The narrative was poorly told, possibly becuase not a lot really happened. Start/Marketing/Maja/Grigg/Wembley/End. I didnt like the first series because it was poorly made, but at least it had some content.
Not yet watched it but going from posts on here and my own completely disrespectful and snobbish view I hope we go out at the first opportunity every time we enter that Micky Mouse Football League Trophy with u-21 sides in it fffs its truly meaningless to a footballing snob like me . I’m so glad we didn’t get to Wembley for the first time since 98 to watch that shit and went to a real game instead . Personally nigh on zero interest in it , yes it’s good for youngsters and reserves but I choose not to go to watch their fixtures . Each to their own but I don’t want our next opportunity to play palace,Chelsea whoever to be an official fixture for allegedly our first team against their u-21s . Imagine a final against them , shameful . of course if we get there I’ll take the kids but we’re not going down anyway cos when the injured players come back we’ll rise up the table and finish mid table comfortably. fuck League One , fuck the FL Trophy , fuck all our wanky owners and chancers who continually take the piss and fuck Cadbury’s for kicking my IBS in there’s a toilet roll shortage dontcha know aaaaah nurse nurse put me to bed .
One thing I found a bit odd was the way, in the final episode, they seemed to just stop filming the behind the scenes stuff. It was all about the fans, which is fair enough, but it seemed to me like the film crew were suddenly denied access or something. The only bits I remember seeing of RedTrousers or Donald was Methven at halftime (speaking his one piece of wisdom all series) and Donald standing behind the Charlton lads as they lifted the trophy and later nearly getting into a row with the fan outside. All through the series it was mainly focused on how they dealt with day to day stuff, then they just stopped.
Also, with the 1998 playoff link, they spoke to the kit man. Why didn’t they talk to Kevin Ball? He was visible all series, but never spoke. Surely they could’ve asked him his thoughts? I’d have been interested to see how he felt in the lead up to the match.
One thing I found a bit odd was the way, in the final episode, they seemed to just stop filming the behind the scenes stuff. It was all about the fans, which is fair enough, but it seemed to me like the film crew were suddenly denied access or something. The only bits I remember seeing of RedTrousers or Donald was Methven at halftime (speaking his one piece of wisdom all series) and Donald standing behind the Charlton lads as they lifted the trophy and later nearly getting into a row with the fan outside. All through the series it was mainly focused on how they dealt with day to day stuff, then they just stopped.
Also, with the 1998 playoff link, they spoke to the kit man. Why didn’t they talk to Kevin Ball? He was visible all series, but never spoke. Surely they could’ve asked him his thoughts? I’d have been interested to see how he felt in the lead up to the match.
I couldn’t understand what the guy was saying to Donald outside at the end, was he having a pop?
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
What I thought happened was that the club found out from the media that Maja had refused a contract extension and were understandably a bit peeved that they heard the news from Sky rather than from the player or his agent. When you have six months or less on your contract you are free to talk
to other clubs, his agent deliberately ran the clock down in the run-up the transfer
window opening and was then free to start negotiating.
Right, you can talk to other clubs with six months left on your deal, you can’t bloody sign for them without your current club accepting an offer. They seemed to make out that they woke up one day and Maja had signed for Bordeaux without them knowing - that can’t possibly be true.
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
Maybe they did and were trying to cover their backs when the manager asked what was going on.
I mean Donald went ahead and signed Grigg despite Ross, Coton and Hill all saying don't bother..
Is that really how transfers are done these days!?
No wonder managers get fed up..
You can see why he signed Grigg. In his mind he needed to replace Maja's goals to secure promotion and there were no other options. But what he did was what the previous owners probably did. Chasing his losses.
There were some similarities with our position. We lost Grant who was scoring goals to the Premier League. Bowyer wasn't in a position to pay for anybody but when the loan he was working on fell through at the death, he had covered us as much as he could signing Parker the day before. Now Parker wasn't the greatest player to put on a Charlton shirt, but he definitely played his part. Look at our winning goal and him winning the free kick that directly led to it for starters.
One thing I found a bit odd was the way, in the final episode, they seemed to just stop filming the behind the scenes stuff. It was all about the fans, which is fair enough, but it seemed to me like the film crew were suddenly denied access or something. The only bits I remember seeing of RedTrousers or Donald was Methven at halftime (speaking his one piece of wisdom all series) and Donald standing behind the Charlton lads as they lifted the trophy and later nearly getting into a row with the fan outside. All through the series it was mainly focused on how they dealt with day to day stuff, then they just stopped.
