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KR v RS - how's it going?

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  • We have a squad of players that look more than capable. They are the ones not delivering on the pitch, not Roland, not Katrien. Time for them to step up. There's no excuse, they are more than good enough.

    If the players look more than capable to you, then you are in a massive minority here.

    Please explain to the rest of us, specifically what the players need to be doing differently ?
    Sticking the ball in the back of the net as simple as it may sound Magennis was clean through on goal last night unpressured and didn't even get it on target!

    Same applies to Novak smashing it into the side netting against Wimbledon on Saturday not even on target.

    Both are more than capable League One players and should be doing better. Once clean through on goal there is nothing more KR or the regime can do at that point.
    If you're clean through on goal and can't hit the target and similar with Novak, then I'd respectfully suggest they are not more than capable goalscorers. Neither of them have ever been true goalscorers. Novak got a reasonable amount of goals when he was younger, but his game was based on running and hassling & for whatever reason, he's been the total opposite at Charlton.
    Magennis finished a similar chance at home to Bristol Rovers to get his hat trick that day, i've not seen the chance again on replay but can only liken his miss to being of a similar chance to that one he tucked away which shows Magennis is capable of sticking them away, in fact I would say he probably had too much time to think about it such was the time and space he had and possibly got caught in two minds what to do.

    Whether or not they are both goalscorers or not, failure to hit the target while not under pressure comes down to the strikers alone. Are they capable enough for League One? Magennis a Northern Ireland international would appear to be though I agree Novak has disapointed this season and if I was KR i'd get rid in the summer.
  • edited February 2017
    I love Josh, at the moment he's my POTY. However he's not really a true goalscorer.

    He's played 219 club games, scoring 36 goals. 1 goal every 6 games.

    His record is best at Charlton, 8 goals in 25 games.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josh_Magennis
  • 2012 BWP & Yann would both waltz into this side.

    Didn't BWP go a dozen games or so without scoring ?
  • edited February 2017
    Scoham said:

    We so over rate the majority of our players. The results and performances do not lie. The comparison that I like to draw is player for player against the League one title winning side of 2012 and you should see quite quickly how inadequate this squad of players really are.

    2011/12 - 2016/17

    Hamer - Rudd - Probably not much in it, others may see more of a difference?

    Solly - Solly - Still a reliable player now but not as good as he was. We didn't have proper cover in 11/12 and we don't have it now.

    Wiggins/Evina - Chicksen/Page - Wiggins was one of our best players and Championship standard. Not yet seen Page. Chicksen is more comparable to Evina than Wiggins for me, looks ok as a squad player at this level.

    Morrison/Taylor/Cort - Pearce/Bauer/Tex - First three were very consistent and stepped up after promotion. CB is one of our strongest positions this season but I'm not convinced they're as good as the 11/12 group. Perhaps the lack of goals in the team makes the current CBs seem worse than they are.

    Doherty - Johnson/Lennon - Couldn't think of anything funny but wanted to mention them since Doherty and Johnson seems an ideal comparison.

    Wagstaff/Green/Ephraim/Cook/N'Guessan - Holmes/Botaka/Byrne/Dasilva - Wingers weren't our strongest position in 11/12, Holmes is better, Botaka doesn't have the goals that Wagstaff/Green had, Dasilva isn't playing, Byrne has done well at this level for Swindon. Could be argued we're stronger now but we only tended to play one winger in 11/12 as Jackson played LM.

    Jackson - Jackson - Coming to the end of his career, not playing regularly as he did back then.

    Stephens - Ulvestad/Forster-Caskey - Stephens was inconsistent at the time but took more risks which is probably why he was more of a threat. Ulvestad is comfortable on the ball and tidy, has a few assists but I don't think he's ever really had a stand out performance for us. Not seen enough of Forster-Caskey to judge - hopefully an improvement on Ulvestad.

    Hughes/Russell - Crofts - first two did well as back up/loan cover, one has had to play nearly every game.

    Hollands/Pritchard - Konsa/Aribo - Hollands was a proven box to box midfielder at this level and scored goals. Pritchard did a good job when he played, but featured more regularly in the Championship. Konsa's more defensive and not likely to score or create goals. Aribo I'd say is more mobile and skilful than Hollands but doesn't yet have the all round game or goal threat.

    Kermorgant - Magennis - I like Josh but Yann was better and probably still is.

    BWP - Ajose/Watt - BWP was our 20 goal a season striker. Ajose was supposed to be. Watt isn't going to be.

