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Rumours Rumours - Summer 2021 edition (Deadline Day from p814)
Comments
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This. Kirk would be a welcome addition but even if he does sign we still need another 4 or 5 quality players to give us a chance of top 6.SELR_addicks said:Even if we sign Kirk in a week or so. That doesn't solve anything.
He's not hiding the other 6 players we need in his pocket. And there's zero rumours of those players anywhere.6 -
Based on previous information from Q&As point 6 comes under Gallen. I have no idea where Roddy fits into process other than he is on the recruitment committeebobmunro said:
In my experience, this is how it should work.Dazzler21 said:Here's how ( I think) Transfers may be working.
1.
Adkins suggests the kind of players he needs, gives the requirements of what they MUST have and probably even names some that do the job of such players.
2.
Gallen goes out, taps up contacts and uses his relationships to find players that match Adkins requirements - Comes back to Adkins to check suitability
3.
When NA & SG are happy I'd hope it was straight to Sandgaard, but I fear this is where Roddy steps in. I don't get what he does, but he basically has to also ratify the signing before it can get to Sandgaard. Maybe he's acting as some sort of buffer to ensure we don't put forward signings over a certain price that don't add enough resale value etc?
4.
When it gets to Sandgaard I would assume the case is put forward on what the player brings, what their resale potential might be, how much we might need to spend to get them and whether they may or may not be able to make the step up.
Alternative
The other thing that may occur is you roll up the meetings where Gallen comes back to a 4-way between Adkins, Gallen, Roddy & Sandgaard and they thrash it out whilst chugging Monster's and listening to rap metal.
1. Owner (TS) sets the budget (transfer fee and wages)
2. Manager (NA) tells head of recruitment (SG) who/what he wants.
3. Head of recruitment draws up a shortlist
4. Manager reviews shortlist and selects those he wants to pursue.
5. Head of recruitment asks current club for permission to talk to player (yes, I know!!).
6. If player is interested the CEO (we don't have one but it could be Roddy in this instance) negotiates with player/club/agent within the confines of the budgets set in 1) above.
7. If agreement (within budget) is reached then player signs).
8. If agreement cannot be reached but manager wants to pursue further then CEO discusses budget with owner. If it can be increased then repeat 6) and 7).
9. If no agreement reached within an acceptable budget then all parties move on.
For us point 6 may be the issue.0 -
Unless things have changed Gallen does the negotiating?bobmunro said:
In my experience, this is how it should work.Dazzler21 said:Here's how ( I think) Transfers may be working.
1.
Adkins suggests the kind of players he needs, gives the requirements of what they MUST have and probably even names some that do the job of such players.
2.
Gallen goes out, taps up contacts and uses his relationships to find players that match Adkins requirements - Comes back to Adkins to check suitability
3.
When NA & SG are happy I'd hope it was straight to Sandgaard, but I fear this is where Roddy steps in. I don't get what he does, but he basically has to also ratify the signing before it can get to Sandgaard. Maybe he's acting as some sort of buffer to ensure we don't put forward signings over a certain price that don't add enough resale value etc?
4.
When it gets to Sandgaard I would assume the case is put forward on what the player brings, what their resale potential might be, how much we might need to spend to get them and whether they may or may not be able to make the step up.
Alternative
The other thing that may occur is you roll up the meetings where Gallen comes back to a 4-way between Adkins, Gallen, Roddy & Sandgaard and they thrash it out whilst chugging Monster's and listening to rap metal.
1. Owner (TS) sets the budget (transfer fee and wages)
2. Manager (NA) tells head of recruitment (SG) who/what he wants.
3. Head of recruitment draws up a shortlist
4. Manager reviews shortlist and selects those he wants to pursue.
5. Head of recruitment asks current club for permission to talk to player (yes, I know!!).
6. If player is interested the CEO (we don't have one but it could be Roddy in this instance) negotiates with player/club/agent within the confines of the budgets set in 1) above.
7. If agreement (within budget) is reached then player signs).
8. If agreement cannot be reached but manager wants to pursue further then CEO discusses budget with owner. If it can be increased then repeat 6) and 7).
