In France, workers now have to wear masks in shared spaces at work after a big jump in case numbers.
If they did that here I would fight a return to the office. Not doing that all day.
Here in France they are starting to force it outside in public spaces. I am resisting.
There is an increase in infections, probably due to the discarded social distancing, but a decrease in hospitalisations.
What will people do when you have to provide proof of vaccination even to access the school playground to pick up the children? A vaccination which hasn't undergone the two year safety standards. The masks are just the beginning of more and more restrictions to our civil liberties. That is my only fear; the virus has become a side issue.
Isn’t it our civil liberty to protect other citizens! 40,000 dead in the uk alone and people harp on about civil poxy liberties! What if you are a systematic and pass it on to someone when a mask could reduce the risk?
i would like nothing more than going to a pub for a pint without having to sign in, follow a one way system etc, but I can’t. It’s what we have to do to control this disease which is real and has caused mayhem world wide. Wearing a mask, following a one way system, giving my name at a pub, all small prices to live a free and as normal life as possible compared to another lockdown. Civil liberties my arse, arrogant selfishness more like.
Isolated incident perhaps but I think illustrative that genuine intellectual deficiency contributes to mask avoidance. Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder. Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind. In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him. Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
As for the wearing of seatbelts I can assure you that the positives far outweigh any negatives. 30 years of attending RTC I speak with some first hand knowledge.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
There will be another lockdown if stupid selfish people don't wear masks, don't keep socially distant and fail to observe the other measures which are there to protect us all.
Those of us wearing masks do so because we want to stop the spread of the virus.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
If you're still listening to that bloated elitist fuckwit and taking anything seriously you're heading for a fall.
It's not saying much but significantly better qualified and vastly more credible authorities than Bojo T Clown have been advocating face coverings for months. On matters of science and health I'll favour scientists and doctors over superannuated buffoons every time.
Where keeping one's distance is any sort of issue or where more than a few people might congregate, facecoverings are common sense the same way that looking both ways before crossing the road makes sense. If the trivial inconvenience of masks disturbs one so greatly, one should stay home anyway cos life must just be so so difficult.
Selfish-arrogant-arsehole is as selfish-arrogant-arsehole does - BtC's latest U-turn notwithstanding.
Article in The Times today, showing that deaths from suicide and substance abuse have risen by a third during lockdown in Scotland. People aged under 45 five times more likely to die from suicide and substance abuse than Covid. You would hope these figures would make politician wary about imposing another lockdown.
Article in The Times today, showing that deaths from suicide and substance abuse have risen by a third during lockdown in Scotland. People aged under 45 five times more likely to die from suicide and substance abuse than Covid. You would hope these figures would make politician wary about imposing another lockdown.
They need to follow the rules to stop another lockdown from happening.
Firstly I never claimed to know best, just to that I don't believe that masks are effective, and that I don't agree with them being obligatory.
What is said to be true just constantly changes. You are stating that germs spread onto surfaces over 10 feet which is about three metres. The social distancing rule in the UK was 2 metres and in France 1metre. I looked it up and discovered that it is probably about 1.5 metres that viruses spread to when breathing and speaking.
Therefore if I stay 2 metres from people and I'm outdoors then the virus wouldn't get to any 'surfaces'.
So why was I just asked to wear a mask when taking my little girl onto an outdoor tennis court? Why are people wearing them when alone at a bus stop.
I am not the radical one here. Society is changing in a bad way.
Firstly I never claimed to know best, just to that I don't believe that masks are effective, and that I don't agree with them being obligatory.
What is said to be true just constantly changes. You are stating that germs spread onto surfaces over 10 feet which is about three metres. The social distancing rule in the UK was 2 metres and in France 1metre. I looked it up and discovered that it is probably about 1.5 metres that viruses spread to when breathing and speaking.
Therefore if I stay 2 metres from people and I'm outdoors then the virus wouldn't get to any 'surfaces'.
So why was I just asked to wear a mask when taking my little girl onto an outdoor tennis court? Why are people wearing them when alone at a bus stop.
I am not the radical one here. Society is changing in a bad way.
Normal speech and breathing may well be up to 5ft as you say, but coughing is up to 10ft and sneezing more than that. Social distancing distances are decided on convenience and likely adherence as well as pure science, hence differing from country to country.
The outdoor tennis court is most likely because the operator has a single policy for all their locations, whether indoors or out. That makes sense, the simpler you make the rules, the easier they are to communicate and the more chance they will be obeyed. As you prove only too well, make the rules ambiguous or give people get out clauses and they will refuse to wear a mask.
