United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
I am assuming you are referring to my post regarding the 'little Englander' comment. I use that term as one of the derogatory terms I use to refer to Brexit voters. In much the same where as the term 'Guardian reader' is regularly used on here as a derogatory term. I am a Guardian reader and I know what it means but I never take offence or expect the poster to explain what they mean by it.
Yes I am as I voted leave I wonder what little englander means? As I'm referred to as it I have never called out as to what newspaper they read.
Would you agree that the hard border in Ireland that you voted for, is going to be very expensive indeed?
Yes it is going to be expensive, not related at all but I think Northern Ireland should have a vote on U.K. Or Ireland of course consult with the roi first.
Do you think it will be as expensive as £350 million a week? What will the amount be spent on when sorting the hard border? Are you concerned that there may be a return to violence once your hard border is established?
All of the points raised would be on the outcome of a vote in ni, the troubles in Northern Ireland are mainly between Catholics and Protestants from Northern Ireland its not north vs roi.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
I am assuming you are referring to my post regarding the 'little Englander' comment. I use that term as one of the derogatory terms I use to refer to Brexit voters. In much the same where as the term 'Guardian reader' is regularly used on here as a derogatory term. I am a Guardian reader and I know what it means but I never take offence or expect the poster to explain what they mean by it.
You forgot liberal as a derogatory term, and liberal wet lettuce.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
So you think the Tory manifesto offers you and your family a better prospect than the Labour one ?
If the answer is yes. I would love to know on what basis you make that decision because as far as I can tell the Tories have no plan at all. Certainly not one that they are prepared to share with the electorate.
As they say.........no plan is better than a bad plan.
I thank you.
'They' meaning the Tory comms department.
Anyone not voting purely based on soundbites can surely recognise what total nonsense this statement is!
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
The only party advocating another referendum is the Lib Dems - so that's another tick for Labour.
Are you really saying - no really saying - that you do not believe there is inequality in the UK on the basis of race?
yes bob i dont think there is ineqaulity in this country and to mention it is a bit silly, people aren't held back because they are Black/Asian or any other ethnic minority, which is apparently what the Tories have done according to Labour its a statement to get those voters on side.
Approximately 15% of the UK population is BME (Black and Minority Ethnic).
Here's just a snippet - there is a lot more than this but I won't bore you.
- of the 552 Elite coaching roles in English football - 23 are BME (4%) - this despite 25% of professional footballers are BME - 53 out of the 100 FTSE companies have no director BME - Total BME directors of FTSE100 companies is 8% (and 40% of that 8% are from seven companies) - White unemployment rate 6.9%, BME is 12.9% - BME workers with degrees are two and a half times more likely to be unemployed than white workers with a university education, while black workers with degrees earned 23% less on average than a white worker with similar qualifications.
Corbyn is not saying the Tories are responsible - what he is saying is that he will do something about it.
Moreover it is not 'a bit silly' to mention it.
His wording was " been held back by the conservatives" that is stating that the conservatives have held BME back.
Are you now accepting there is a problem and just arguing about whose fault it is - or are you still saying there isn't a problem?
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
The only party advocating another referendum is the Lib Dems - so that's another tick for Labour.
Are you really saying - no really saying - that you do not believe there is inequality in the UK on the basis of race?
yes bob i dont think there is ineqaulity in this country and to mention it is a bit silly, people aren't held back because they are Black/Asian or any other ethnic minority, which is apparently what the Tories have done according to Labour its a statement to get those voters on side.
Approximately 15% of the UK population is BME (Black and Minority Ethnic).
Here's just a snippet - there is a lot more than this but I won't bore you.
- of the 552 Elite coaching roles in English football - 23 are BME (4%) - this despite 25% of professional footballers are BME - 53 out of the 100 FTSE companies have no director BME - Total BME directors of FTSE100 companies is 8% (and 40% of that 8% are from seven companies) - White unemployment rate 6.9%, BME is 12.9% - BME workers with degrees are two and a half times more likely to be unemployed than white workers with a university education, while black workers with degrees earned 23% less on average than a white worker with similar qualifications.
