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Has Bowyer lost it?
Comments
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You can struggle to believe it all you likeJ BLOCK said:
We had budget to sign stockley, we signed Schwartz we signed smith. Whilst all are good players, at least one should have been a defender. I struggle to believe there wasn’t one player we could get that was better than Deji or Pearce, they are garbage.Chunes said:
Him and Gallen both said they weren't any better CBs available under the cap.J BLOCK said:
So why didn't lord Bowyer strength in Jan? It was obvious to every single person who watched us before Jan that we needed strengthening there and we failed to do anything.Chunes said:
Deji and Pearce aren't good enough to make the play-offs. It's hard to get anywhere with a weakness like that in the spine of the team. Would they get in any of the teams above us? I don't think so. Pearce might be lucky to get in any of the teams in the bottom 5. I would certainly swap Gillingham's CBs for them, one of them in particular looked very handy.J BLOCK said:
This squad is more than capable of play offs, we are getting turned over week on week by teams worse than us, that is the issue.SamE7 said:I still can't get my head around that some people can't seem to comprehend the situation our club was in over the summer.
-Relegation
-Loss of most of our first team
-Transfer embargo / wage cap
-Team thrown together in 2 weeks
-Injuries (I'm aware every team has them)
If anyone here thought we would have a successful season then you are deluded. Some of the players we signed on frees were mostly out of necessity that nobody wanted (see the ones who have left), this whole club needs a rebuild and stability from top to bottom. That doesn't take 6 months.
Bowyer has done some odd things but the situation permits, as the saying goes. I think some football fans (definitely on the forum) live in this magical dream world where everything is like Football Manager. Imagine at the end of each year your whole workplace was turned over from top to bottom0 -
It's lucky that we don't have a history of players getting injured when they're coming back from injury.
It's lucky that Bowyer has never brought a player back only for him to get injured straight away again because he was pushed too much.1 -
Im talking about during our good run , Famewo was playing wasn’t he , no one was concerned that our squad would be as shit as we are .Redrobo said:
I think a fair few mentioned the most important factor would be the return of Famewo.oohaahmortimer said:I may have missed it but once all the new players arrived not one person was questioning the squad strength or showing any concern that play offs may be a struggle .
Then with the miracle run no one said I’m not sure about this , it was all it’s only gonna get better once they get to know each other .
Now oh they’re not good enough he can’t walk , he’s got 3 left feet and we should be grateful we’re above Wigan .0 -
Hopefully Famewo being back will allow us to play from the back more, instead of passing it back and forth and then lump it. Hopefully too Oshilaja will be able to perform better alongside Akin this time as he had a rough start to the season, although that partnership only got to play together the twice.Dazzler21 said:I am tempted to say Inniss won't play more than 5 games more this season.
Famewo will finish the last 15 I think. (Risk of new injuries aside)
We showed against Portsmouth we can cope without Inniss... Been questioning myself for a while if defensively its Akin we need back more1 -
Saw this on the BBC website, I guess this means a Curbishley return is out of the picture now.
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What is the 'it' that he has lost?
This Lincoln website gives us a reminder:
https://lincoln.vitalfootball.co.uk/who-are-the-league-one-managers-no-6-lee-bowyer-charlton-athletic/
Personally I love Lee Bowyer whatever.0 -
I didn't read all that but the last paragraph is a bit odd.jimmymelrose said:What is the 'it' that he has lost?
This Lincoln website gives us a reminder:
https://lincoln.vitalfootball.co.uk/who-are-the-league-one-managers-no-6-lee-bowyer-charlton-athletic/
Personally I love Lee Bowyer whatever.0 -
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages0 -
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?
