Builders in at the training ground

Longtimeaddicted said:

The site will have been registered with the HSE for CDM purposes I'll have a nose around.

Tried that without luck.

Don't forget the CDM Regulations changed recently - they may have to resubmit to get their F10 for the demolition/construction phase.

Would expect a JCT Contract with named or nominated Sub Contractors set up for this kind of work. The value would also mean if there was a tender for the works they would need to go through the OJEU process.

Sorry, but I know next to nothing about Belgium Contract Law - can't imagine it would be significantly different.

Any changes to the agreed Contract Programme will cost an absolute fortune though.

ShootersHillGuru said:

rikofold said:

The official version is that the work continues but as it was going to miss the audit deadline for Cat 1 the schedule was relaxed.

Don't shoot the messenger.

This is highly unlikely. There would be considerable costs involved for the contractors in mobilisation of plant etc. Additionally the cost of materials would be going up considerably with delay.

There a smelly rat here somewhere.

I wonder what his name is ?

Our fellow trapdoor-sufferers Bolton used to have a Category 1 academy but downgraded in 2015 to save £1 million a year. They are now thinking of downgrading again, prompting the BW Supporters Trust to consider ways of putting money into the academy.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/14493147.Trust_fund_may_aid_Lostock_academy/

CDM (Construction Design Management) a build regulation thing means, that any largish job needs a Planning Supervisor appointment and notification to the Health Safety Exec.

The "You can't get Cat 1 in league 1" argument doesn't hold water.

Even if that is the rule the build won't be finished until next summer. The club must at least expect to have a go at promotion before then even if we know that they lack the common sense to build a club and team able to do that.

If, and it still isn't clear if this is the case, the work has stopped or even to quote the bully boy coward Tony Keohone "relaxed" then we really are in a bad way.

The training ground was one of the few, perhaps only, good long term projects this regime has promised to do and started and now it could be stopped.

Meanwhile the training ground is, to quote JBG, "Shit", the facilities outdated and now half built. The players are eating in portacabins and the Community Trust (that's the trust that does all the good work that Katrien falsely claims credit) is in temporary offices.

Stig said:

Airman Brown said:

stonemuse said:

I cannot track down the name of the main contractor anywhere ...not easy to unravel this one.

The architect is Belgian (or Dutch) I believe. Could the contractor be too? I'm assuming that would add significantly to the costs.

Logically you'd think that that would significantly add to the costs. But these aren't the sort of contractors that you call on and off to undertake specific projects. These are network contractors under contract to Melexis and strategically deployed wherever they are most needed. So as well as the Sparrows Lane redevelopment they'll also be putting a roof on the stadium at Ujpest, a row of shops in at Alcorcon, a hot tub and permanent barbecue at Katie's house and a new duck tape rack for Roly.

Architects might be from overseas and even the main contractor although I doubt it but the subbies won't be.

Putting off, relaxing or whatever they care to call it will have a cost. Implies to me that RD doesn't want to spend money he might not recoup in a sale.

ShootersHillGuru said:

Stig said:

Airman Brown said:

stonemuse said:

I cannot track down the name of the main contractor anywhere ...not easy to unravel this one.

The architect is Belgian (or Dutch) I believe. Could the contractor be too? I'm assuming that would add significantly to the costs.

Logically you'd think that that would significantly add to the costs. But these aren't the sort of contractors that you call on and off to undertake specific projects. These are network contractors under contract to Melexis and strategically deployed wherever they are most needed. So as well as the Sparrows Lane redevelopment they'll also be putting a roof on the stadium at Ujpest, a row of shops in at Alcorcon, a hot tub and permanent barbecue at Katie's house and a new duck tape rack for Roly.

Architects might be from overseas and even the main contractor although I doubt it but the subbies won't be.

Putting off, relaxing or whatever they care to call it will have a cost. Implies to me that RD doesn't want to spend money he might not recoup in a sale.

I agree, but to me it means that a sale is potentially more imminent than is publicly acknowledged. RD and those who speak for him maintain that he is there for the long run. KM's comments in Dublin about selling on "the future stars of the Premier League" is one of the few concrete insights into the plans of this regime. If investing in the academy and training ground is scaling back, to me that says that RD is scaling back spending on his business model for the club, which for me means he's contemplating a sale.

SDAddick said:

ShootersHillGuru said:

Stig said:

Airman Brown said:

stonemuse said:

I cannot track down the name of the main contractor anywhere ...not easy to unravel this one.

The architect is Belgian (or Dutch) I believe. Could the contractor be too? I'm assuming that would add significantly to the costs.

Logically you'd think that that would significantly add to the costs. But these aren't the sort of contractors that you call on and off to undertake specific projects. These are network contractors under contract to Melexis and strategically deployed wherever they are most needed. So as well as the Sparrows Lane redevelopment they'll also be putting a roof on the stadium at Ujpest, a row of shops in at Alcorcon, a hot tub and permanent barbecue at Katie's house and a new duck tape rack for Roly.

Architects might be from overseas and even the main contractor although I doubt it but the subbies won't be.

Putting off, relaxing or whatever they care to call it will have a cost. Implies to me that RD doesn't want to spend money he might not recoup in a sale.

I agree, but to me it means that a sale is potentially more imminent than is publicly acknowledged. RD and those who speak for him maintain that he is there for the long run. KM's comments in Dublin about selling on "the future stars of the Premier League" is one of the few concrete insights into the plans of this regime. If investing in the academy and training ground is scaling back, to me that says that RD is scaling back spending on his business model for the club, which for me means he's contemplating a sale.

Henry Irving said:

The "You can't get Cat 1 in league 1" argument doesn't hold water.

