She really had nothing to say except a rather strange idea that I might be worried about speaking to her face to face. I'm guessing that the background to this is that I don't routinely cross the road, stand in her way or shout at her when she arrives at work four hours after her staff, which is quite true. I usually ignore her, indeed I don't always notice her.
The reason I don't confront her is that I think it both could and would appear aggressive - and provide the opportunity for her to play the victim, which she's very good at. I'm not playing that game, thanks.
She did exactly the right thing today by embracing the protest (accepting a sticker and a mask) and approaching me was no doubt also part of showing she wasn't affected by it. I'm sure she'd given it a lot of thought, but ask yourself why she was coming over to me when she actually had nothing to say.
I asked her some questions about why she will only speak to handpicked fans and cannot appear in front of them without surrounding herself with other staff, which she didn't answer. I asked her why she has never been willing to engage with the people who ran the club for 15 years and why she is so frightened of speaking to Varney, who she sneered at.
At that point two of the hovering goons intervened and indicated I wasn't allowed to continue, although as it was the street it was nothing to do with them. With hindsight I'd probably have played it differently, but then unlike Katrien I hadn't spent the last hour planning it.
Please take what I'm about to say with this in mind: this is my simple attempt at trying to help improve communication (and if this has already been attempted and I missed it, disregard and I apologize). It is meant with honesty and humility. I am nowhere near SE7, I have watched and followed the protests and responses from afar, I have not been supporting Charlton for nearly as long as most of you, and there are some things I agree with protestors on, some things less so. At the end of the day I think the club is poorly run. I would like to do what I can to help.
Everything about RD's interviews this week said to me that he has no plans to go anywhere. Given that he talks about "learning from mistakes," and this has become a common trope, but cannot provide any examples or any even vague outline of a plan on how to implement these things. To me it feels that he is incredibly insular, and that this is not a healthy business structure, or a particularly productive one.
As such, and @Airman Brown this is not to criticize your interaction today, but it feels like CARD should need to at least be prepared to engage in direct discourse with the regime in a number of forums (including, apparently, a road outside the ground). Are they? Are some of the leaders prepared to speak (calmly and civilly) to members of the regime on matter such as (and I'm using my own examples here, I know CARD have their own):
"We would like to understand the structure and running of the transfer policy when the club lacks a DoF and Chief Scout and when most business is done outside the window. What percentage of players are identified by agents, and what percentage by scouts?"
"If FFP does not progress beyond transfer bans for offenders, what are the club's plans to remain competitive in a division that is becoming an arms race? What impacts will it have on the playing staff, both at present and who we will be able to attract? Are you familiar with the history of the Premier League, specifically over the past 10-15 years and the fact that it has led to a horrible boom-bust culture (See: Portsmouth, West Ham, Bolton, Blackburn, Manchester United, Liverpool, Manchester City, etc.)?"
"Can you please explain, using example, how, in footballing terms, Charlton Athletic Football Club has directly benefited from being a part of a network of clubs who do not seem to face the same challenges or are at the same level as CAFC?"
"Do the club have plans for the reduction in income that will result from dropping down to League One? Please understand that numerous clubs have lost huge amounts of money, or nearly been bankrupted (Portsmouth, Newcastle, QPR, Bolton) by not being prepared for a drop in divisions."
Protests are an excellent method to get attention, and to provide a voice to the masses who might otherwise be voiceless. Protests are not so good with nuanced discourse. I am just trying to ask if CARD is prepared to evolve. And also, if there is anything I can do to help (I have a background in writing and do a fair amount of speaking), I would be honored to do so.
Okay, you can all go about calling me a useless keyboard warrior .
The problem is, CAST have been trying to get proper dialogue with the Katrien for months now, and appear (although I am willing to be corrected) to have had little success beyond being invited along to the odd supporters' meeting where Jackson's been used as a human shield. Perhaps if there was any indication that the regime was prepared to listen to fans rather than just keep talking at us, then we wouldn't be where we are now.
Personally I'm perfectly happy for CARD to be the awkward squad and CAST to be the voice of reason.
3 London away games left this season. Fulham on saturday, Brentford next month and QPR in April. If any disruption is likely to be caused then there is more chance of that happening at those away games than at home.
However the last home game of the season against Burnley will be very interesting especially if we are relegated by then and Burnley need something to go up. Sky and the football league would not want to see a scenario where the game is abandoned and effects the promotion places and play off fixtures.