Corbyn is not saying the Tories are responsible - what he is saying is that he will do something about it.
Moreover it is not 'a bit silly' to mention it.
His wording was " been held back by the conservatives" that is stating that the conservatives have held BME back.
Are you now accepting there is a problem and just arguing about whose fault it is - or are you still saying there isn't a problem?
I'm saying that he has "accused" conservatives in this day 2nd June 2017 I don't think there is a problem but I haven't got facts and figures at my disposal so who am I to argue
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
I am assuming you are referring to my post regarding the 'little Englander' comment. I use that term as one of the derogatory terms I use to refer to Brexit voters. In much the same where as the term 'Guardian reader' is regularly used on here as a derogatory term. I am a Guardian reader and I know what it means but I never take offence or expect the poster to explain what they mean by it.
Yes I am as I voted leave I wonder what little englander means? As I'm referred to as it I have never called out as to what newspaper they read.
Would you agree that the hard border in Ireland that you voted for, is going to be very expensive indeed?
Yes it is going to be expensive, not related at all but I think Northern Ireland should have a vote on U.K. Or Ireland of course consult with the roi first.
Do you think it will be as expensive as £350 million a week? What will the amount be spent on when sorting the hard border? Are you concerned that there may be a return to violence once your hard border is established?
All of the points raised would be on the outcome of a vote in ni, the troubles in Northern Ireland are mainly between Catholics and Protestants from Northern Ireland its not north vs roi.
Although useful shorthand, the division in Northern Ireland is not officially Catholic v Protestant. And it was not just self contained in the 6 counties here: a reasonable proportion of violent Irish Republicans were from the Republic, while Loyalist paramilitaries did plant bombs in the Republic in the 1970s, to say nothing of Charlie Haughey's involvement in a proposed gun-running scheme (he still managed to become Taoiseach later).
Under the terms of the Good Friday Agreement, the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland can call a referendum, when he/she believes that there is sufficient support for a change. While it may be more likely, following Brexit, that enthusiasm for a United Ireland will increase, it depends on the impact of any deal, if one is, agreed on cross border movement and the economy.
It's not likely that the Conservatives would choose to have a border poll, in part because it would be an admission of failure on the part of the Leave campaign, to which they have attached their colours (which referred to warnings about threats to the Union following Brexit as Project Fear). However, it could well be that they will require Parliamentary support from either the DUP or UUP, which would lessen the chance again.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
I am assuming you are referring to my post regarding the 'little Englander' comment. I use that term as one of the derogatory terms I use to refer to Brexit voters. In much the same where as the term 'Guardian reader' is regularly used on here as a derogatory term. I am a Guardian reader and I know what it means but I never take offence or expect the poster to explain what they mean by it.
Yes I am as I voted leave I wonder what little englander means? As I'm referred to as it I have never called out as to what newspaper they read.
In my opinion little englander could mean a whole host of things, people chanting no surrender skinheads racist? If that is what you mean then if you could kindly let me know, if not then maybe don't slag 52% of the people that voted off.
I will 'slag off' and redicule Brexit voters everyday until I am in my grave. Especially when Brexit actually happens and the inevitable consequences become clear to even the dumbest Brexit voter.
So I was bang on the money - Anyone that voted leave is classed as xenophobic.
I work up town so might see you up there one day waving a placard around protesting.
Ian Mcewan expresses perfectly my feelings on Brexit.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
The only party advocating another referendum is the Lib Dems - so that's another tick for Labour.
Are you really saying - no really saying - that you do not believe there is inequality in the UK on the basis of race?
yes bob i dont think there is ineqaulity in this country and to mention it is a bit silly, people aren't held back because they are Black/Asian or any other ethnic minority, which is apparently what the Tories have done according to Labour its a statement to get those voters on side.
Approximately 15% of the UK population is BME (Black and Minority Ethnic).
Here's just a snippet - there is a lot more than this but I won't bore you.
- of the 552 Elite coaching roles in English football - 23 are BME (4%) - this despite 25% of professional footballers are BME - 53 out of the 100 FTSE companies have no director BME - Total BME directors of FTSE100 companies is 8% (and 40% of that 8% are from seven companies) - White unemployment rate 6.9%, BME is 12.9% - BME workers with degrees are two and a half times more likely to be unemployed than white workers with a university education, while black workers with degrees earned 23% less on average than a white worker with similar qualifications.
