I did not want to renew mine but my Dad wanted too, so I did in the end. Solely for the reason of spending each Saturday with my dad in the pub and having a few beers. I have protested at every game and will continue to do so.
What if Roland keeps the club for another five years? I'm 34 and gone since I was 4. Its in my blood.
My Dad won't be about forever and spending time with him is too valuable to me to give up. I don't want to look back and regret not spending my Saturday's with him going to matches due to some twat who owns the club.
What will be sad is the amount of passionate people that have not renewed that won't be there to protest next season, it will make their life easier for KM and Roland.
This is almost identical to me (even to your age) but I did want to renew. I will always renew.
Complete paradox given I want them out but that's just the way it is for me. I'm not letting this administration drive me out of my club
As it stands, it's Roland's Charlton - not yours.
But there are 3,000 hardcore charlton fans that have basically made a statement to Roland and Katrien that they wont walk away when the going gets tough and they had better get used to the abuse
'Protesting' by not going to the game ??? Each to their own but I think that's a joke. In fact, it's probably a relief to RD and KM that there are less fans in the ground at the moment.
We were here before him and we will be here after him.
I did not want to renew mine but my Dad wanted too, so I did in the end. Solely for the reason of spending each Saturday with my dad in the pub and having a few beers. I have protested at every game and will continue to do so.
What if Roland keeps the club for another five years? I'm 34 and gone since I was 4. Its in my blood.
My Dad won't be about forever and spending time with him is too valuable to me to give up. I don't want to look back and regret not spending my Saturday's with him going to matches due to some twat who owns the club.
What will be sad is the amount of passionate people that have not renewed that won't be there to protest next season, it will make their life easier for KM and Roland.
This is almost identical to me (even to your age) but I did want to renew. I will always renew.
Complete paradox given I want them out but that's just the way it is for me. I'm not letting this administration drive me out of my club
As it stands, it's Roland's Charlton - not yours.
Owners come and go. It's the fans club, they are just landlords for a time.
I'm surprised its that many. They must either watch a different game to the one we see or they all have their heads in the sand. How can anybody commit to suffering more of the same, on & off the pitch, next season.
Unless, of course, the chief WUMmer Colin has bought them all!
No I haven't got my head in the sand and I'm also aware of what I've been watching, But as a loyal supporter I'll be there through thick and thin, it's a way of life, it's in my blood and I couldn't image Saturday afternoons without Charlton Athletic. I hope you enjoy your Saturday's in the future doing your DIY or whatever else you've got planned, And when we get ourselves out of this mess I'll look forward to seeing you come back for the good times.
You do realise that you are likely to be applying that last statement to supporters who have been season ticket holders for years? For many of them, myself included, the decision not to renew has been extremely difficult but there is genuine fear that further support of the regime by providing them with the revenue to help them continue their madness could spell terminal decline for the club. And you, loyal supporter that you are, have a dig? Unbelievable.
I did not start this thread so that fans could discuss the rights or wrongs of renewing, those renewing are just repeating what they have stated on other threads. Thanks SE9Addick for making an attempt to put £'s to the numbers. The £50K they are supposed to get from VG must look very attractive (sorry rickfold) to them.
I did not start this thread so that fans could discuss the rights or wrongs of renewing, those renewing are just repeating what they have stated on other threads. Thanks SE9Addick for making an attempt to put £'s to the numbers. The £50K they are supposed to get from VG must look very attractive (sorry rickfold) to them.
And one thing we can say with some degree of certainty, is that this number of renewals is unlikely to change much in the next couple of months unless something significant happens, so this is basically all the upfront money the club will get
I did not start this thread so that fans could discuss the rights or wrongs of renewing, those renewing are just repeating what they have stated on other threads. Thanks SE9Addick for making an attempt to put £'s to the numbers. The £50K they are supposed to get from VG must look very attractive (sorry rickfold) to them.