She really had nothing to say except a rather strange idea that I might be worried about speaking to her face to face. I'm guessing that the background to this is that I don't routinely cross the road, stand in her way or shout at her when she arrives at work four hours after her staff, which is quite true. I usually ignore her, indeed I don't always notice her.
The reason I don't confront her is that I think it both could and would appear aggressive - and provide the opportunity for her to play the victim, which she's very good at. I'm not playing that game, thanks.
She did exactly the right thing today by embracing the protest (accepting a sticker and a mask) and approaching me was no doubt also part of showing she wasn't affected by it. I'm sure she'd given it a lot of thought, but ask yourself why she was coming over to me when she actually had nothing to say.
I asked her some questions about why she will only speak to handpicked fans and cannot appear in front of them without surrounding herself with other staff, which she didn't answer. I asked her why she has never been willing to engage with the people who ran the club for 15 years and why she is so frightened of speaking to Varney, who she sneered at.
At that point two of the hovering goons intervened and indicated I wasn't allowed to continue, although as it was the street it was nothing to do with them. With hindsight I'd probably have played it differently, but then unlike Katrien I hadn't spent the last hour planning it.
Please take what I'm about to say with this in mind: this is my simple attempt at trying to help improve communication (and if this has already been attempted and I missed it, disregard and I apologize). It is meant with honesty and humility. I am nowhere near SE7, I have watched and followed the protests and responses from afar, I have not been supporting Charlton for nearly as long as most of you, and there are some things I agree with protestors on, some things less so. At the end of the day I think the club is poorly run. I would like to do what I can to help.
Everything about RD's interviews this week said to me that he has no plans to go anywhere. Given that he talks about "learning from mistakes," and this has become a common trope, but cannot provide any examples or any even vague outline of a plan on how to implement these things. To me it feels that he is incredibly insular, and that this is not a healthy business structure, or a particularly productive one.
As such, and @Airman Brown this is not to criticize your interaction today, but it feels like CARD should need to at least be prepared to engage in direct discourse with the regime in a number of forums (including, apparently, a road outside the ground). Are they? Are some of the leaders prepared to speak (calmly and civilly) to members of the regime on matter such as (and I'm using my own examples here, I know CARD have their own):
"We would like to understand the structure and running of the transfer policy when the club lacks a DoF and Chief Scout and when most business is done outside the window. What percentage of players are identified by agents, and what percentage by scouts?"
"If FFP does not progress beyond transfer bans for offenders, what are the club's plans to remain competitive in a division that is becoming an arms race? What impacts will it have on the playing staff, both at present and who we will be able to attract? Are you familiar with the history of the Premier League, specifically over the past 10-15 years and the fact that it has led to a horrible boom-bust culture (See: Portsmouth, West Ham, Bolton, Blackburn, Manchester United, Liverpool, Manchester City, etc.)?"
"Can you please explain, using example, how, in footballing terms, Charlton Athletic Football Club has directly benefited from being a part of a network of clubs who do not seem to face the same challenges or are at the same level as CAFC?"
"Do the club have plans for the reduction in income that will result from dropping down to League One? Please understand that numerous clubs have lost huge amounts of money, or nearly been bankrupted (Portsmouth, Newcastle, QPR, Bolton) by not being prepared for a drop in divisions."
Protests are an excellent method to get attention, and to provide a voice to the masses who might otherwise be voiceless. Protests are not so good with nuanced discourse. I am just trying to ask if CARD is prepared to evolve. And also, if there is anything I can do to help (I have a background in writing and do a fair amount of speaking), I would be honored to do so.
Okay, you can all go about calling me a useless keyboard warrior .
As Aliwibble says, there have been multiple, continuous efforts by numerous people, me included at times, to engage with Meire over two years. If she doesn't fail to reply at all, which is her default, she procrastinates.
Those who have got so far as sitting down with her have not found it a worthwhile exercise. CAST and Target 20,000, in which she agreed one thing and then almost immediately did another, was just about the final straw for people who had tried to deal with her over many months.
It's worth remembering that Henry and the Spell It Out people's questions were an attempt to proceed in just this way back in October - he was accused by her of "inciting a riot". For promoting the wearing of black and white scarves!