Without asking them I have no idea why people are wearing them at bus stops. If they're close together then it makes sense, being outside isn't a magical barrier to spreading Covid, it just lessens the chances. Maybe they feel safer wearing the masks, maybe they are just trying to get into the habit, maybe they just want to make life simpler when the bus arrives, one less thing to do when they get on.
Society is not changing in a bad way because people are being asked to make simple changes to prevent spread of disease. People like you are choosing to interpret it that way. If the oxygen content in the atmosphere dropped and people were told to wear oxygen masks, would that be a bad change to society, or a necessary change in order to preserve society? You are the radical one, you are refusing to adhere to public safety guidelines because it inconveniences you, and using some quasi-human rights argument to justify selfishness.
There is no cure and no vaccine for this disease. We have limited too to slow the spread, social distancing, masks, cleaning (of ourselves and our environs) and isolation. The last of these is the only one that is 100% effective, but impractical for society to operate. Therefore we have 3 imperfect tools and we need to use all three. You attitude seems to be that you don't like 1 of the 3, so you'll do a little bit of one of the others and hope that's enough. Forgive me if I don't think you should get to endanger everybody you meet based on your ill-founded hope.
I keep my distance from others. I have to do door to door prospection for my job, and after knocking on the door, I stand back 2 metres. Mask wearers generally don't do that so I could claim that they are selfish. Normally, if anything, I find that people are approaching me and I'm backing off.
Besides, in claiming that the refusers are passing it on to the wearers, you are basically admitting the inefficiency of a mask.
Sorry to post so many times on this subject, but it comes to something when people accuse others about which there is no proof, and when it concerns a virus: more virulent forms of which have never ever led some to dictate rules on the others in this manner.
We have never had a worldwide pandemic such as this in most people's lifetime.
It IS selfish to not wear a mask if you don't have a medical reason. It IS selfish not to wear a seat belt. If you have an accident and need the NHS to fix you, it affects far more than just you.
Well, on that basis it's selfish to smoke, drink alcohol, be overweight, practice dangerous sports, put too much salt on your food, travel; anything in fact that increases your chances of being hospitalised is selfish. We may as well just wrap ourselves up in cotton wool, do nothing, and be miserable.
Also, by your standards, Swedish people are all selfish.
Isolated incident perhaps but I think illustrative that genuine intellectual deficiency contributes to mask avoidance. Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder. Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind. In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him. Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
Genuine intellectual deficiency? Thanks.
I've given my opinion on here and it's fine if you disagree with it.
It's just typical in the current climate that those of another opinion are branded as idiots with a new invented term covidiocy. I could refer to those who believe everything they are told, and do everything they are told to do with the same insult. Instead I'm just attempting to have a sensible discussion about it, and if we disagree then fine. At least an alternative point of view will have been shared.
Isolated incident perhaps but I think illustrative that genuine intellectual deficiency contributes to mask avoidance. Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder. Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind. In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him. Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
Genuine intellectual deficiency? Thanks.
I've given my opinion on here and it's fine if you disagree with it.
It's just typical in the current climate that those of another opinion are branded as idiots with a new invented term covidiocy. I could refer to those who believe everything they are told, and do everything they are told to do with the same insult. Instead I'm just attempting to have a sensible discussion about it, and if we disagree then fine. At least an alternative point of view will have been shared.
Problem is that if you took 5 minutes to actually research mask wearing you'd see the enormous benefits to others.
Instead you'd rather just ignore it all because you don't fancy wearing one. Using anecdotal evidence to back up your claims which is nonsense in the grand scheme of things.
Particles coming out of your mouth and nose stay on surfaces for up to 72 hours. So staying 2 meters from everyone but still proceeding to wonder around people's houses and streets without a mask on is pure selfishness and lack of care for others.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Isolated incident perhaps but I think illustrative that genuine intellectual deficiency contributes to mask avoidance. Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder. Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind. In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him. Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
Genuine intellectual deficiency? Thanks.
I've given my opinion on here and it's fine if you disagree with it.
It's just typical in the current climate that those of another opinion are branded as idiots with a new invented term covidiocy. I could refer to those who believe everything they are told, and do everything they are told to do with the same insult. Instead I'm just attempting to have a sensible discussion about it, and if we disagree then fine. At least an alternative point of view will have been shared.
Problem is that if you took 5 minutes to actually research mask wearing you'd see the enormous benefits to others.
