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Who owns the Valley? - The Ownership Thread
Comments
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Well shall we just believe everything our new owners say without question even when we find they are not telling us the truth?nth_london_addick said:LargeAddick said:
disagree. this is a fundamental question. first he says they bought The Valley with Sparrows Lane to follow. now he says that currently they have bought neither. if that doesn't bother you then fine but it sure as hell bothers me.nth_london_addick said:There’s no questions need answering
this is the biggest problem people poking their noses where it’s not needed
If people stop looking for negative news stories to break to feel important you will all feel better in the long runFinding all that out in the first 2 months is important why
There’s bitterness and trouble making a foot
fall for it at your peril
When we have a new chairman and one of the first things he does is paint chairman in a parking space when to my mind their are more important matters(like sorting the pot holes) seems very “weird” to me.
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Brown to match our trousers!0
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Good job I've still got a choice 😉.happyvalley said:What colour scarves should we wear to the Fulham game?
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I agree in a sense. Its not that they don't own the assets yet that worries me the most. It is that he appears to have blantantly changed his story. We do own the valley, to we don't own the valley. First the valley is key to our DNA, second we have been lied to too much in recent years. Please give us our club back n tell us the truth. And explain the rationale otherwise it'll be a short honeymoon period. Thanks.AFKABartram said:Not sure why the alarm reaction
Doesn't this in reality only become an issue in the run up to their 6 month obligation if it has not occurred yet?
I’m these are the aspects which took the EFL time to question and scrutinise. They then gave the green light to proceed.
Worry when there is something tangible to worry about is my view. Not sure what stepping on the scrutiny gas at this point is going to achieve other than more angst.10 -
The level of cynicism in all aspects of life is off the charts at the moment, because the previous ownerships were shambolic, doesn’t instantly mean that this ownership are as bad, cynical or problematic. At present there is nothing to worry about for me, if in June there is a no sign of a change in then ownership of the club/ground then worry. But it seems people are addicted to the fight, and are acting like Japanese soldiers in the jungle0
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Hartleypete said:
Well shall we just believe everything our new owners say without question even when we find they are not telling us the truth?nth_london_addick said:LargeAddick said:
disagree. this is a fundamental question. first he says they bought The Valley with Sparrows Lane to follow. now he says that currently they have bought neither. if that doesn't bother you then fine but it sure as hell bothers me.nth_london_addick said:There’s no questions need answering
this is the biggest problem people poking their noses where it’s not needed
If people stop looking for negative news stories to break to feel important you will all feel better in the long runFinding all that out in the first 2 months is important why
There’s bitterness and trouble making a foot
fall for it at your peril
When we have a new chairman and one of the first things he does is paint chairman in a parking space when to my mind their are more important matters(like sorting the pot holes) seems very “weird” to me.he Didn’t paint it though did he
and did you see how busy it was Saturday
good job it was painted he’d have had nowhere to Park
you can all worry if it makes you feel better but you have nothing to worry about2 -
Lets all agree that ESI are still likely to be the real deal, but we should still be concerned about recent developments. For starters we thought we were rid of that yellow toothed piece of scum and it seems we are not yet. If say ESI don't meet their obligation to buy the assets, shouldn't the rest return to him. Otherwise it makes it too easy for dodgy people like Roland to shift the bit of the business they want to get rid of. If it has been purchased for a lot of money fair enough, but the bit ESI own is the bit Roland has been saying is free!2
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Didn’t realise he is on Katrien time.nth_london_addick said:Hartleypete said:
Well shall we just believe everything our new owners say without question even when we find they are not telling us the truth?nth_london_addick said:LargeAddick said:
disagree. this is a fundamental question. first he says they bought The Valley with Sparrows Lane to follow. now he says that currently they have bought neither. if that doesn't bother you then fine but it sure as hell bothers me.nth_london_addick said:There’s no questions need answering
this is the biggest problem people poking their noses where it’s not needed
If people stop looking for negative news stories to break to feel important you will all feel better in the long runFinding all that out in the first 2 months is important why
There’s bitterness and trouble making a foot
fall for it at your peril
When we have a new chairman and one of the first things he does is paint chairman in a parking space when to my mind their are more important matters(like sorting the pot holes) seems very “weird” to me.he Didn’t paint it though did he
and did you see how busy it was Saturday
good job it was painted he’d have had nowhere to Park
you can all worry if it makes you feel better but you have nothing to worry about1 -
- EFL are satisfied
- ESI own the Valley leasehold
- MS is talking about commencing building works at the training ground0 -
IF the club and freehold of The Valley are now separated - even temporarily - by having different owners, isn't this exactly the circumstance the ACV was intended to highlight?
