How many sprinkler companies do you think are out there to carry out any retrofitting that everyone is expecting?
This, plus the lead times for raw materials will be massive - especially if all the orders go in at once. I fear that the pressure to do everything all at once and yesterday is going to lead to nothing getting done properly.
Now is the time to get things done properly, the purse strings are open - but just because every building has not been recladded and retrofitted with sprinklers yesterday doesn't mean nothing is happening.
Communication has been utter shite though, the government should have appointed a 'czar' for all comms to flow through, taking the strain of individual councils. The line needs to be, this is what we are doing and why it is the right way to do it. This 'czar' should be an expert from outside the government, to depoliticise this situation as much as possible.
i loved my time working for lewisham council, but despite the clear talent that did work for them in a lot of areas, comms was not where the best and the brightest went!
i do think that's the way it should be though, leave the experienced people to do their jobs, they shouldn't be fact finding and arse covering for their superiors. The government should take the heat right now and make changes at local level after a solution is in place (a solution to the crisis i mean). I bet a few councils are even spending some budget on crisis PR, just a hunch.
It always used to happen in education, if an MP asked our director a question, everything stopped until they had their answer, no matter how important the job we were doing at the time (providing SEN statements for kids btw) its a shocking waste of resources, and it seems to me that is what is happening now.
I'm not allowed to talk to the meeja - all has to go through my Comms team, (which has more members of staff than I do).
Had to turn important TV chanels down like BBC Asian network and RTE. High powered fire expert me - in great demand
I've had media training and it sounds like money for old rope, but it's not, and even though BBC Asia and RTE may sound like slim pickings, journalists can spin anything when they sense prey. Make a mistake locally and it goes national quickly.
I'm doing it because it matters to me despite being lucky enough to be in a position where I could tell them "I told you so" and telling them to stick it.
Not a single word of thanks either.
I know it doesn't really help Addickted, but thank you.
They take for ever then pick a controversial judge in relation to the specifics of this enquiry. Not saying he wouldn't be totally honest, but can't see how the families will accept the choice which has implications down the line. Are these people in authority really as stupid as they seemingly keep demonstrating?
They take for ever then pick a controversial judge in relation to the specifics of this enquiry. Not saying he wouldn't be totally honest, but can't see how the families will accept the choice which has implications down the line. Are these people in authority really as stupid as they seemingly keep demonstrating?
Unfortunately,they are. We all know this enquiry should be totally independent as its the only way to ensure theres no cover up.
They take for ever then pick a controversial judge in relation to the specifics of this enquiry. Not saying he wouldn't be totally honest, but can't see how the families will accept the choice which has implications down the line. Are these people in authority really as stupid as they seemingly keep demonstrating?
You seem to be falling for some journalistic spin. So, go on then, find me a judge anywhere in the UK working or retired who has served for a long period of time and you'll find one that has made "controversial decisions". (What does that even mean? In this case it seems to be that the graunidad has scrabbled around and found one mildly tricky matter. Big deal. Every judge has had decisions overturned. Sometimes they get things wrong. In any event the very nature of their work means they can't keep everyone happy all the time.)
As I pointed out to you previously the appointment was within the ambit of the Lord Chief Justice; not politicians. Without exception, every judge I have ever had to deal with has been unfailingly fair, extraordinarily intelligent and perhaps most importantly is able to quickly grasp and understand subject matter. Are you suggesting the Lord Chief Justice is in some way thick? Because if that's true and as he's presently the best of the bunch, we really are in the shit.
Chair of inquiry predicting there will be an outcry as his brief is strictly limited to grenfell tower fire and no wider.
Perhaps this is to ensure that we don't have the whole matter dragging out to save the survivors unnecessary anguish and drive new rules/laws more quickly?
I suspect that we might all feel short changed as surely this issue is due to systemic failures and therefore demands root and branch investigations.
I certainly wouldn't want to think at the end of this process, following on from so much pain that we didn't all know why a large percentage of the country is literally living and possibly working in death traps.
I get the feeling that whomever carries out the Inquiry, you'd find a reason to object.
You've already made your mind up.
You see, I think the irony is that to me your mind has been totally closed, given that you have strong expertise in the field that nobody else has, I have sensed from your posts an unwillingness to listen to the contributions of others. So thanks for judging me, I'll judge you back.
As for my point, it is an important one - the historic sex abuse enquiry had to change it's leader 4 times beacause not enough was done - on two occasions anyway to consider potential objections from victims. How the victims percieve this appointment, not me, is going to determine how smoothly the enquiry goes.
Why not try to get the chair of the Camberwell fire enquiry? There would be lots of learned expertise there. If they couldn't at least let people know they were the first choice! Also worrying that this judge is saying the enquiry will only focus on how fire started and spread - that seems to go against what politicians have been openly promising.
You can bet your life that many of those who have been screaming blue murder of corruption and neglect by the councils and government are the same dirty bstds that have used their flats that they have been given and rented them fraudulently exploiting the same people they are crying about ,
During the the enquiry I hope that we learn all the facts and we expose not only those who took back handers within the building contracts but also dig deep and hard to expose the ease of which the scum who deliberately sub let and exploit those in need and put things in place to stop it
Those that rented out rooms to family's meaning in some of those flats there were 3 x the amount of people living in there than what was believed are as guilty of them dying as the builders and government
Why not try to get the chair of the Camberwell fire enquiry? There would be lots of learned expertise there. If they couldn't at least let people know they were the first choice! Also worrying that this judge is saying the enquiry will only focus on how fire started and spread - that seems to go against what politicians have been openly promising.