Instead you'd rather just ignore it all because you don't fancy wearing one. Using anecdotal evidence to back up your claims which is nonsense in the grand scheme of things.
Particles coming out of your mouth and nose stay on surfaces for up to 72 hours. So staying 2 meters from everyone but still proceeding to wonder around people's houses and streets without a mask on is pure selfishness and lack of care for others.
Oh, I've taken more than 5 minutes! I've done a lot of research online. It all depends on which expert you listen to. Not everything he says sounds right to me, but a lot of what he says is very interesting, particularly about the winter burden mortality, and the immune system. The most interesting part however is from 16:55
Isolated incident perhaps but I think illustrative that genuine intellectual deficiency contributes to mask avoidance. Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder. Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind. In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him. Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
Genuine intellectual deficiency? Thanks.
I've given my opinion on here and it's fine if you disagree with it.
It's just typical in the current climate that those of another opinion are branded as idiots with a new invented term covidiocy. I could refer to those who believe everything they are told, and do everything they are told to do with the same insult. Instead I'm just attempting to have a sensible discussion about it, and if we disagree then fine. At least an alternative point of view will have been shared.
Problem is that if you took 5 minutes to actually research mask wearing you'd see the enormous benefits to others.
Instead you'd rather just ignore it all because you don't fancy wearing one. Using anecdotal evidence to back up your claims which is nonsense in the grand scheme of things.
Particles coming out of your mouth and nose stay on surfaces for up to 72 hours. So staying 2 meters from everyone but still proceeding to wonder around people's houses and streets without a mask on is pure selfishness and lack of care for others.
Oh, I've taken more than 5 minutes! I've done a lot of research online. It all depends on which expert you listen to. Not everything he says sounds right to me, but a lot of what he says is very interesting, particularly about the winter burden mortality, and the immune system. The most interesting part however is from 16:55
1. Physics PHD not medical. 2. Climate Change denier. 3. Got kicked out of his University he was working at.
"When my colleague asked for scientific evidence to back this denial, the poster directed her to an article by Denis Rancourt, entitled “Masks Don’t Work.” And, indeed, Rancourt’s paper cited eight peer-reviewed essays, all from reputable journals. But when she actually clicked on the links provided, she found something very curious. None of the studies cited concluded what Rancourt says they did. For example, six of the eight studies measured the effectiveness of N95 respirators compared to surgical masks—not, as Rancourt implied, the effectiveness of wearing a mask vs. not wearing a mask."
Isolated incident perhaps but I think illustrative that genuine intellectual deficiency contributes to mask avoidance. Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder. Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind. In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him. Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
Genuine intellectual deficiency? Thanks.
I've given my opinion on here and it's fine if you disagree with it.
It's just typical in the current climate that those of another opinion are branded as idiots with a new invented term covidiocy. I could refer to those who believe everything they are told, and do everything they are told to do with the same insult. Instead I'm just attempting to have a sensible discussion about it, and if we disagree then fine. At least an alternative point of view will have been shared.
Problem is that if you took 5 minutes to actually research mask wearing you'd see the enormous benefits to others.
Instead you'd rather just ignore it all because you don't fancy wearing one. Using anecdotal evidence to back up your claims which is nonsense in the grand scheme of things.
Particles coming out of your mouth and nose stay on surfaces for up to 72 hours. So staying 2 meters from everyone but still proceeding to wonder around people's houses and streets without a mask on is pure selfishness and lack of care for others.
Oh, I've taken more than 5 minutes! I've done a lot of research online. It all depends on which expert you listen to. Not everything he says sounds right to me, but a lot of what he says is very interesting, particularly about the winter burden mortality, and the immune system. The most interesting part however is from 16:55
Yes, it is true that various experts don't agree which makes it very difficult for any decision makers. However, none of us (that I am aware of and apologies to any virologists on here) are experts, so need to do what we are directed by those making decisions on the back of actual experts.
Firstly I never claimed to know best, just to that I don't believe that masks are effective, and that I don't agree with them being obligatory.
What is said to be true just constantly changes. You are stating that germs spread onto surfaces over 10 feet which is about three metres. The social distancing rule in the UK was 2 metres and in France 1metre. I looked it up and discovered that it is probably about 1.5 metres that viruses spread to when breathing and speaking.
Therefore if I stay 2 metres from people and I'm outdoors then the virus wouldn't get to any 'surfaces'.
So why was I just asked to wear a mask when taking my little girl onto an outdoor tennis court? Why are people wearing them when alone at a bus stop.
I am not the radical one here. Society is changing in a bad way.
