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The Takeover Thread - Duchatelet Finally Sells (Jan 2020)
Comments
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I don’t think Muir is the slightest like Duchâtelet. One is a non mega rich finance industry man and the other a billionaire (?) businessman.CAFCTrev said:This is obvs the british consortium. Reading the rangers fans comments, Muir basically seems like a Scottish RD. Really dont like this!
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I don't think it means they are close (or that they aren't).J BLOCK said:
That's not good then. I get the impression that Muir and Mcleish are close to a deal, what with attendance in last two games and being murray's guests.Redhenry said:The one i heard wasn't Muir
It just means they were at the game. My guess would be that they are not close as they are still looking at the club, seeing what needs doing etc etc.
We just don't know.1 -
Ex players move in the same circles as some seriously rich people. As GH posted earlier up the thread, Mcleish and Muir could just be working on behalf of someone else as part of their DD and that is where the relationship ends.Davo55 said:
But why would potential buyers use McLeish/Muir for that? Without disrespect to either, it seems an odd choice.nth london addick said:From No one and no where is there evidence that Muir and McLeish have the 50 mil that Roland wants to sell the club , from what I heard they are the front for others and just looking at the state of play, on the pitch and what the main issues are off it
It’s all part of being diligent
The biggest problem now is that unless the buyers are super minted or Refbull they ain’t going to be good enough
At this point, no one knows and the only place the Scotch paper and Rangers forum seem to be getting their info from is here, so where in effect winding ourselves up with our own speculation4 -
Spot on Henry. But I'd be surprised if the money men weren't in place by now, to some degree at least?
I think what we're all dreaming of is some mega rich foreign investors taking a punt on getting us into the Premier League, in the style of an Abramovich. Muir has real expertise in turning businesses around, but what worries me is that football isn't really like any other business. The failure of FFP has demonstrated that.
Muir is an acknowledged 'turnaround expert':
“It was buying, merging, expanding and disposing of a lot of businesses,” he says. “I was doing change management from the start, so I became a turnround expert while still in corporate life.”
“Very often we inherit a ‘train crash’, so the key is to find signs of life in the form of committed people, so you can turn the bits back into something healthy,” he says.
“You must show people the way forward by focusing on the outcomes, getting them to buy in and motivating them to deliver. No turnround professional can succeed on their own, but you must be very disciplined and rigid in how you drive things through.”
“People often say that they have been in the organisation for 25 years and I cannot possibly understand the business,” he says. “I tell them that a pound note is the same in any sector and we need to generate cash.
“If you tried to understand all the detailed complexities of every troubled business your head would blow up,” says Mr Muir. “I distil everything down to half a dozen points and use my experience to maximum effect.”
“We have to put leadership and discipline quickly back into an ailing organisation and instil logical and commercial thinking,” he says. “We nurse it back to strong financial performance as soon as conveniently possible, but it takes a major infusion of energy to make it happen!”
It's just very hard to effect change in one club while others (your competition) aren't necessarily playing by the same rules.
But it's all speculation at the moment, we know very little really.
Except that the soap opera continues.1 -
ABR6
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- Alex McLeish's last club was Zamalek
- Zamalek is the nickname given to Carling Black Label, a beer in South Africa
- McLeish fronting South African investors confirmed0 -
Of course members are going to panic about this news.
We've had 10 years of shit, most notably the last 4. The sale of the club represents a chance to have the tide turned. OK maybe a mega bucks purchaser is a dream but we'd hope for at least a solid buyer who is going to get us competing again. I don't expect us to get back to the PL any time soon but I do expect us to try.
The only piece of public news identifying a purchaser is this, a mediocre UK manager and a finance front man with a not very good football reputation.
Sure, we don't know the make up of the 'consortium' or even how close the deal truly is. But, on the face of it, it looks like more of the same shit.