Also, with the 1998 playoff link, they spoke to the kit man. Why didn’t they talk to Kevin Ball? He was visible all series, but never spoke. Surely they could’ve asked him his thoughts? I’d have been interested to see how he felt in the lead up to the match.
I couldn’t understand what the guy was saying to Donald outside at the end, was he having a pop?
I didn't read it as him having a go as such - he was a fan who was just desperate for an assurance from the owner that they would get out of the division sooner rather than later.
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
Maybe they did and were trying to cover their backs when the manager asked what was going on.
I mean Donald went ahead and signed Grigg despite Ross, Coton and Hill all saying don't bother..
Is that really how transfers are done these days!?
No wonder managers get fed up..
I was surprised Ross went home at 6pm on deadline day to be honest. Would have thought the manager stays in the building right to the end.
One thing I found a bit odd was the way, in the final episode, they seemed to just stop filming the behind the scenes stuff. It was all about the fans, which is fair enough, but it seemed to me like the film crew were suddenly denied access or something. The only bits I remember seeing of RedTrousers or Donald was Methven at halftime (speaking his one piece of wisdom all series) and Donald standing behind the Charlton lads as they lifted the trophy and later nearly getting into a row with the fan outside. All through the series it was mainly focused on how they dealt with day to day stuff, then they just stopped.
Also, with the 1998 playoff link, they spoke to the kit man. Why didn’t they talk to Kevin Ball? He was visible all series, but never spoke. Surely they could’ve asked him his thoughts? I’d have been interested to see how he felt in the lead up to the match.
I couldn’t understand what the guy was saying to Donald outside at the end, was he having a pop?
I didn't read it as him having a go as such - he was a fan who was just desperate for an assurance from the owner that they would get out of the division sooner rather than later.
No, I mean I literally couldn’t understand him! They focused on him gripping Donald’s hand for an uncomfortably long time so I assumed it was aggy.
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
Maybe they did and were trying to cover their backs when the manager asked what was going on.
I mean Donald went ahead and signed Grigg despite Ross, Coton and Hill all saying don't bother..
Is that really how transfers are done these days!?
No wonder managers get fed up..
I was surprised Ross went home at 6pm on deadline day to be honest. Would have thought the manager stays in the building right to the end.
That is a point - maybe shows managers have no real control over signings even at that level.
I wondered how he felt having been ignored though.
Watched all episodes, it’s not as good as the first series, even with our inclusion.
That Charlie guy is a complete twat, either he’s on some Charlie himself or he really is a prick. The Irish girl, think after the way he spoke to her pitch side would’ve made anyone walk. No one deserves that. Glad he has been shown to the whole nation who he is and what he’s like. Lots will turn on him now.
Taylor spoke to Sunderland before he did us, can you imagine what was going through Lyle’s mind after speaking to Charlie Methven, now compare that to after speaking with Bowyer and Gallen, there was no way he was ever going to Sunderland.
Steward Donald is someone who gets swept away with the emotions of being a club owner. Never should’ve spent anything like they did on Grigg, but he’s desperate for success and includes the fans. You can’t fault him too much.
McGeady and O’Nien come across really well throughout.
Maja is a prick and can see that with having the same agent as Aribo, it’s clear neither were ever going to stay at Sunderland or with us. Got nothing but love for Aribo, but he should do the right thing and find himself a better and more decent agent.
Jack Ross came across tactically naive at times. You’re a manager of the biggest club in the league, with enormous amount of talent and attacking talent, use it. Use their strengths, use the crowd, show intent and let the crowd get behind the players. Goes to show the difference with Bowyer to other managers. We’re lucky to have Bow.
Overall, Sunderland fans have been through it like us but in different ways. But that’s the nature of the sport. Things work in cycles and when there are so many things wrong throughout a club, the correlation is there for all to see of how they do on the pitch. They have a lot of die hard fans and will eventually go back up, but they’ve got to be careful that they don’t start to feel entitled and well above everyone else.
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
Maybe they did and were trying to cover their backs when the manager asked what was going on.
I mean Donald went ahead and signed Grigg despite Ross, Coton and Hill all saying don't bother..