Normal speech and breathing may well be up to 5ft as you say, but coughing is up to 10ft and sneezing more than that. Social distancing distances are decided on convenience and likely adherence as well as pure science, hence differing from country to country.
The outdoor tennis court is most likely because the operator has a single policy for all their locations, whether indoors or out. That makes sense, the simpler you make the rules, the easier they are to communicate and the more chance they will be obeyed. As you prove only too well, make the rules ambiguous or give people get out clauses and they will refuse to wear a mask.
Without asking them I have no idea why people are wearing them at bus stops. If they're close together then it makes sense, being outside isn't a magical barrier to spreading Covid, it just lessens the chances. Maybe they feel safer wearing the masks, maybe they are just trying to get into the habit, maybe they just want to make life simpler when the bus arrives, one less thing to do when they get on.
Society is not changing in a bad way because people are being asked to make simple changes to prevent spread of disease. People like you are choosing to interpret it that way. If the oxygen content in the atmosphere dropped and people were told to wear oxygen masks, would that be a bad change to society, or a necessary change in order to preserve society? You are the radical one, you are refusing to adhere to public safety guidelines because it inconveniences you, and using some quasi-human rights argument to justify selfishness.
There is no cure and no vaccine for this disease. We have limited too to slow the spread, social distancing, masks, cleaning (of ourselves and our environs) and isolation. The last of these is the only one that is 100% effective, but impractical for society to operate. Therefore we have 3 imperfect tools and we need to use all three. You attitude seems to be that you don't like 1 of the 3, so you'll do a little bit of one of the others and hope that's enough. Forgive me if I don't think you should get to endanger everybody you meet based on your ill-founded hope.
A lot of what you say makes sense. To be honest, no-one until today has ever presented to me this argument about the virus falling on surfaces from breathing. I wasn't aware of that possibility. Up until now I've seen surface infection as being through touching, and breathing infection as being solely through the air. I do not however see how this breathing to surface transmission can really be a realistic issue outdoors, and it is outdoors that is my real bone of contention. I think that you might be misunderstanding me in that I should clarify that I have been wearing a mask in indoor locations. It is this new trend towards wearing them outdoors that I don't understand. Perhaps we are a little at cross purposes in that I live in a different country and I am not getting in to any densely populated places, such as buses or trains.
I would also like to refer back to my original post. You are quite right to say that doing all three tools is the best, and that one of these three I don't like. Obviously I clearly dislike masks and it's not just because 'I don't fancy wearing one' as SELR_addicks' said. My point is that those wearing masks are largely ignoring one of the other three tools: social distancing. All around me are people wearing masks are having conversations at a 'normal' distance. I would argue that this is no better, and probably worse, than having a conversation at a distance of two metres without a mask. Who is most likely to infect others: someone keeping a good distance without a mask, or someone wearing a mask and speaking into someone elses face?
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Leave off. Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Leave off. Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
Maybe we should have. But that wasn't what the government was advised at the time. But we are now
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Leave off. Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
Maybe we should have. But that wasn't what the government were advised at the time. But we are now
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Leave off. Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
Maybe we should have. But that wasn't what the government were advised at the time. But we are now
Do you honestly believe that?
As far as I know this is all true. What are you disputing?
Maybe we should have been wearing them before? I don't know if we should have been, hence the 'maybe'
The government were not told we should be but they have been told recently hence the advice changing.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Leave off. Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
Maybe we should have. But that wasn't what the government were advised at the time. But we are now
Do you honestly believe that?
As far as I know this is all true. What are you disputing?
Maybe we should have been wearing them before? I don't know if we should have been, hence the 'maybe'
The government were not told we should be but they have been told recently hence the advice changing.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing remember
Put sky news on iFiona. Goverment was warned lifting restrictions on Bolton and Trafford was to early. Bolton came out of the restrictions for 12 hours and are now back in restrictions.
Absolutely no1 wearing face-masks in wales (big tesco at peak time, also other shops and petrol station) albeit haven't checked what the rules are here.
Probably explains why Wales had the worst UK figures when I looked a week ago.
So what I am reading and understanding it will only be safe to not wear a mask when Boris Johnson says so. If Boris says we do not have to wear a mask, then people are not selfish arrogant arseholes, but when he says we must people are selfish arseholes.
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
It wom't be safe when a politician says so, it will be because experts have informed afore mention politicians. As for u-turns, what do you want, politicians to do, never change their minds when more evidence or information comes to light? I often make a decision I have to change because someone has put forward an argument that I accept. But of course the media has to bang on about u-turns
You’re not a politician though. The point is, being in the position they’re in, they shouldn’t have got it wrong in the first place.
