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I am going to say it!! Yes I am, Nathan Jones......................
Comments
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In the promotion season. He was blessed with David Davis in the championship .Chunes said:
Bowyer was blessed with a midfield.LittleAddick said:This season has actually made the Bowyer Championship season seem more impressive in hindsight. We spent about 200k that season, had 3 proper relegation spots as opposed to this year's 2, lost our best player for half the year, and was under an embargo for January. Yet somehow, this year despite spending 30x more we're barely any better.3 -
Nathan Jones has been running scared for a few games now. And he has made some awful decisions. Part of his neurotic personality I’m assuming. I still think he deserves next season to see what he can do with a good window and better players. But Charlton has been a hard watch for a few months now.7
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If we go down he’ll be gone2
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Yeh no that’s fair. Im just trying to highlight the point that the judgement of has he succeeded being based on a very black and white - we stay up we don’t stay up thing is overly simplistic as minutiae circumstances outside of anyone’s control can impact those fine margins.LargeAddick said:
And yet in the same game if the ref hadn’t given them a penalty that they later admitted wasn’t we’d be two points better off now and it’ll be done and dusted. But that doesn’t suit your narrative.paulsturgess said:+ If Oxford hadn’t gifted us the most mind bogglingly stupid peno in history - well, I’d be researching bus routes to Hayes Lane as we speakThe overall judgement is how well have we reasonably performed to have kept things within our control, away from these fine margins or so we are on balance deserving of some of them falling our way, and have we improved and given it the best shot we can.Last night another perfect example of that, in my view. Okay, against one of the best sides - but we did not make Ipswich break sweat second half, not able to garner an attempt on goal. Sheff We’d game a better example - When you don’t offer enough, don’t take occasions, matches, seasons, by the scruff of the neck - just hang on and hope. You might get lucky and land on the right side of the line but you also can’t complain if the coin lands on the wrong side for you, because you’ve gone for the strategy of leaving it to chance1 -
To play devils advocate…..Rob said:Nathan Jones has been running scared for a few games now. And he has made some awful decisions. Part of his neurotic personality I’m assuming. I still think he deserves next season to see what he can do with a good window and better players. But Charlton has been a hard watch for a few months now.
- What about if we go down? It can be argued he has been proven capable to get promoted out of that league but would he be able to recover mentally from such a massive collapse this season?
- A good window and better players? When he was here for the last 4-5 windows can we be sure he will suddenly have a better transfer window?
Lots to consider either way.
I would say we need to get the senior structure at the club right pretty sharpish but that’s another discussion entirely0 -
Also worth noting regarding “expectations” that Lincoln have romped to the L1 title with one of the divisions lowest budgets. Teams do outperform budgets and expectations, and I was born in 1986 and for the entire first half of my lifetime that is what Charlton Athlwtic not only did, but stood for. Notwithstanding the debacle of the second half of my lifetime, I don’t think it’s therefore a ludicrous “expectation” to ask a manager to try and exceed his budget league table1
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I don't know that it is honestly, if the senior structure is sorted out and there is a clear vision and leadership structure then someone is placed to make decisions on Jones and his future. At present it seems to be based on something not much more complex than safety = success = stays without any concept of whether he is the right option longer term or not.DamoNorthStand said:
To play devils advocate…..Rob said:Nathan Jones has been running scared for a few games now. And he has made some awful decisions. Part of his neurotic personality I’m assuming. I still think he deserves next season to see what he can do with a good window and better players. But Charlton has been a hard watch for a few months now.
- What about if we go down? It can be argued he has been proven capable to get promoted out of that league but would he be able to recover mentally from such a massive collapse this season?
- A good window and better players? When he was here for the last 4-5 windows can we be sure he will suddenly have a better transfer window?
Lots to consider either way.
I would say we need to get the senior structure at the club right pretty sharpish but that’s another discussion entirely1 -
Jones wanted control over recruitment, and he has burned a lot of the owners money now, are they willing for him to do that again the summer?
