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The Takeover Thread - Duchatelet Finally Sells (Jan 2020)

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Comments

  • Henry Irving
    Henry Irving Posts: 85,290
    Rudders22 said:
    If Henry is going tonight we will have to wait for his missus to cook him dinner 1st before he writes up his minutes.








    I'm not there tonight.




  • Chizz
    Chizz Posts: 28,355
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    Some people are suggesting that the title of the properties, clear of the directors' loans, remains to be settled before a deal can go through. 
  • Bolderhumphreyreid
    Bolderhumphreyreid Posts: 2,556
    Who cares how much it’ll cost to buy us? We just need it done ASAP.
  • gilbertfilbert
    gilbertfilbert Posts: 2,282
    Henry Irving said:
    Rudders22 said:
    If Henry is going tonight we will have to wait for his missus to cook him dinner 1st before he writes up his minutes.








    I'm not there tonight.




    You could still write the minutes.
  • ken_shabby
    ken_shabby Posts: 6,273
    NornIrishAddick said:


    Rebellion, led by Robert Emmet, in Ireland.




    Wasn't he the lead figure in the Lego Movie?
  • Imnot Athletic
    Imnot Athletic Posts: 1,017
    edited June 2019
    If Roland thought that he could buy off the £7m loans at a discount last summer, surely that discount will have lessened now we are one division closer to them becoming due.  That could be his reason for bumping the price up to the Aussies.
  • Bolderhumphreyreid
    Bolderhumphreyreid Posts: 2,556
    Henry Irving said:
    Bolderhumphreyreid said:
    Who cares how much it’ll cost to buy us? We just need it done ASAP.
    Surprisingly, the buyers and the seller.
    I don’t believe there are any buyers or sellers on here.
  • MartinCAFC
    MartinCAFC Posts: 3,231
    54,074 comments.

    A seat for every comment, we have now filled Anfield.

    The Etihad is next (55,097) probably done by the weekend!
  • Chizz
    Chizz Posts: 28,355
    Bolderhumphreyreid said:
    Henry Irving said:
    Bolderhumphreyreid said:
    Who cares how much it’ll cost to buy us? We just need it done ASAP.
    Surprisingly, the buyers and the seller.
    I don’t believe there are any buyers or sellers on here.
    Maybe the people that come on here want to find out what is or might be happening; might want to share their understanding or prediction are to the outcome; or are genuinely curious as to what the effect of a significant investment in Charlton would be on the playing strength of the squad, future plans, catering, ticket pricing and ambitions of the club. 

    Why do you post on here? 

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  • harveys_gardener
    harveys_gardener Posts: 7,038
    edited June 2019
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    If the assets are worth £33m, the loans £7m then new owners can still borrow up to £26m, and I believe the book value of the Valley & Sparrows Lane is over £40m.
  • Henry Irving
    Henry Irving Posts: 85,290
    Chizz said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    Some people are suggesting that the title of the properties, clear of the directors' loans, remains to be settled before a deal can go through. 
    The last two disastrous owners didn't see the ex-directors bonds as an issue.

    But because the new owners MIGHT that has to mean they, the new owners, are dodgy!

    If I was paying £33m for something I'd want to own it all and have clear title. I really don't see why any rational, non- spiv owners wouldn't.

    Yes, they MIGHT want to take out a loan.

    For example, to spend the remaining £10m on the training ground they might take out a mortgage/loan at the current very low interest rates rather than trying up capital. Charlton did similar when building the north stand.

    But at present any of the ex-directors could block that. I doubt they would, but a buyer would rather be safe than sorry.

    Isn't all the problems the loans are causing Duchatelet (totally his fault, no blame on the ex-directors) just proof of why clean title is preferable?
  • Airman Brown
    Airman Brown Posts: 15,756
    edited June 2019
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    The land is worth about £23m. I’m not an expert but I would have thought anyone incoming will have trouble borrowing anywhere near that against it.

    What removing the ex-directors’ loans would allow, however, is Roland to secure debt that he leaves on the books as a first charge against the assets, while selling the club and the land.

    Don’t forget that LDT has said that one of the “agreed” deals includes a further payment to RD on promotion to the Premier League. In that scenario it’s very likely he would look to secure that debt - the fact the fixed assets wouldn’t necessarily cover it doesn’t mean this can’t be done. The valuation would, however, prevent a new loan that exceeded the value of the assets.

    It’s just a theory but no one is borrowing huge sums against the assets because any lender would establish what they are worth.


  • Red_in_SE8
    Red_in_SE8 Posts: 5,961
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    Doesn’t make sense. 
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,658
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    Doesn’t make sense. 
    It does.
  • Addickted
    Addickted Posts: 19,456
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    Doesn’t make sense. 
    Does to me. Debt isn't as secured without clean title.
  • ElfsborgAddick
    ElfsborgAddick Posts: 29,200
    favershamaddick said:
    Redskin said:
    Henry Irving said:Tuppence
    bobmunro said:
    i_b_b_o_r_g said:
    So what is the amount Dalman is believed to have agreed?
    I’m supremely confident in saying it will be in the range of tuppence halfpenny and £77m.

    I could be wrong though.
    Tuppance halfpenny. You've been away too long @bobmunro

    Tuppance Hap'ny
    Tuppence ha'penny

    Our new CEO after the takeover?
  • ElfsborgAddick
    ElfsborgAddick Posts: 29,200
    hawksmoor said:
    favershamaddick said:
    Redskin said:
    Henry Irving said:Tuppence
    bobmunro said:
    i_b_b_o_r_g said:
    So what is the amount Dalman is believed to have agreed?
    I’m supremely confident in saying it will be in the range of tuppence halfpenny and £77m.

