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POST-MATCH THREAD: Blackburn Rovers v Charlton Athletic: Sunday 4th January 2026: KO 15:00
Comments
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_uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Fkn hilarious.se9addick said:
I think that’s really pertinent. It seems like the need to create constant drama for “content” means all perspective is lost. Yesterday was a six pointer and we should have been targeting a win (especially at two bloody nil up) but it clearly wasn’t a “must win” game since we didn’t win it and our goal of avoiding relegation is still alive._uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Guess everyone who went Blackburn away I spoke to yesterday also must run youtube accounts as they were all in agreement how important a win was (off camera)
And all the Blackburn fans I had a chat with must have a secret tiktok setup who also said they need a win because of their poor form.
"The cost of harmony"
You do realise there are millions of football fans who lose their mind after bad results and not all of them are on camera or YouTube themselves?
I have posted in this exact same manner about Charlton on all social media platforms for almost 2 decades. Has absolutely f all to do with a youtube account.
Petty, petty jabs.3 -
Again, you’re moving the goal posts (or misunderstanding what “must win” means). No one thinks yesterday wasn’t important or a good opportunity to pick up three points. But it, evidently, wasn’t a “must win” match. Given that your poll conflated must win with a six pointer, which aren’t the same thing, I’m not surprised that you had people agreeing with you when you interviewed them yesterday.Braziliance said:_uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Fkn hilarious.se9addick said:
I think that’s really pertinent. It seems like the need to create constant drama for “content” means all perspective is lost. Yesterday was a six pointer and we should have been targeting a win (especially at two bloody nil up) but it clearly wasn’t a “must win” game since we didn’t win it and our goal of avoiding relegation is still alive._uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Guess everyone who went Blackburn away I spoke to yesterday also must run youtube accounts as they were all in agreement how important a win was (off camera)
And all the Blackburn fans I had a chat with must have a secret tiktok setup who also said they need a win because of their poor form.
"The cost of harmony"
You do realise there are millions of football fans who lose their mind after bad results and not all of them are on camera or YouTube themselves?
I have posted in this exact same manner about Charlton on all social media platforms for almost 2 decades. Has absolutely f all to do with a youtube account.
Petty, petty jabs.I genuinely thought this was a well understood term that didn’t really need explanation.3 -
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
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NJ is our man 100%.
This year has reminded me though what an unbelievable job Powell did in 2012-13. Ridiculous really when you consider the squad he had to play with.10 -
Google is your friend. Like I said before, people take it way too seriously and start being pedantic as a result.se9addick said:
Again, you’re moving the goal posts (or misunderstanding what “must win” means). No one thinks yesterday wasn’t important or a good opportunity to pick up three points. But it, evidently, wasn’t a “must win” match. Given that your poll conflated must win with a six pointer, which aren’t the same thing, I’m not surprised that you had people agreeing with you when you interviewed them yesterday.Braziliance said:_uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Fkn hilarious.se9addick said:
I think that’s really pertinent. It seems like the need to create constant drama for “content” means all perspective is lost. Yesterday was a six pointer and we should have been targeting a win (especially at two bloody nil up) but it clearly wasn’t a “must win” game since we didn’t win it and our goal of avoiding relegation is still alive._uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Guess everyone who went Blackburn away I spoke to yesterday also must run youtube accounts as they were all in agreement how important a win was (off camera)
And all the Blackburn fans I had a chat with must have a secret tiktok setup who also said they need a win because of their poor form.
"The cost of harmony"
You do realise there are millions of football fans who lose their mind after bad results and not all of them are on camera or YouTube themselves?
I have posted in this exact same manner about Charlton on all social media platforms for almost 2 decades. Has absolutely f all to do with a youtube account.
Petty, petty jabs.I genuinely thought this was a well understood term that didn’t really need explanation.
It is what it is, I have a very different view point about Charlton to posters on Charlton Life. All it comes down to.
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No medication required?😂Miserableoldgit said:
They'll all sort themselves out.Sword65pf said:
I struggle with their, there and they’re!!wolfgang said:
I always get confused with long words like promotion and relegation.eastterrace6168 said:wolfgang said:Two points thrown away (and a point gifted to a promotion rival) because of N Jones' bungling and favouritism.
Yes, I know he did great last season in League One. But that was because he is a League One manager. He does not have the sophistication for the Championship. His only strategy is to drag teams down to our level. It worked quite well for a bit until managers got wise to it.