He has to change, it is the same out lump the ball, it is like the start of last years league one season again, but once we got the ball down and played, we got on a run. We keep doing the same thing and it doesn't work.3 -
He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)
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Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)3 -
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I bet Jones would love some of the midfielders that Mousinho has. We might have spent more on transfer fees but Pompey have been at this level for an extra year which makes a huge difference in terms of squadMarcusH26 said:
Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)4 -
The problem was we couldn’t sign better players so we have a poor squad. When you are the L1 play off winning team and amongst the favourites for relegation, you can’t bring in championship proven level players. We had to shop in the league 1 window unfortunately so that’s why our squad looks very league 1SELR_addicks said:'You can't blame Jones when we have such a poor squad'.
Who was the manager that signed the majority of these players and has an aversion to signing loan players that previously have been some of our best players?4 -
Ebou Adams would make such a difference. Quite like Devlin too even though he's playing RB currently.NabySarr said:
I bet Jones would love some of the midfielders that Mousinho has. We might have spent more on transfer fees but Pompey have been at this level for an extra year which makes a huge difference in terms of squadMarcusH26 said:
Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)1 -
But we won't, so he should definitely stay.AberystwythAddick said:If we go down he’ll be gone0 -
Hasn't Jones done that all season? We've not been in a relegation spot once.paulsturgess said:Also worth noting regarding “expectations” that Lincoln have romped to the L1 title with one of the divisions lowest budgets. Teams do outperform budgets and expectations, and I was born in 1986 and for the entire first half of my lifetime that is what Charlton Athlwtic not only did, but stood for. Notwithstanding the debacle of the second half of my lifetime, I don’t think it’s therefore a ludicrous “expectation” to ask a manager to try and exceed his budget league table5 -
Adams was available in January and we went for Coady instead. Now he hasn’t been a bad signing but I’d bet my (admittedly rented) house in the fact that Adam’s would have played moreMarcusH26 said:
Ebou Adams would make such a difference. Quite like Devlin too even though he's playing RB currently.NabySarr said:
I bet Jones would love some of the midfielders that Mousinho has. We might have spent more on transfer fees but Pompey have been at this level for an extra year which makes a huge difference in terms of squadMarcusH26 said:
Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)0 -
Why?Stu_of_Kunming said:
But we won't, so he should definitely stay.AberystwythAddick said:If we go down he’ll be gone2 -
Yeah I get the thinking with the Coady signing now even if initially I was rather " what the hell are we actually doing" not expecting him to play CDM. Adams would have fitted the mould perfectly for us.fenaddick said:
Adams was available in January and we went for Coady instead. Now he hasn’t been a bad signing but I’d bet my (admittedly rented) house in the fact that Adam’s would have played moreMarcusH26 said:
Ebou Adams would make such a difference. Quite like Devlin too even though he's playing RB currently.NabySarr said:
I bet Jones would love some of the midfielders that Mousinho has. We might have spent more on transfer fees but Pompey have been at this level for an extra year which makes a huge difference in terms of squadMarcusH26 said:
Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)1 -
This was ten weeks ago and it could have been written todayNadou said:If we do manage to survive this season, I can't pretend that I relish the idea of watching another year of Jones' ugly anti-football. There are no signs that he has any other way of playing. Last season's success largely relied on the same style as the one we are enduring this year.2 -
In any walk of life - be it football, any other sport, any occupation or business venture - if something isnt working you have to change it. You can't blindly sleepwalk into trouble without attempting to do something in a different way. It stands to reason if something has broadly been resulting in a certain outcome over the last few weeks, you do something different.
If we are unable to coach or get professional footballers to play in a different way / formation to try and force a different outcome - then thats a problem.5 -
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I think we have tried different things, they just haven’t worked. Now maybe that’s a coaching issue, maybe it’s a confidence issue. Both lay with Jones to some degree. The change to Fevrier at RWB (yesterday enforced) has worked well, even if it’s taken away a weapon in Clarke’s long throw.DamoNorthStand said:In any walk of life - be it football, any other sport, any occupation or business venture - if something isnt working you have to change it. You can't blindly sleepwalk into trouble without attempting to do something in a different way. It stands to reason if something has broadly been resulting in a certain outcome over the last few weeks, you do something different.