Or would it only be activated by Roland selling the ground & not the club, instead of vice versa? If so, that is a big weakness in the system when it is applied to sporting venues.
I hope ESI can come back quickly with a good explanation of why Matt said in his videoed interview that ESI owned the stadium, but not yet the training ground, and now in his interview with CAST it emerges they don't own The Valley either.
To gain my trust they must make the situation crystal clear.
Their "due diligence" on the fan base was poor if they did not realise, in the light of our history, we would be keeping a close eye on them until they proved their good faith. They underestimated us fans badly if they thought half truths would go uncovered and unchallenged.
I want this take-over to be a success. I want to believe we can put the past decade behind us.
But having said earlier that having "talked the talk" I now need to see them "walking the walk", this is not starting well.17 - Sponsored links:
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Fuck me I wonder why anyone would bother buying us with Poirot and Colombo In every other seat
give them a chance and stop worrying
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Nth London Addict. Serious question - what is it you know that gives you so much confidence?. Can you share with the rest of us??9
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It's not about worrying, I think most people just want clarity.nth_london_addick said:Fuck me I wonder why anyone would bother buying us with Poirot and Colombo In every other seat
give them a chance cji our and stop worrying
I am over the moon that RD has gone, I have been boycotting for three years and boy am I looking forward to coming back. Plus I desperately want this deal with ESI to work out however if MS has dropped a gaff with his statements I for one would like it to be clarified.
You are a big advocate about the fact the new owners have only been in the building "5 minutes". Well within that short space of time MS first said ESI had purchased the footballing side and The Valley and were legally obligated to purchase the Training Ground within the next six months.
However now according to the trust he has said ESI do not own The Valley. If these statements were months or years apart it might be different but to make both statement within "5 minutes" I find worrying.
A current owner of the club not owning The Valley is a big deal in my eyes and if this is true it should have been stated from the start to avoid all this hysteria.
Are we going to pay Roland rent for the next six months?
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So we lose Gallagher to another team in our own division, the transfer of Maddison is on hold or falling apart, Roland still owns the soul of the club.... anything else to make the day worse?2
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Yeah, Bowyer still ain't signedNapaAddick said:So we lose Gallagher to another team in our own division, the transfer of Maddison is on hold or falling apart, Roland still owns the soul of the club.... anything else to make the day worse?5 -
Filings made at CH have a lot of people flummoxed I guess, me included. Interesting that first Confirmation Statement of the 3 existing entities, FC, Baton and Holdings is the latter in February. Let's see if any changes are filed there.3
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I’ve got my weigh in tomorrow and just had 2 Ferrero Rocher and a Lindt ball :-(NapaAddick said:So we lose Gallagher to another team in our own division, the transfer of Maddison is on hold or falling apart, Roland still owns the soul of the club.... anything else to make the day worse?13 -
It’s nothing that I know and it’s nothing hasn’t already been said in the RD yearsCheshireAddick said:Nth London Addict. Serious question - what is it you know that gives you so much confidence?. Can you share with the rest of us??