9. If no agreement reached within an acceptable budget then all parties move on.
For us point 6 may be the issue.3 -
I don't think negotiating skills is the issue (there would/should be lawyers for the club involved at that stage) - it might be that Roddy has an opinion on the player that differs from NA/SG - that's a big issue. The CEO should be the deal maker, not the selector.Dazzler21 said:Nah the more I think about it, I'm sure it's the alternative.
(You're likely spot on Bob, is Ged Roddy known for his negotiating skills?)2 -
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era12 -
Replace CEO with Head of Recruitment then.Scoham said:
Unless things have changed Gallen does the negotiating?bobmunro said:
In my experience, this is how it should work.Dazzler21 said:Here's how ( I think) Transfers may be working.
1.
Adkins suggests the kind of players he needs, gives the requirements of what they MUST have and probably even names some that do the job of such players.
2.
Gallen goes out, taps up contacts and uses his relationships to find players that match Adkins requirements - Comes back to Adkins to check suitability
3.
When NA & SG are happy I'd hope it was straight to Sandgaard, but I fear this is where Roddy steps in. I don't get what he does, but he basically has to also ratify the signing before it can get to Sandgaard. Maybe he's acting as some sort of buffer to ensure we don't put forward signings over a certain price that don't add enough resale value etc?
4.
When it gets to Sandgaard I would assume the case is put forward on what the player brings, what their resale potential might be, how much we might need to spend to get them and whether they may or may not be able to make the step up.
Alternative
The other thing that may occur is you roll up the meetings where Gallen comes back to a 4-way between Adkins, Gallen, Roddy & Sandgaard and they thrash it out whilst chugging Monster's and listening to rap metal.
1. Owner (TS) sets the budget (transfer fee and wages)
2. Manager (NA) tells head of recruitment (SG) who/what he wants.
3. Head of recruitment draws up a shortlist
4. Manager reviews shortlist and selects those he wants to pursue.
5. Head of recruitment asks current club for permission to talk to player (yes, I know!!).
6. If player is interested the CEO (we don't have one but it could be Roddy in this instance) negotiates with player/club/agent within the confines of the budgets set in 1) above.
7. If agreement (within budget) is reached then player signs).
8. If agreement cannot be reached but manager wants to pursue further then CEO discusses budget with owner. If it can be increased then repeat 6) and 7).
9. If no agreement reached within an acceptable budget then all parties move on.
For us point 6 may be the issue.
Still begs the question as to whether or not GR is involved in the process.1 -
He is the one person on that committee that I don't understand why.JohnnyH2 said:
Based on previous information from Q&As point 6 comes under Gallen. I have no idea where Roddy fits into process other than he is on the recruitment committeebobmunro said:
In my experience, this is how it should work.Dazzler21 said:Here's how ( I think) Transfers may be working.
1.
Adkins suggests the kind of players he needs, gives the requirements of what they MUST have and probably even names some that do the job of such players.
2.
Gallen goes out, taps up contacts and uses his relationships to find players that match Adkins requirements - Comes back to Adkins to check suitability
3.
When NA & SG are happy I'd hope it was straight to Sandgaard, but I fear this is where Roddy steps in. I don't get what he does, but he basically has to also ratify the signing before it can get to Sandgaard. Maybe he's acting as some sort of buffer to ensure we don't put forward signings over a certain price that don't add enough resale value etc?
4.
When it gets to Sandgaard I would assume the case is put forward on what the player brings, what their resale potential might be, how much we might need to spend to get them and whether they may or may not be able to make the step up.
Alternative
The other thing that may occur is you roll up the meetings where Gallen comes back to a 4-way between Adkins, Gallen, Roddy & Sandgaard and they thrash it out whilst chugging Monster's and listening to rap metal.
1. Owner (TS) sets the budget (transfer fee and wages)
2. Manager (NA) tells head of recruitment (SG) who/what he wants.
3. Head of recruitment draws up a shortlist
4. Manager reviews shortlist and selects those he wants to pursue.
5. Head of recruitment asks current club for permission to talk to player (yes, I know!!).
6. If player is interested the CEO (we don't have one but it could be Roddy in this instance) negotiates with player/club/agent within the confines of the budgets set in 1) above.