Meire is the Karel Fraeye of the non-playing side of the club. No amount of dialogue is going to change that, in my view. If she went or Duchatelet chose to engage himself (which is still unlikely IMO) things might be different but based on her ability and attitude I can't see any useful purpose in talking further to her. As with Fraeye, she appears to have no grasp of how far she is out of her depth.
I think , as with anything , you can't please all of the people all of the time and I for one am truly grateful that CARD are doing something because anything is better than nothing It's all too easy for me to sit back and say that wasn't right or this wasn't right but I'm not capable of organising or arranging anything that will come anywhere near these sort of levels of ridicule that we are putting on the joke operation that are running our club These owners appear set in their (shit) ways and the hotheaded part of me thinks let's be orrible and threaten Roland like the Standard fans did but no sane person is gonna do that with the potential repercussions illegal behaviour could entail. So what can we do to rid our self of these nutters , well I don't know but what CARD are doing is much better than doing nothing.
I haven't spent a penny in the ground since prolly October , no programmes , refreshments , club merchandise , mascot packages etc or anything and I will not be buying any season tickets next year I'll pick and chose
I didn't go today, using the cold wet weather as a reason not to go with 3 of my sons , there is no way this would have happened in the past, no matter how poor the teamor weather has been but my disgust at the clowns running the club has driven me to the lowest point of love I've ever had for this great club of ours , they have to go.
Keep up the good fight because these people deserve no respite for their insular approach to things (says the bloke sitting on his arse at home!)
I have to admit that I was a bit underwhelmed with the Pinocchio day announcement, as I was expecting more. But then, I'm not involved in the organisation of it, nor have even given my thoughts to what form the protests should take. So, I won't criticise CARD for thinking outside of the box.
In fact, even though I was underwhelmed I still wore the mask at the car park protest, along with the wife & kids. They too were all wearing the masks too, I should add that I could only stay for half an hr as I've been battling the flu all week, and was amazed I even made the game at all. If it wasn't for a protest after the game, I might've given the whole game a miss.
As for boycotts, I haven't bought any merchandise all season, food & drink (and beer) since end of October, or a programme since Xmas (buying one was religious for me), and I strill haven't decided about our 4 STs for next year yet!
Anyway, back to the protest. Cudos for the A0 blow up of the companies house form! I cracked up at that, and the companies house songs. Still not sure disney masks are the way forward, and who knows if that played a part in the much poorer numbers in the car park this week, or not. But it does worry me, that the numbers were dropping and the stand up chants seem to be waining.
We can't let the regime win! We must continue until they pack up and leave.
CARD need to continue to do the things which keep visible pressure up on the club, and in my opinion are doing it very well. I would love to see how much stewarding/policing costs have gone up as a consequence. Surprised katrien hasn't played the "we wanted to sign messi but unfortunately our policing bill due to protests stopped us" card yet
Fans as a group need to keep doing the things which keep financial pressure up on the club. It would be nice to see the food queues even shorter (yesterday is fair enough as it was mostly families and people who will never come again buying the food)
Individuals with sheer brilliance need to keep doing things like the Company House prank.
Media attention I doubt they care about but I think keeps us in good spirits. Financial losses will definitely bother them, more so than anything else, whereas for other owners, bad media attention would bother them more than financial losses.. The sheer embarrassment of the companies house thing is brilliant. You have to remember katrien is effectively the boss at the valley, and things like that will have people giggling at the water cooler. The last thing you want at work is to be a laughing stock.
May I suggest that all those on here that thought the masks were either silly, childish, abusive etc please tell us all their ideas for the next protest.
People are allowed to say what they think about today's protest even if they don't agree. It's called having an opinion. That's what forums like CL are all about. I didn't think today's idea was great or a good use of funds but I'm fully behind what CARD is doing. Just because someone might not agree with the form of protest it doesn't automatically mean they have come up with a better idea. Don't shoot people down just because they might disagree. Rant over
Bit touchy aren't you. I was merely asking a polite question.
Having actively and financially supported them from before they launched and after (and having turned down multiple offers to join their board) I was very critical of their survey and mustn't upset anyone stance.
So now they are being active, while rightly leaving the door open to dialogue, I say well done and keep it up. That whetr a Trust should stand.
She really had nothing to say except a rather strange idea that I might be worried about speaking to her face to face. I'm guessing that the background to this is that I don't routinely cross the road, stand in her way or shout at her when she arrives at work four hours after her staff, which is quite true. I usually ignore her, indeed I don't always notice her.