Is that really how transfers are done these days!?
No wonder managers get fed up..
I was surprised Ross went home at 6pm on deadline day to be honest. Would have thought the manager stays in the building right to the end.
That is a point - maybe shows managers have no real control over signings even at that level.
I wondered how he felt having been ignored though.
I think managers do have limited control. However, perhaps it was Ross's way of conveying that he just didn't want Grigg.
Wyke wasn't a prolific scorer. However, Sunderland would have had a way of playing with him playing up top with runners such as O'Nien, McGeady, Maguire, Power, Gooch and Honeyman. With Grigg's arrival he either had to change effectively to two up top or use Grigg as a lone striker but he simply isn't good enough with his back to goal and wouldn't help them defensively at set pieces in the way that Wyke would.
Don’t see how Ross can take much of the blame tbh, he had no control or say in what the club offered or tried to negotiate with Maja or his agent, out of his hands, and when asked by Donald about Grigg he is now on record for all to see and hear that he didn’t rate him at 1.5M, let alone the 3-4M eventual cost, and he stated wouldn’t fit into his system anyway. Maja leaving, and a gamble by Donald on Grigg, who was clearly not 100% fit or out of form cost them their season imo
An interesting thing I’ve just noticed, it seems (if her twitter account is correct and up to date) that Sophie Ashcroft is back in the same role at a Sunderland backed charity
When they do eventually get it right you could see Sunderland doing a Brighton, Norwich or Sheffield United and within a short time getting to the PL. Potentially, they could have 40,000 every week turning up and that support coupled with a good manager on a decent budget could be enough.
Cant believe how desperate they were to get grigg.
Then again they put themselves in that situation with the Maja situation. I didnt want them to cave in to the greedy agent but in hindsight Maja would have probably won them promotion if they just kept him to the end of the season and took a hit on the fee they received from Bordeaux.
An interesting thing I’ve just noticed, it seems (if her twitter account is correct and up to date) that Sophie Ashcroft is back in the same role at a Sunderland backed charity
Yeah, looks like she simply moved over to the Mackem equivalent of CACT, the Foundation of Light. Good on her - hopefully she's had the last laugh on Charlie-boy. But pretty poor for the film-makers to imply that she walked/got the boot from the whole set-up without any clarification.
I guess this was always going to be a bit of a disappointment - "football club adapts to relegation from Premier League" is an easier story for outsiders to get into than "football club fucks it up again and is now in League One", and I don't think Jack Ross allowed them the access to the team they had in the first series. If Charlie Methven wasn't such a tosser they might have ended up binning the whole series. While there are stories left untold in this, I guess the full, excruciating saga of how Stewart Donald wasted a pile of cash on Will Grigg made up for it to an extent. Donald seems a good man but should never have left non-league.
And as others have pointed out, the sloppier bits of editing/production jarred - we started out as "Charlton Athletic" and ended up as "Charlton", c'mon, the Netflix money should have paid for someone to pick that up.
Watching our day at Wembley through their eyes was surprisingly difficult. Brought home how big our achievement then was - and the whole series brought home how big Chris Powell's achievement in 2011/12 was.
What Sunderland fans should accept is that Parkinson is a slow burner manager. I wouldn't employ him for instant results but seeing as he has been there a while he will get them up and build the club. If they try to push him out they won't benefit.
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
What I thought happened was that the club found out from the media that Maja had refused a contract extension and were understandably a bit peeved that they heard the news from Sky rather than from the player or his agent. When you have six months or less on your contract you are free to talk
to other clubs, his agent deliberately ran the clock down in the run-up the transfer
window opening and was then free to start negotiating.
Right, you can talk to other clubs with six months left on your deal, you can’t bloody sign for them without your current club accepting an offer. They seemed to make out that they woke up one day and Maja had signed for Bordeaux without them knowing - that can’t possibly be true.
