The rise of the vegans.
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Make your own dinner.Stig said:@AFKABartram I'd be interested in joining your challenge, depending on when you're doing it.
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I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.0 -
My two sister-in-law's have been strict veggies for 20 years now and have since converted their parents and are bringing up my nephew and niece as veggie.
She even managed to convert her South African husband who still cooks the best steak I've ever tasted.
Anyway. Having eaten meals with them dozens of times over the last few years, I could happily eat the food they eat every day.
Not sure I could go full vegan though. A life without eggs and cheese? Is this some kind of witch craft? I don't think I could do that. I love cheese-on-toast and scrambled/fried egg-on-toast more than I like bacon sandwiches!2 -
@JohnBoyUK - you can use tofu to make a scrambled egg alternative, just add some nutritional yeast, onion powder and turmeric for colour and there you have it. I chuck in bits of chopped sun-dried tomatoes and a bit of basil and bosh....
My wife tried a scrambled tofu ‘egg’ n cress sandwich at a new vegan restaurant in York and you’d be hard pressed to tell the difference.1 -
Or you could just scramble some eggs.AddickUpNorth said:@JohnBoyUK - you can use tofu to make a scrambled egg alternative, just add some nutritional yeast, onion powder and turmeric for colour and there you have it. I chuck in bits of chopped sun-dried tomatoes and a bit of basil and bosh....
My wife tried a scrambled tofu ‘egg’ n cress sandwich at a new vegan restaurant in York and you’d be hard pressed to tell the difference.0 -
Had a vegetable tagine and quinoa for lunch, and very nice it was to5
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Greenie said:
Or you could just scramble some eggs.AddickUpNorth said:@JohnBoyUK - you can use tofu to make a scrambled egg alternative, just add some nutritional yeast, onion powder and turmeric for colour and there you have it. I chuck in bits of chopped sun-dried tomatoes and a bit of basil and bosh....
My wife tried a scrambled tofu ‘egg’ n cress sandwich at a new vegan restaurant in York and you’d be hard pressed to tell the difference.
If you fancy a bit of chicken period I guess.
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Mmmmmmmm.
Chicken Period......2 -
Love a chicken period with salt and pepper tomatoes and spinach, with olive oilSuedeAdidas said:Mmmmmmmm.
Chicken Period......
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Just finished some jackfruit tacos with homemade salsa and guacamole and a side order of spicy potatoe wedges. Few wedges of lime for that fresh zing and boom....a tasty af meal without any harm caused. What’s not to like?0
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Lack of protein mate, where's the bacon?AddickUpNorth said:Just finished some jackfruit tacos with homemade salsa and guacamole and a side order of spicy potatoe wedges. Few wedges of lime for that fresh zing and boom....a tasty af meal without any harm caused. What’s not to like?
Not a fan of jackfruit myself, got a weird soft texture about it1 -
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?0 -
Good try K&F. Kathleen Jannaway, an esteemed secretary of the Vegan society back in the 70's/80's, would only eat food that she could grow in her garden in Leatherhead, or buy locally. She would not eat bananas or pineapples for example. She lived well into her nineties, always robust and philosophical and proved the point (for her) that one could live on a natural 'local' vegan diet and be healthy which was an important issue at that period of time. Her cook book, which I used quite a lot, was pretty good but would be regarded as a bit bland nowadays. Personally I do like to eat imported fruits/foods but unlike Kathleen I was not trying to prove a philosophical point.
As for India, I think you will find that Indian people love their vegetables just like us, but easily grow rice and spices and have an amazing variety of exotic fruits. They do grow soya but I am unsure what the vegan ratio is over there.0 -
All protein comes from plants.killerandflash said:
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-protein-combining-myth/
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That seems fishy.Stevelamb said:
All protein comes from plants.killerandflash said:
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-protein-combining-myth/0 -
Slightly lapsed vegan from 5300 years ago makes news
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-448071010 -
"He already had signs of blocked arteries at the time of his death."A-R-T-H-U-R said:Slightly lapsed vegan from 5300 years ago makes news
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-448071010 -
TrollStevelamb said:
All protein comes from plants.killerandflash said:
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-protein-combining-myth/
'all protein comes from plants' is the most misleading thing I've ever read. It's a thoroughly disingenuous way of saying 'you can get a balanced diet, including protein, from eating only plants'
But then - you knew that
Just keeping it balanced for anyone happening along who might take the shite you trowel out at face value2 -
Probably killed by a toxic fern. Should have stuck to goat's fat and venison!A-R-T-H-U-R said:Slightly lapsed vegan from 5300 years ago makes news
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-448071013 - Sponsored links:
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Vegan Vibes @ Greenwich market today.0
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https://nutritionfacts.org/video/taking-personal-responsibility-for-your-health/Leroy Ambrose said:
TrollStevelamb said:
All protein comes from plants.killerandflash said:
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-protein-combining-myth/
'all protein comes from plants' is the most misleading thing I've ever read. It's a thoroughly disingenuous way of saying 'you can get a balanced diet, including protein, from eating only plants'
But then - you knew that
Just keeping it balanced for anyone happening along who might take the shite you trowel out at face value0 -
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-great-protein-fiasco/Leroy Ambrose said:
TrollStevelamb said:
All protein comes from plants.killerandflash said:
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-protein-combining-myth/
'all protein comes from plants' is the most misleading thing I've ever read. It's a thoroughly disingenuous way of saying 'you can get a balanced diet, including protein, from eating only plants'
But then - you knew that
Just keeping it balanced for anyone happening along who might take the shite you trowel out at face value
http://beyondmeat.com/whats-new/view/plant-proteins-and-meat-proteins-whats-the-difference-
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Leroy Ambrose said:
TrollStevelamb said:
All protein comes from plants.killerandflash said:
Traitorthewolfboy said:I normally like 'Killerandflash's' interventions but he seems to have forgotten that in India, for thousands of years, millions of hindus and ditto for buddhists have lived perfectly well on a vegetarian diet, so beware of any scientist twaddle when saying that we need to eat meat. (Their research may have been paid for by big business meat associations.)