The reason I don't confront her is that I think it both could and would appear aggressive - and provide the opportunity for her to play the victim, which she's very good at. I'm not playing that game, thanks.
She did exactly the right thing today by embracing the protest (accepting a sticker and a mask) and approaching me was no doubt also part of showing she wasn't affected by it. I'm sure she'd given it a lot of thought, but ask yourself why she was coming over to me when she actually had nothing to say.
I asked her some questions about why she will only speak to handpicked fans and cannot appear in front of them without surrounding herself with other staff, which she didn't answer. I asked her why she has never been willing to engage with the people who ran the club for 15 years and why she is so frightened of speaking to Varney, who she sneered at.
At that point two of the hovering goons intervened and indicated I wasn't allowed to continue, although as it was the street it was nothing to do with them. With hindsight I'd probably have played it differently, but then unlike Katrien I hadn't spent the last hour planning it.
Please take what I'm about to say with this in mind: this is my simple attempt at trying to help improve communication (and if this has already been attempted and I missed it, disregard and I apologize). It is meant with honesty and humility. I am nowhere near SE7, I have watched and followed the protests and responses from afar, I have not been supporting Charlton for nearly as long as most of you, and there are some things I agree with protestors on, some things less so. At the end of the day I think the club is poorly run. I would like to do what I can to help.
Everything about RD's interviews this week said to me that he has no plans to go anywhere. Given that he talks about "learning from mistakes," and this has become a common trope, but cannot provide any examples or any even vague outline of a plan on how to implement these things. To me it feels that he is incredibly insular, and that this is not a healthy business structure, or a particularly productive one.
As such, and @Airman Brown this is not to criticize your interaction today, but it feels like CARD should need to at least be prepared to engage in direct discourse with the regime in a number of forums (including, apparently, a road outside the ground). Are they? Are some of the leaders prepared to speak (calmly and civilly) to members of the regime on matter such as (and I'm using my own examples here, I know CARD have their own):
"We would like to understand the structure and running of the transfer policy when the club lacks a DoF and Chief Scout and when most business is done outside the window. What percentage of players are identified by agents, and what percentage by scouts?"
"If FFP does not progress beyond transfer bans for offenders, what are the club's plans to remain competitive in a division that is becoming an arms race? What impacts will it have on the playing staff, both at present and who we will be able to attract? Are you familiar with the history of the Premier League, specifically over the past 10-15 years and the fact that it has led to a horrible boom-bust culture (See: Portsmouth, West Ham, Bolton, Blackburn, Manchester United, Liverpool, Manchester City, etc.)?"
"Can you please explain, using example, how, in footballing terms, Charlton Athletic Football Club has directly benefited from being a part of a network of clubs who do not seem to face the same challenges or are at the same level as CAFC?"
"Do the club have plans for the reduction in income that will result from dropping down to League One? Please understand that numerous clubs have lost huge amounts of money, or nearly been bankrupted (Portsmouth, Newcastle, QPR, Bolton) by not being prepared for a drop in divisions."
Protests are an excellent method to get attention, and to provide a voice to the masses who might otherwise be voiceless. Protests are not so good with nuanced discourse. I am just trying to ask if CARD is prepared to evolve. And also, if there is anything I can do to help (I have a background in writing and do a fair amount of speaking), I would be honored to do so.
Okay, you can all go about calling me a useless keyboard warrior .
Fans groups and individuals have gone out of their way over the past 2 years to engage with this mob.
The Trust have tried the nicely nicely approach and had that olive branch snapped, countless emails have been ignored and offers of dialogue snubbed by a multitude of people who have signalled the slightest element of dissent or not toeing the party line.
The result being that in2 years we've had:
- A staged video with a youngster - A pathetic power point "Q&A" which was risible in the contempt shown on that stage by Murray and Meire and the cowardly inclusion of Jackson to keep things civil. Extremely civil. -A staged Q& A by murray in which his scripted answers were entirely contradicted within a fortnight by the actions that followed - Valley Gold meetings in which the discontent is given lip service - Fans Forum meetings where they turn up mob handed with palace- supporting staff so far up their harris it's cringeworthy and then proceed to belittle and sneer at deidcated earnest fans - More recent staged interviews and press releases in which the puppet master dons his returning estranged father act and pretends now daddy is home and everything is ok continuing to patronise the supporters in the hope of appeasing them and duping them long enough to continue his futile masterplan
and probably much more.