And one thing we can say with some degree of certainty, is that this number of renewals is unlikely to change much in the next couple of months unless something significant happens, so this is basically all the upfront money the club will get
I think the key date is June 30th, that's the end of the financial year, it would be good if anyone who plans on renewing but hasn't can hold off until after then - if that can be achieved then the club's accounts will look atrocious.
Having a couple of hours to spare, I decided to count the number of seats indicated in use on the online season ticket sale site.
Upper North 317 Lower North 1200 Family 82 NWQ 112 East 650 Lower West 764 Upper West 304
Total 3429 Approx.
OK well I've gone on the cafc ticket website and then by stand and block and it shows the seats available as of today, (24/04/16).
North Lower 2,029 North Upper 2,321 West Lower 2,998 West Upper 2,961 East 3,148 Family Stand 1,068 NW Quadrant 1,395 Total Unsold Seats 14,852 Potential Unsold Value £5,082,425 (based on adult seat price)
If the capacity is 27K and the Jimmy Seed is about £3K then:
There are 3,400 seats in the Jimmy Seed Stand. The directors box, press gantry and wheelchair areas are not shown on the online system at all. I think your east number is well off (about 1,500) and your upper north number is about 500 short. You also haven't allowed for unsold but unavailable.
You've not allowed for senior/U21 concessions or VAT. Adults are 52% of the total. Disabled numbers are more than you'd allow for and carers free.
I would guess think on these numbers net season ticket revenue is likely to be about £750k at most - given the bias towards the lower north it could be as low as £600k.
For a business running at an operating loss of about £4.4m already these season ticket sales numbers are absolutely catastrophic.
As I said, forget about the numbers sold - they can spin those - focus on the revenue earned which is lower than I ever imagined it would be.
That £3m figure is not all season tickets. If the club had sold, say, 8,000 at that point that would point to an average yield (after VAT) of £375, which is pie in the sky. It's nearer £200, because of concessions, child tickets, free carers, etc.
Don't think RD cares about the money otherwise he'd have sold up - his nose is out of joint and he's determined to win at all costs. It's about his ego and showing what a stubborn old git he is. Nobody tells him what to do. I genuinely feel he doesn't give a shit about how many S/T sales or whether we buy programmes etc... He's happy to leave the useless CEO in charge because he can't be seen to bow to pressure. I genuinely have no idea how anything will change? Does anyone know what he thinks apart from the bizarre statement?
There are 3,400 seats in the Jimmy Seed Stand. The directors box, press gantry and wheelchair areas are not shown on the online system at all. I think your east number is well off (about 1,500) and your upper north number is about 500 short. You also haven't allowed for unsold but unavailable.
Well spotted, spreadsheet malfunction.
Revised numbers:
North Lower 2,029 North Upper 2,644 West Lower 2,998 West Upper 2,961 East 4,676 Family Stand 1,068 NW Quadrant 1,395 Total Unsold Seats 16,783
If the capacity is 27K and the Jimmy Seed is about £3.4K then:
27,000 (Capacity) - 3,400 (JS) - 3,429 (Sold) - 16,783 (Unsold) = 3,388 for directors box, press gantry etc.
Prices in the lower north are £175 (£145.83 net of VAT) adults, £135 (112.50 net) concessions, £100 (£83.83 net) U18s and £50 (£41.66 net) U11s.
You'd normally expect 52% of sales to be to adults. I think that will be skewed in the lower north, partly because the price incentive only applies to adults and concessions; and partly because it's not an area likely to attract many over 65s.
Working off 66% and 1,200 sales (and ignoring any comps) that works out at 800 x £145.83 = £116,664. The average net income from the remaining tickets is unlikely to reach £90, but assuming it does that's 400 x £90 = £36,000.
In round numbers, for well over a third of the season tickets they have sold, the club will have realised just £150,000.
Even if the remainder has an average net value of £275 (which would be historically high, but they are disproportionately in more expensive areas) that would equate to 2,000 (or less) x £275 = £550,000.