So we're on a promotion push are we, a promotion rival!!...🤷♂️1 -
You are not alone!!😬😂Braziliance said:
Google is your friend. Like I said before, people take it way too seriously and start being pedantic as a result.se9addick said:
Again, you’re moving the goal posts (or misunderstanding what “must win” means). No one thinks yesterday wasn’t important or a good opportunity to pick up three points. But it, evidently, wasn’t a “must win” match. Given that your poll conflated must win with a six pointer, which aren’t the same thing, I’m not surprised that you had people agreeing with you when you interviewed them yesterday.Braziliance said:_uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Fkn hilarious.se9addick said:
I think that’s really pertinent. It seems like the need to create constant drama for “content” means all perspective is lost. Yesterday was a six pointer and we should have been targeting a win (especially at two bloody nil up) but it clearly wasn’t a “must win” game since we didn’t win it and our goal of avoiding relegation is still alive._uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Guess everyone who went Blackburn away I spoke to yesterday also must run youtube accounts as they were all in agreement how important a win was (off camera)
And all the Blackburn fans I had a chat with must have a secret tiktok setup who also said they need a win because of their poor form.
"The cost of harmony"
You do realise there are millions of football fans who lose their mind after bad results and not all of them are on camera or YouTube themselves?
I have posted in this exact same manner about Charlton on all social media platforms for almost 2 decades. Has absolutely f all to do with a youtube account.
Petty, petty jabs.I genuinely thought this was a well understood term that didn’t really need explanation.
It is what it is, I have a very different view point about Charlton to posters on Charlton Life. All it comes down to.
keep enjoying what you do, and plenty will enjoy it with you.As the numbers show👍2 -
Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.Totally agree, when I was spending £100 upwards on a day out and see a load of rubbish it was hard to swallow.1 -
Think the keeper moved just before he hit it so maybe he spotted that and didn't need to hit it cleanly. Hopefully anyway!AFKABartram said:
Agreed, the side is badly lacking goals / final third play conversion, so Kelman hitting the net is crucial.Lincsaddick said:Best result .. Kelman re-finding his goal scoring touch .. all in all though, disappointing to draw after going 2 upHowever…his penalty has given me no confidence for future penalties!1 -
My turn to resort to AI tools:Braziliance said:
Google is your friend. Like I said before, people take it way too seriously and start being pedantic as a result.se9addick said:
Again, you’re moving the goal posts (or misunderstanding what “must win” means). No one thinks yesterday wasn’t important or a good opportunity to pick up three points. But it, evidently, wasn’t a “must win” match. Given that your poll conflated must win with a six pointer, which aren’t the same thing, I’m not surprised that you had people agreeing with you when you interviewed them yesterday.Braziliance said:_uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Fkn hilarious.se9addick said:
I think that’s really pertinent. It seems like the need to create constant drama for “content” means all perspective is lost. Yesterday was a six pointer and we should have been targeting a win (especially at two bloody nil up) but it clearly wasn’t a “must win” game since we didn’t win it and our goal of avoiding relegation is still alive._uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Guess everyone who went Blackburn away I spoke to yesterday also must run youtube accounts as they were all in agreement how important a win was (off camera)
And all the Blackburn fans I had a chat with must have a secret tiktok setup who also said they need a win because of their poor form.
"The cost of harmony"
You do realise there are millions of football fans who lose their mind after bad results and not all of them are on camera or YouTube themselves?
I have posted in this exact same manner about Charlton on all social media platforms for almost 2 decades. Has absolutely f all to do with a youtube account.
Petty, petty jabs.I genuinely thought this was a well understood term that didn’t really need explanation.
It is what it is, I have a very different view point about Charlton to posters on Charlton Life. All it comes down to.Here’s the dynamic in plain English:- When you tell someone “you’re taking it too literally”, you’re claiming the phrase isn’t meant to be interpreted at face value.- But when you then whip out a Google screenshot to “prove” the correct interpretation, you’re suddenly treating the phrase as if it does have a single, authoritative, literal meaning.- Those two moves can’t coexist. One says “it’s figurative, relax”, the other says “here’s the official, literal definition you must follow”.
It’s like saying “don’t be pedantic” and then immediately producing a dictionary.1 -
Sponsored links:
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Excellent post._uptheaddicks said:AFKABartram said:
I agree, and if I was to challenge and be critical, then given we only had Edwards and Ramsay unavailable, we really should have utilised the squad more rather than going with the same 11 for both gamesthickandthin63 said:I think we should also bear in mind the logistics of the last two games.We Played the league leaders 1st Jan,one days gap then a 250 mile approx trip to the North West (your Arsenals and Chelseas of this world would probably have flown in about an hour or so )I have done this trip several times by car and it a bastard journey by road so although the team would have been driven,it is still a tiring journey which could well have contributed to the 2nd half deterioration in performance.As an NJ fan, I really cannot understand the following:
Neither Apter nor Fullah starting at LWB in any game
No attempt to switch formation based on the players available
Fullah playing zero minutes since Birmingham
Gough impressing against Norwich but not being used in the same role when an injury created the need
Bell being moved to RCB, leaving TC and Macca together on the left
Burke starting three games in seven days
Bree being allowed to hit the first man or waste set pieces consistently
Karoy impressing and bringing energy to midfield, then being left out of the squad entirely for the last two games
JRC starting three games in seven days and still being expected to maintain performance levels
He does make some odd choices and decisions doesn't he!