People that have spent a lot of time and effort like Rikofold have tried the diplomatic approach and have often been derided for it by fans whilst effectively been taken for granted by the board rather than embraced for their manner and delivery of the message.
The bottom line is they don't give a monkey's toss about fans' views. Whenever I hear platitudes or see a picture of a laughing Meire holding one of CARD's very own masks the phrase "Fans need to understand it's Roland's way or nothing" rings loud in my ears. We were told this with great aplumb 2 years ago when the first seeds of discontent were sown and the message remains true today. Actions speak louder than words and the table shows our position has been made by our lame duck squad on the cheap and cobbled together by another one of their men in Riga who is happy to be compliant yet again for the fourth time in his not so sterling career.
The softly softly let's have dialogue approach has been rejected and sneered at for 2 years now. The time for talking is over and collectively we need to do whatever it is to get this mob out asap as they will not be going anywhere otherwise and will not change, that much is evident over the past 2 years and has been underlined and highlighted in bold in recent months.
This is from the opening post on the setting up of C.A.R.D.
"The meeting was also attended by observers from the board of the Charlton Athletic Supporters’ Trust. All present played a full part in discussions at a very productive and consensual meeting."
So, there's a clue right there.
@Curb_It as an early donator to the protest fund, in my opinion the masks, etc were an excellent idea. It is good to mix things up. While songs, boycotts, abuse, an undercurrent of hate and the potential for violence all have their place in protests to keep resources tied up, sometimes a little bit of ridicule works wonders. By way of example, I'd refer doubters to what effects the bacon sandwich and Ed Stone had on Miliband......
Meire has been selective on who she sits down and engages with. Clearly choosing people she thinks will give her less of a hard time. I see the protests as chipping away -we have to continue doing this and be patient - Pinocchio day was a good idea and gimmicks are very important in a long battle. It was a rainy day and it wasn't the best for an after game protest - but we keep doing them and some will be better attended than others. Perversely, the fewer protest, the more the club should worry as the reason won't be happiness with the regime but apathy! Roland's recent interview would have made many angry, but many may also be questioning what the point is. I really think we need to do something during the game as a next step. Throwing things on the pitch, as long as they are not dangerous can be very effective - look at the Dortmund fans and the publicity they recieved. I think the personal element of the Pinnochio attacks is worth pursuing by the way. I am not totally comfortable with the personal elements of it, but this is a war for our club, we shouldn't forget that and Meire's departure would be a major victory within that war. It is unfortunate, but the owner is a COWARD and idiot and he has put her up there to be shot at. If he thinks coming to the Valley unannounced and giving us some poor bullshit interview is leading, he is even more of an idiot than I thought he was (and that is an achievement) and I do have a tinge of sympathy for Meire after seeing it but she is a qualified lawyer- she can always tell him to stuff his stupid job! Those of us who continue to protest can't tell him to stuff his stupid club as we happen to love it. Those that do tell him that are the blood pouring from the wound he has made!
If my experience yesterday was anything to go by, the club was rattled by the C.A.R.D actions yesterday.
I was the one looking out of the window wearing my mask. When it was seen by the protestors and they waved to me, the stewards were very quick to come up and put the blinds down.
When I objected to having the blind next to me pulled and they asked me to 'stop looking out of the window' they said it was for reasons of health and safety. This is a load of rubbish - they were more worried about how it would look if it were seen that people 'inside' are also as angry at the way this club is being run as those actually protesting outside.
Where else as a 'customer' would you be banned from looking out of a window? I'm no hooligan, only a 58 year old fan who has used the hospitality of the club for many years. This may well be the last.
But Airman is over qualified for the job under Duchatelet.
When Murray was sane he saw that Curbishley had what was needed and he saw that Airman did too - and he was right on both counts. That is written in history, not a throw away statement.
If my experience yesterday was anything to go by, the club was rattled by the C.A.R.D actions yesterday.
I was the one looking out of the window wearing my mask. When it was seen by the protestors and they waved to me, the stewards were very quick to come up and put the blinds down.
When I objected to having the blind next to me pulled and they asked me to 'stop looking out of the window' they said it was for reasons of health and safety. This is a load of rubbish - they were more worried about how it would look if it were seen that people 'inside' are also as angry at the way this club is being run as those actually protesting outside.