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My only genuine answer to that is he has always said he likes 2 players for each position. If he's playing a diamond that's effectively 8 central players needed. I guess moving JW, MM, GL on he felt we was short? I agree though CB cover was neededcafcfan1990 said:
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?0 - Sponsored links:
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But Millar is one of the first names on the teamsheet, I can't imagine us playing the diamond too often to be honest. Getting rid of Williams and Maddison also supports this because we lost the two who would play at the tip.agim said:
My only genuine answer to that is he has always said he likes 2 players for each position. If he's playing a diamond that's effectively 8 central players needed. I guess moving JW, MM, GL on he felt we was short? I agree though CB cover was neededcafcfan1990 said:
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?0 -
Yeah I'm not defending the transfer. Both Millar & DJ look like wingers so you'd assume we won't be using the diamond much. He does love a centre midcafcfan1990 said:
But Millar is one of the first names on the teamsheet, I can't imagine us playing the diamond too often to be honest. Getting rid of Williams and Maddison also supports this because we lost the two who would play at the tip.agim said:
My only genuine answer to that is he has always said he likes 2 players for each position. If he's playing a diamond that's effectively 8 central players needed. I guess moving JW, MM, GL on he felt we was short? I agree though CB cover was neededcafcfan1990 said:
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?0 -
If we play the diamond Millar, and possibly DJ, are candidates for the "10" aren't they?agim said:
My only genuine answer to that is he has always said he likes 2 players for each position. If he's playing a diamond that's effectively 8 central players needed. I guess moving JW, MM, GL on he felt we was short? I agree though CB cover was neededcafcfan1990 said:
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?
That still leaves Pratley, Watson, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey plus Vennings0 -
That's what I'm saying:Cafc43v3r said:
If we play the diamond Millar, and possibly DJ, are candidates for the "10" aren't they?agim said:
My only genuine answer to that is he has always said he likes 2 players for each position. If he's playing a diamond that's effectively 8 central players needed. I guess moving JW, MM, GL on he felt we was short? I agree though CB cover was neededcafcfan1990 said:
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?
That still leaves Pratley, Watson, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey plus Vennings
DM: Pratley and Watson
LCM: JFC, Shinnie
RCM: Gilbey, Morgan
AM: Millar, DJ
Two players each position. Remember we had Levitt in there at some point too0 -
And we have Smith still at this point.0
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I think quite a few thought that luck was going our way in some games, the ‘who is going to score our goals’ thread was going quite well, and many were unhappy with Bowyer playing Pratley and Watson in front of the back four, but I agree that most thought a top six finish was achievable.oohaahmortimer said:
Im talking about during our good run , Famewo was playing wasn’t he , no one was concerned that our squad would be as shit as we are .Redrobo said:
I think a fair few mentioned the most important factor would be the return of Famewo.oohaahmortimer said:I may have missed it but once all the new players arrived not one person was questioning the squad strength or showing any concern that play offs may be a struggle .
Then with the miracle run no one said I’m not sure about this , it was all it’s only gonna get better once they get to know each other .
Now oh they’re not good enough he can’t walk , he’s got 3 left feet and we should be grateful we’re above Wigan .
I would not have been so confident if I had known that we would lose both our CH’s3 -
We're down to Pratley, Morgan, Smith, Watson, Shinnie and Gilbey as central midfield options0
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I hope you will be very happy together......jimmymelrose said:What is the 'it' that he has lost?
This Lincoln website gives us a reminder:
https://lincoln.vitalfootball.co.uk/who-are-the-league-one-managers-no-6-lee-bowyer-charlton-athletic/
Personally I love Lee Bowyer whatever.1 -
What happened to the nine game blocks Bowyer used to go on about?0
- Sponsored links:
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I'd imagine someone told him 2/3 wins in every nine isn't worth shouting about...cafcsinger said:What happened to the nine game blocks Bowyer used to go on about?1 -
Yes, so when you have those 8 all pretty much fit and ready to play, but only two fit CB's, why sign Smith? Although I think the two players for every position thing is inaccurate now anyway because Miller and DJ are wingers, not AM's.agim said:
That's what I'm saying:Cafc43v3r said:
If we play the diamond Millar, and possibly DJ, are candidates for the "10" aren't they?agim said:
My only genuine answer to that is he has always said he likes 2 players for each position. If he's playing a diamond that's effectively 8 central players needed. I guess moving JW, MM, GL on he felt we was short? I agree though CB cover was neededcafcfan1990 said:
We should have signed a CB over Smith.agim said:
I'd say it became quite obvious he'd lost faith in Williams towards the end. The same with Maddison and Bogle. Deji has forced his way in but it will only take another bad performance for him to be dropped I feel. On the whole the general chopping and changing suggests that he hasn't got a comfortable first 11 in his head because nobody has really been that consistent.Cafc43v3r said:
Not saying your right or wrong, but who doesn't he rate?agim said:
Yes I'm with you. I've said for a while the team needs a identity which I feel like it hasn't got at the moment. Does Bowyer have a history of chopping and changing so drastically I'm not sure he does? Hence why I think he doesn't rate the squad. He has always rotatedDazzler21 said:
You won't find a consistent performing 11 without playing a consistent 11.agim said:
It's very easy to blame the manager. Are we supposed to believe that Bowyer and the team have made these guys bad players over the course of the season? You're talking about 10/11 pros here. I agree he has tinkered loads, almost excessively BUT I do think part of it is the fact we can't find a consistent performing 11. Prime example is last week against Gillingham when he kept the same 11 as Rochdale and they produce that shit show. What's he meant to do this week, keep the same 11 after such a poor showing?Dazzler21 said:
I'll simplify it for you @agimagim said:Dazzler21 said:There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
We need a sustained period of playing a single formation and first 11. Only changing when better players become available (Inniss & Famewo) OR players are showing fatigue OR get injured. Rotating for the sake of it just messes with the playing chemistry or 'gelling'.