I do wonder how much he listens to his staff and coaches opinions?
It can't be just CL bloggers that can see all this obvious stuff?
He is I reckon very self focused and stubborn.
Must be a tough bloke to work alongside and play for?
Maybe why he always goes back to ex staff and players who he trusts can work for him.
All this said and done I am still glad he is our weirdo manager!3 -
It's a guideline, genuinely it isn't that deep. You know it wasn't a must win, I know it was, bla bla bla. Hopefully by the season end I am extremely wrong._uptheaddicks said:
My turn to resort to AI tools:Braziliance said:
Google is your friend. Like I said before, people take it way too seriously and start being pedantic as a result.se9addick said:
Again, you’re moving the goal posts (or misunderstanding what “must win” means). No one thinks yesterday wasn’t important or a good opportunity to pick up three points. But it, evidently, wasn’t a “must win” match. Given that your poll conflated must win with a six pointer, which aren’t the same thing, I’m not surprised that you had people agreeing with you when you interviewed them yesterday.Braziliance said:_uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Fkn hilarious.se9addick said:
I think that’s really pertinent. It seems like the need to create constant drama for “content” means all perspective is lost. Yesterday was a six pointer and we should have been targeting a win (especially at two bloody nil up) but it clearly wasn’t a “must win” game since we didn’t win it and our goal of avoiding relegation is still alive._uptheaddicks said:
Absolutely. It’s become a core part of today’s vlogger and YouTube culture: create a bit of extra drama, even if it comes at the cost of harmony within their own fan base.AFKABartram said:‘’Must win’ just creates unnecessary pressure and additional disappointment when it doesn’t occur.There were 66 points still on offer going into yesterday’s game. Winning / Drawing / Losing v Blackburn won’t define our season, if we end up staying up by 10 points then this game would have had no real relevance.
I’m purposely not looking at the table now until about mid-Feb when there’s 13-14 games to go. We know we need to start winning games, that’s clear to everyone, as is the likely outcome if we don’t.
In reality, if we had drawn all of our so called ‘must win’ games, we still would have come away with a 3 point gap from each team played. Wins would have been great, of course.
Guess everyone who went Blackburn away I spoke to yesterday also must run youtube accounts as they were all in agreement how important a win was (off camera)
And all the Blackburn fans I had a chat with must have a secret tiktok setup who also said they need a win because of their poor form.
"The cost of harmony"
You do realise there are millions of football fans who lose their mind after bad results and not all of them are on camera or YouTube themselves?
I have posted in this exact same manner about Charlton on all social media platforms for almost 2 decades. Has absolutely f all to do with a youtube account.
Petty, petty jabs.I genuinely thought this was a well understood term that didn’t really need explanation.
It is what it is, I have a very different view point about Charlton to posters on Charlton Life. All it comes down to.Here’s the dynamic in plain English:- When you tell someone “you’re taking it too literally”, you’re claiming the phrase isn’t meant to be interpreted at face value.- But when you then whip out a Google screenshot to “prove” the correct interpretation, you’re suddenly treating the phrase as if it does have a single, authoritative, literal meaning.- Those two moves can’t coexist. One says “it’s figurative, relax”, the other says “here’s the official, literal definition you must follow”.
It’s like saying “don’t be pedantic” and then immediately producing a dictionary.
Used CL for 2 days and got a swift reminder why I lowered my usage. I'll avoid post match views on here as it's too time consuming if you get caught up mass replying, and I just don't match the general view of this platform.
Hopefully we stay up, our current form won't let it happen unless all the teams below us remain equally as shit though, simple.
Enjoy your week mate.0 -
Me coming back to this thread a few days after first uttering the Must Win line.....
10 -
Partly my bad for ribbing you over it tooDamoNorthStand said:Me coming back to this thread a few days after first uttering the Must Win line.....0 -
Some really good posts on here this morning. Sleeping on things certainly seems to give good perspective
(Ignoring the "must-win" controversy)
COYR0 -
I think he is frustrating in that he isn't afraid to make mistakes and constantly seems to make them. However, turning that on its head, despite his mistakes he got us promoted so even though we think we are seeing them, we have to trust him. He has earned that trust.blackpool72 said:Jones is still in credit as far as I'm concerned and I'm sure he will keep us up , which after all was the target this season.
Back him in the summer and hopefully we will continue to improve.
My only gripe with Jones is his insistence of playing wingbacks when we don't have players available to suit that system.