Corbyn is not saying the Tories are responsible - what he is saying is that he will do something about it.
Moreover it is not 'a bit silly' to mention it.
His wording was " been held back by the conservatives" that is stating that the conservatives have held BME back.
Are you now accepting there is a problem and just arguing about whose fault it is - or are you still saying there isn't a problem?
I'm saying that he has "accused" conservatives in this day 2nd June 2017 I don't think there is a problem but I haven't got facts and figures at my disposal so who am I to argue
Well I provided some thereby basing my argument on 'facts and figures'. In terms of 'who am I to argue' - well it's entirely reasonable for you to refute the figures I quoted with contrary evidence to support your view.
I have no idea what your ethnicity is but it is very easy for someone not affected to consider there isn't a problem when the reality is that the disease that is racism is deep-seated in this country and experienced by ethnic minorities on a daily basis.
I am White British to use the ONS label so haven't experienced it - so I need to rely on others who have for the truth.
Changing tack slightly, it was curious that on more than one occasion Corbyn used the 'homeless people in our train stations' soundbite as if homelessness was invented in 2010.
In fact in the UK it peaked in 2003, fully six years into a Labour government.
I don't have the figures for 2003, but the number of rough sleepers in the UK has increased by 134% in the past six years
Homelessness includes more than just rough sleepers and yes it has increased since 2010, but my point was that it actually peaked at much higher levels in 2003 under Labour.
So if you believe that Tory cuts have caused the recent spike in homelessness (seems fair to assume it has been a partial contributory factor), then one needs an alternative explanation for what happened under Labour last time (unsurprisingly Corbyn keeps quiet on this one!).
What happened between 2003 and 2010 then?
I don't think anyone can say with a straight face that Labour failed the homeless.
If you ignore the brief six years to 2003 and the absolute levels it reached!
So during the Labour years it rose by about 70 before falling by 210, so a net improvement of 140 to record lows, and you're seriously trying to paint this as a Labour failure?
Did you expect it to drop overnight once Blair crushed Major? Should Tony, Prezza, Campbell, Gordon and co been out Friday the morning after with the cement mixers building new homes?
Might you understand how Maggie selling off over half the housing stock may have been a factor in Labour not immediately solving the issue?
No. Still the same number of houses and (without Labour's laissez-faire attitude to immigration) still the same number of people. Now, add in Labour's deliberate policy of getting as many immigrants as possible through the door +3.6mn and might you understand that, partially, the housing shortage is of Labour's making? (Of course, it's got worse since as numbers of people that live in the UK has increased further. But that doesn't give Labour absolution does it?)
CAFC FAN it may have escaped your notice but the Tories have been in power for SEVEN years and during most of this time Theresa May was in charge of immigration with 330k slipping through through net each year. But let's not ignore the positive contribution they make to our society as mentioned elsewhere by non-racists. On housing, big house builders are only interested in £750k+ gaffes and social housing is an inconvenient add-on. I worked in the industry for 5 years. We need to build properties specifically for those on low incomes to prevent working families squandering money on ever increasing rents, often to money launderers from abroad. Please research my post on another thread about the scandal of land ownership in this country.
No it hasn't escaped my notice at all. In fact I quite like what immigrants have brought to this country, voted remain and think the NHS really would be up shit creek without a paddle if it were not for their immigrant staff. I have also previously provided a link to a Rowntree Fundation report which debunked the myth of overseas workers getting paid peanuts and doing UK workers out of jobs. So I don't much appreciate your snide allegation that I'm a racist. And would quite like a retraction.
I was merely countering a point of view that attempted to absolve Labour from any blame for the "housing crisis" by looking at it from a very narrow perspective. It is as clear as day that the housing crisis is only going to be exacerbated by net immigration though unless other remedial action is taken. How can it possibly be otherwise? Neither Labour when last in power (nor the current lot) have taken any meaningful steps to solve that problem. In fact it might be impossible to solve. Imagine what the mouth-breathers from UKIP would have been saying if cheap housing was readily available and immigration had been higher?