I'd be pretty confident on that basis that they have revenue of £700k or less to date.
Don't think RD cares about the money otherwise he'd have sold up - his nose is out of joint and he's determined to win at all costs. It's about his ego and showing what a stubborn old git he is. Nobody tells him what to do. I genuinely feel he doesn't give a shit about how many S/T sales or whether we buy programmes etc... He's happy to leave the useless CEO in charge because he can't be seen to bow to pressure. I genuinely have no idea how anything will change? Does anyone know what he thinks apart from the bizarre statement?
Yes and we need the Football League to liven up and drag Pinnochio in to explain why there are stoppages at the start of games and charge them for not being able to provide adequate security at games. It was the initial comments from the Football League after the Boro game that prompted the Roly rant. More embarrassment and ridicule, and a hefty fine will get their attention. All part of making the club un-manageable. They have no control over what will happen next, in fact CARD is running rings around them. Thats why they want to chat.
If RD makes the unfortunate decision not to sell, but offers season tickets for adults around the ground at £225 with a rebate for those who have already renewed, announces a new manager and director of football that both sound positive would you renew if KM was left in role and there was no guarantee the manager and director of football would have any autonomy?
Following a similar process to @Dansk_Red I make the revised numbers as follows
Upper North 414 Lower North 1,457 Family 99 NWQ 126 East 777 Lower West 929 Upper West 304 (no movement from Dansk_Red's figures...)
Total 4,106
The way I got to these figures was instead of counting up the 'available' seats I worked out the total number of seats in a block, then subtracted the total number of 'unavailable' seats in that block and then subtracted the number of seats marked as 'available' to calculate the total number of 'in use' seats per block. I then sanity checked this by manually counting a few blocks where the number of 'in use' seats were very small just to ensure my calculations were accurate.
This means now all the hard work is done all I need to do to generate my figures in future is to update my spreadsheet with the published number of 'available' seats for each block and the number of 'in use' is automatically calculated.
I'd say my numbers are 99% accurate but still came across the odd discrepency as there are some blocks not easy to count due to the layout of them i.e the quadrants and the West Lower block B seemed to have a very large number of condensed 'in use' seats which didn't seem to tie up with the number of 'available' seats on the site and my calculations, slightly smaller but similar issue with West Lower block A too but then these were also the last blocks I calculated so it's also possible maybe fatigue had kicked in but I can review this again in future easily enough.
I've got block by block calculations available as well but didn't want to make this post too long.
Whoever said that Charlton would become unsustainable by Christmas 2016 looks about right. When a third of all season tickets are only paying £7 a game there has to be massive injections of Duchatelet's cash to keep the club running.
Following a similar process to @Dansk_Red I make the revised numbers as follows
Upper North 414 Lower North 1,457 Family 99 NWQ 126 East 777 Lower West 929 Upper West 304 (no movement from Dansk_Red's figures...)
Total 4,106
The way I got to these figures was instead of counting up the 'available' seats I worked out the total number of seats in a block, then subtracted the total number of 'unavailable' seats in that block and then subtracted the number of seats marked as 'available' to calculate the total number of 'in use' seats per block. I then sanity checked this by manually counting a few blocks where the number of 'in use' seats were very small just to ensure my calculations were accurate.
This means now all the hard work is done all I need to do to generate my figures in future is to update my spreadsheet with the published number of 'available' seats for each block and the number of 'in use' is automatically calculated.
I'd say my numbers are 99% accurate but still came across the odd discrepency as there are some blocks not easy to count due to the layout of them i.e the quadrants and the West Lower block B seemed to have a very large number of condensed 'in use' seats which didn't seem to tie up with the number of 'available' seats on the site and my calculations, slightly smaller but similar issue with West Lower block A too but then these were also the last blocks I calculated so it's also possible maybe fatigue had kicked in but I can review this again in future easily enough.
I've got block by block calculations available as well but didn't want to make this post too long.
