When you go back to using a computer with a spinning disk, you want to chuck it out of the window
For now IMO it's a decent compromise, putting your Operating System (eg Windows) and frequently used programmes on the SSD, using it as a boot drive - those will open really quickly.
All your other stuff can be stored on the mechanical disk, where there's plenty of storage.
This is a useful website for comparing processor performance. http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Pentium+G3450+@+3.40GHz
I still think you could get it cheaper though
Cray hasn't had an SSD though so he won't know the difference. If he can get one for his money then he should, I just think there are other priorities when building a cheap(ish) machine for tasks that will not be particularly testing.
Whatever you do, back it up. It's essential. A conventional hard drive for storing / backing up infrequently accessed files is fine as suggested above, but, if you are not computer savvy then you should just go for the one option. Installing software across disks will become cumbersome and eventually drive you insane.
The price is creeping up though... suspect you may be able to get it cheaper elsewhere.
I just went on Novatech.co.uk (A housemate of mine bought a PC from them and it's still going 5 years later so reputable).
They will give you:
CPU: Intel i3 6100 (very new and should be excellent)
RAM: 8GB DDR4 Ram (More than enough and fast)
Graphics: Nvidia GT730 2GB Graphics card
SSD: Samsung 850 EVO 250GB
Windows 10
Other: DVD drive
For £494 which is a much better deal than the one you've been quoted.
It has enough raw processing performance, a super quick hard drive, sufficient RAM, Latest version of windows and a dedicated graphics card.
I invite comments.
(top left) Desktop PCs
Under 'For Home' > 'Home Tower'
Novatech Life NTI199 > Customise
Case: Default
Motherboard: Default
Processor: Intel 6th Gen Dual Core i3 6100 3.7GHZ (+£45.11)
Processor Cooling: Default
Memory: 8GB (2x4GB) DDR4 2133Mhz (+£17.26)
GPU: EVGA GeForce GT730 Silent/Low Profile 2GB GDDR3 (+55.50)
HardDrive(1): Samsung 850 EVO SATA 6GB/s 2.5" 250GB SSD (+71.18)
HardDrive(2): No hard drive required (£-33.04)
DVD: Default
PSU: Default
Mouse: Default
Keyboard: Default
Sound/Audio Default
Operating System: Windows 10 for high end devices (£+79.99)
Office: Default
Warranty: Default
So the components that I've customised i've put in bold
CPU: Intel Core i5-6400 2.7GHz Quad-Core Processor (£149.99 @ Ebuyer)
Motherboard: Asus H110M-K D3 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£46.98 @ Ebuyer)
Memory: Patriot Signature 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£27.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Sandisk Z400s 128GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£31.98 @ Novatech)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£37.00 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: PowerColor Radeon R9 380X 4GB PCS+ Myst. Edition Video Card (£186.99 @ Ebuyer)
Case: Fractal Design Core 1100 MicroATX Mini Tower Case (£28.49 @ Novatech)
Power Supply: EVGA 500W 80+ Certified ATX Power Supply (£34.99 @ Novatech)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 OEM (64-bit) (£59.99 @ Amazon UK)
Wireless Network Adapter: TP-Link TL-WN725N 802.11b/g/n USB 2.0 Wi-Fi Adapter (£6.98 @ Novatech)
Total: £611.38
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
or change video card for:
EVGA GeForce GTX 750 Ti 2GB Superclocked Video Card (£99.98 @ Novatech)
Total: £524.37
If still too expensive play around abit and create your own.
A lot of people on here seem to think you need a high spec PC for all tasks?
My cousin uses this for his gaming: http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/view-item/Fusion-550-gaming-pc/?gclid=CKTdzbmE7coCFZadGwodmu8GxQ
and he's a proper steam fanboy.
I doubt that most people would want to build their own PC. I know they are only trying to be helpful, but come on. If he hasn't a clue of which one to buy, he's hardly likely to build his own.
Have you decided yet, Cray?