Very glad to read some of the reassuring posts on here from people who don't say much, but when they do - it's always worth listening to.
If we are in tough financial straights, so be it - we've been here before and we've come through it - we can get through it again.
I think it is time to pull together as fans and get behind the board, no-one will be more disappointed than them at what appears to have happened. The question is, what will help the situation, us throwing a hissy fit, or us pulling together and facing it in a united way? I think most of us know the answer to that. These people have given us something fantastic so far, and are obviously doing everything they can to remedy the problem we find ourselves; let's not turn on them.
These kind of situations show how important the moves to establish a CAST are, but we need to be loyal to those who have given us a fantastic 12 months as well as pragmatic in terms of the short term future of this club. Let's not fight amongst ourselves, that won't get us anywhere.
Sorry Airman I appear to have got that wrong. Thought it was earlier. I apologise for inaccuracy.
Like I said I don't mean to criticise him only to observe that perhaps some might doubt his credentials as a CEO of an upcoming FC with premiership aspirations.
As I see it the club is in the same position now as it was when the previous directors deferred to Richard Murray to enable him to find a buyer. For Richard Murray read Tony Jimenez.
He has had two of the 9.8% VI shareholdings added to his tally to get him close to 50% and to enable him to suggest to a prospective buyer that he can do a deal without having to put it to a committee.
I suspect the need to find a new owner is as critical as it was a couple of years back. The debt is almost certainly building weekly.
We are unlikely to hear much from the current board because the remaining members are relatively powerless to circumstance.
If I am reading it correctly I would opt for a radical cutback in the budget to ensure the long term future of the club. That also would probably make it more difficult to sell though.
Maybe a new owner will be found and things will turn out ok. Maybe not. And the bigger the debt come the day the greater the consequences.
Airman all of your posts are very negative, let go of the blanket.
I think if you read them my posts on this thread have been defending either the owners or Steve Kavanagh, so hardly negative.
I was involved at Charlton long before Steve and I expect to be around long after he has gone, thanks, in whatever capacity, but I do find criticism of Steve from people who have no idea what they are talking about unfair and worthy of rebuttal.
Maybe the new regime let things out in a manor which would show where info was coming from and SK may have got caught in that trap and it was deemed In the best interests
I don't knowif this is true just my thoughts on the matter
Going to watch the Olympics and work hard for the next few weeks so I ain't going to have time to worry or stress over Charlton
Poxy pre season can't wait no for the real stuff to begin so we can just concentrate on the results and football
Ken I don't know the precise reason why this backer pulled out.
What I do know is that if we had a Supporters Trust like Swansea's we would know, and it probably wouldnt be such a crisis anyway
Why would a Supporters Trust make any difference? The crisis (as is) only exists in the minds of those who think it is a crisis, if you trust the new board (which I do) then you trust them to make the right decisions for the long term future of the club. There may be a few wobbles on the way, but they deserve the chance to sort them out, without having to explain what they're doing every 5 minutes. Remember it was Peter Varney who brought our new owners in. Nothing has changed today, we have tight finances, so won't be splashing the cash, but aren't about to collapse either.
A Trust, unless it owned a major stake in the club wouldn't be party to such decisions and negotiations, and why should it? Negotiations to bring in a new investor would hardly be helped by having a load of supporters reviewing the transaction, and probably arguing amongst themselves (as on this board). Are the club going to give 20% of the club say to a body representing 100 hard core supporters anyway without hard cash?
Just because you believe the current owners are good for the club, can you say with certainty that the next ones will be, or the ones after that? I don't think we can, but I think we can say with certainty that a supporters trust will always put the club first and have its best interests at heart. Of course having the club's best interests at heart doesn't mean you will automatically make good decisions (reference some of the disastrous decisions good club men like Richard Murray made over the last 5+ years) but having a proper and organised supporters group with boardroom representation is, imho, the best way for us as fans to safeguard the club's future and minimise the chances of someone taking advantage of it.
Whether the will would exist among enough fans to set up a trust during this time of relative prosperity I don't know, but I think Prague is right to be championing it as a concept because having one now might make it possible to help prevent the shit ever hitting the fan, rather than setting up a trust when it's time to wipe down all the walls and redecorate.