Even if that is the rule the build won't be finished until next summer. The club must at least expect to have a go at promotion before then even if we know that they lack the common sense to build a club and team able to do that.

If, and it still isn't clear if this is the case, the work has stopped or even to quote the bully boy coward Tony Keohone "relaxed" then we really are in a bad way.

The training ground was one of the few, perhaps only, good long term projects this regime has promised to do and started and now it could be stopped.

Meanwhile the training ground is, to quote JBG, "Shit", the facilities outdated and now half built. The players are eating in portacabins and the Community Trust (that's the trust that does all the good work that Katrien falsely claims credit) is in temporary offices.

Isn't the assessment mid-season, though?

Airman Brown said:

Henry Irving said:

The "You can't get Cat 1 in league 1" argument doesn't hold water.

Even if that is the rule the build won't be finished until next summer. The club must at least expect to have a go at promotion before then even if we know that they lack the common sense to build a club and team able to do that.

If, and it still isn't clear if this is the case, the work has stopped or even to quote the bully boy coward Tony Keohone "relaxed" then we really are in a bad way.

The training ground was one of the few, perhaps only, good long term projects this regime has promised to do and started and now it could be stopped.

Meanwhile the training ground is, to quote JBG, "Shit", the facilities outdated and now half built. The players are eating in portacabins and the Community Trust (that's the trust that does all the good work that Katrien falsely claims credit) is in temporary offices.

Isn't the assessment mid-season, though?

Yes, but they are going to miss that anyway.

There is no value in stopping now other than to save the planned expenditure.

Meanwhile it is like living in a half built house and all the best summer building time (good weather, not so many people about) is being wasted.

"The training ground was one of the few, perhaps only, good long term projects this regime has promised to do and started and now it could be stopped."

What about Target 20K?










And the sofa?







:-)

Other people working on the project:

From the latest planning application dated 10th of March.

Johnathan Richard Associates - Building Services Consultants
Couch Consulting Engineers - Civil & Structural Engineering, doc related to drainage
Sports Pitch Engineering - Pitch Design & Associated Services http://www.sports-pitch-engineering.nl/en/ have the project listed on their website.

All this may be known already.

Airman Brown said:

Henry Irving said:

Airman Brown said:

Henry Irving said:

The "You can't get Cat 1 in league 1" argument doesn't hold water.

Even if that is the rule the build won't be finished until next summer. The club must at least expect to have a go at promotion before then even if we know that they lack the common sense to build a club and team able to do that.

If, and it still isn't clear if this is the case, the work has stopped or even to quote the bully boy coward Tony Keohone "relaxed" then we really are in a bad way.

The training ground was one of the few, perhaps only, good long term projects this regime has promised to do and started and now it could be stopped.

Meanwhile the training ground is, to quote JBG, "Shit", the facilities outdated and now half built. The players are eating in portacabins and the Community Trust (that's the trust that does all the good work that Katrien falsely claims credit) is in temporary offices.

Isn't the assessment mid-season, though?

Yes, but they are going to miss that anyway.

There is no value in stopping now other than to save the planned expenditure.

Meanwhile it is like living in a half built house and all the best summer building time (good weather, not so many people about) is being wasted.

I wonder how they came to set a timetable that missed the assessment? Surely it couldn't have been a management error.

I was thinking the same. Of course it wasn't a management error. Just because they got the managers and players wrong doesn't mean everything else is shit

It was the authorities fault that after Charlton had changed the plans, enlarged them so it took more work, split off the Community Trust facilities so losing a lot of the promised external funding the authorities refused to move their audit timetable to suit Charlton.

If this was Belgium they would do want Roland tells them but in this country his visionary genius is ignored.

cafcfan said:

The planning docs https://google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/PAWS/media_id_11521/charlton_athletic_training_ground_report.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwiV1tr6kN7MAhVJF8AKHQ8xDnQQFggnMAU&usg=AFQjCNEy63KSXknyrr04fht8Zm-peK1emw&sig2=vilLh_kjWlg7tetIdjTvvg
Indicate the architects were HB Architects based in Rugby. Again theircweb site is silent on Charlton in its client list. (Even Dunchurch Infant School gets a mention.)
Unique.

The project team are highly likely to have been asked to sign a Non Disclosure Agreement. As much as they would want to shout from the rooftops they are not permitted to at the moment.

The project team are experienced in these sorts of designs - ie high-end stadia, training facilities etc

They are all based in the UK.

Infrastructure works for the sites services - which takes a bloody long time - are ongoing. It's very difficult to figure out a cost effective way of getting power to the site without digging everything up at a cost of millions and UKPN aren't exactly helpful or quick to respond.

Swisdom said:

cafcfan said:

The planning docs https://google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/PAWS/media_id_11521/charlton_athletic_training_ground_report.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwiV1tr6kN7MAhVJF8AKHQ8xDnQQFggnMAU&usg=AFQjCNEy63KSXknyrr04fht8Zm-peK1emw&sig2=vilLh_kjWlg7tetIdjTvvg
Indicate the architects were HB Architects based in Rugby. Again theircweb site is silent on Charlton in its client list. (Even Dunchurch Infant School gets a mention.)
Unique.

The project team are highly likely to have been asked to sign a Non Disclosure Agreement. As much as they would want to shout from the rooftops they are not permitted to at the moment.

The project team are experienced in these sorts of designs - ie high-end stadia, training facilities etc

They are all based in the UK.

Infrastructure works for the sites services - which takes a bloody long time - are ongoing. It's very difficult to figure out a cost effective way of getting power to the site without digging everything up at a cost of millions and UKPN aren't exactly helpful or quick to respond.

Thanks, so work is ongoing then?

I'm not in construction but understand that it is a complicated and easily disrupted process.