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The rise of the vegans.

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  • Rob7Lee said:
    MrOneLung said:
    Serious question, would you guys not visit a friends house that had leather sofa of get in a car with leather seats? 

    No right or wrong answers, just curious. 
    Yes, I would, just as I eat at a table where people are eating meat. I just try to live my life as authentically as possible according to my own ethics.
    What I hate (and I've said this before) is people making remarks about their non-vegan lifestyle in a joking way while I'm there - 'oh I'm eating turkey for xmas, sorry Al' etc. Just as I don't point out the lump of dead meat on their plate I don't expect to become a figure of fun for my beliefs.

    I started going to a Buddhist group a couple of years ago. As well as most of them being vegan, they also enjoy a simpler, less consumer led lifestyle which fits with my beliefs. It's such a relief to spend time with them. It's where I feel most comfortable and accepted.
    I had similar for a while when I went tea total, they soon got bored of the ribbing after a while.
    If you do anything outside of the norm it invariably bothers some people who then feel obliged to make 'humorous' comments for months/years which get even less funny with repetition. I'm never clear what response they expect?

    I remember as a kid in the 70s getting my ears pierced which was just too much for some people - they seemed to feel obliged to pass comment on my appearance. 


    That wasn’t on (unless you had the right ear pierced, which is the gay one)
  • Rob7Lee said:
    MrOneLung said:
    Serious question, would you guys not visit a friends house that had leather sofa of get in a car with leather seats? 

    No right or wrong answers, just curious. 
    Yes, I would, just as I eat at a table where people are eating meat. I just try to live my life as authentically as possible according to my own ethics.
    What I hate (and I've said this before) is people making remarks about their non-vegan lifestyle in a joking way while I'm there - 'oh I'm eating turkey for xmas, sorry Al' etc. Just as I don't point out the lump of dead meat on their plate I don't expect to become a figure of fun for my beliefs.

    I started going to a Buddhist group a couple of years ago. As well as most of them being vegan, they also enjoy a simpler, less consumer led lifestyle which fits with my beliefs. It's such a relief to spend time with them. It's where I feel most comfortable and accepted.
    I had similar for a while when I went tea total, they soon got bored of the ribbing after a while.
    If you do anything outside of the norm it invariably bothers some people who then feel obliged to make 'humorous' comments for months/years which get even less funny with repetition. I'm never clear what response they expect?

    I remember as a kid in the 70s getting my ears pierced which was just too much for some people - they seemed to feel obliged to pass comment on my appearance. 


    That wasn’t on (unless you had the right ear pierced, which is the gay one)
    I had both pierced which guaranteed me endless comments including questions about my sexuality and being compared to David Essex and gypsies. Didn't take much to freak people out back then. Happy days!




  • Rob7Lee said:
    MrOneLung said:
    Serious question, would you guys not visit a friends house that had leather sofa of get in a car with leather seats? 

    No right or wrong answers, just curious. 
    Yes, I would, just as I eat at a table where people are eating meat. I just try to live my life as authentically as possible according to my own ethics.
    What I hate (and I've said this before) is people making remarks about their non-vegan lifestyle in a joking way while I'm there - 'oh I'm eating turkey for xmas, sorry Al' etc. Just as I don't point out the lump of dead meat on their plate I don't expect to become a figure of fun for my beliefs.

    I started going to a Buddhist group a couple of years ago. As well as most of them being vegan, they also enjoy a simpler, less consumer led lifestyle which fits with my beliefs. It's such a relief to spend time with them. It's where I feel most comfortable and accepted.
    I had similar for a while when I went tea total, they soon got bored of the ribbing after a while.
    If you do anything outside of the norm it invariably bothers some people who then feel obliged to make 'humorous' comments for months/years which get even less funny with repetition. I'm never clear what response they expect?

    I remember as a kid in the 70s getting my ears pierced which was just too much for some people - they seemed to feel obliged to pass comment on my appearance. 


    That wasn’t on (unless you had the right ear pierced, which is the gay one)
    I had both pierced which guaranteed me endless comments including questions about my sexuality and being compared to David Essex and gypsies. Didn't take much to freak people out back then. Happy days!




    Probably you announcing that your new Prince Albert was the best thing ever ;)
  • I suppose this stresses the importance of making sure you counter the lack of calcium from not eating dairy by making sure you take a supplement. 