A director who disagrees with the way that a company is being run ought to resign if he thinks that the company is (a) about to enter a form of insolvency as it has no realistic hope of trading through financial difficulties (b) he himself has been advised that were the company to fail there is a realistic prospect that creditors might pursue him for some or all of the company's debts due perhaps to wrongful or fraudulent trading or some form of director's misfeasance (c) he himself has been advised that the secretary of state for trade might on the recommendation of an insolvency specialist charged with winding up the insolvent estate of the company pursue him for an order under the DIrectors Disqualification Act precluding him from acting as a company director eg for taking unwarranted risks with creditors' monies.not sure if any of this has any relevance whatsoever to the factual matrix of events but these are legal facts.i acted in such a case for former directors of a very local and rival football club that went tits up while owned by a guy now linked with Bromley FC.the trial lasted for three weeks in the high court and was not at all a pleasant experience for any involved including in particular the former owner of the club that I refer to especially as I wore in court my charlton tie every day that I sat next to him throughout the proceedings!one important consideration in all of what is happening at charlton is that it doesn't appear to be the case that anyone recently resigning is forthwith walking from the club and I take some albeit small degree of comfort from that .there is presently no actual evidence of anything untoward save for inference and speculation .until such time as any such evidence were to emerge (if ever) I take a contrary view to Prague Addick and with respect to the "Deferential Reaction ".
Briefly for now. I believe it has already been well established by various people (before it was confirmed to me) that Steve Kavanagh is now working out his resignation period at home and not working. (not exactly 'gardening leave' as it's usually meant, but that's a detail), so I think it is the case that he is "forthwith walking from the club". Now, I'm hearing two opposing views about exactly how alarming that might be, and for the moment, I'm watching and listening, and hoping to get a key third view. I will leave that with you to consider - although its not new information.
I'll ask Razil if we should set up a separate thread to discuss the pros and cons of a Trust and what impact it might have on the club and our relationship with it.
What I mean by deferential behaviour by the British generally, but applicable to the various reactions to our club's plight is encapsulated this article far better than i could summarise. I'll be interested to read your reaction to it, should you have the time and taste.
Times are hard. It would appear that we are cutting our cloth accordingly, which all of us believe is the correct way to progress. Very soon all League Clubs will have financial constraints put on their expenditure in line with their income. It seems sensible to do that now rather than suffer what could be a serious cull of staff in a couple of seasons.
I'm all for organic growth - and I believe we have the potential for substantial growth in the medium term.
Be concerned by all means - but I do believe we need to at least give the current Board an opportunity to be allowed to do what they believe is right. After all, it is their money.
Things could be a lot worse - just look at the fire sale of key players by our stripey neighbours down the road.
looks like we're following the recent newcastle model on a smaller scale
they've been buying younger players with sell on potential and jog em on as and when to balance the books , at least that is what they are trying to do
and be run more prudently than they have been in the past
I was very sad to read that Steve Kavanagh is now on "gardening leave" and so effectively no longer at the Club.
I have been lucky enough to interact with him over the past few years and he has always been a pleasure to deal with, even when he was telling me things I didn't want to hear such as back in May when he couldn't let Bromley Addicks have the League One trophy at our meeting. He didn't have to explain why not or the reasons behind that decision but he did. That was typical of him.
I know some people who worked with him as employees may have a different view and I respect that but I can only comment on how he was with me.
He was a good friend to Bromley Addicks and was a regular reader of Charlton Life. He even had one of the very rare Charlton Life badges on display in his office at the Valley.
Despite having a young family he was always available for evening meetings such as fans Q & As, the Fans Forum or Target 40,000 , all of which he actively promoted.
He has a dry but very sharp sense of humour which he will have needed during the past ten years of working for Charlton.
Personally I will miss him being at the Club although he was useless as a source of gossip or rumours. He was always professional and tight lipped as he should be, only once giving me a decent tip off and that was only to say that Frank Nouble had signed 15 minutes before it was on the OS.
Professionally I think CAFC has lost a valuable and committed member of staff. His replacement will have a hard act to follow.
Good luck for the future Kav and if the Club can't bring themselves to say thanks to him on the OS then the least I can do is say it here.
My 'source' is back in the country today - will find out later what all the kerfuffle is about - still expecting it to be just about clearing the way for our major backer and puppet master to become even more prominent - almost emerging from nowhere to heroically help us out of this seeming financial meltdown!
Where has the gardening leave thing come from? I thought he just resigned from the Board and was carrying on in his role? Maybe I've missed something though.
My 'source' is back in the country today - will find out later what all the kerfuffle is about - still expecting it to be just about clearing the way for our major backer and puppet master to become even more prominent - almost emerging from nowhere to heroically help us out of this seeming financial meltdown!
when you say source is that to supply some mind altering substance?
Where has the gardening leave thing come from? I thought he just resigned from the Board and was carrying on in his role? Maybe I've missed something though.
first I heard of it was Prague Addick confirming it in his post, previous page I think.
@HenryIrving Where has the gardening leave thing come from? I thought he just resigned from the Board and was carrying on in his role? Maybe I've missed something though.
Comments
If we are in tough financial straights, so be it - we've been here before and we've come through it - we can get through it again.
I think it is time to pull together as fans and get behind the board, no-one will be more disappointed than them at what appears to have happened. The question is, what will help the situation, us throwing a hissy fit, or us pulling together and facing it in a united way? I think most of us know the answer to that. These people have given us something fantastic so far, and are obviously doing everything they can to remedy the problem we find ourselves; let's not turn on them.