I also saw your other post but I'm sorry to say it made little sense to me. Yeah, most land in this country is owned by relatively few people. But most of it is entirely unsuitable for social housing or housing of any type for that matter. then there's "green belt" land I'd quite like to keep because it's so good for wildlife - I'd like the Rainham Marshes RSPB site to stay like that rather than be turned into a housing estate. I'll leave it to you to decide whether your average family would be keen to live in the middle of a forest or grouse moor, scores of miles from the nearest job, transport, hospital, education or Tesco.
Take, too, the situation with actual towns, like Fleetwood. Here you can buy and walk into a rather pleasant three-bedroom semi-detached house for a paltry £75,000. But it's of no use to anybody because there's not much work to speak of available in that town. It's largest employer makes Fisherman's Friend lozenges.
There's land available for sale slap-bang in the centre of Stoke. In London the asking price would be the bargain of the century. In Stoke, it's a different story of course. These problems are not easy to solve. They require some joined-up thinking.
I wondered about your assertion on what drives builders. So had a look at a developer I have shares in, Countryside Properties. It's true to say they put up a high proportion of high value properties but I noted that a number of their schemes had a mix of 1,2 and three bed apartments with a number of detached properties too. So there seemed to be a blend. I guess - and it is a guess - that they are forced to put up a percentage of lower value homes by the local authorities? But I noted too that they work in partnership with local authorities on certain developments which, I assume, means they are building lower priced accommodation. I hope that indicates that they find it's still profitable to do so. Because unless there is some money in it, stuff like this will not happen at all.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
.
.
Very broadly I think voting for the conservatives is voting for 'as is' bar a few changes like winter fuel, care costs etc. So I think those who generally vote conservative aren't overly bothered about their manifesto.
Voting labour is largely voting for a huge number of expensive promises which all sound wonderful but I view it as hugely unlikely that the money will be there to pay for it. So then what? If the tax rises don't raise the money they believe will taxes increase more? I suspect so and also at a much lower level.
It's also the quality of the people, corbyns key people are not fit for the jobs they are likely to have.
Just my view, I know others will have the polar opposite.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
.
So you think the Tory manifesto offers you and your family a better prospect than the Labour one ?
If the answer is yes. I would love to know on what basis you make that decision because as far as I can tell the Tories have no plan at all. Certainly not one that they are prepared to share with the electorate.
Very broadly I think voting for the conservatives is voting for 'as is' bar a few changes like winter fuel, care costs etc. So I think those who generally vote conservative aren't overly bothered about their manifesto.
Voting labour is largely voting for a huge number of expensive promises which all sound wonderful but I view it as hugely unlikely that the money will be there to pay for it. So then what? If the tax rises don't raise the money they believe will taxes increase more? I suspect so and also at a much lower level.
It's also the quality of the people, corbyns key people are not fit for the jobs they are likely to have.
Just my view, I know others will have the polar opposite.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
So you think the Tory manifesto offers you and your family a better prospect than the Labour one ?
If the answer is yes. I would love to know on what basis you make that decision because as far as I can tell the Tories have no plan at all. Certainly not one that they are prepared to share with the electorate.
Very broadly I think voting for the conservatives is voting for 'as is' bar a few changes like winter fuel, care costs etc. So I think those who generally vote conservative aren't overly bothered about their manifesto.
Voting labour is largely voting for a huge number of expensive promises which all sound wonderful but I view it as hugely unlikely that the money will be there to pay for it. So then what? If the tax rises don't raise the money they believe will taxes increase more? I suspect so and also at a much lower level.
It's also the quality of the people, corbyns key people are not fit for the jobs they are likely to have.
Just my view, I know others will have the polar opposite.
"Bar a few changes...", like completely removing the central funding grant for the many services currently provided by local councils. You do know that's happening right?