Where else as a 'customer' would you be banned from looking out of a window? I'm no hooligan, only a 58 year old fan who has used the hospitality of the club for many years. This may well be the last.
Health and safety ! Didn't stop Pinocchio herself looking out and taking photos at an early protest did it.
Do they inform visiting representatives from opposing clubs that they can't look outside ?
Well done CARD and Airman Brown, thank you for organising protests. I speak to an number of people in the ground and if they ( we) stick to what is said season ticket sales will tumble. I do not want dialogue with KM or RD, they will only say what they think we want to hear. I want actions- the club run sensibly, decent players and manager. I want to feel the club wants me there. I take part in the protests and will continue to do so. Charlton will be relegated, I do not see the current regime having the will or ability to restructure and get us promoted or even halt the slide. CARD step up the protests, next season with 5000 at the ground there will be little effective protests( apart from not being there)
I am shaking here as I spent a good time this morning looking out of my window at the sunny morning. I didn't realise I was putting my life in danger.
To be fair to the club, if you're wearing a face mask and need to be rescued in an emergency, firemen won't be able to tell who is real and who is not.
I am shaking here as I spent a good time this morning looking out of my window at the sunny morning. I didn't realise I was putting my life in danger.
To be fair to the club, if you're wearing a face mask and need to be rescued in an emergency, firemen won't be able to tell who is real and who is not.
Oh yes, thanks, I feel better now. I wasn't wearing my Pinocchio mask so I must have been safe.
If my experience yesterday was anything to go by, the club was rattled by the C.A.R.D actions yesterday.
I was the one looking out of the window wearing my mask. When it was seen by the protestors and they waved to me, the stewards were very quick to come up and put the blinds down.
When I objected to having the blind next to me pulled and they asked me to 'stop looking out of the window' they said it was for reasons of health and safety. This is a load of rubbish - they were more worried about how it would look if it were seen that people 'inside' are also as angry at the way this club is being run as those actually protesting outside.
Where else as a 'customer' would you be banned from looking out of a window? I'm no hooligan, only a 58 year old fan who has used the hospitality of the club for many years. This may well be the last.
I think CARD are doing a great job, I have donated and am going to give more, I think last week was excellent, we had very good media the brilliant Companies House, Roland coming over for his interviews, they are clearly rattled and well done to everyone yesterday, thank you for all the hard work that goes into organising and making match day a day for the owner to wonder if it is coming time to sell up lets hope so
I think it was an inspired idea. Sure it was a little childlish but it was introduced as a fun event for children young and old so it's not as though this fact was lost on the organisers.
The truth is that it is going to be very difficult to keep coming up with new and inventive ideas. The most important thing is to keep the pressure up but it will also help keep people engaging if it is fun, and this sounded fun!
Comments
Please take what I'm about to say with this in mind: this is my simple attempt at trying to help improve communication (and if this has already been attempted and I missed it, disregard and I apologize). It is meant with honesty and humility. I am nowhere near SE7, I have watched and followed the protests and responses from afar, I have not been supporting Charlton for nearly as long as most of you, and there are some things I agree with protestors on, some things less so. At the end of the day I think the club is poorly run. I would like to do what I can to help.
Everything about RD's interviews this week said to me that he has no plans to go anywhere. Given that he talks about "learning from mistakes," and this has become a common trope, but cannot provide any examples or any even vague outline of a plan on how to implement these things. To me it feels that he is incredibly insular, and that this is not a healthy business structure, or a particularly productive one.
As such, and @Airman Brown this is not to criticize your interaction today, but it feels like CARD should need to at least be prepared to engage in direct discourse with the regime in a number of forums (including, apparently, a road outside the ground). Are they? Are some of the leaders prepared to speak (calmly and civilly) to members of the regime on matter such as (and I'm using my own examples here, I know CARD have their own):
"We would like to understand the structure and running of the transfer policy when the club lacks a DoF and Chief Scout and when most business is done outside the window. What percentage of players are identified by agents, and what percentage by scouts?"
"If FFP does not progress beyond transfer bans for offenders, what are the club's plans to remain competitive in a division that is becoming an arms race? What impacts will it have on the playing staff, both at present and who we will be able to attract? Are you familiar with the history of the Premier League, specifically over the past 10-15 years and the fact that it has led to a horrible boom-bust culture (See: Portsmouth, West Ham, Bolton, Blackburn, Manchester United, Liverpool, Manchester City, etc.)?"