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/vegans-40-more-likely-to-suffer-a-bone-fracture-rzb2bj06l

    I can't read the full article because it's behind a paywall, but seems that it might be indicating that the 'meat alternatives' are lulling people into a false sense of security (ie: it seems to then that they're replacing meat with 'like meat' and it's therefore got all the stuff in it that they need). Just lends more weight to the discussion had earlier in this thread about not seeking out a direct replacement for meat in vegetarian/vegan meals, but rather embracing the idea that you don't *need* to do that to eat healthily and tastily
  • I suppose this stresses the importance of making sure you counter the lack of calcium from not eating dairy by making sure you take a supplement. 

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/vegans-40-more-likely-to-suffer-a-bone-fracture-rzb2bj06l

    I can't read the full article because it's behind a paywall, but seems that it might be indicating that the 'meat alternatives' are lulling people into a false sense of security (ie: it seems to then that they're replacing meat with 'like meat' and it's therefore got all the stuff in it that they need). Just lends more weight to the discussion had earlier in this thread about not seeking out a direct replacement for meat in vegetarian/vegan meals, but rather embracing the idea that you don't *need* to do that to eat healthily and tastily
    Hard to get a balanced diet if you exclude foods and then don't replace the vitamins etc that they provide. It's quite possible to eat a very unhealthy vegan diet.
  • I suppose this stresses the importance of making sure you counter the lack of calcium from not eating dairy by making sure you take a supplement. 

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/vegans-40-more-likely-to-suffer-a-bone-fracture-rzb2bj06l

    I can't read the full article because it's behind a paywall, but seems that it might be indicating that the 'meat alternatives' are lulling people into a false sense of security (ie: it seems to then that they're replacing meat with 'like meat' and it's therefore got all the stuff in it that they need). Just lends more weight to the discussion had earlier in this thread about not seeking out a direct replacement for meat in vegetarian/vegan meals, but rather embracing the idea that you don't *need* to do that to eat healthily and tastily
    Hard to get a balanced diet if you exclude foods and then don't replace the vitamins etc that they provide. It's quite possible to eat a very unhealthy vegan diet.
    Damn right. Someone I used to work with was a vegan - she was a huge shambling mess of a woman who seemed to subsist entirely on junk food, and get less exercise than the average piece of furniture
  • I suppose this stresses the importance of making sure you counter the lack of calcium from not eating dairy by making sure you take a supplement. 

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/vegans-40-more-likely-to-suffer-a-bone-fracture-rzb2bj06l

    I can't read the full article because it's behind a paywall, but seems that it might be indicating that the 'meat alternatives' are lulling people into a false sense of security (ie: it seems to then that they're replacing meat with 'like meat' and it's therefore got all the stuff in it that they need). Just lends more weight to the discussion had earlier in this thread about not seeking out a direct replacement for meat in vegetarian/vegan meals, but rather embracing the idea that you don't *need* to do that to eat healthily and tastily
    Hard to get a balanced diet if you exclude foods and then don't replace the vitamins etc that they provide. It's quite possible to eat a very unhealthy vegan diet.
    Damn right. Someone I used to work with was a vegan - she was a huge shambling mess of a woman who seemed to subsist entirely on junk food, and get less exercise than the average piece of furniture
    Liver and kidneys are really good for you but a lot of people aren't keen. Some vegans seem to assume their diet is good without a lot of research.

    I used to work on an orthopaedic ward and regularly saw the effects of a lack of calcium with fractures in the elderly. 
  • Of course if you eat a diet full of processed crap, or a diet of nothing but chips then you will not get the nutrients you need. That goes for an omnivore diet as well as vegan. If you fuel your body with shit, you’re going to feel like shit. End of. By no means am I perfect, some days I don’t eat for the best but that has nothing to do with veganism but purely because I’m lazy or don’t have the time. One thing that has amazed me since I went vegan is the number of people who suddenly seem to have qualifications in nutrition. Funny thing, no one ever seems to care about the nutritional needs of a person if they don’t follow a plant based diet. When I ate meat I can’t recall anyone ever saying to me ‘hmmm, that pepperoni pizza is unhealthy or that burger dripping with grease and cheese is not going to meet your daily requirements. 

    Anyway, here are two videos sourced from YouTube that may be of interest. 

    How to Prevent Deficiencies On A Plant Based Diet

     https://youtu.be/zKwnMCEp3HM

    The Four Rules For Thriving on a Plant Based Diet

    https://youtu.be/WYe6NIsyIXs

    I raised the issue as it's a thread about veganism and there are a minority of vegans who can be preachy about their diet.
    I do take an interest in nutrition and my concern is that some who switch to a vegan diet don't. There can be health implications if you don't replace things that you remove from your diet.