No one knew and the advice keeps changing;it is an unprecedented situation that is evolving
Leave off. Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
Maybe we should have. But that wasn't what the government were advised at the time. But we are now
Do you honestly believe that?
As far as I know this is all true. What are you disputing?
Maybe we should have been wearing them before? I don't know if we should have been, hence the 'maybe'
The government were not told we should be but they have been told recently hence the advice changing.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing remember
Put sky news on iFiona. Goverment was warned lifting restrictions on Bolton and Trafford was to early. Bolton came out of the restrictions for 12 hours and are now back in restrictions.
I have sky news on all the time. We are discussing face masks
Yep, they made a mistake and went back on it. And your point is?
You do realise that not all experts advise the same thing?
Comments
i would like nothing more than going to a pub for a pint without having to sign in, follow a one way system etc, but I can’t. It’s what we have to do to control this disease which is real and has caused mayhem world wide. Wearing a mask, following a one way system, giving my name at a pub, all small prices to live a free and as normal life as possible compared to another lockdown. Civil liberties my arse, arrogant selfishness more like.
Had to enter a large retail/catering establishment to relieve my full bladder.
Masked up before crossing the threshold and was pleased to note that the overwhelming majority were also wearing face coverings of some kind.
In the gents a big ginger bloke was the only one without a mask. As we were washing our hands after micturating, I heard a chap have a quiet word with the ginger lump, to the effect that 'you should be wearing a mask indoors'. I earwigged a moment longer, expecting ginge to react in some way, all he said was "Eh, what you talking about?" no antagonism just genuine bafflement. I caught sight of him on the way out and he still looked totally confused as to why the geezer was talking to him.
Covidiocy takes many forms, ginger must have been living under a rock for 6 months.
Other observations from my 5 minutes in this gaggle of humanity: school age kids largely wearing face coverings, those bare-faced were mostly feral brats haring about, making a racket and nuisance of themselves. The only other bare face was of a senior chap who by his garb was clearly a devout sort, protected by a higher power or stricken by some respiratory affliction, who can tell?
Without the amount of U-turns recently that could happen at anymore. If the public appeal is there it is clearly not. Hope everyone is looking forward to their national lockdown over xmas.
30 years of attending RTC I speak with some first hand knowledge.
Those of us wearing masks do so because we want to stop the spread of the virus.
It's not saying much but significantly better qualified and vastly more credible authorities than Bojo T Clown have been advocating face coverings for months. On matters of science and health I'll favour scientists and doctors over superannuated buffoons every time.
Where keeping one's distance is any sort of issue or where more than a few people might congregate, facecoverings are common sense the same way that looking both ways before crossing the road makes sense. If the trivial inconvenience of masks disturbs one so greatly, one should stay home anyway cos life must just be so so difficult.
Selfish-arrogant-arsehole is as selfish-arrogant-arsehole does - BtC's latest U-turn notwithstanding.
Firstly I never claimed to know best, just to that I don't believe that masks are effective, and that I don't agree with them being obligatory.
What is said to be true just constantly changes. You are stating that germs spread onto surfaces over 10 feet which is about three metres. The social distancing rule in the UK was 2 metres and in France 1metre. I looked it up and discovered that it is probably about 1.5 metres that viruses spread to when breathing and speaking.
Therefore if I stay 2 metres from people and I'm outdoors then the virus wouldn't get to any 'surfaces'.
So why was I just asked to wear a mask when taking my little girl onto an outdoor tennis court?
Why are people wearing them when alone at a bus stop.
I am not the radical one here. Society is changing in a bad way.
The outdoor tennis court is most likely because the operator has a single policy for all their locations, whether indoors or out. That makes sense, the simpler you make the rules, the easier they are to communicate and the more chance they will be obeyed. As you prove only too well, make the rules ambiguous or give people get out clauses and they will refuse to wear a mask.
Without asking them I have no idea why people are wearing them at bus stops. If they're close together then it makes sense, being outside isn't a magical barrier to spreading Covid, it just lessens the chances. Maybe they feel safer wearing the masks, maybe they are just trying to get into the habit, maybe they just want to make life simpler when the bus arrives, one less thing to do when they get on.