    Hayes/Clarke - Novak - Hayes linked up with BWP from the off. Novak so far hasn't got going for us, a bit like Clarke.

    Haynes - Mavididi - Haynes did well enough but went on to be more of a threat in the Championship. Not seen Mavididi yet.

    I think that covers the main players we've used in both seasons. Almost every position in 11/12 was stronger and where it's close it could still be argued either way.

    As well as lacking enough quality two obvious things we're missing now are goalscorers and a system/formation that gets the best out of everyone.
    And a manager that really got what charlton was all about, and could relate to the fans ,rather than a younger, cheaper more compliant type , who makes you think that nothing has changed in the strategy of our owners, surely they will get fed up, and bugger off?
  • I am afraid that Duchatelet sees us as a challenge
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  • Scoham said:

    We so over rate the majority of our players. The results and performances do not lie. The comparison that I like to draw is player for player against the League one title winning side of 2012 and you should see quite quickly how inadequate this squad of players really are.

    2011/12 - 2016/17

    Hamer - Rudd - Probably not much in it, others may see more of a difference?

    Solly - Solly - Still a reliable player now but not as good as he was. We didn't have proper cover in 11/12 and we don't have it now.

    Wiggins/Evina - Chicksen/Page - Wiggins was one of our best players and Championship standard. Not yet seen Page. Chicksen is more comparable to Evina than Wiggins for me, looks ok as a squad player at this level.

    Morrison/Taylor/Cort - Pearce/Bauer/Tex - First three were very consistent and stepped up after promotion. CB is one of our strongest positions this season but I'm not convinced they're as good as the 11/12 group. Perhaps the lack of goals in the team makes the current CBs seem worse than they are.

    Doherty - Johnson/Lennon - Couldn't think of anything funny but wanted to mention them since Doherty and Johnson seems an ideal comparison.

    Wagstaff/Green/Ephraim/Cook/N'Guessan - Holmes/Botaka/Byrne/Dasilva - Wingers weren't our strongest position in 11/12, Holmes is better, Botaka doesn't have the goals that Wagstaff/Green had, Dasilva isn't playing, Byrne has done well at this level for Swindon. Could be argued we're stronger now but we only tended to play one winger in 11/12 as Jackson played LM.

    Jackson - Jackson - Coming to the end of his career, not playing regularly as he did back then.

    Stephens - Ulvestad/Forster-Caskey - Stephens was inconsistent at the time but took more risks which is probably why he was more of a threat. Ulvestad is comfortable on the ball and tidy, has a few assists but I don't think he's ever really had a stand out performance for us. Not seen enough of Forster-Caskey to judge - hopefully an improvement on Ulvestad.

    Hughes/Russell - Crofts - first two did well as back up/loan cover, one has had to play nearly every game.

    Hollands/Pritchard - Konsa/Aribo - Hollands was a proven box to box midfielder at this level and scored goals. Pritchard did a good job when he played, but featured more regularly in the Championship. Konsa's more defensive and not likely to score or create goals. Aribo I'd say is more mobile and skilful than Hollands but doesn't yet have the all round game or goal threat.

    Kermorgant - Magennis - I like Josh but Yann was better and probably still is.

    BWP - Ajose/Watt - BWP was our 20 goal a season striker. Ajose was supposed to be. Watt isn't going to be.

    Hayes/Clarke - Novak - Hayes linked up with BWP from the off. Novak so far hasn't got going for us, a bit like Clarke.

    Haynes - Mavididi - Haynes did well enough but went on to be more of a threat in the Championship. Not seen Mavididi yet.

    I think that covers the main players we've used in both seasons. Almost every position in 11/12 was stronger and where it's close it could still be argued either way.

    As well as lacking enough quality two obvious things we're missing now are goalscorers and a system/formation that gets the best out of everyone.
    And a manager that really got what charlton was all about, and could relate to the fans ,rather than a younger, cheaper more compliant type , who makes you think that nothing has changed in the strategy of our owners, surely they will get fed up, and bugger off?
    Plus a good CEO (even though he's gone over to the dark side since), owners who didn't interfere too much (Alonso, Clarke) and most importantly a clear and ambitious plan. Unfortunately that plan relied on someone else's cash (Cash).
  • Just remember KM told the fans forum back in April the plan was to build a squad like Powelly's side from that season that's going well
  • JohnnyH2 said:

    Just remember KM told the fans forum back in April the plan was to build a squad like Powelly's side from that season that's going well

    A quote that strangely didn't appear in the minutes.