Whoever said that Charlton would become unsustainable by Christmas 2016 looks about right. When a third of all season tickets are only paying £7 a game there has to be massive injections of Duchatelet's cash to keep the club running.
As has been said elsewhere, the financial year end is June 30th. The drop in cashflow will be enormous when compared to last year's accounts, especially as the summer is when no regular income comes in
Comments
'Protesting' by not going to the game ??? Each to their own but I think that's a joke. In fact, it's probably a relief to RD and KM that there are less fans in the ground at the moment.
We were here before him and we will be here after him.
If you're going today then just protest loud and proud !
North Lower 2,029
North Upper 2,321
West Lower 2,998
West Upper 2,961
East 3,148
Family Stand 1,068
NW Quadrant 1,395
Total Unsold Seats 14,852
Potential Unsold Value £5,082,425 (based on adult seat price)
If the capacity is 27K and the Jimmy Seed is about £3K then:
27,000 (Capacity) - 3,000 (JS) - 3,429 (Sold) - 14,852 (Unsold) = 5,719 missing
Where have I gone wrong??
Cheers
Rich
I genuinely feel he doesn't give a shit about how many S/T sales or whether we buy programmes etc...
He's happy to leave the useless CEO in charge because he can't be seen to bow to pressure.
I genuinely have no idea how anything will change?
Does anyone know what he thinks apart from the bizarre statement?
Revised numbers:
North Lower 2,029
North Upper 2,644
West Lower 2,998
West Upper 2,961
East 4,676
Family Stand 1,068
NW Quadrant 1,395
Total Unsold Seats 16,783
If the capacity is 27K and the Jimmy Seed is about £3.4K then:
27,000 (Capacity) - 3,400 (JS) - 3,429 (Sold) - 16,783 (Unsold) = 3,388 for directors box, press gantry etc.
Cheers
You'd normally expect 52% of sales to be to adults. I think that will be skewed in the lower north, partly because the price incentive only applies to adults and concessions; and partly because it's not an area likely to attract many over 65s.
Working off 66% and 1,200 sales (and ignoring any comps) that works out at 800 x £145.83 = £116,664.
The average net income from the remaining tickets is unlikely to reach £90, but assuming it does that's 400 x £90 = £36,000.
In round numbers, for well over a third of the season tickets they have sold, the club will have realised just £150,000.
Even if the remainder has an average net value of £275 (which would be historically high, but they are disproportionately in more expensive areas) that would equate to 2,000 (or less) x £275 = £550,000.
I'd be pretty confident on that basis that they have revenue of £700k or less to date.
I wouldn't.
Upper North 414
Lower North 1,457
Family 99
NWQ 126
East 777
Lower West 929
Upper West 304 (no movement from Dansk_Red's figures...)
Total 4,106
The way I got to these figures was instead of counting up the 'available' seats I worked out the total number of seats in a block, then subtracted the total number of 'unavailable' seats in that block and then subtracted the number of seats marked as 'available' to calculate the total number of 'in use' seats per block. I then sanity checked this by manually counting a few blocks where the number of 'in use' seats were very small just to ensure my calculations were accurate.
This means now all the hard work is done all I need to do to generate my figures in future is to update my spreadsheet with the published number of 'available' seats for each block and the number of 'in use' is automatically calculated.
I'd say my numbers are 99% accurate but still came across the odd discrepency as there are some blocks not easy to count due to the layout of them i.e the quadrants and the West Lower block B seemed to have a very large number of condensed 'in use' seats which didn't seem to tie up with the number of 'available' seats on the site and my calculations, slightly smaller but similar issue with West Lower block A too but then these were also the last blocks I calculated so it's also possible maybe fatigue had kicked in but I can review this again in future easily enough.
I've got block by block calculations available as well but didn't want to make this post too long.
Not buying a season ticket and therefore not feeding the animal will let it die quickly, ready to be re-born quickly.