Society is not changing in a bad way because people are being asked to make simple changes to prevent spread of disease. People like you are choosing to interpret it that way. If the oxygen content in the atmosphere dropped and people were told to wear oxygen masks, would that be a bad change to society, or a necessary change in order to preserve society? You are the radical one, you are refusing to adhere to public safety guidelines because it inconveniences you, and using some quasi-human rights argument to justify selfishness.
There is no cure and no vaccine for this disease. We have limited too to slow the spread, social distancing, masks, cleaning (of ourselves and our environs) and isolation. The last of these is the only one that is 100% effective, but impractical for society to operate. Therefore we have 3 imperfect tools and we need to use all three. You attitude seems to be that you don't like 1 of the 3, so you'll do a little bit of one of the others and hope that's enough. Forgive me if I don't think you should get to endanger everybody you meet based on your ill-founded hope.
Also, by your standards, Swedish people are all selfish.
I've given my opinion on here and it's fine if you disagree with it.
It's just typical in the current climate that those of another opinion are branded as idiots with a new invented term covidiocy. I could refer to those who believe everything they are told, and do everything they are told to do with the same insult. Instead I'm just attempting to have a sensible discussion about it, and if we disagree then fine. At least an alternative point of view will have been shared.
Instead you'd rather just ignore it all because you don't fancy wearing one. Using anecdotal evidence to back up your claims which is nonsense in the grand scheme of things.
Particles coming out of your mouth and nose stay on surfaces for up to 72 hours. So staying 2 meters from everyone but still proceeding to wonder around people's houses and streets without a mask on is pure selfishness and lack of care for others.
Oh, I've taken more than 5 minutes! I've done a lot of research online. It all depends on which expert you listen to. Not everything he says sounds right to me, but a lot of what he says is very interesting, particularly about the winter burden mortality, and the immune system. The most interesting part however is from 16:55
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPfrcSkMe2Y&feature=youtu.be
1. Physics PHD not medical.
2. Climate Change denier.
3. Got kicked out of his University he was working at.
"When my colleague asked for scientific evidence to back this denial, the poster directed her to an article by Denis Rancourt, entitled “Masks Don’t Work.” And, indeed, Rancourt’s paper cited eight peer-reviewed essays, all from reputable journals. But when she actually clicked on the links provided, she found something very curious. None of the studies cited concluded what Rancourt says they did. For example, six of the eight studies measured the effectiveness of N95 respirators compared to surgical masks—not, as Rancourt implied, the effectiveness of wearing a mask vs. not wearing a mask."
https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/logical-take/202007/yes-masks-work-debunking-the-pseudoscience
Seems like all your research has just taken you to debunked scientists that fit in with your own view. Try listening to medical experts in the future.
A lot of what you say makes sense. To be honest, no-one until today has ever presented to me this argument about the virus falling on surfaces from breathing. I wasn't aware of that possibility. Up until now I've seen surface infection as being through touching, and breathing infection as being solely through the air. I do not however see how this breathing to surface transmission can really be a realistic issue outdoors, and it is outdoors that is my real bone of contention. I think that you might be misunderstanding me in that I should clarify that I have been wearing a mask in indoor locations. It is this new trend towards wearing them outdoors that I don't understand. Perhaps we are a little at cross purposes in that I live in a different country and I am not getting in to any densely populated places, such as buses or trains.
I would also like to refer back to my original post. You are quite right to say that doing all three tools is the best, and that one of these three I don't like. Obviously I clearly dislike masks and it's not just because 'I don't fancy wearing one' as SELR_addicks' said. My point is that those wearing masks are largely ignoring one of the other three tools: social distancing. All around me are people wearing masks are having conversations at a 'normal' distance. I would argue that this is no better, and probably worse, than having a conversation at a distance of two metres without a mask. Who is most likely to infect others: someone keeping a good distance without a mask, or someone wearing a mask and speaking into someone elses face?
My basic view is that these must be worse for protecting others than a non valve mask because they let you exhale moisture?
Even if there was a 0.00001% chance masks help we should of been wearing them in March.
Do you honestly believe that?
Maybe we should have been wearing them before? I don't know if we should have been, hence the 'maybe'
The government were not told we should be but they have been told recently hence the advice changing.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing remember
Goverment was warned lifting restrictions on Bolton and Trafford was to early.
Bolton came out of the restrictions for 12 hours and are now back in restrictions.
It may come ‘naturally’ for some and essential for others but once we start, even after a vaccine they’ll be no turning back.
It could turn into a freak show like Atwood’s Gliead.
Yep, they made a mistake and went back on it. And your point is?
You do realise that not all experts advise the same thing?
https://twitter.com/i/events/1288477138606120960