Under the Bosman ruling you can both talk to and sign a pre-contract agreement to join another club for the following season regardless of the wishes of your club as long as its within six months of your current contract ending. Maja's agent, Elite Project Group, know how the game is played (they also represent Ademola Lookman and Jadon Sancho amongst others) and were pretty cynical about playing it too their advantage. They drove the transfer probably in the knowledge that Maja will be on the move again soon and so they'll collect another payday fror brokering that transfer. Being a cheap transfer Maja's wages and signing on fee would be a bit better than a negotiated transfer deal and doubtless they stood to make a bit more from that. So Sunderland took some money while they could and presumably gambled on getting a replacement in for about the same money they sold Maja for, in hindsight of course they should have kept him, and if he'd stayed fit then that would have been automatic promotion tied up. However Maja only played a few games for Bordeaux before getting injured and then missed the end of the season, if he'd stayed at SAFC would he have still got injured? There's all manner of sliding door stuff to debate there.
Maja doesn't come out of this well - his evasiveness about contractual negotiations suggest that he was under a lot of pressure to play the agent's game, from his body language he didn't look happy being put on the spot, but you also contrast that with the defender who was out of contract and sweating on a new deal being signed. As the graphic stated at the beginning of the programme wages at L1 level are not as great as some people think. You can go from earning a decent but not earth shatering wage to nothing in a moment.
Just watched ep 5. Cant believe how gutted they were to lose the checkatrade. God knows how they are going to feel in episode 6 with 6 seconds to go. I feel sorry for them already.
Just binged watched it today . The series felt more rushed than the last one but my overriding thoughts at the end was how I like the Sunderland fans . Proper fans. I actually felt gutted for them despite it being one of the best days of my life .
Just finished it, thought the first series was better (apart from the end).
My favourite bit until the last episode was Donald losing the plot on transfer deadline day and going from £1.25M to £3M rising to £4M on Will Grigg in a matter of minutes. Bet Wigan couldn’t accept that one fast enough!
I’m kind of confused by the Maja situation, how did he sign for Bordeaux without them knowing? He was still under contract with Sunderland at the time, did I miss the bit where they actually accepted an offer for him?
What I thought happened was that the club found out from the media that Maja had refused a contract extension and were understandably a bit peeved that they heard the news from Sky rather than from the player or his agent. When you have six months or less on your contract you are free to talk
to other clubs, his agent deliberately ran the clock down in the run-up the transfer
window opening and was then free to start negotiating.
Right, you can talk to other clubs with six months left on your deal, you can’t bloody sign for them without your current club accepting an offer. They seemed to make out that they woke up one day and Maja had signed for Bordeaux without them knowing - that can’t possibly be true.
Under the Bosman ruling you can both talk to and sign a pre-contract agreement to join another club for the following season regardless of the wishes of your club as long as its within six months of your current contract ending. Maja's agent, Elite Project Group, know how the game is played (they also represent Ademola Lookman and Jadon Sancho amongst others) and were pretty cynical about playing it too their advantage. They drove the transfer probably in the knowledge that Maja will be on the move again soon and so they'll collect another payday fror brokering that transfer. Being a cheap transfer Maja's wages and signing on fee would be a bit better than a negotiated transfer deal and doubtless they stood to make a bit more from that. So Sunderland took some money while they could and presumably gambled on getting a replacement in for about the same money they sold Maja for, in hindsight of course they should have kept him, and if he'd stayed fit then that would have been automatic promotion tied up. However Maja only played a few games for Bordeaux before getting injured and then missed the end of the season, if he'd stayed at SAFC would he have still got injured? There's all manner of sliding door stuff to debate there.
Maja doesn't come out of this well - his evasiveness about contractual negotiations suggest that he was under a lot of pressure to play the agent's game, from his body language he didn't look happy being put on the spot, but you also contrast that with the defender who was out of contract and sweating on a new deal being signed. As the graphic stated at the beginning of the programme wages at L1 level are not as great as some people think. You can go from earning a decent but not earth shatering wage to nothing in a moment.
Just watched ep 5. Cant believe how gutted they were to lose the checkatrade. God knows how they are going to feel in episode 6 with 6 seconds to go. I feel sorry for them already.
Looking forward to watching ep 6 tonight.
Too much attention on checkatrade. They didn’t expect to beat us in play off final
Comments
I didnt like the first series because it was poorly made, but at least it had some content.
I’m so glad we didn’t get to Wembley for the first time since 98 to watch that shit and went to a real game instead .
Personally nigh on zero interest in it , yes it’s good for youngsters and reserves but I choose not to go to watch their fixtures .
Each to their own but I don’t want our next opportunity to play palace,Chelsea whoever to be an official fixture for allegedly our first team against their u-21s .