    I could be wrong though.
    Tuppance halfpenny. You've been away too long @bobmunro

    Tuppance Hap'ny
    Tuppence ha'penny

    Jill Ha'penny?



    The answer is yes.
  • Addickted
    Addickted Posts: 19,456
    ElfsborgAddick said:
    hawksmoor said:
    favershamaddick said:
    Redskin said:
    Henry Irving said:Tuppence
    bobmunro said:
    i_b_b_o_r_g said:
    So what is the amount Dalman is believed to have agreed?
    I’m supremely confident in saying it will be in the range of tuppence halfpenny and £77m.

    I could be wrong though.
    Tuppance halfpenny. You've been away too long @bobmunro

    Tuppance Hap'ny
    Tuppence ha'penny

    Jill Ha'penny?



    The answer is yes.
    You couldn't reach.
  • Henry Irving
    Henry Irving Posts: 85,290
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    Doesn’t make sense. 
    In simple terms, as I understand it, it would be difficult to get a second loan against property that already has a charge (the ex-directors bonds) against it as the lender would be second in line to collect if it all went wrong.

    @Grapevine49 can explain it better than me, I'm sure

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  • Bolderhumphreyreid
    Bolderhumphreyreid Posts: 2,556
    Chizz said:
    Bolderhumphreyreid said:
    Henry Irving said:
    Bolderhumphreyreid said:
    Who cares how much it’ll cost to buy us? We just need it done ASAP.
    Surprisingly, the buyers and the seller.
    I don’t believe there are any buyers or sellers on here.
    Maybe the people that come on here want to find out what is or might be happening; might want to share their understanding or prediction are to the outcome; or are genuinely curious as to what the effect of a significant investment in Charlton would be on the playing strength of the squad, future plans, catering, ticket pricing and ambitions of the club. 

    Why do you post on here? 
    Exactly that.

    I get bored with the usual 50 post bursts of how much it is going to cost especially when most are second guessing. I’m really not bothered if it’s £26m, £33m or £40m+. It really isn’t important.

    Just my opinion of course.
  • Airman Brown
    Airman Brown Posts: 15,756
    edited June 2019
    Henry Irving said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    Doesn’t make sense. 
    In simple terms, as I understand it, it would be difficult to get a second loan against property that already has a charge (the ex-directors bonds) against it as the lender would be second in line to collect if it all went wrong.

    @Grapevine49 can explain it better than me, I'm sure
    And more importantly the value isn’t there to support such a loan in the first place.
  • Imnot Athletic
    Imnot Athletic Posts: 1,017
    I don't get people dismissing the £7m.  Its a real issue for whoever is buying as I doubt they are buying the club just to sit in the Championship, so this will become payable in their eyes in their plan.  Just because you get mega money in the EPL,  £7m is still a significant sum.  Its probably one less player in the squad for a season.  
  • Cafc43v3r
    Cafc43v3r Posts: 21,600
    edited June 2019
    Clear title could also mean that the new owners are mega rich and want to use the assets as a vehicle to circumnavigate FFP in the championship?  See Derby and Sheffield Wednesday.

    Although if that ever happened the bed wetters would be out in full force. 
  • flyingkiwiDK
    flyingkiwiDK Posts: 5,727
    Have we sold yet?
  • happyvalley
    happyvalley Posts: 8,996
    1804, William Wordsworth writes his famous poem, I Wandered Lonely As A Cloud.
  • Red_in_SE8
    Red_in_SE8 Posts: 5,961
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Red_in_SE8 said:
    I have a deep aversion to fish puns so only skim this thread occasionally. I may have missed something so please ignore this post if I am raising an issue that has already been dealt with. 

    Fact: we have some director loans totalling £7 million. These loans have been raised against the ground and training ground.

    Fact: these loans only become payable on promotion to the Premier League.

    Fact: on promotion to the Premiership Charlton will immediately receive approximately £100 million and guaranteed £90 million for the following three years in parachute payments if we are relegated after one season.

    Is it still being claimed that the £7 million in loans is holding up a sale?
    It is suggested that new owners who might want to raise finance on the assets might not be able to without clean title.
    Doesn’t make sense. 
    It does.
    It doesn’t. First thing to remember is this is not a normal debt. It may never be paid. It is also interest free so it may not be financially prudent to repay it. Also, we are living in the 21st century. A world of incredibly complex financial and insurance instruments. If I was buying the club and my plan involved borrowing against the assets and I wanted to borrow the full value of the assets I Find it difficult to believe I could not easily and with not too much additional cost go to the debt market and get that loan with a tailored financial instrument that guaranteeid immediate repayment of the director loans on promotion to the Premier league. 
  • Todds_right_hook
    Todds_right_hook Posts: 10,893
    Uboat said:
    CH4RLTON said:
    In my heart i get the feeling that tonight's FF meeting should be a really good indicator and the most informative one to date.

    My head says hes just going to spout exactly the same pointless things hes said in all the others,  that's if he even bothers to turn up.








    What does your gut tell you?
    To lay off the spicy food
  • Solidgone
    Solidgone Posts: 10,230
    Cafc43v3r said:
    Clear title could also mean that the new owners are mega rich and want to use the assets as a vehicle to circumnavigate FFP in the championship?  See Derby and Sheffield Wednesday.

    Although if that ever happened the bet wetters would be out in full force. 
    Which area is preferred for our new ground; Greenwich peninsula or somewhere in Kent or ground sharing with Millwall...that would be nice. 
  • Horsfield9
    Horsfield9 Posts: 3,082
    Wonder if Roland regrets turning down @Redhenry's Arabs £43 million ?
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