    You are obviously well informed on the matter so I will watch the videos you have recommended.

    I fully accept that any diet can be unhealthy and that ultimately a vegan diet may be the best for us if we can get everything we require from it. 
  • edited November 2020
    Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


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  • Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
  • Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
    It’s definitely worth a watch if you get the chance. It may not be perfect and some people have tried to debunk it but it contains many truths in my opinion. My tip is approach it with an open mind.
  • Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
    It’s definitely worth a watch if you get the chance. It may not be perfect and some people have tried to debunk it but it contains many truths in my opinion. My tip is approach it with an open mind.
    I'm definitely open minded. Certainly keen to improve my diet and health.
  • Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    Blimey!
  • Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
    It’s definitely worth a watch if you get the chance. It may not be perfect and some people have tried to debunk it but it contains many truths in my opinion. My tip is approach it with an open mind.
    After watching it find the two Joe Rogan Experience episodes 

    1. A bloke debunks the documentary. 

    2. James (the maker of the documentary) challenges the debunking. The guy in episode 1 admits at one point he doesn't know how to interpret one of the graphs yet it was a big point for him in debunking the entire documentary. 

    Personally I felt those two discussions made the documentary all the more interesting. (You'll need a couple of hours for the documentary and about 4 that you can listen to the two podcasts), personally I think it was vital in me understanding the pros and cons of every statement made in Game Changers
  • Dazzler21 said:
    Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
    It’s definitely worth a watch if you get the chance. It may not be perfect and some people have tried to debunk it but it contains many truths in my opinion. My tip is approach it with an open mind.
    After watching it find the two Joe Rogan Experience episodes 

    1. A bloke debunks the documentary. 

    2. James (the maker of the documentary) challenges the debunking. The guy in episode 1 admits at one point he doesn't know how to interpret one of the graphs yet it was a big point for him in debunking the entire documentary. 

    Personally I felt those two discussions made the documentary all the more interesting. (You'll need a couple of hours for the documentary and about 4 that you can listen to the two podcasts), personally I think it was vital in me understanding the pros and cons of every statement made in Game Changers
    Just finished watching Game Changers and found it a really interesting watch. I've looked at some of the articles debunking some of the claims in the documentary and it's given me plenty of food for thought.

    Ultimately I want to improve my health and to have a diet that is more sustainable. If I can move towards a more plant based diet I will do but I will continue to read up on the subject.


  • edited November 2020
    Dazzler21 said:
    Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
    It’s definitely worth a watch if you get the chance. It may not be perfect and some people have tried to debunk it but it contains many truths in my opinion. My tip is approach it with an open mind.
    After watching it find the two Joe Rogan Experience episodes 

    1. A bloke debunks the documentary. 

    2. James (the maker of the documentary) challenges the debunking. The guy in episode 1 admits at one point he doesn't know how to interpret one of the graphs yet it was a big point for him in debunking the entire documentary. 

    Personally I felt those two discussions made the documentary all the more interesting. (You'll need a couple of hours for the documentary and about 4 that you can listen to the two podcasts), personally I think it was vital in me understanding the pros and cons of every statement made in Game Changers
    Just finished watching Game Changers and found it a really interesting watch. I've looked at some of the articles debunking some of the claims in the documentary and it's given me plenty of food for thought.

    Ultimately I want to improve my health and to have a diet that is more sustainable. If I can move towards a more plant based diet I will do but I will continue to read up on the subject.
    Honestly at least watch/listen to the second of the two JRE episodes. James whatshisname backs up almost every statement game changers made. Joe Rogan simply mediates as the debunker and James go at it. 

    I really enjoyed both the documentary and the follow up debates.

    *James Wilks & Chris Kresser* 

  • mascot88 said:
    I don’t think we’ll ever really find the cause of Covid 19, it may not have been the eating of an infected bat @Dazzler21 so in that respect I agree with your post. What can’t be denied is that intensive animal agriculture is undoubtedly creating problems for the future. I’ve posted a video for you to watch (it’s just over six minutes long so not too time consuming) from a vegan activist called Earthling Ed. He’s a ‘gentle’ activist who doesn’t talk with fire and brimstone so he shouldn’t be too hard going for you. The message he is conveying about antibiotic resistance should be listened to. I hope you find the time to give it a go.

    https://youtu.be/gnQL-brI-9I

    One thing I do hope that comes about through Covid 19 is the end of the barbaric practice of fur farming. The problems experienced in Denmark with mink were problems that could’ve been fully avoided if fur farming had been consigned to the distant past. Unless you’re an Inuit or similar there is absolutely no reason for any human being to wear the fur of another species. It’s fucking gross.
    I agree and it makes me so angry the arrogance and ignorance of some. I often think I should carry a pot of paint and accidentally spill it on them.