Until I have more info I reserve the right to be pissed off with this report.6 -
But surely we should try for a standard higher than that?Henry Irving said:
Wouldn't it make more sense for an Arab or South African buyer to use Brits to review a British purchase?Davo55 said:
Simply that if I was an Australian or Arab money man I think I would be most unlikely to commission these two gentleman to run their eye over the club for me. If I was a British/Scottish money man it might be a different view.Henry Irving said:
Why not?Davo55 said:
But why would potential buyers use McLeish/Muir for that? Without disrespect to either, it seems an odd choice.nth london addick said:From No one and no where is there evidence that Muir and McLeish have the 50 mil that Roland wants to sell the club , from what I heard they are the front for others and just looking at the state of play, on the pitch and what the main issues are off it
It’s all part of being diligent
The biggest problem now is that unless the buyers are super minted or Refbull they ain’t going to be good enough
D. Muir is an international finance person. If they asked him to find a football person to have a look at the club it makes sense that he'd ask his life long friend and international football manager Alex McLeish who has won trophies in Scotland and England as a manager and was part of the very successful Aberdeen side of the 70s and 80s as a player under Fergie. I don't see it as an add choice at all. He's got a more impressive CV than any Charlton manager under Roland (including SCP).
OR maybe we've got this all the wrong way round. Maybe Muir and McLeish see the potential in Charlton, think it can be turned around (Muir's area of expertise) and so are putting together a prospectus to present to financial big hitters that they can access via D Muir. Maybe there are no buyers behind M & M yet.
As I wrote when Duchatelet took over the Chinese word for change is made up of two other Chinese words "opportunity" and "risk".
Four years on we are back at the same point again.
If any of us where buying a house in France would we speak to our local estate agent or find a French agency? Which would we trust to know more about the local rules, market, issues, etc?
I don't know what all the connections are or who is with who doing what.
I do think McLeish and D Muir are a huge step up from Fraeye, Driesen and Meire.
It's noteworthy that I haven't seen anyone in football say anything positive about Muir. And McLeish was a terrible manager (who managed Bowyer at Birmingham I believe).1 -
You [McCleish & Muir] are only here to watch the Charlton!1
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McLeish was a pretty successful manager in Scotland and is quite a decent bloke, I think. He's a good friend of Sir Alex.4
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I have heard there's a meeting on Thursday with Muir and the group who are interested in to buy us, South Africans i beleive.11
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Could Muir (the Scottish one) be working on behlaf of RD to broker a deal?0
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McLeish won the treble at Rangers, won the league twice (despite the financial melt-down at Ibrox, got Birmingham promoted and won the league cup with them.SDAddick said:
But surely we should try for a standard higher than that?Henry Irving said:
Wouldn't it make more sense for an Arab or South African buyer to use Brits to review a British purchase?Davo55 said:
Simply that if I was an Australian or Arab money man I think I would be most unlikely to commission these two gentleman to run their eye over the club for me. If I was a British/Scottish money man it might be a different view.Henry Irving said:
Why not?Davo55 said:
But why would potential buyers use McLeish/Muir for that? Without disrespect to either, it seems an odd choice.nth london addick said:From No one and no where is there evidence that Muir and McLeish have the 50 mil that Roland wants to sell the club , from what I heard they are the front for others and just looking at the state of play, on the pitch and what the main issues are off it
It’s all part of being diligent
The biggest problem now is that unless the buyers are super minted or Refbull they ain’t going to be good enough
D. Muir is an international finance person. If they asked him to find a football person to have a look at the club it makes sense that he'd ask his life long friend and international football manager Alex McLeish who has won trophies in Scotland and England as a manager and was part of the very successful Aberdeen side of the 70s and 80s as a player under Fergie. I don't see it as an add choice at all. He's got a more impressive CV than any Charlton manager under Roland (including SCP).
OR maybe we've got this all the wrong way round. Maybe Muir and McLeish see the potential in Charlton, think it can be turned around (Muir's area of expertise) and so are putting together a prospectus to present to financial big hitters that they can access via D Muir. Maybe there are no buyers behind M & M yet.
As I wrote when Duchatelet took over the Chinese word for change is made up of two other Chinese words "opportunity" and "risk".
Four years on we are back at the same point again.
If any of us where buying a house in France would we speak to our local estate agent or find a French agency? Which would we trust to know more about the local rules, market, issues, etc?
I don't know what all the connections are or who is with who doing what.
I do think McLeish and D Muir are a huge step up from Fraeye, Driesen and Meire.
It's noteworthy that I haven't seen anyone in football say anything positive about Muir. And McLeish was a terrible manager (who managed Bowyer at Birmingham I believe).
I don't think he's a great manager nor would I want him as Charlton boss but lets not pretend that he was "terrible" as the record proves that wrong.7 -
His track record is more in turnaround than broking though guess they are quite closely related.The Red Robin said:Could Muir (the Scottish one) be working on behlaf of RD to broker a deal?