"Can you please explain, using example, how, in footballing terms, Charlton Athletic Football Club has directly benefited from being a part of a network of clubs who do not seem to face the same challenges or are at the same level as CAFC?"
"Do the club have plans for the reduction in income that will result from dropping down to League One? Please understand that numerous clubs have lost huge amounts of money, or nearly been bankrupted (Portsmouth, Newcastle, QPR, Bolton) by not being prepared for a drop in divisions."
Protests are an excellent method to get attention, and to provide a voice to the masses who might otherwise be voiceless. Protests are not so good with nuanced discourse. I am just trying to ask if CARD is prepared to evolve. And also, if there is anything I can do to help (I have a background in writing and do a fair amount of speaking), I would be honored to do so.
Okay, you can all go about calling me a useless keyboard warrior
Personally I'm perfectly happy for CARD to be the awkward squad and CAST to be the voice of reason.
However the last home game of the season against Burnley will be very interesting especially if we are relegated by then and Burnley need something to go up. Sky and the football league would not want to see a scenario where the game is abandoned and effects the promotion places and play off fixtures.
Those who have got so far as sitting down with her have not found it a worthwhile exercise. CAST and Target 20,000, in which she agreed one thing and then almost immediately did another, was just about the final straw for people who had tried to deal with her over many months.
It's worth remembering that Henry and the Spell It Out people's questions were an attempt to proceed in just this way back in October - he was accused by her of "inciting a riot". For promoting the wearing of black and white scarves!
Meire is the Karel Fraeye of the non-playing side of the club. No amount of dialogue is going to change that, in my view. If she went or Duchatelet chose to engage himself (which is still unlikely IMO) things might be different but based on her ability and attitude I can't see any useful purpose in talking further to her. As with Fraeye, she appears to have no grasp of how far she is out of her depth.
It's all too easy for me to sit back and say that wasn't right or this wasn't right but I'm not capable of organising or arranging anything that will come anywhere near these sort of levels of ridicule that we are putting on the joke operation that are running our club
These owners appear set in their (shit) ways and the hotheaded part of me thinks let's be orrible and threaten Roland like the Standard fans did but no sane person is gonna do that with the potential repercussions illegal behaviour could entail.
So what can we do to rid our self of these nutters , well I don't know but what CARD are doing is much better than doing nothing.
I haven't spent a penny in the ground since prolly October , no programmes , refreshments , club merchandise , mascot packages etc or anything and I will not be buying any season tickets next year
I'll pick and chose
I didn't go today, using the cold wet weather as a reason not to go with 3 of my sons , there is no way this would have happened in the past, no matter how poor the teamor weather has been but my disgust at the clowns running the club has driven me to the lowest point of love I've ever had for this great club of ours , they have to go.
Keep up the good fight because these people deserve no respite for their insular approach to things (says the bloke sitting on his arse at home!)
In fact, even though I was underwhelmed I still wore the mask at the car park protest, along with the wife & kids. They too were all wearing the masks too, I should add that I could only stay for half an hr as I've been battling the flu all week, and was amazed I even made the game at all. If it wasn't for a protest after the game, I might've given the whole game a miss.
As for boycotts, I haven't bought any merchandise all season, food & drink (and beer) since end of October, or a programme since Xmas (buying one was religious for me), and I strill haven't decided about our 4 STs for next year yet!
Anyway, back to the protest. Cudos for the A0 blow up of the companies house form! I cracked up at that, and the companies house songs. Still not sure disney masks are the way forward, and who knows if that played a part in the much poorer numbers in the car park this week, or not. But it does worry me, that the numbers were dropping and the stand up chants seem to be waining.
We can't let the regime win! We must continue until they pack up and leave.
Fans as a group need to keep doing the things which keep financial pressure up on the club. It would be nice to see the food queues even shorter (yesterday is fair enough as it was mostly families and people who will never come again buying the food)
Individuals with sheer brilliance need to keep doing things like the Company House prank.
Media attention I doubt they care about but I think keeps us in good spirits.
Financial losses will definitely bother them, more so than anything else, whereas for other owners, bad media attention would bother them more than financial losses..
The sheer embarrassment of the companies house thing is brilliant. You have to remember katrien is effectively the boss at the valley, and things like that will have people giggling at the water cooler. The last thing you want at work is to be a laughing stock.