imo the club was complicated in what was found in due diligence and I doubt that any of it changed pre purchase so i am of the opinion that it’s being sorted whilst ESI are here rather than leave it to be done before they done the deal
those that are now shit stirring or scaremongering trying to be some sort of expose Detective
know this as well
Give them 6 months and then judge
maybe I just don’t worry about things that others do
but then that wouldn’t sell copy or gain membership if it was said that people should sit back and wait
this is just ridiculous absolutely ridiculous that people are concerned right now
for no reason
Matt Southall is just being honest things change so quickly maybe This is the Strange part like bows said
because maybe other potential buyers would’ve just walked away at every obstacle instead of finding ways to circumnavigate it
Rome wasn’t built in a day charlton wasn’t sold for yrs despite so much interest
things take time and are done In private
The real business shouldn’t be conducted in public
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What's the worst case scenario we're facing?0
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Yes this a loop hole scenario for ACV because the freehold hasn’t changed hands, as you state it would only work if the ground were sold away from the company that owns it because it applies to property law I assume.You could even argue now that ACV cannot apply as it is no longer technically owned by the entity that is the CAFC football club, although if that sale was part of it being detached from the purpose of being CAFCs stadium it might still apply. I would probably argue that if at any point it’s put up for sale in a way that separates it from cafc which is where it’s community value originated it would invoke ACV while the status remains in place. In theory that would mean the separation that exists couldn’t happen again.
The legislation is recent but I’m struggling to see how you could get around this loophole without special law applying to football clubs, and this act is generic for any community asset, even a pub. I did argue for a new special listed status for stadia way back but Clive Efford didn’t get to become sports minister at any stage..2 - Sponsored links:
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AFKA has gained 2lbs rather than lost anything?SantaClaus said:What's the worst case scenario we're facing?4 -
It will but doesn't have to be filed for ESI until 12 months after incorporation which was 13 November just gone I thought.Rock Spectacle said:Confirmation Statement will confirm quite a bit for all 3 entities in terms of ownership of them all and any possible food chain. It's due quite soon.0 -
Thanks NLA and I agree that given time I'm convinced they will will be good for CAFC.nth_london_addick said:
It’s nothing that I know and it’s nothing hasn’t already been said in the RD yearsCheshireAddick said:Nth London Addict. Serious question - what is it you know that gives you so much confidence?. Can you share with the rest of us??
imo the club was complicated in what was found in due diligence and I doubt that any of it changed pre purchase so i am of the opinion that it’s being sorted whilst ESI are here rather than leave it to be done before they done the deal
those that are now shit stirring or scaremongering trying to be some sort of expose Detective
know this as well
Give them 6 months and then judge
maybe I just don’t worry about things that others do
but then that wouldn’t sell copy or gain membership if it was said that people should sit back and wait
this is just ridiculous absolutely ridiculous that people are concerned right now
for no reason
Matt Southall is just being honest things change so quickly maybe This is the Strange part like bows said
because maybe other potential buyers would’ve just walked away at every obstacle instead of finding ways to circumnavigate it
Rome wasn’t built in a day charlton wasn’t sold for yrs despite so much interest
things take time and are done In private
The real business shouldn’t be conducted in public
The one concern I have is that in Saturday's programme it clearly states that they own the club and the valley, now it's being said they dont. I find that strange and I think the fans deserve a quick response from Matt to this contradiction.