Completely removing the central grant used for providing things like parks for our kids, cleaning our streets, collecting our rubbish, youth workers, OT's for the elderly, tackling antisocial behaviour, noisy party patrols, libraries, public spaces, car parks, licensing taxi drivers and bars, inspecting cafes or your neighbours loft conversion and about a 1000 other things the public take for granted and moan like anything when they aren't there or are not as good as the used to be.
I love diverse opinions. In fact I wish I heard them more often. Strangely, though, when pressed to give a full opinion, many people go defensive and refuse. Not naming names, of course.
I have been quite ignorant of this election, until today where i have read a few of the manifestos and on here. I am looking for the best way to sort of compare as i am undecided where is the best place to look? or watch the live debates on catch up etc.
Thanks in advance i will check in later/ or some point over the weekend. I did previous vote Tory, but will look at it open minded and i am not really a fan of Theresa May or Corbyn.
I did a mock test and it showed me Green Party/ Labour, hence why i have been reading up more today.
I love diverse opinions. In fact I wish I heard them more often. Strangely, though, when pressed to give a full opinion, many people go defensive and refuse. Not naming names, of course.
Might be because those doing the pressing come across as aggressive with tantrum like finger pointing, not naming names, of course.
I have been quite ignorant of this election, until today where i have read a few of the manifestos and on here. I am looking for the best way to sort of compare as i am undecided where is the best place to look? or watch the live debates on catch up etc.
Thanks in advance i will check in later/ or some point over the weekend. I did previous vote Tory, but will look at it open minded and i am not really a fan of Theresa May or Corbyn.
The Channel 4/Sky debate is well worth watching, as well as the Leader's Debate on that was on BBC just the other day. There is also Leader's Question Time on BBC tonight I believe where May and Corbyn are challenged directly by the audience.
The ITV debate didn't include Labour or the Tories so is a bit of a waste of time unless you're planning to vote third party IMO.
Also worth considering looking at something like this quiz http://www.whoshouldyouvotefor.com/ obviously not advocating basing your vote solely on this quiz but it will align your views with the manifesto policies and tell you who your views most align with.
I simply want to put out there that the Conservative Party candidate standing in South Thanet, and charged with Electorial fraud under the Representation of the People's act, is innocent until proven guilty.
Being somebody who believes in Democracy I must apologise to Nigel Farage who did say this at the time but I thought it was sour grapes.
No doubt the Tory party will be distancing themselves from the candidate and possibly withdrawing him from the contest?
The Conservative Party have released a statement. Sorry I can't post a link, but it is easily accessed on the BBC site.
I've not seen the statement but I'm betting that it start with " it's clear"
Just read this.
A separate Conservative statement said the party was standing by Mackinlay, and referred to previous allegations against candidates, over which the CPS opted to take no action, as being “politically motivated”.
United Kingdom Sadiq Khan - london mayor Jeremy Corbyn - prime minister
To quote heavy d from arsenal fan tv " were fucked "
Were fucked before, but OK now. Is that what you mean?
Them 2 in those positions would be very bad.
They wouldn't fill be with confidence either - but May is better, do you think?
Even the tory grandees recognise her as a dim-witted, nasty character with, I have to say, not a single positive trait. That's why they won't allow her to answer any questions that she hasn't prepared for in advance - and even then it's the same old drivel of platitudes, meaningless rhetoric and repetitive slogans.
The country is well and truly fucked if the current crop of so-called leaders is the best we've got.
Tbh I'm only voting may/conservative because in my opinion she's the best of a very bad lot. The constant bitching and whining countrywide about brexit is a constant annoyance, if we have another vote and the People vote leave again will that be it, or will it be a constant string of elections until remain is voted In, as I may be mistaken but that's not a democracy, the little Englanders comment the poster hasn't commented on so unclear what he/she means. Some elements of labour I do like renationalising railways, looking after the elderly for example but then there's things I don't agree with free uni fees, defence budget cuts, the references that racial equality is a factor in the employment and education of people. So on that basis I add up the pros and cons and make my decision on that.
I am assuming you are referring to my post regarding the 'little Englander' comment. I use that term as one of the derogatory terms I use to refer to Brexit voters. In much the same where as the term 'Guardian reader' is regularly used on here as a derogatory term. I am a Guardian reader and I know what it means but I never take offence or expect the poster to explain what they mean by it.