  • Updated after 14 games:



    Robinson - P14 W3 D7 L4 For 15 Against 17

    Slade - P14 W2 D7 L5 For 12 Against 15


    KR nosing ahead, but Slade's next 5 games were undefeated with 3 wins and 2 draws. How will KR match up?
  • Updated after 14 games:



    Robinson - P14 W3 D7 L4 For 15 Against 17

    Slade - P14 W2 D7 L5 For 12 Against 15


    KR nosing ahead, but Slade's next 5 games were undefeated with 3 wins and 2 draws. How will KR match up?

    He'll always nose ahead but it looks like he will fall short of Slade's 21 game record.
  • Ive backed robinson, however slightly bored of him now, same old tosh I'm hearing. Not much talking going on the pitch.
  • Scoham said:

    We so over rate the majority of our players. The results and performances do not lie. The comparison that I like to draw is player for player against the League one title winning side of 2012 and you should see quite quickly how inadequate this squad of players really are.

    2011/12 - 2016/17

    Hamer - Rudd - Probably not much in it, others may see more of a difference?

    Solly - Solly - Still a reliable player now but not as good as he was. We didn't have proper cover in 11/12 and we don't have it now.

    Wiggins/Evina - Chicksen/Page - Wiggins was one of our best players and Championship standard. Not yet seen Page. Chicksen is more comparable to Evina than Wiggins for me, looks ok as a squad player at this level.

    Morrison/Taylor/Cort - Pearce/Bauer/Tex - First three were very consistent and stepped up after promotion. CB is one of our strongest positions this season but I'm not convinced they're as good as the 11/12 group. Perhaps the lack of goals in the team makes the current CBs seem worse than they are.

    Doherty - Johnson/Lennon - Couldn't think of anything funny but wanted to mention them since Doherty and Johnson seems an ideal comparison.

    Wagstaff/Green/Ephraim/Cook/N'Guessan - Holmes/Botaka/Byrne/Dasilva - Wingers weren't our strongest position in 11/12, Holmes is better, Botaka doesn't have the goals that Wagstaff/Green had, Dasilva isn't playing, Byrne has done well at this level for Swindon. Could be argued we're stronger now but we only tended to play one winger in 11/12 as Jackson played LM.

    Jackson - Jackson - Coming to the end of his career, not playing regularly as he did back then.

    Stephens - Ulvestad/Forster-Caskey - Stephens was inconsistent at the time but took more risks which is probably why he was more of a threat. Ulvestad is comfortable on the ball and tidy, has a few assists but I don't think he's ever really had a stand out performance for us. Not seen enough of Forster-Caskey to judge - hopefully an improvement on Ulvestad.

    Hughes/Russell - Crofts - first two did well as back up/loan cover, one has had to play nearly every game.

    Hollands/Pritchard - Konsa/Aribo - Hollands was a proven box to box midfielder at this level and scored goals. Pritchard did a good job when he played, but featured more regularly in the Championship. Konsa's more defensive and not likely to score or create goals. Aribo I'd say is more mobile and skilful than Hollands but doesn't yet have the all round game or goal threat.

    Kermorgant - Magennis - I like Josh but Yann was better and probably still is.

    BWP - Ajose/Watt - BWP was our 20 goal a season striker. Ajose was supposed to be. Watt isn't going to be.

    Hayes/Clarke - Novak - Hayes linked up with BWP from the off. Novak so far hasn't got going for us, a bit like Clarke.

    Haynes - Mavididi - Haynes did well enough but went on to be more of a threat in the Championship. Not seen Mavididi yet.

    I think that covers the main players we've used in both seasons. Almost every position in 11/12 was stronger and where it's close it could still be argued either way.

    As well as lacking enough quality two obvious things we're missing now are goalscorers and a system/formation that gets the best out of everyone.
    Excellent analysis. Nice work taking the time to put together

  • I feel this is the best place to state that I mistakenly put out a tweet earlier whereby I said KR had won 3 from 16. It's as above 3 from 14. My fault, sent it immediately after the final whistle as I thought today was his 16th game in charge.

    Still be interesting to see how the next few games pan out
  • KR are you Russell in disguise are you Russell in disguise
  • Updated after 14 games:



    Robinson - P14 W3 D7 L4 For 15 Against 17

    Slade - P14 W2 D7 L5 For 12 Against 15


    KR nosing ahead, but Slade's next 5 games were undefeated with 3 wins and 2 draws. How will KR match up?

    Leave the cup games out and the points total is identical after 12 League games each.