7. If agreement (within budget) is reached then player signs).
8. If agreement cannot be reached but manager wants to pursue further then CEO discusses budget with owner. If it can be increased then repeat 6) and 7).
9. If no agreement reached within an acceptable budget then all parties move on.
For us point 6 may be the issue.
In the initial announcement of him joining it was said that"His primary focus will be planning and implementing the club’s long-term footballing strategy with the initial aim of helping the club stabilise and ultimately getting the club back to the Premier League."He said himself:
“We have to put the foundations in place to stabilise the club and give us something to build on. The long-term view is ambitious and that is exciting but we’ll need to walk before we can run. We’ll have to be clever in the way we do business and invest in the development of the club. We have a good structure already in place, with some very talented people working at the club, and with a little bit of support, there is no reason why, over time, we can’t achieve everything the owner, the staff and the fans dream of. I am humbled to be joining this great club and can’t wait to get started.”I don't get what he's doing regarding transfers. I do believe he is doing a lot behind closed doors to ensure the club is being run as a business.
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Peak Golfie this.golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
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TS is going to have to get a least 6 or 7 quality players in because if he doesn’t he’s going to be reminded every time we lose . We have some fans on social media who can be very unforgiving and it might get very uncomfortable .2
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Clare played really well in his one league game for us and I'm already seeing him be written off. Ludicrous55
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Probably cos they were signed whilst we were in the Championship on inflated wages.golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
Do we really have a full day of this nonsense?24 -
This article has interesting quotes from NA. It did make me wonder at the time if SG role has changed - talks about him negotiating deals more than identifying players. Then goes on to say GRs recruitment team. Feels like SGs role has changed.
"We’ve obviously got Steve Gallen, who is in negotiation with the players, the players’ agents and opposite clubs – because he is linked to the finances. Ged Roddy and his recruitment team identify players as part of a process as well. Data is used in a big way now – it’s the future of football, I suppose."
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/charlton-athletic-boss-nigel-adkins-all-our-out-of-contract-players-want-to-stay/
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It is, but it's not wrong for any of those players.FishCostaFortune said:
Peak Golfie this.golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
I'm not about to go celebrating Roland's achievements with the club though! The guy was an absolute maniac.2 -
opinion from my souurce is that its a matter of him being tight as we should't be struggling as our club is massive yet for some reason were struggling to attract players0
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Duchatelet-esqueDubaiCAFC said:One thing I would like to know, where is our bigger playing budget than last season being spent? As TS said in a recent interview. He must read social media, and likely the forums, he must be feeling a bit of pressure..?
In the words of Bowyer ‘we need some help’
Listening to NA interviews, he does t sound confident that we are going to get the required players in. Certainly seems an issue with getting the deals over the line.
Kirk deal does sound like a bit of bad luck on our side, but I think we will get that over the line when Charlie is ready, as he is going through a terrible tough time.
Heard Gomes was offered 1 year deal, which was verbally agreed, then the terms changed to what was verbally agreed. This why it broke down. Hopefully we can bring someone in better to be honest.. but running out of options now.
it is also worrying when a club like AFC Wimbledon have more depth and strength than us. They made 9 changes, and by all accounts deserved the win!0 -
At the risk of playing devils advocate here, is there any actual proof that Roddy is any way interfering with the transfer process?bobmunro said:
I don't think negotiating skills is the issue (there would/should be lawyers for the club involved at that stage) - it might be that Roddy has an opinion on the player that differs from NA/SG - that's a big issue. The CEO should be the deal maker, not the selector.Dazzler21 said:Nah the more I think about it, I'm sure it's the alternative.
(You're likely spot on Bob, is Ged Roddy known for his negotiating skills?)
Obviously people aren't happy with what's happening and understandably so but it doesn't sit right to speculating that this is somehow Roddy's fault when for all we know it's nothing to do with him.3 -
Listened to Moyes yesterday speaking about how quiet market was and making particular reference to lack of activity in the Championship. Made sense to me in the light of the very restricted financial situation most clubs must be experiencing for obvious reasons. I think the prospect of players being unemployed is realistic come the end of the window, released players not being picked up etc. Uncertain and unforeseen times.