Imagine a final against them , shameful .
of course if we get there I’ll take the kids but we’re not going down anyway cos when the injured players come back we’ll rise up the table and finish mid table comfortably.
fuck League One , fuck the FL Trophy , fuck all our wanky owners and chancers who continually take the piss and fuck Cadbury’s for kicking my IBS in there’s a toilet roll shortage dontcha know aaaaah nurse nurse put me to bed .
All through the series it was mainly focused on how they dealt with day to day stuff, then they just stopped.
Also, with the 1998 playoff link, they spoke to the kit man. Why didn’t they talk to Kevin Ball? He was visible all series, but never spoke. Surely they could’ve asked him his thoughts? I’d have been interested to see how he felt in the lead up to the match.
There were some similarities with our position. We lost Grant who was scoring goals to the Premier League. Bowyer wasn't in a position to pay for anybody but when the loan he was working on fell through at the death, he had covered us as much as he could signing Parker the day before. Now Parker wasn't the greatest player to put on a Charlton shirt, but he definitely played his part. Look at our winning goal and him winning the free kick that directly led to it for starters.
I wondered how he felt having been ignored though.
That Charlie guy is a complete twat, either he’s on some Charlie himself or he really is a prick. The Irish girl, think after the way he spoke to her pitch side would’ve made anyone walk. No one deserves that. Glad he has been shown to the whole nation who he is and what he’s like. Lots will turn on him now.
Taylor spoke to Sunderland before he did us, can you imagine what was going through Lyle’s mind after speaking to Charlie Methven, now compare that to after speaking with Bowyer and Gallen, there was no way he was ever going to Sunderland.
Steward Donald is someone who gets swept away with the emotions of being a club owner. Never should’ve spent anything like they did on Grigg, but he’s desperate for success and includes the fans. You can’t fault him too much.
McGeady and O’Nien come across really well throughout.
Maja is a prick and can see that with having the same agent as Aribo, it’s clear neither were ever going to stay at Sunderland or with us. Got nothing but love for Aribo, but he should do the right thing and find himself a better and more decent agent.
Jack Ross came across tactically naive at times. You’re a manager of the biggest club in the league, with enormous amount of talent and attacking talent, use it. Use their strengths, use the crowd, show intent and let the crowd get behind the players. Goes to show the difference with Bowyer to other managers. We’re lucky to have Bow.
Overall, Sunderland fans have been through it like us but in different ways. But that’s the nature of the sport. Things work in cycles and when there are so many things wrong throughout a club, the correlation is there for all to see of how they do on the pitch. They have a lot of die hard fans and will eventually go back up, but they’ve got to be careful that they don’t start to feel entitled and well above everyone else.
Wyke wasn't a prolific scorer. However, Sunderland would have had a way of playing with him playing up top with runners such as O'Nien, McGeady, Maguire, Power, Gooch and Honeyman. With Grigg's arrival he either had to change effectively to two up top or use Grigg as a lone striker but he simply isn't good enough with his back to goal and wouldn't help them defensively at set pieces in the way that Wyke would.
Maja leaving, and a gamble by Donald on Grigg, who was clearly not 100% fit or out of form cost them their season imo
Both players were picked up based on their scoring records within the Division rather than whether they'd fit into the system that they were playing
Then again they put themselves in that situation with the Maja situation. I didnt want them to cave in to the greedy agent but in hindsight Maja would have probably won them promotion if they just kept him to the end of the season and took a hit on the fee they received from Bordeaux.
I guess this was always going to be a bit of a disappointment - "football club adapts to relegation from Premier League" is an easier story for outsiders to get into than "football club fucks it up again and is now in League One", and I don't think Jack Ross allowed them the access to the team they had in the first series. If Charlie Methven wasn't such a tosser they might have ended up binning the whole series. While there are stories left untold in this, I guess the full, excruciating saga of how Stewart Donald wasted a pile of cash on Will Grigg made up for it to an extent. Donald seems a good man but should never have left non-league.
And as others have pointed out, the sloppier bits of editing/production jarred - we started out as "Charlton Athletic" and ended up as "Charlton", c'mon, the Netflix money should have paid for someone to pick that up.
Watching our day at Wembley through their eyes was surprisingly difficult. Brought home how big our achievement then was - and the whole series brought home how big Chris Powell's achievement in 2011/12 was.
Looking forward to watching ep 6 tonight.