We've done this to death. She's now retired from UK judging. But she's still working. She's a Justice of the Qatar International Court and Dispute Resolution Centre. Would that be "controversial" at all, do you think? I refer you to the construction deaths on the World Cup stadia..... Just chill and stop assuming everyone is corrupt.
Why not try to get the chair of the Camberwell fire enquiry? There would be lots of learned expertise there. If they couldn't at least let people know they were the first choice! Also worrying that this judge is saying the enquiry will only focus on how fire started and spread - that seems to go against what politicians have been openly promising.
We've done this to death. She's now retired from UK judging. But she's still working. She's a Justice of the Qatar International Court and Dispute Resolution Centre. Would that be "controversial" at all, do you think? I refer you to the construction deaths on the World Cup stadia..... Just chill and stop assuming everyone is corrupt.
A lot of people are - but my point is that the judge has to satisfy the victims not me. I haven't made any direct comment about his honesty. Nothing will be served by this judge being pressured off like the historic abuse ones. Getting these things right from the beginning is important and promises were made to the residents that have to be kept. You shouldn't be telling me to chill but the residents! I am just making what seems to be an obvious point! That it is lost on you that it is not political but practical is not my fault!
But the Inquiry is not taking place to satisfy the victims.
It's there to examine the facts. How the fire started, how it was able to spread so rapidly, what precautions were in place to prevent the spread of fire, what steps were taken to alert residents of a fire and why was the stay put policy ineffective.
The result of the inquiry will then allow the CPS to take the decision if any criminal prosecutions are necessary. If there have been any deliberate and criminal activities that have taken place then quite rightly those involved should be prosecuted and receive heavy sentences, rather than just the fines given to Southwark after the Lakanal inquiry which punished nobody but Southwark Council tax payers.
I really hope to see some Corporate Manslaughter convictions, though I expect this will be very difficult to prove.
From my point of view, I want to know what went wrong, how it went wrong and what is the best course of action to ensure this disaster is not repeated.
Comments
Now is the time to get things done properly, the purse strings are open - but just because every building has not been recladded and retrofitted with sprinklers yesterday doesn't mean nothing is happening.
Communication has been utter shite though, the government should have appointed a 'czar' for all comms to flow through, taking the strain of individual councils. The line needs to be, this is what we are doing and why it is the right way to do it. This 'czar' should be an expert from outside the government, to depoliticise this situation as much as possible.
The media are finding plenty of non government experts to act as talking heads, could start there.
Had to turn important TV chanels down like BBC Asian network and RTE. High powered fire expert me - in great demand
i do think that's the way it should be though, leave the experienced people to do their jobs, they shouldn't be fact finding and arse covering for their superiors. The government should take the heat right now and make changes at local level after a solution is in place (a solution to the crisis i mean). I bet a few councils are even spending some budget on crisis PR, just a hunch.
It always used to happen in education, if an MP asked our director a question, everything stopped until they had their answer, no matter how important the job we were doing at the time (providing SEN statements for kids btw) its a shocking waste of resources, and it seems to me that is what is happening now.
As I pointed out to you previously the appointment was within the ambit of the Lord Chief Justice; not politicians. Without exception, every judge I have ever had to deal with has been unfailingly fair, extraordinarily intelligent and perhaps most importantly is able to quickly grasp and understand subject matter. Are you suggesting the Lord Chief Justice is in some way thick? Because if that's true and as he's presently the best of the bunch, we really are in the shit.
You've already made your mind up.
He agreed that someone could be re-housed in Milton Keynes.
Perhaps this is to ensure that we don't have the whole matter dragging out to save the survivors unnecessary anguish and drive new rules/laws more quickly?
I suspect that we might all feel short changed as surely this issue is due to systemic failures and therefore demands root and branch investigations.
I certainly wouldn't want to think at the end of this process, following on from so much pain that we didn't all know why a large percentage of the country is literally living and possibly working in death traps.
As for my point, it is an important one - the historic sex abuse enquiry had to change it's leader 4 times beacause not enough was done - on two occasions anyway to consider potential objections from victims. How the victims percieve this appointment, not me, is going to determine how smoothly the enquiry goes.
During the the enquiry I hope that we learn all the facts and we expose not only those who took back handers within the building contracts but also dig deep and hard to expose the ease of which the scum who deliberately sub let and exploit those in need and put things in place to stop it
Those that rented out rooms to family's meaning in some of those flats there were 3 x the amount of people living in there than what was believed are as guilty of them dying as the builders and government
It's there to examine the facts. How the fire started, how it was able to spread so rapidly, what precautions were in place to prevent the spread of fire, what steps were taken to alert residents of a fire and why was the stay put policy ineffective.
The result of the inquiry will then allow the CPS to take the decision if any criminal prosecutions are necessary. If there have been any deliberate and criminal activities that have taken place then quite rightly those involved should be prosecuted and receive heavy sentences, rather than just the fines given to Southwark after the Lakanal inquiry which punished nobody but Southwark Council tax payers.
I really hope to see some Corporate Manslaughter convictions, though I expect this will be very difficult to prove.
From my point of view, I want to know what went wrong, how it went wrong and what is the best course of action to ensure this disaster is not repeated.