If he is going to continue with this then we have to address the problem this transfer window.2 -
One for the coaches, quite a lot of our conceded goals seem to be from the cutback into the centre with on rushing player putting it away, are we blaming our wingbacks, midfielders not tracking the runner, centre backs not seeing the danger or all of the above?, I find it even more frustrating that we don’t score that many using this method, probably due to poor cut backs, no runners from midfield.0
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Ah, we're at the 'he sent the keeper the wrong way but didn't hit it top bins' stage of the post-match thread are we8
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NJ said Conor was at fault for the first, their man ran off his back.Sword65pf said:One for the coaches, quite a lot of our conceded goals seem to be from the cutback into the centre with on rushing player putting it away, are we blaming our wingbacks, midfielders not tracking the runner, centre backs not seeing the danger or all of the above?, I find it even more frustrating that we don’t score that many using this method, probably due to poor cut backs, no runners from midfield.
We're much too deep for the second. Our CBs and DM are practically standing on the goal line. Steve Brown brings that up all the time, not sure why it's not been fixed.1 -
It’s happened a lot, the Coventry goal was similar.Chunes said:
NJ said Conor was at fault for the first, their man ran off his back.Sword65pf said:One for the coaches, quite a lot of our conceded goals seem to be from the cutback into the centre with on rushing player putting it away, are we blaming our wingbacks, midfielders not tracking the runner, centre backs not seeing the danger or all of the above?, I find it even more frustrating that we don’t score that many using this method, probably due to poor cut backs, no runners from midfield.
We're much too deep for the second. Our CBs and DM are practically standing on the goal line. Steve Brown brings that up all the time, not sure why it's not been fixed.0 -
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Not bonkers at all, some comments just stick with you and bothered me as typical of hysterical, Arsenal fan TV football culture and often wild generalisations or statements - and that "statement" (it's not a statement, it's at best an opinion) bothered me especially cos it undermined my all-time superhero SCP!!!Braziliance said:
Yes.paulsturgess said:
Despite unacceptably and disastrously failing to win any of these must win matches, is Jones still "undoubtedly a better manager than Bowyer and Powell", by the way...?Braziliance said:
Playing the magnitude of the game down, quite sensible.aliwibble said:
But also "... a point is a point, it's on the road, it's important not to lose..."Braziliance said:
My fkn gaffer.robinofottershaw said:I really wish NJ hadn’t said this!
“We’re disappointed. This is Blackburn Rovers, they’ve been a Championship side for a long time and we’re coming here and we’re devastated with a point, so it shows we’ve come a long way.”
And so we should be devastated Jones mate, their fans didn't expect a win at all.
That's why he put his arms up at the end at us as if to say "what the f**k" he knows how honking this was.
No one knows more than Nathan Jones how important these games have been, and to get 4 out of a possible 12, when we only managed 2 points out of a possible 21 from the other 7 games either side of the relegation 6 pointers, was a bloody disaster.
Fortunately the other teams below us are so horrendous, we have got away with it, for now.
FYI I'm very much still in support of Jones and whilst disappointing and a number of managerial errors in these games, I don't think it's been disastrous or unacceptable and hoping he will see us on to better and out of this situation
Remind me how Powell did after us and Bowyer, and then look at Jones accolades.
Nathan Jones will be in the managerial game for years to come, can't say the same about Powell and Bowyer as actual head coaches/football managers.
Bonkers you are remembering a post I said months ago btw which in turn undermines our actual current manager?
Powell & Bowyer gave us good times, but I'd say move on, Jones is the man now.
You have no idea what Jones will do in future - I'm pretty sure anyone at the time would have assumed Powell would be in the managerial game for years to come when he was smashing it with us, (he actually didn't do badly in either of his following jobs, very harshly sacked by Hudds and look what happened to Southend after he left - he certainly wasn't as spectacularly bad as Jones at Stoke and Saints)
I'm not undermining Jones at all (if anything you have been by so vigorously calling out the results over the last week). I'm massively in support of him despite having been against him this time last year and despite also questioning some of his decisions now - I think he's got as a good or the best chance as anybody of keeping us up this season and I think he will do it.
I'm also not looking to argue with you! I just want to point out that hysterical assertions should sometimes be tempered when they're in the moment (i.e. a good start to the season or a poor run now), true to Curbs frequently quoted adage of not too high with the highs or low with the lows.
Jones may/ hopefully will go on to achieve more with us. But as it stands, he has this season pretty much identically mirrored our 19/20 season under Bowyer, despite being better resourced, and is falling below Powell's 12/13 season, despite being better resourced. That's not to say he's not doing well - the job is very tough! And therefore I'm not calling him out at all.
Powell, and arguably even Bowyer, achieved more/greater feats than Jones has for us, thus far. History will judge.