I think looking at results so far there must be a number of clubs wondering about their squads and how things will pan out. Ipswich spring to mind after their opening fixtures. I was surprised to see a comment earlier that suggested the season was done if we didn't win on Saturday.
New blood is always good however we've bought a lot of shite in over the years. The polarisation in the support doesn't surprise me at all. There have always been factions and a vocal minority at war with each other. Social media makes it worse as it does with most things.
In my experience we will have some new players and then it is down to the manager and JJ to get a tune out of them. It's reasonable to assume we'll concede less this season and so the focus must be on making sure we score at least once every game. In my view the "we need 6/7/23/" comments are pointless. Crosses for the big lad and a partner that can feed on the scraps and has the legs to slide in at the far post for the ball across the box will do me. All efforts should be focused on that aim and if that means 2 permanent players so be it, a couple of talented loans would be nice too but if the youngsters have to step up then they must. They'll get better for playing and continue the attractive nature of the club to young talent who can see there is a realistic chance of making it as a pro with a club like us.
I saw Southport v Everton U23 other day and there were a couple that stood out for their touch and athleticism if not their end product but I could never imagine any of them playing in Everton's first team. These lads will inevitably fade from the game in many cases, ours may actually get the chance to play competitive football and rise to the level required. Why do we bother with the academy st up if we don't test them?
We're a third division team with ambitions not a divine right to regain a Championship status.6 -
So, Roland and Driesen were visionaries after all!!!DessieValley said:Data is used in a big way now – it’s the future of football, I suppose."
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/charlton-athletic-boss-nigel-adkins-all-our-out-of-contract-players-want-to-stay/
0 -
The longer we leave it, the more I worry that we'll just have to get bodies in for the sake of it. Another window of Matt Smith v1 and David Davis.4
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I'm under the impression that it's GR's responsibility to ensure that our signings fit with our overall strategy.bobmunro said:
Replace CEO with Head of Recruitment then.Scoham said:
Unless things have changed Gallen does the negotiating?bobmunro said:
In my experience, this is how it should work.Dazzler21 said:Here's how ( I think) Transfers may be working.
1.
Adkins suggests the kind of players he needs, gives the requirements of what they MUST have and probably even names some that do the job of such players.
2.
Gallen goes out, taps up contacts and uses his relationships to find players that match Adkins requirements - Comes back to Adkins to check suitability
3.
When NA & SG are happy I'd hope it was straight to Sandgaard, but I fear this is where Roddy steps in. I don't get what he does, but he basically has to also ratify the signing before it can get to Sandgaard. Maybe he's acting as some sort of buffer to ensure we don't put forward signings over a certain price that don't add enough resale value etc?
4.
When it gets to Sandgaard I would assume the case is put forward on what the player brings, what their resale potential might be, how much we might need to spend to get them and whether they may or may not be able to make the step up.
Alternative
The other thing that may occur is you roll up the meetings where Gallen comes back to a 4-way between Adkins, Gallen, Roddy & Sandgaard and they thrash it out whilst chugging Monster's and listening to rap metal.
1. Owner (TS) sets the budget (transfer fee and wages)
2. Manager (NA) tells head of recruitment (SG) who/what he wants.
3. Head of recruitment draws up a shortlist
4. Manager reviews shortlist and selects those he wants to pursue.
5. Head of recruitment asks current club for permission to talk to player (yes, I know!!).
6. If player is interested the CEO (we don't have one but it could be Roddy in this instance) negotiates with player/club/agent within the confines of the budgets set in 1) above.
7. If agreement (within budget) is reached then player signs).
8. If agreement cannot be reached but manager wants to pursue further then CEO discusses budget with owner. If it can be increased then repeat 6) and 7).
9. If no agreement reached within an acceptable budget then all parties move on.
For us point 6 may be the issue.
Still begs the question as to whether or not GR is involved in the process.
It seems to me our strategy is to further integrate the academy with the first team - quite why that needs to be done when you look at the history of our academy I'm not sure, but it would certainly be a cheaper (if less successful) way of running the football club.
It's a bad example as we'll probably end up signing him anyway but in my head it might be something like GR saying "Why would we sign Kirk when we have Clayden in our academy" or "Why would we sign a left back when my son is doing a fantastic job there".