These kind of situations show how important the moves to establish a CAST are, but we need to be loyal to those who have given us a fantastic 12 months as well as pragmatic in terms of the short term future of this club. Let's not fight amongst ourselves, that won't get us anywhere.
COYR
Like I said I don't mean to criticise him only to observe that perhaps some might doubt his credentials as a CEO of an upcoming FC with premiership aspirations.
We have current players signing new deals
We have been to Spain
We have won every PSF
We have constructed a new development set up
We have lost 2 directors
We have not lost a player
Can everyone just get a grip - you can't influence any of this shit anyway, just have a beer, smile at the crumpet and get on with life.
He has had two of the 9.8% VI shareholdings added to his tally to get him close to 50% and to enable him to suggest to a prospective buyer that he can do a deal without having to put it to a committee.
I suspect the need to find a new owner is as critical as it was a couple of years back. The debt is almost certainly building weekly.
We are unlikely to hear much from the current board because the remaining members are relatively powerless to circumstance.
If I am reading it correctly I would opt for a radical cutback in the budget to ensure the long term future of the club. That also would probably make it more difficult to sell though.
Maybe a new owner will be found and things will turn out ok. Maybe not. And the bigger the debt come the day the greater the consequences.
I was involved at Charlton long before Steve and I expect to be around long after he has gone, thanks, in whatever capacity, but I do find criticism of Steve from people who have no idea what they are talking about unfair and worthy of rebuttal.
I don't knowif this is true just my thoughts on the matter
Going to watch the Olympics and work hard for the next few weeks so I ain't going to have time to worry or stress over Charlton
Poxy pre season can't wait no for the real stuff to begin so we can just concentrate on the results and football
A Trust, unless it owned a major stake in the club wouldn't be party to such decisions and negotiations, and why should it? Negotiations to bring in a new investor would hardly be helped by having a load of supporters reviewing the transaction, and probably arguing amongst themselves (as on this board). Are the club going to give 20% of the club say to a body representing 100 hard core supporters anyway without hard cash?
Whether the will would exist among enough fans to set up a trust during this time of relative prosperity I don't know, but I think Prague is right to be championing it as a concept because having one now might make it possible to help prevent the shit ever hitting the fan, rather than setting up a trust when it's time to wipe down all the walls and redecorate.
Briefly for now. I believe it has already been well established by various people (before it was confirmed to me) that Steve Kavanagh is now working out his resignation period at home and not working. (not exactly 'gardening leave' as it's usually meant, but that's a detail), so I think it is the case that he is "forthwith walking from the club".
Now, I'm hearing two opposing views about exactly how alarming that might be, and for the moment, I'm watching and listening, and hoping to get a key third view. I will leave that with you to consider - although its not new information.
I'll ask Razil if we should set up a separate thread to discuss the pros and cons of a Trust and what impact it might have on the club and our relationship with it.
What I mean by deferential behaviour by the British generally, but applicable to the various reactions to our club's plight is encapsulated this article far better than i could summarise. I'll be interested to read your reaction to it, should you have the time and taste.
Prague, maybe your post later yesterday is not as positive as it reads?
I'm all for organic growth - and I believe we have the potential for substantial growth in the medium term.
Be concerned by all means - but I do believe we need to at least give the current Board an opportunity to be allowed to do what they believe is right. After all, it is their money.
Things could be a lot worse - just look at the fire sale of key players by our stripey neighbours down the road.
they've been buying younger players with sell on potential and jog em on as and when to balance the books , at least that is what they are trying to do
and be run more prudently than they have been in the past
I have been lucky enough to interact with him over the past few years and he has always been a pleasure to deal with, even when he was telling me things I didn't want to hear such as back in May when he couldn't let Bromley Addicks have the League One trophy at our meeting. He didn't have to explain why not or the reasons behind that decision but he did. That was typical of him.
I know some people who worked with him as employees may have a different view and I respect that but I can only comment on how he was with me.
He was a good friend to Bromley Addicks and was a regular reader of Charlton Life. He even had one of the very rare Charlton Life badges on display in his office at the Valley.
Despite having a young family he was always available for evening meetings such as fans Q & As, the Fans Forum or Target 40,000 , all of which he actively promoted.
He has a dry but very sharp sense of humour which he will have needed during the past ten years of working for Charlton.
Personally I will miss him being at the Club although he was useless as a source of gossip or rumours. He was always professional and tight lipped as he should be, only once giving me a decent tip off and that was only to say that Frank Nouble had signed 15 minutes before it was on the OS.
Professionally I think CAFC has lost a valuable and committed member of staff. His replacement will have a hard act to follow.
Good luck for the future Kav and if the Club can't bring themselves to say thanks to him on the OS then the least I can do is say it here.
Where has the gardening leave thing come from? I thought he just resigned from the Board and was carrying on in his role? Maybe I've missed something though.