Quote: I think what the findings suggest is that meat is essential for a completely balanced diet, but in fairly small quantities as MOST of the essential amino acids can be obtained through plant means, but not all.
Seriously I believe what I said was that a small amount of meat was essential for a "natural" completely balanced diet, especially based on what was available for people in Britain.
People in India may have lived for centuries on a vegan diet, but the plants they have naturally there are different to the ones we have. I can't think of many forms of plant based protein that grow naturally in Britain. And people do develop different natural metabolisms based on their local diet, aren't far more Indians gluten intolerant than Europeans?
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-protein-combining-myth/
'all protein comes from plants' is the most misleading thing I've ever read. It's a thoroughly disingenuous way of saying 'you can get a balanced diet, including protein, from eating only plants'
But then - you knew that
Just keeping it balanced for anyone happening along who might take the shite you trowel out at face value
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukY5_VFcA08
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I think people should have a look at the provenance of those links before jumping in lock, stock and barrel. As far as i can see Michael Greger thinks plant based diets cure cancer (let's ask Steve Jobs about that).
I think the last person on this thread to raise the 'protein is only from meat' argument was the other vegan that is imposing their views on others. Benefit of the doubt, you started this thread in good faith (despite using a sensationalist thread not more than a day or so earlier to push the message) but between you and the other person, it is all getting very preachy in my opinion.
Shame as there has been some decent discussion.0 -
Have any of the vegans on here had kids? Did you start feeding them a vegan based diet from 6 months/a year old?1
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(let's ask Steve Jobs about that).Super_Eddie_Youds said:I think people should have a look at the provenance of those links before jumping in lock, stock and barrel. As far as i can see Michael Greger thinks plant based diets cure cancer (let's ask Steve Jobs about that).
I think the last person on this thread to raise the 'protein is only from meat' argument was the other vegan that is imposing their views on others. Benefit of the doubt, you started this thread in good faith (despite using a sensationalist thread not more than a day or so earlier to push the message) but between you and the other person, it is all getting very preachy in my opinion.
Shame as there has been some decent discussion.
I will try now I am a preacher but I don't hold up much hope.0 -
Did you know that you do not need a qualification to be a nutritionist?
Therefore the vast majority of Nutritionists, be they Herbivore or Omnivore are just selling you their own version of the truth.3 -
We can all quote the bits we want to fit our needs.Dr Frank Maixner said:
If you consider the altitude where the Iceman was hunting, you need this kind of energy supply,Stevelamb said:
"He already had signs of blocked arteries at the time of his death."A-R-T-H-U-R said:Slightly lapsed vegan from 5300 years ago makes news
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-44807101
His diet was a well-balanced mix of carbohydrates, proteins and also fat,
Quite astonishing also was the high fat content he ingested.
It's goat fat and it's hard to imagine how this tastes, It's definitely not as tasty as we would eat nowadays.
Considering that there was no salt also, the pure taste of this meat, this fat - of all these components - I think it's hardly edible.
Also this Helen doesn't quote Dr Maixner when commenting on the Iceman's arteries...
Just like she doesn't when she mentions: "he may have wrapped his food up in fern leaves and ingested the toxic spores by mistake."
It could be her speculation rather than truth just like when she mentions the toxic spores in the fern leaves...
THE VEGETATION HE ATE TRIED TO MURDER HIM!
Vegetables and leafy greens must therefore be murderers!0 -
My daughter is a committed vegetarian with vegan sympathies and is bringing up my grand children on a non-meat diet, but she is not so stupid to think that a baby can thrive on a vegan diet with its nutrient deficiencies. They would need to have additional supplements added to their diet which a baby cannot normally eat like nuts and seeds or contain excessive salt like Marmite, or you get pills from Holland & Barrett. One child in France did die weighing 12lbs nearly one year old because parents were outraged at treatment of cows and went vegan.
The cult of veganism and the myths behind it being the natural human state would not have been possible to promote before the advent of a global supply chain of food from anywhere at any time. The only way people a hundred years ago stayed healthy, and far less healthy than we are now, was thorough preserving fish and meat to provide nutrition through the winter, they didn't have access to Marmite and Chia seeds and nuts were foraged food, not imported as an African cash crop. The Vegan Society didn't exist until 1944 and now we re-writes the history of human nutritional needs based on what pre-historic man could have bought from Tesco.
When vegans talk about "plant" protein, they mean seeds and nuts. Try eating two cabbages for lunch to get your daily protein.
A vegan diet is a moral code based belief system, if you don't believe it ask yourself why vegan mothers had to check with PETA if breastfeeding was OK as it was not plant based food. I venture to suggest it could be taking up the slack as we become less religious.
By all means promote Veganism/Vegetarianism as a lifestyle choice, but stop telling everyone else they are savages who hate animals and are following an inferior and morally repugnant lifestyle by eating a healthy balanced diet which includes the meat of animals who live and die suffering less cruelty or distress than many pet dogs.9