Non rant over.
Having actively and financially supported them from before they launched and after (and having turned down multiple offers to join their board) I was very critical of their survey and mustn't upset anyone stance.
So now they are being active, while rightly leaving the door open to dialogue, I say well done and keep it up. That whetr a Trust should stand.
The Trust have tried the nicely nicely approach and had that olive branch snapped, countless emails have been ignored and offers of dialogue snubbed by a multitude of people who have signalled the slightest element of dissent or not toeing the party line.
The result being that in2 years we've had:
- A staged video with a youngster
- A pathetic power point "Q&A" which was risible in the contempt shown on that stage by Murray and Meire and the cowardly inclusion of Jackson to keep things civil. Extremely civil.
-A staged Q& A by murray in which his scripted answers were entirely contradicted within a fortnight by the actions that followed
- Valley Gold meetings in which the discontent is given lip service
- Fans Forum meetings where they turn up mob handed with palace- supporting staff so far up their harris it's cringeworthy and then proceed to belittle and sneer at deidcated earnest fans
- More recent staged interviews and press releases in which the puppet master dons his returning estranged father act and pretends now daddy is home and everything is ok continuing to patronise the supporters in the hope of appeasing them and duping them long enough to continue his futile masterplan
and probably much more.
People that have spent a lot of time and effort like Rikofold have tried the diplomatic approach and have often been derided for it by fans whilst effectively been taken for granted by the board rather than embraced for their manner and delivery of the message.
The bottom line is they don't give a monkey's toss about fans' views. Whenever I hear platitudes or see a picture of a laughing Meire holding one of CARD's very own masks the phrase "Fans need to understand it's Roland's way or nothing" rings loud in my ears. We were told this with great aplumb 2 years ago when the first seeds of discontent were sown and the message remains true today. Actions speak louder than words and the table shows our position has been made by our lame duck squad on the cheap and cobbled together by another one of their men in Riga who is happy to be compliant yet again for the fourth time in his not so sterling career.
The softly softly let's have dialogue approach has been rejected and sneered at for 2 years now. The time for talking is over and collectively we need to do whatever it is to get this mob out asap as they will not be going anywhere otherwise and will not change, that much is evident over the past 2 years and has been underlined and highlighted in bold in recent months.
This is from the opening post on the setting up of C.A.R.D.
"The meeting was also attended by observers from the board of the Charlton Athletic Supporters’ Trust. All present played a full part in discussions at a very productive and consensual meeting."
So, there's a clue right there.
@Curb_It as an early donator to the protest fund, in my opinion the masks, etc were an excellent idea.
It is good to mix things up. While songs, boycotts, abuse, an undercurrent of hate and the potential for violence all have their place in protests to keep resources tied up, sometimes a little bit of ridicule works wonders. By way of example, I'd refer doubters to what effects the bacon sandwich and Ed Stone had on Miliband......
But Airman is over qualified for the job under Duchatelet.
I was the one looking out of the window wearing my mask. When it was seen by the protestors and they waved to me, the stewards were very quick to come up and put the blinds down.
When I objected to having the blind next to me pulled and they asked me to 'stop looking out of the window' they said it was for reasons of health and safety. This is a load of rubbish - they were more worried about how it would look if it were seen that people 'inside' are also as angry at the way this club is being run as those actually protesting outside.
Where else as a 'customer' would you be banned from looking out of a window? I'm no hooligan, only a 58 year old fan who has used the hospitality of the club for many years. This may well be the last.
Do they inform visiting representatives from opposing clubs that they can't look outside ?
Absolute joke of a club.
In game protests have to be considered soon. Something disruptive.
I speak to an number of people in the ground and if they ( we) stick to what is said season ticket sales will tumble.
I do not want dialogue with KM or RD, they will only say what they think we want to hear. I want actions- the club run sensibly, decent players and manager. I want to feel the club wants me there.
I take part in the protests and will continue to do so.
Charlton will be relegated, I do not see the current regime having the will or ability to restructure and get us promoted or even halt the slide.
CARD step up the protests, next season with 5000 at the ground there will be little effective protests( apart from not being there)
Great publicity.
Absolute madness.
The truth is that it is going to be very difficult to keep coming up with new and inventive ideas. The most important thing is to keep the pressure up but it will also help keep people engaging if it is fun, and this sounded fun!
Being held back for an Easter surprise. Keep it to yourself.