    I’ve also never been able to get my head around women walking a dog while wearing a fur coat, can they not see the hypocrisy?
    The hypocrisy of someone loving a pet whilst putting another animal through a life of forced pregnancy and child stripping then death is cognitive dissonance 
    Sorry I don’t get your point, if you’re relating it to me?
  • Dazzler21 said:
    Dazzler21 said:
    Here’s an interview with ultra athlete Rich Roll who up until the age of 39 was a self confessed couch potato. Following a health scare he adopted a plant based lifestyle and thrived. Not many people can compete in the Ultraman World Championships where participants complete a 6.2 mile swim, a 261.4 mile bike ride and a 52.4 mile run over three days. Roll smashed it. This may be of interest to you @Dazzler21

    https://youtu.be/fb3iNi60wH8


    There is also a film on Netflix called 'The Game Changers' regarding elite athletes and diet. I will watch it when I get a chance.

    It does seem a lot of athletes are turning towards a vegan diet. 
    It’s definitely worth a watch if you get the chance. It may not be perfect and some people have tried to debunk it but it contains many truths in my opinion. My tip is approach it with an open mind.
    After watching it find the two Joe Rogan Experience episodes 

    1. A bloke debunks the documentary. 

    2. James (the maker of the documentary) challenges the debunking. The guy in episode 1 admits at one point he doesn't know how to interpret one of the graphs yet it was a big point for him in debunking the entire documentary. 

    Personally I felt those two discussions made the documentary all the more interesting. (You'll need a couple of hours for the documentary and about 4 that you can listen to the two podcasts), personally I think it was vital in me understanding the pros and cons of every statement made in Game Changers
    Just finished watching Game Changers and found it a really interesting watch. I've looked at some of the articles debunking some of the claims in the documentary and it's given me plenty of food for thought.

    Ultimately I want to improve my health and to have a diet that is more sustainable. If I can move towards a more plant based diet I will do but I will continue to read up on the subject.
    Honestly at least watch/listen to the second of the two JRE episodes. James whatshisname backs up almost every statement game changers made. Joe Rogan simply mediates as the debunker and James go at it. 

    I really enjoyed both the documentary and the follow up debates.

    *James Wilks & Chris Kresser* 

    I watched a fair bit of the debate but found it rather laboured. Maybe somebody other than James and Chris could have made it more engaging.


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  • edited January 2021

    This guy is 72 and looks better than both in terms of health and fitness. Oh he's apparently a vegan bodybuilder.



  • Can't stand stuff like this, I could post a picture of me when I ate meat in 2017 to a picture of me now and I'm unrecognisable. Very easy to make bias images like this 

    Anyway, Aldi are great atm, they have vegan pains au chocolat, marshmallows, chocolate fudge brownie ice cream (it's really good) and some new additions. 

    I've always wanted junk food to be more viable and cheaper, now it's becoming dangerous how often I can find stuff, must have put on half a stone over Christmas :smile:

    Good luck to anyone attempting veganuary, best decision you'll ever make 
  • That’s a piss poor attempt at trying to prove a point from Hartleypete but to be honest it’s a common thing when it comes to non-vegans trying to put down the personal choice of millions (and counting) of people. The reality is that a plant based diet of natural whole foods has been proven by medical and dietetic bodies worldwide to not only be healthy but in many cases can help a person to thrive. As far as I’m aware no vegetable, fruit, legume or grain has been classed as a class 1 carcinogenic unlike bacon and other heavily processed meats.
  • That’s a piss poor attempt at trying to prove a point from Hartleypete but to be honest it’s a common thing when it comes to non-vegans trying to put down the personal choice of millions (and counting) of people. The reality is that a plant based diet of natural whole foods has been proven by medical and dietetic bodies worldwide to not only be healthy but in many cases can help a person to thrive. As far as I’m aware no vegetable, fruit, legume or grain has been classed as a class 1 carcinogenic unlike bacon and other heavily processed meats.
    Yeah this is true.

    However grass fed animals have also been classified as being 'as healthy as a plant based diet'. 

    Heavily processed foods of any sort increase the carcinogenic risks.

    However three days back into my plant based challenge I'm happy without meat and dairy, except the chocolates I have on the side waiting for me to return.

  • Not too healthy for the grass fed animal though Dazzler. Pretty much deadly for them.
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