Yes I am as I voted leave I wonder what little englander means? As I'm referred to as it I have never called out as to what newspaper they read.
In my opinion little englander could mean a whole host of things, people chanting no surrender skinheads racist? If that is what you mean then if you could kindly let me know, if not then maybe don't slag 52% of the people that voted off.
I will 'slag off' and redicule Brexit voters everyday until I am in my grave. Especially when Brexit actually happens and the inevitable consequences become clear to even the dumbest Brexit voter.
So I was bang on the money - Anyone that voted leave is classed as xenophobic.
I work up town so might see you up there one day waving a placard around protesting.
I think that is bang out of order @palarsehater, people voted leave for a number of reasons and I am quite sure that many of them were not xenophobes. I think you should apologise to Brexiters.
This article might be of interest for those who are interested in the shadowy spin doctors. It argues that Lynton Crosby is losing his touch. The author is worth reading because he knows his stuff and has a Charlton connection. Chris Powell. Not Sir Chris, but one of the Powell brothers who have impacted on politics (Jonathan and Sir Charles are the other two ). He was my old boss at the ad agency, and as such was the man who sanctioned the pro bono Valley party ad campaign. He retired long ago but I am delighted to see his brain is still razor sharp.
Those you listed were because of expenses fraud. The MP who claimed the lowest amount of expenses when all the fiddling was being chased up, and has nearly always claimed the least is Jeremy Corbyn. One part of his Parliamentary history that people don't keep going on about for some reason.
What you forget is that at £80k it is quite likely people will be taxed more under the Tories - if you could decipher their manifesto - we are only looking at an extra £400 per anum under Labour.
In terms of the phrase little Englander - I think the reference is possibly to Warwick Davies
Amazed some polls now showing Labour on 40%, must be one the most meteoric campaign turn arounds in recent U.K. History
Blimey. Pity I only get back to Eltham on the 8th afternoon. Otherwise I wouldn't just vote for Clive Efford, I would go out and bang on some doors for him
Those you listed were because of expenses fraud. The MP who claimed the lowest amount of expenses when all the fiddling was being chased up, and has nearly always claimed the least is Jeremy Corbyn. One part of his Parliamentary history that people don't keep going on about for some reason.
Without expressing an opinion one way or the other on the innocence or guilt of the Conservative candidate for South Thanet he has not wilfully claimed expenses for personal gain like the MPs shown in the above link supplied by @cafcfan .
What MAY have been done in his name is a breach of expense limits for individual candidates under the Representation of Peoples Act. The Party Machine looks after that side of things and the individual candidate will attach a signature as and when required. In other words he (and others) may have committed a technical breach of electoral rules which, whilst still wrong if he has, is not in the same league as shameless snouts in the trough.
Comments
Anyone not voting purely based on soundbites can surely recognise what total nonsense this statement is!
Under the terms of the Good Friday Agreement, the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland can call a referendum, when he/she believes that there is sufficient support for a change. While it may be more likely, following Brexit, that enthusiasm for a United Ireland will increase, it depends on the impact of any deal, if one is, agreed on cross border movement and the economy.
It's not likely that the Conservatives would choose to have a border poll, in part because it would be an admission of failure on the part of the Leave campaign, to which they have attached their colours (which referred to warnings about threats to the Union following Brexit as Project Fear). However, it could well be that they will require Parliamentary support from either the DUP or UUP, which would lessen the chance again.
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2017/jun/02/ian-mcewan-denialist-confessions-remainer-brexit
I have no idea what your ethnicity is but it is very easy for someone not affected to consider there isn't a problem when the reality is that the disease that is racism is deep-seated in this country and experienced by ethnic minorities on a daily basis.
I am White British to use the ONS label so haven't experienced it - so I need to rely on others who have for the truth.
I was merely countering a point of view that attempted to absolve Labour from any blame for the "housing crisis" by looking at it from a very narrow perspective. It is as clear as day that the housing crisis is only going to be exacerbated by net immigration though unless other remedial action is taken. How can it possibly be otherwise? Neither Labour when last in power (nor the current lot) have taken any meaningful steps to solve that problem. In fact it might be impossible to solve. Imagine what the mouth-breathers from UKIP would have been saying if cheap housing was readily available and immigration had been higher?