If we are unable to coach or get professional footballers to play in a different way / formation to try and force a different outcome - then thats a problem.
It was said elsewhere earlier in the week but one of the best moves we could make this summer is to bring in a coach who specialises in in possession play. He failed as manager here but Ben Garner has clearly made a difference at Southampton doing exactly that. It could even be internal, someone like Chris Lock. It’s just clear that we need a bit more help/resource on that side of things1 -
Personally I think NJ should go, mainly based on the poor performances, tactics and team selection! For example had Gough been given an extended in around match day squads he would have ampfylly and filled in one of the spots and likely to have kept his place.
Again Bell one of the best on his day injured playing LWB, NJ has not learned from his mistakes. We need a manager on that touchline who is in control of his emotions, at best his decision making is at very rash.
I think we will lose the next 2 and as for the last how many weeks waiting for other teams to slip up, as opposed to being on the from front foot as Blackburn, Pompey and West Brom have shown!
🤞we survived, coya0 -
Who else shall we bring in? You can't say Jones out without an alternative, makes no sense. Not heard one alternative in this threadAberystwythAddick said:
Why?Stu_of_Kunming said:
But we won't, so he should definitely stay.AberystwythAddick said:If we go down he’ll be gone0 -
Plenty of alternatives in this thread.llama_child_21cws said:
Who else shall we bring in? You can't say Jones out without an alternative, makes no sense. Not heard one alternative in this threadAberystwythAddick said:
Why?Stu_of_Kunming said:
But we won't, so he should definitely stay.AberystwythAddick said:If we go down he’ll be gone0 -
If he doesn't have a Plan B, what did he start with yesterday?5
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Really? Apart from Godden, who’s nearly 60 years old and been crippled all season, our strikers are crap - between them all, they’ve scored 15 goals in 163 appearances.MarcusH26 said:
Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)MarcusH26 said:
Great point about Pompey , I bet Mousinho would absolutely love to have had our budget and striking options but he's got a pretty limited squad safe again just through hard work.EastTerrace said:He has had a squad full of limited players, but surely on the same level or slightly better than Portsmouth’s, who are safe but have had a terrible injury crisis too.
Jones’ decisions, team selections and set ups over the past month have been awful, especially when you see how we can play in that first half last night.
In my opinion, if we fail to stay up then, even with this limited bunch of players, he has to take most of the responsibility. (Not necessarily saying he should go though, if we do go down)0 -
And I'm reminded of when he switched to the box midfield to nullify the 'unbeatable' Birmingham side at home last season. It's nonsense.NabySarr said:
The no plan B is such a lazy criticism. All season Jones has regularly changed shape or changed things tactically. If anything he sometimes changes things too muchChunes said:If he doesn't have a Plan B, what did he start with yesterday?6 -
Why can't people be fed up and want Jones out unless they offer up a suitable alternative?llama_child_21cws said:
Who else shall we bring in? You can't say Jones out without an alternative, makes no sense. Not heard one alternative in this threadAberystwythAddick said:
Why?Stu_of_Kunming said:
But we won't, so he should definitely stay.AberystwythAddick said:If we go down he’ll be gone
I'm not even someone who wants him gone (although i accept his job will be in trouble if we do go down), but it's not our job to advise who the next manager should be. There are people at the club paid very good money to do that.
I think Gillesphey and Burke are a waste of wages and we should get rid of both this summer, it doesn't mean i have to email the club with suitable replacements.
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Yes you can.llama_child_21cws said:
Who else shall we bring in? You can't say Jones out without an alternative, makes no sense. Not heard one alternative in this threadAberystwythAddick said:
Why?Stu_of_Kunming said:
But we won't, so he should definitely stay.AberystwythAddick said:If we go down he’ll be gone7