And in the meantime, stick at it Jonesy!! And stick at the vlogs BBB!!2 -
I was happy just to read this spat about "must win" and stay out of it, but this is a bit out of order. I don't know Callum personally but he was one of the first long distance Addicks to book his flight to London (something like 11 hours each way) for the playoffs, and as I recall, flew more or less straight back again after the game, and at a time when his employment situation was a bit rocky. I'm not even sure you are right that it's easier to watch from afar on TV. At least when you are there, you are with friends/family, its a shared experience. It was pretty shitty watching the Pompey fiasco on Charlton TV and then 2 minutes later my wife (who is very wary of my football obsession) walks in and I have to immediately try and act normally, because after all this is not her problem. That's not a "measured head" there. It's a disturbed, bottled up one😂.Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
Then of course I'm bound to point out that you are also seeking to recover some of the "bleeding money", are you not? That's OK per se by me, a lot of people like your work, but it's the nature of vlogging generally that it seeks to create immediate extreme reactions from an audience rather than a more measured viewpoint. So you are in the kitchen, creating some heat, not sure you can complain about the heat too much.7 -
There’s also plenty of more measured head fans that are at pretty much every game. I’m one of themPragueAddick said:
I was happy just to read this spat about "must win" and stay out of it, but this is a bit out of order. I don't know Callum personally but he was one of the first long distance Addicks to book his flight to London (something like 11 hours each way) for the playoffs, and as I recall, flew more or less straight back again after the game, and at a time when his employment situation was a bit rocky. I'm not even sure you are right that it's easier to watch from afar on TV. At least when you are there, you are with friends/family, its a shared experience. It was pretty shitty watching the Pompey fiasco on Charlton TV and then 2 minutes later my wife (who is very wary of my football obsession) walks in and I have to immediately try and act normally, because after all this is not her problem. That's not a "measured head" there. It's a disturbed, bottled up one😂.Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
Then of course I'm bound to point out that you are also seeking to recover some of the "bleeding money", are you not? That's OK per se by me, a lot of people like your work, but it's the nature of vlogging generally that it seeks to create immediate extreme reactions from an audience rather than a more measured viewpoint. So you are in the kitchen, creating some heat, not sure you can complain about the heat too much.
Can understand some over the top reactions after the full time whistle, I’m definitely guilty myself of them, it’s heat of the moment and have had a drink, but I’m usually then more reasonable after a few hours or the next day. But it feels like too many people act like our season is over after one defeat, or write a player off after a few bad games. I think it’s a modern football fan thing, overreaction to defeats, demanding the manager out sooner, demanding money spent on new players rather than being a bit more patient with some of our existing players. It’s not going anywhere unfortunately and every fan base is the same11 -
I remember a small player called Simonsen we picked up cheaply from Barcelona.I just wondered, based on our current logic of playing players who defend first and attack second, would he actually get a game for us under these tactics.If I was Apter who takes a beautiful corner, free kick and cross I would be wondering why am I at this club.The past 14 corners from the last 2 games has resulted in just 2 decent crosses in the box that can be attacked.We now use 2 tactics at corners....a high slow floated cross to the back post attempting to reach Jones (which fails) or a pass back to Bell to cross which is easy to defend against.We do not need Bell to cross the ball from the corner rather we need him in the box to score a goal.3
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How did we ever get Simonsen!? Far above our level then. No he wouldn't get in Jones' teams for the reason you state. Defence first.mayoboy said:I remember a small player called Simonsen we picked up cheaply from Barcelona.I just wondered, based on our current logic of playing players who defend first and attack second, would he actually get a game for us under these tactics.If I was Apter who takes a beautiful corner, free kick and cross I would be wondering why am I at this club.The past 14 corners from the last 2 games has resulted in just 2 decent crosses in the box that can be attacked.We now use 2 tactics at corners....a high slow floated cross to the back post attempting to reach Jones (which fails) or a pass back to Bell to cross which is easy to defend against.We do not need Bell to cross the ball from the corner rather we need him in the box to score a goal.
As for Apter why did Jones want him in? I do hope we can use him at some point and not at wingback either.1 -
It’s hard to say whether the distance thing has an effect on being level headed post match, or how much.NabySarr said:
There’s also plenty of more measured head fans that are at pretty much every game. I’m one of themPragueAddick said:
I was happy just to read this spat about "must win" and stay out of it, but this is a bit out of order. I don't know Callum personally but he was one of the first long distance Addicks to book his flight to London (something like 11 hours each way) for the playoffs, and as I recall, flew more or less straight back again after the game, and at a time when his employment situation was a bit rocky. I'm not even sure you are right that it's easier to watch from afar on TV. At least when you are there, you are with friends/family, its a shared experience. It was pretty shitty watching the Pompey fiasco on Charlton TV and then 2 minutes later my wife (who is very wary of my football obsession) walks in and I have to immediately try and act normally, because after all this is not her problem. That's not a "measured head" there. It's a disturbed, bottled up one😂.Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
Then of course I'm bound to point out that you are also seeking to recover some of the "bleeding money", are you not? That's OK per se by me, a lot of people like your work, but it's the nature of vlogging generally that it seeks to create immediate extreme reactions from an audience rather than a more measured viewpoint. So you are in the kitchen, creating some heat, not sure you can complain about the heat too much.