Even in our 8 game unbeaten run, we tinkered each game, and unsurprisingly the defence had the fewest changes.
I think we can still make the playoffs, even under Bowyer, but he needs to have a settled side to do so.
Out of those signings who has performed ?There's a lot of class in there, do you think they suddenly all became average league one players overnight? Or do you think the Manager and his training and tactics may play a part?
How do you expect players to gel and perform under the above conditions? We've got the squad that should be making the playoffs, but not they're not a team as they can't gel.
A reminder we have played with:
18 different defence set ups,
25 different midfield set ups,
22 different forward lines
across 6 different formations.
Rotation at time is needed as is changes after a poor performance. Its a catch 22 scenario in a sense of which Bowyer and the players are too blame for our poor season.
My argument is he has history of improving players and I'd like to see the likes of DJ, Schwartz and Innis a year from now
I'm not against making changes to freshen up under performing areas or fatigued/injured players, but we won't ever gel unless we try to have a consistent 11.
I agree Bowyer and his team have improved some players, but we've also seen some quality players underperform regularly under that same set up then excel elsewhere.
I'm all for Bowyer kicking on and trying to go for promotion if he can just try to keep at least one thing consistent. Maybe he can stick to one formation so players at least know their role each game. (Once again this may change as a result of enforced changes)
If the answer is "the center halves" it raises a number of questions, the answers to which lay firmly at Bowyer's door.
With the centre halves thing I can't understand why we didn't cancel Famewo's loan and bring in someone else? Hes been out for ages
Agree about the first 11, but it's the tactics and formation too. I'd love Bowyer to turn it around and yes I have sympathy with what he's put up with. But how many other managers out there are at this stage of the season with no real idea of who is his best team or best formation. You can say that underperforming players and injuries have contributed to that (and I'd agree) but I think it's a real mystery. If it's 442 he wants to play, why sign Smith when you already have Watson, Pratley, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey?
That still leaves Pratley, Watson, JFC, Shinnie, Morgan and Gilbey plus Vennings
DM: Pratley and Watson
LCM: JFC, Shinnie
RCM: Gilbey, Morgan
AM: Millar, DJ
Two players each position. Remember we had Levitt in there at some point too0 -
Block 1 = 19/27pts (6w 1d 2l)
Block 2 = 13/27pts (3w 4d 2l)
Block 3 = 11/27pts (3w, 2d 4l)
Block 4 = 0/27pts (0w, 0d, 1l)
Block 5 = 0/27pts
Block 6 = 0/6pts
0 -
Manager stability 'increasingly important' in pandemic, says League Managers Association
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56085322
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oohaahmortimer said:I may have missed it but once all the new players arrived not one person was questioning the squad strength or showing any concern that play offs may be a struggle .
Then with the miracle run no one said I’m not sure about this , it was all it’s only gonna get better once they get to know each other .
Now oh they’re not good enough he can’t walk , he’s got 3 left feet and we should be grateful we’re above Wigan .What did you expect fans to say? “Oh FFS we’ve signed Bogle he’s shit”?Fans rarely question their team’s latest signings - that’s why everyone loves transfer windows. That next signing could be the future club legend who leads us to glory.1 -
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I surprise myself sometimes.Dazzler21 said:1 -
I wasn't overwhelmed by the signing of Bogle, but then I was one of the few who wanted Bonne to stayDazzler21 said:2 -
As did I. But I am always open to giving players a chance unless they're next level wronguns.killerandflash said:
I wasn't overwhelmed by the signing of Bogle, but then I was one of the few who wanted Bonne to stayDazzler21 said:1
This discussion has been closed.