The fans have had to put up with so much shit over the years and are rightly suspicious when the communications are not clear.7 -
Think I'm gonna take the pragmatic aproach to all this and have an evaluation on the 1st of Feb and again at the end of June. I'm sure in that time a lot more will become clear4
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If we keep schtum until it becomes an issue it may be too late, I don’t know, maybe it won’t but I can’t see the harm in asking for clarification.SomervilleAddick said:I’m (almost) with @AFKABartram on this. It’s not an issue until it’s time to conclude that part of the deal.I’m just slightly concerned that after supposedly looking at how the fanbase has been “misled” by prior owners, and stating they want to fix that, they start out by once again misleading the fans. Deliberately or not, it just reminds us of what we thought we’d just got rid of.8 -
If we get clarification and it's not what people want to hear then what?LargeAddick said:
If we keep schtum until it becomes an issue it may be too late, I don’t know, maybe it won’t but I can’t see the harm in asking for clarification.SomervilleAddick said:I’m (almost) with @AFKABartram on this. It’s not an issue until it’s time to conclude that part of the deal.I’m just slightly concerned that after supposedly looking at how the fanbase has been “misled” by prior owners, and stating they want to fix that, they start out by once again misleading the fans. Deliberately or not, it just reminds us of what we thought we’d just got rid of.2 -
RedChaser said:
If we get clarification and it's not what people want to hear then what?LargeAddick said:
If we keep schtum until it becomes an issue it may be too late, I don’t know, maybe it won’t but I can’t see the harm in asking for clarification.SomervilleAddick said:I’m (almost) with @AFKABartram on this. It’s not an issue until it’s time to conclude that part of the deal.I’m just slightly concerned that after supposedly looking at how the fanbase has been “misled” by prior owners, and stating they want to fix that, they start out by once again misleading the fans. Deliberately or not, it just reminds us of what we thought we’d just got rid of.“You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time"
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I’m not pleasedi_b_b_o_r_g said:RedChaser said:
If we get clarification and it's not what people want to hear then what?LargeAddick said:
If we keep schtum until it becomes an issue it may be too late, I don’t know, maybe it won’t but I can’t see the harm in asking for clarification.SomervilleAddick said:I’m (almost) with @AFKABartram on this. It’s not an issue until it’s time to conclude that part of the deal.I’m just slightly concerned that after supposedly looking at how the fanbase has been “misled” by prior owners, and stating they want to fix that, they start out by once again misleading the fans. Deliberately or not, it just reminds us of what we thought we’d just got rid of.“You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time"
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Shitstirring and scaremongering? Really. To me it’s just that some of us require some clarity. Have ESI purchased The Valley inc freehold or not? Simple question to which so far we have had two answers, yes and no.nth_london_addick said:
It’s nothing that I know and it’s nothing hasn’t already been said in the RD yearsCheshireAddick said:Nth London Addict. Serious question - what is it you know that gives you so much confidence?. Can you share with the rest of us??
imo the club was complicated in what was found in due diligence and I doubt that any of it changed pre purchase so i am of the opinion that it’s being sorted whilst ESI are here rather than leave it to be done before they done the deal
those that are now shit stirring or scaremongering trying to be some sort of expose Detective
know this as well
Give them 6 months and then judge
maybe I just don’t worry about things that others do
but then that wouldn’t sell copy or gain membership if it was said that people should sit back and wait
this is just ridiculous absolutely ridiculous that people are concerned right now
for no reason
Matt Southall is just being honest things change so quickly maybe This is the Strange part like bows said
because maybe other potential buyers would’ve just walked away at every obstacle instead of finding ways to circumnavigate it
Rome wasn’t built in a day charlton wasn’t sold for yrs despite so much interest
things take time and are done In private
The real business shouldn’t be conducted in public
Lets say six months down the line ESI say we can’t afford to buy The Valley or Sparrows Lane but we are going to rent them from that nice man Roland Shitweasal would you be happy?
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Get some plastic pigs and beach balls in.RedChaser said:
If we get clarification and it's not what people want to hear then what?LargeAddick said:
If we keep schtum until it becomes an issue it may be too late, I don’t know, maybe it won’t but I can’t see the harm in asking for clarification.SomervilleAddick said:I’m (almost) with @AFKABartram on this. It’s not an issue until it’s time to conclude that part of the deal.I’m just slightly concerned that after supposedly looking at how the fanbase has been “misled” by prior owners, and stating they want to fix that, they start out by once again misleading the fans. Deliberately or not, it just reminds us of what we thought we’d just got rid of.1