Can understand some over the top reactions after the full time whistle, I’m definitely guilty myself of them, it’s heat of the moment and have had a drink, but I’m usually then more reasonable after a few hours or the next day. But it feels like too many people act like our season is over after one defeat, or write a player off after a few bad games. I think it’s a modern football fan thing, overreaction to defeats, demanding the manager out sooner, demanding money spent on new players rather than being a bit more patient with some of our existing players. It’s not going anywhere unfortunately and every fan base is the same
My brain is constantly calculating as the game is going on “well we need this many points… we have this much probability of getting back into the game after conceding first…” etc. which I think helps me more than distance, although I will stay I can do that with a clearer head when I’m not at the ground personally, so maybe distance is a factor indirectly?
Like Prague said though, it’s not like the big moments don’t get me excited or sting like anyone else. My wife actually laughed at me at Portsmouth FT because she watched me jump around like a lunatic in the living room for a minute and then immediately fall on the floor with my head in my hands when we conceded. She told me she wanted to watch a film together immediately after that and I said I needed an hour to calm down first lol.
I feel the moments just as much as I always have done - I just have more space to breathe and think about the context of a 46 game season more clearly than if I’m surrounded by others in the Covered End trying to suck the ball into the net.6 -
Fully relate to this ha. Was away between Christmas and NY, couldn't watch but was following updates on my phone and supposed to be having a drink with family. Jumped up and did a lap of honour round the lobby celebrating, then had my head in my hands after checking my phone again. Basically couldn't speak after because I was so gutted and just went to bed!Callumcafc said:
It’s hard to say whether the distance thing has an effect on being level headed post match, or how much.NabySarr said:
There’s also plenty of more measured head fans that are at pretty much every game. I’m one of themPragueAddick said:
I was happy just to read this spat about "must win" and stay out of it, but this is a bit out of order. I don't know Callum personally but he was one of the first long distance Addicks to book his flight to London (something like 11 hours each way) for the playoffs, and as I recall, flew more or less straight back again after the game, and at a time when his employment situation was a bit rocky. I'm not even sure you are right that it's easier to watch from afar on TV. At least when you are there, you are with friends/family, its a shared experience. It was pretty shitty watching the Pompey fiasco on Charlton TV and then 2 minutes later my wife (who is very wary of my football obsession) walks in and I have to immediately try and act normally, because after all this is not her problem. That's not a "measured head" there. It's a disturbed, bottled up one😂.Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
Then of course I'm bound to point out that you are also seeking to recover some of the "bleeding money", are you not? That's OK per se by me, a lot of people like your work, but it's the nature of vlogging generally that it seeks to create immediate extreme reactions from an audience rather than a more measured viewpoint. So you are in the kitchen, creating some heat, not sure you can complain about the heat too much.
Can understand some over the top reactions after the full time whistle, I’m definitely guilty myself of them, it’s heat of the moment and have had a drink, but I’m usually then more reasonable after a few hours or the next day. But it feels like too many people act like our season is over after one defeat, or write a player off after a few bad games. I think it’s a modern football fan thing, overreaction to defeats, demanding the manager out sooner, demanding money spent on new players rather than being a bit more patient with some of our existing players. It’s not going anywhere unfortunately and every fan base is the same
My brain is constantly calculating as the game is going on “well we need this many points… we have this much probability of getting back into the game after conceding first…” etc. which I think helps me more than distance, although I will stay I can do that with a clearer head when I’m not at the ground personally, so maybe distance is a factor indirectly?
Like Prague said though, it’s not like the big moments don’t get me excited or sting like anyone else. My wife actually laughed at me at Portsmouth FT because she watched me jump around like a lunatic in the living room for a minute and then immediately fall on the floor with my head in my hands when we conceded. She told me she wanted to watch a film together immediately after that and I said I needed an hour to calm down first lol.
I feel the moments just as much as I always have done - I just have more space to breathe and think about the context of a 46 game season more clearly than if I’m surrounded by others in the Covered End trying to suck the ball into the net.4 -
I doubt distance has anything to do with it. You only have to look at social media while a game is going on to see plenty of people that obviously aren’t at the game losing their heads. Some people are just more level headed or more optimistic, some are more reactive or pessimists, and whether they are at a game or distance from the valley has little to do with itCallumcafc said:
It’s hard to say whether the distance thing has an effect on being level headed post match, or how much.NabySarr said:
There’s also plenty of more measured head fans that are at pretty much every game. I’m one of themPragueAddick said:
I was happy just to read this spat about "must win" and stay out of it, but this is a bit out of order. I don't know Callum personally but he was one of the first long distance Addicks to book his flight to London (something like 11 hours each way) for the playoffs, and as I recall, flew more or less straight back again after the game, and at a time when his employment situation was a bit rocky. I'm not even sure you are right that it's easier to watch from afar on TV. At least when you are there, you are with friends/family, its a shared experience. It was pretty shitty watching the Pompey fiasco on Charlton TV and then 2 minutes later my wife (who is very wary of my football obsession) walks in and I have to immediately try and act normally, because after all this is not her problem. That's not a "measured head" there. It's a disturbed, bottled up one😂.Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
Then of course I'm bound to point out that you are also seeking to recover some of the "bleeding money", are you not? That's OK per se by me, a lot of people like your work, but it's the nature of vlogging generally that it seeks to create immediate extreme reactions from an audience rather than a more measured viewpoint. So you are in the kitchen, creating some heat, not sure you can complain about the heat too much.