    Slade had a defensive way of setting up his side, whilst Robinson is more attacking, but it's still the same outcome.

    Early days for Robinson. Powell had a worse record after his first 12 league games than the pair of them 6 years ago, but he was allowed by the board back then to plan early and bring in a brand new team/squad to gain promotion.

    Robinson deserves that chance (We need stablility, even though he's got more rabbit than Sainsburys) to build his own squad, but in my opinion it's doubtful under the current owner with his past track record of not having a manager in charge of Charlton any longer than 10 months.
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  • How many points were MK Dons behind us when they sacked KR and how many points have they caught up since or even just sInce KR Took us over?
  • Updated after 14 games:



    Robinson - P14 W3 D7 L4 For 15 Against 17

    Slade - P14 W2 D7 L5 For 12 Against 15


    KR nosing ahead, but Slade's next 5 games were undefeated with 3 wins and 2 draws. How will KR match up?

    No wonder they call us The Entertainers
  • I can't believe all the comparisons between RS & KR. Ultimately, and I am only talking on what I've seen (aways only) the team seem to be creating more chances with KR than they ever did with RS. We took 2 strikers who scored for fun last season in this division and Charltonised them RS style. He needed to go, I didn't do Port Vale but Gillingham was disgraceful. He bigged up all our opposition like we were playing Premiership sides FFS !! He may have relaid some foundations that had been allowed to set in off field pre his appt but as far as the footballing side was concerned we appeared to set up not to lose the game first rather than try to tackle the oppositions weakness.

    In KR, we have someone who wants to play attractive football. Last Saturday, AFC Wimbledon, we controlled the game so well, yes Novak should have scored, we created enough chances to have won that game. But ultimately it is not KR's fault if players don't execute their chances.

    Now, there is a very big argument that Kevin Nugent probably should have been given some time. The game at Bristol Rovers showed some real promise....

    We are where we are thru the dreadful mismanagement of our club over 3 seasons and anyone who has taken on the job in this time has done so probably unknowingly with one hand tied behind their back. I like KR - not his interviews - and think under the circumstances he will do as well as anyone else.
  • shirty5 said:

    Updated after 14 games:



    Robinson - P14 W3 D7 L4 For 15 Against 17

    Slade - P14 W2 D7 L5 For 12 Against 15


    KR nosing ahead, but Slade's next 5 games were undefeated with 3 wins and 2 draws. How will KR match up?

    Leave the cup games out and the points total is identical after 12 League games each.

    Slade had a defensive way of setting up his side, whilst Robinson is more attacking, but it's still the same outcome.

    Early days for Robinson. Powell had a worse record after his first 12 league games than the pair of them 6 years ago, but he was allowed by the board back then to plan early and bring in a brand new team/squad to gain promotion.

    Robinson deserves that chance (We need stablility, even though he's got more rabbit than Sainsburys) to build his own squad, but in my opinion it's doubtful under the current owner with his past track record of not having a manager in charge of Charlton any longer than 10 months.
    Wasn't it also true that the rebuilding started immediately so that they could release unwanted players in the January window leaving us potentially vulnerable for the rest of the season ?
  • Give KR this season and next season then reassess. No managerial changes.
  • Give KR this season and next season then reassess. No managerial changes.

    How long do you need to look at failure and listen to complete bull? Sack him now. Sack him later. Who cares ? He's worse than Karel and more loyal as a puppet. Let's have Congo Chris and cut out the middle man.

    Why does this guy deserve any longer than any other third rate manager employed in the Roly nightmare?
  • Give KR this season and next season then reassess. No managerial changes.

    How long do you need to look at failure and listen to complete bull? Sack him now. Sack him later. Who cares ? He's worse than Karel and more loyal as a puppet. Let's have Congo Chris and cut out the middle man.

    Why does this guy deserve any longer than any other third rate manager employed in the Roly nightmare?
    This is why I fight, folks
  • Take away Nugent's period, they've won seven games combined in the entire season. That's pretty awful in my opinion.
  • Give KR this season and next season then reassess. No managerial changes.

    How long do you need to look at failure and listen to complete bull? Sack him now. Sack him later. Who cares ? He's worse than Karel and more loyal as a puppet. Let's have Congo Chris and cut out the middle man.

    Why does this guy deserve any longer than any other third rate manager employed in the Roly nightmare?
    Just because you need continuity.

    Or have you given up on that idea, and agree with Roland that it's always the manager's fault, not his?

    The problems run deeper than that.
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Roland Out Forever!