I also saw your other post but I'm sorry to say it made little sense to me. Yeah, most land in this country is owned by relatively few people. But most of it is entirely unsuitable for social housing or housing of any type for that matter. then there's "green belt" land I'd quite like to keep because it's so good for wildlife - I'd like the Rainham Marshes RSPB site to stay like that rather than be turned into a housing estate. I'll leave it to you to decide whether your average family would be keen to live in the middle of a forest or grouse moor, scores of miles from the nearest job, transport, hospital, education or Tesco.
Take, too, the situation with actual towns, like Fleetwood. Here you can buy and walk into a rather pleasant three-bedroom semi-detached house for a paltry £75,000. But it's of no use to anybody because there's not much work to speak of available in that town. It's largest employer makes Fisherman's Friend lozenges.
There's land available for sale slap-bang in the centre of Stoke. In London the asking price would be the bargain of the century. In Stoke, it's a different story of course. These problems are not easy to solve. They require some joined-up thinking.
I wondered about your assertion on what drives builders. So had a look at a developer I have shares in, Countryside Properties. It's true to say they put up a high proportion of high value properties but I noted that a number of their schemes had a mix of 1,2 and three bed apartments with a number of detached properties too. So there seemed to be a blend. I guess - and it is a guess - that they are forced to put up a percentage of lower value homes by the local authorities? But I noted too that they work in partnership with local authorities on certain developments which, I assume, means they are building lower priced accommodation. I hope that indicates that they find it's still profitable to do so. Because unless there is some money in it, stuff like this will not happen at all.
Having no plan is letting him play up front.
No plan is telling them to play with smiles on their faces.
Completely removing the central grant used for providing things like parks for our kids, cleaning our streets, collecting our rubbish, youth workers, OT's for the elderly, tackling antisocial behaviour, noisy party patrols, libraries, public spaces, car parks, licensing taxi drivers and bars, inspecting cafes or your neighbours loft conversion and about a 1000 other things the public take for granted and moan like anything when they aren't there or are not as good as the used to be.
A "few changes" my arse!
Thanks in advance i will check in later/ or some point over the weekend. I did previous vote Tory, but will look at it open minded and i am not really a fan of Theresa May or Corbyn.
I did a mock test and it showed me Green Party/ Labour, hence why i have been reading up more today.
The ITV debate didn't include Labour or the Tories so is a bit of a waste of time unless you're planning to vote third party IMO.
Also worth considering looking at something like this quiz http://www.whoshouldyouvotefor.com/ obviously not advocating basing your vote solely on this quiz but it will align your views with the manifesto policies and tell you who your views most align with.
A separate Conservative statement said the party was standing by Mackinlay, and referred to previous allegations against candidates, over which the CPS opted to take no action, as being “politically motivated”.
telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/8776160/Expenses-MPs-and-their-sentences-how-long-each-served.html
Those you listed were because of expenses fraud.
The MP who claimed the lowest amount of expenses when all the fiddling was being chased up, and has nearly always claimed the least is
Jeremy Corbyn.
One part of his Parliamentary history that people don't keep going on about for some reason.
However whilst we look back:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5314219/Michael-Gove-to-pay-back-7000-MPs-expenses.htmlhttp://londonist.com/2009/10/boris_johnson_told_to_pay_back_expehttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5309646/MPs-expenses-David-Davies-the-council-estate-lad-who-claimed-5700-for-a-portico.htmlhttps://www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/dec/10/jeremy-hunt-repays-expenses
In terms of the phrase little Englander - I think the reference is possibly to Warwick Davies
The tories will still win, but May is toast.
What MAY have been done in his name is a breach of expense limits for individual candidates under the Representation of Peoples Act. The Party Machine looks after that side of things and the individual candidate will attach a signature as and when required. In other words he (and others) may have committed a technical breach of electoral rules which, whilst still wrong if he has, is not in the same league as shameless snouts in the trough.
In my opinion anyway.