Can understand some over the top reactions after the full time whistle, I’m definitely guilty myself of them, it’s heat of the moment and have had a drink, but I’m usually then more reasonable after a few hours or the next day. But it feels like too many people act like our season is over after one defeat, or write a player off after a few bad games. I think it’s a modern football fan thing, overreaction to defeats, demanding the manager out sooner, demanding money spent on new players rather than being a bit more patient with some of our existing players. It’s not going anywhere unfortunately and every fan base is the same
My brain is constantly calculating as the game is going on “well we need this many points… we have this much probability of getting back into the game after conceding first…” etc. which I think helps me more than distance, although I will stay I can do that with a clearer head when I’m not at the ground personally, so maybe distance is a factor indirectly?
Like Prague said though, it’s not like the big moments don’t get me excited or sting like anyone else. My wife actually laughed at me at Portsmouth FT because she watched me jump around like a lunatic in the living room for a minute and then immediately fall on the floor with my head in my hands when we conceded. She told me she wanted to watch a film together immediately after that and I said I needed an hour to calm down first lol.
I feel the moments just as much as I always have done - I just have more space to breathe and think about the context of a 46 game season more clearly than if I’m surrounded by others in the Covered End trying to suck the ball into the net.3 -
I'm at the game as a season ticket holder and I'm usually so engrossed that I pop on here at half time and when I get home. Personally I am grateful for those who are tuned into the stream, as in the heat of moment not everything is clear cut. I'm not sure if you get more frustrated being there or being on-line, I think, as previously stated, you are probably better taking a deep breath before commenting, not easy when you concede in the last seconds at Pompey though.NabySarr said:
I doubt distance has anything to do with it. You only have to look at social media while a game is going on to see plenty of people that obviously aren’t at the game losing their heads. Some people are just more level headed or more optimistic, some are more reactive or pessimists, and whether they are at a game or distance from the valley has little to do with itCallumcafc said:
It’s hard to say whether the distance thing has an effect on being level headed post match, or how much.NabySarr said:
There’s also plenty of more measured head fans that are at pretty much every game. I’m one of themPragueAddick said:
I was happy just to read this spat about "must win" and stay out of it, but this is a bit out of order. I don't know Callum personally but he was one of the first long distance Addicks to book his flight to London (something like 11 hours each way) for the playoffs, and as I recall, flew more or less straight back again after the game, and at a time when his employment situation was a bit rocky. I'm not even sure you are right that it's easier to watch from afar on TV. At least when you are there, you are with friends/family, its a shared experience. It was pretty shitty watching the Pompey fiasco on Charlton TV and then 2 minutes later my wife (who is very wary of my football obsession) walks in and I have to immediately try and act normally, because after all this is not her problem. That's not a "measured head" there. It's a disturbed, bottled up one😂.Braziliance said:
It isn't equivalent, it is comparable, I am using it as an example so you can understand the importance of 6 pointers.Callumcafc said:
You’re comparing a top of the table chase to a bottom of the table dog fight. It’s not equivalent.Braziliance said:
If Man City play Arsenal 23 games in, or Real Madrid play Barca 23 games in etc, and they're both in a title race, they are must win games, as the assumption is, both teams in the title race, are too good to drop points against lesser teams.Callumcafc said:
The idea of a MUST WIN game is that you MUST WIN that game. You aren’t considering context of other games later in the season.Braziliance said:
Where do you think we will be if we go another 10 games with 1 win?Callumcafc said:
Brother, for the last time - these are not the same thing!!!Braziliance said:Charlton43 said:Think most would’ve taken a point before the game.If we can get a win against either Sheffield or Derby doesn’t look like a bad block of 4 games points wise.Love Macca for the play off final but he’s got to go now. Same as Bez and Doc, we need proper championship quality.
I genuinely reckon, I spoke to 50 Charlton fans today at the game, maybe more, not one of them said they'd be happy with a point, and most said it was a must win (35+ maybe) and the rest a not lose.
My poll on twitter with over 150 votes returned it as a 76% must win/6 pointer.
I think it's insanity to be happy with/ taken draw in the circumstances, especially with how it happened being 2 up.
Anyway, on to the next free hit/must win/ must not lose/ doesn't matter that much as we are 4-7 points safe / we are lucky to be here so enjoy the moment.
“Must win” implies some sort of dire consequence as a result of not achieving said win.What was the dire consequence of today’s result? As far as I can tell, we are further away from the drop than we were before the day started.