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Covered End need to start practising to get this goodCharlton_Stu said:I have heard there's a meeting on Thursday with Muir and the group who are interested in to buy us, South Africans i beleive.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTtINHRja4k 0 -
The world of football has changed a lot in 20 years though, back in the 90s there were virtually no foreign owners, and the second tier was run on a much more sensible financial footing.DA9 said:
I disagree, the owners who took us to the Premier league were not minted in today’s terms.nth london addick said:From No one and no where is there evidence that Muir and McLeish have the 50 mil that Roland wants to sell the club , from what I heard they are the front for others and just looking at the state of play, on the pitch and what the main issues are off it
It’s all part of being diligent
The biggest problem now is that unless the buyers are super minted or Refbull they ain’t going to be good enough
What we need is caring, sensible football people with good business sense, willing to invest wisely and cost effectively.
Buying success is one thing, long term stability and growth better IMO.
Now the Championship is a financial disaster zone, as owners desperately try to chase promotion.1 -
McGhee is currently the Barnet manager, so I imagine he's there as a favour for his friend. Unless he's looking at one of our youngsters for a loan signingNo.1 in South London said:
That's Mark McGhee I believe ex Aberdeen player and manager, he would have played in the same team as McLeishDA9 said:
Looks like Malky Mackay to his leftshirty5 said:
Rowley Birkin QC alongside McLeish again, but this time Mark Strong has appeared in a light jacket and dark gloves.killerandflash said:
More people in the Director's box than in the rest of the stadium!craigcafc said:Mark McGhee there with McLeish tonight as well by the looks of things...
Former Millwall manager as well...0 -
Muir used to live in Orpington (indeed may still do so) so there may be more to this than immediately meets the eye.0
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ohh eck not south Africans..Charlton_Stu said:I have heard there's a meeting on Thursday with Muir and the group who are interested in to buy us, South Africans i beleive.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeDk6ZeGNnU 8 -
Anyone else considered McLeish was just there to watch a couple of good games of football?
Just me then!
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Interestingly enough, so does Rio Ferdinand!newyorkaddick said:Muir used to live in Orpington (indeed may still do so) so there may be more to this than immediately meets the eye.
It's happening I tell thee!7 -
Sounds like a sensible chapnewyorkaddick said:Muir used to live in Orpington (indeed may still do so) so there may be more to this than immediately meets the eye.
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I may well have missed something on the skim read but where did the SA thing come in?!Charlton_Stu said:I have heard there's a meeting on Thursday with Muir and the group who are interested in to buy us, South Africans i beleive.
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Alex McLeish attending 2 games at the valley in a row is not really much to feel suspicious about to be honest....considering the nature of blockbuster fixtures such as Charlton v oxford in the checkatrade cup.
Just wants to watch one hell of a game.7 -
AND... Rio is a Scottish name, er no it's not!carly burn said:
Interestingly enough, so does Rio Ferdinand!newyorkaddick said:Muir used to live in Orpington (indeed may still do so) so there may be more to this than immediately meets the eye.
It's happening I tell thee!
Panic over.0 -
I was told about Muir and South Africans before Christmas, didn't know weather to believe it as his name wasn't mentioned before, but do now. especially as Donald Muir has now been seen a couple of times.PaddyP17 said:
I may well have missed something on the skim read but where did the SA thing come in?!Charlton_Stu said:I have heard there's a meeting on Thursday with Muir and the group who are interested in to buy us, South Africans i beleive.
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To turn up for a Checkatrade match, does strongly suggest active interest, as they would know the Mickey Mouse nature of the fixture with players being rested and empty stands.Henry Irving said:
I don't think it means they are close (or that they aren't).J BLOCK said:
That's not good then. I get the impression that Muir and Mcleish are close to a deal, what with attendance in last two games and being murray's guests.Redhenry said:The one i heard wasn't Muir
It just means they were at the game. My guess would be that they are not close as they are still looking at the club, seeing what needs doing etc etc.
We just don't know.
I imagine that IF they are interested they would want to conclude a deal asap due to the artificial deadline of the transfer window0 -
Muir versus Muir is whats is happening. One Muir the Australian has done DD and made his bid ,Roland has not excepted ,Muir No.2 now doing DD to work out his bid. While Muir No 1 sits back and waits believing his bid will not be topped.
Its a game of Poker with our Club, who folds first.19
This discussion has been closed.