Does "ensuring there is a pathway for our youngsters" just mean "we're not going to sign better players that would be ahead of them in the pecking order".6 - Sponsored links:
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Nope - which is why I said 'might be'.thenewbie said:
At the risk of playing devils advocate here, is there any actual proof that Roddy is any way interfering with the transfer process?bobmunro said:
I don't think negotiating skills is the issue (there would/should be lawyers for the club involved at that stage) - it might be that Roddy has an opinion on the player that differs from NA/SG - that's a big issue. The CEO should be the deal maker, not the selector.Dazzler21 said:Nah the more I think about it, I'm sure it's the alternative.
(You're likely spot on Bob, is Ged Roddy known for his negotiating skills?)
Obviously people aren't happy with what's happening and understandably so but it doesn't sit right to speculating that this is somehow Roddy's fault when for all we know it's nothing to do with him.1 -
Agreed, thought him and Dobson look a good pairing in the middle and without trying to single out one of our own, i think if we add a bit of quality where Albie is (Personal opinion maybe) we would be sorted in the middle, Gilbey might be a factor if he is due back anytime soon there is probably less need to go out and get someone. Morgan isn't terrible just feel he lacks that cutting edge and composure, i would love him to prove me wrong but for now he should be a back upLeuth said:Clare played really well in his one league game for us and I'm already seeing him be written off. Ludicrous1 -
Well we've seen two competitive matches from Dobson and Clare who are 23 and 24 respectively. How the hell can you even judge that the other players are a 'damn sight' better?Dazzler21 said:
It is, but it's not wrong for any of those players.FishCostaFortune said:
Peak Golfie this.golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
I'm not about to go celebrating Roland's achievements with the club though! The guy was an absolute maniac.
Also how successful have those players careers been with the exception of JBG since they left Charlton?
He also fails to mention all the guff we signed under Roland as well.
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Replace those names with Cullen, Bielik, Taylor, Williams.ValleyGary said:
Probably cos they were signed whilst we were in the Championship on inflated wages.golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
Do we really have a full day of this nonsense?
Point still stands - it’s easy to pile in on Golfie but in this case he has a point.
At present Clare and Dobson are nowhere near that calibre…. On paper someone like Kirk would be closer but we would need another 5-6 of him.3 -
Also one for you guys, understaand it was Andy Marshall who would tell cawley all the gossip beforehand. seems inline with cawley not knowing/releasing as much since marshall has left.13
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My worry is that right at the end of the window we'll end up with our version of Man U under Moyes buying Fellaini for a ridiculous price, because we're desperate to buy someone, indeed anyoneCroydon said:The longer we leave it, the more I worry that we'll just have to get bodies in for the sake of it. Another window of Matt Smith v1 and David Davis.0 -
Which of those were signed in league one?golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
None of them.5 -
He will have a point at the end of the transfer window, IF we don’t sign players good enough to try and get us out of this division. Comparing Dobson and Clare who have signed for a League One club with a sensible owner to Gudmonnson and Vetekole, who were signed under a madman and his cat weasel CEO in the Championship is ludicrous and does absolutely nothing to get people thinking anything different that he’s just a miserable sod.DamoNorthStand said:
Replace those names with Cullen, Bielik, Taylor, Williams.ValleyGary said:
Probably cos they were signed whilst we were in the Championship on inflated wages.golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era
Do we really have a full day of this nonsense?
Point still stands - it’s easy to pile in on Golfie but in this case he has a point.
At present Clare and Dobson are nowhere near that calibre…. On paper someone like Kirk would be closer but we would need another 5-6 of him.1 -
Taylor, Cullen, Bielik, Williams…. Even Jamie Ward and Billy ClarkeChunes said:
Which of those were signed in league one?golfaddick said:
In retrospect players like Yoni Buyons, JBG, Vetokeke, Teixeira, Bulot & Watt were a damn sight better than Clare & Dobson.ForeverAddickted said:
Grass was always greener on the other side springs to mind.Rothko said:Quiet enjoying the revisionism of the RD era1
This discussion has been closed.