The dire consequence is, if we now lose the games against the bigger budgets in this season, which we did when we lost to Wrexham, Saints, Stoke, Coventry, Boro, and then still don't pick up the points against the teams around us, we are down.
Prevention is better than cure. We only don't look that bad today, because Norwich lost, Pompey & Oxford were postponed. Pompey could have been 1 behind us today.
We cannot keep relying on other teams being s**t, we need to win games of football, so how are the favourable fixtures not must wins?
You are taking it far too literal. You must realise the idea of projections, expectations etc and that I know we aren't relegated tonight?
Anyway, dreadful second half. Just Sheffield United, Derby and Millwall up next. Sure we will pick up 9 points to make up for it.
I can’t tell if this is trolling on your part, or maybe it’s just another example of how words like literally are no longer used in a literal sense.
It was literally a must win game.
You apply that exact same logic here. On paper, right now, and our form, suggests, we cannot beat the teams with bigger budgets, so we need to pick points up in these games, to avoid the drop, because chances are, there are a multiple number of games where we can probably expect 0 points.
All there is to it.
All good though, win 1 in 10 again, and say none of them are must wins again, sure the table will look dandy.At the top you have to keep winning to keep up the pace. At the bottom a point per game generally keeps you in the race, which is exactly what we’ve achieved the last few weeks.
We’ve won 1 in 10. Blackburn have won 1 in 10. Oxford have won 2 in 13.None of these teams are racing past us. No individual game is a must win when you want to avoid getting relegated. Because you only need to win about 3 in 10, against whoever you can get them, to be safe.
All you've done now is demonstrate that we are only staying afloat as other teams can't capitalise. Fingers crossed it stays that way, but it isn't realistic.
It's all good, respectfully, you're living in America and watching games on a VPN, it's easier to watch Charlton lose from afar, I know this as someone who has been a long distance addick. It's frustrating, but easier to have a measured head when you aren't bleeding as much time and money into it.
Then of course I'm bound to point out that you are also seeking to recover some of the "bleeding money", are you not? That's OK per se by me, a lot of people like your work, but it's the nature of vlogging generally that it seeks to create immediate extreme reactions from an audience rather than a more measured viewpoint. So you are in the kitchen, creating some heat, not sure you can complain about the heat too much.
Can understand some over the top reactions after the full time whistle, I’m definitely guilty myself of them, it’s heat of the moment and have had a drink, but I’m usually then more reasonable after a few hours or the next day. But it feels like too many people act like our season is over after one defeat, or write a player off after a few bad games. I think it’s a modern football fan thing, overreaction to defeats, demanding the manager out sooner, demanding money spent on new players rather than being a bit more patient with some of our existing players. It’s not going anywhere unfortunately and every fan base is the same
My brain is constantly calculating as the game is going on “well we need this many points… we have this much probability of getting back into the game after conceding first…” etc. which I think helps me more than distance, although I will stay I can do that with a clearer head when I’m not at the ground personally, so maybe distance is a factor indirectly?
Like Prague said though, it’s not like the big moments don’t get me excited or sting like anyone else. My wife actually laughed at me at Portsmouth FT because she watched me jump around like a lunatic in the living room for a minute and then immediately fall on the floor with my head in my hands when we conceded. She told me she wanted to watch a film together immediately after that and I said I needed an hour to calm down first lol.
I feel the moments just as much as I always have done - I just have more space to breathe and think about the context of a 46 game season more clearly than if I’m surrounded by others in the Covered End trying to suck the ball into the net.1 -
We’ve played 4 of our rivals in the last few weeks, 3 of those away - we won our home game, drew an away game and lost narrowly in 2 of the away games - it could have been better but could have been a lot lot worse so I don’t agree it’s been a disasterDamoNorthStand said:DOUCHER said:
did they have us down to win at Ipswich or Sheffield Utd?DamoNorthStand said:Oh god - what have i started? I think this all started when I said Pompey was must win. Wish I hadn’t said anything now!
There is definitely some over analysing of the word must.I know for a fact the management have a graph across the season as the second half unwinds and it will have targets for points per game and final total to stay up.
There is no way we had one point against the last three games. Oxford we would have been par, and now for every point dropped we are dropping further below par.
The question should really be where do people want to aim to get 4-6 points back? For me, and like @Braziliance says prevention is better than cure, i would rather not be chasing points from Millwall away, Boro away etc. But we will now likely have to do that to stay on par.
Had we have nicked an unexpected win vs Cov then this may have switched to a point.
As it is I set high targets (across my whole life - work life, home life and football life). We had to win that in order to avoid a potential problem down the line and we didn’tNo - and that’s a good point.
So we are in agreement that we will likely need to win at Southampton, Leicester or Boro now.
We might pull one out the bag.
I would rather not have to rely on it, but the last thee games have been a disaster.
The question for all of us is are we confident of going to the above and grabbing 3 points?1
