It depends on what is meant by "ambition". If Jiminez was an extremely rich investor in his own right, and was able to fund a large transfer and salary budget for this season, then that would be a legitimate ambition which we could all get excited about.
Patently, that is not the case. Were he that rich, he would for a start still be at Newcastle, probably having ousted Ashley. He has never been that rich and it is fair to say that his business outlook isnt as good as it was. That is simply a general observation based on the known fact that his business is built on property development and dealing, and focused on Spain. Nobody with that business profile is doing well compared with four years ago.
Despite the remarkable effort of Norwich and Southampton, it is a damn tall order to get straight through this division. One reason is the -disgraceful, I use that word again - distribution of TV money where those relegated form the Prem have an even bigger amount to spend compared with the rest . If 'ambition' means expecting to get promoted, without having anything like the financial firepower of Blackburn, then that places an impossible burden of expectation on the manager. And that should be a matter of great concern to all of us.
Reading these posts gives me food for thought. The ONLY threat to Chris Powells job must surely be abject relegation, not failing to get promoted. Even if we're relegated I would still think long and hard, very long and very hard, before Chris Powell is removed from his post. If there is anybody with any power and authority within the club who thinks removing Chris under any circumstances other than relegation with, I dunno, 30 points, then they will have no credibility at all with me. I also think the wider football world would be astonished if a bloke that delivers 101 points in our best season for ages were to get sacked.
Know where you're coming from , Seth, but when has an owner worried what the fans think when it comes to dismissing a manager ? Countless instances of the "gaffer" being given his P45 after a relative handful of matches in charge, to the consternation & puzzlement of that "football world " you mention.Some owners, allegedly " know best " .....
99.99% of the Charlton faithful would be apoplectic if SCP was to be moved on after the success of last season, especially if results appeared to be suffering from lack of investment for additional squad players. I'm not suggesting that the players we have onboard at this moment in time are incapable of achieving success in the forthcoming season but there are never any guarantees of course and who knows how soon an owner's finger might be twitching over that " red card"....Especially if he is hell bent on immediate promotion.
A nightmare scenario for us all, but we know SO little of our "owner(s) " plans or intentions.
Another post based on the invention of someones mind. Show me one piece of evidence that all is not right at our club - evidence not hearsay, not conjecture, not coincidence but hard solid evidence.
I don't know what TJs views are on Powell but if he wanted to get rid and replace him with Zola he had the perfect opportunity at the end of Powell's first season.
Another post based on the invention of someones mind. Show me one piece of evidence that all is not right at our club - evidence not hearsay, not conjecture, not coincidence but hard solid evidence.
Errrm. Well the loss of Peter Varney and Steve Kavanagh (already discussed to death) might just constitute a little bit of hard solid evidence.
Am I the only fan who doesn't want promotion next year? I'd like to see ST base up to 23k+ first so we don't have hordes of non-CAFC fans turning up to see other sides. I'd like to see kids integarated to assess if they are the next Solly. I'd like to see CP do a full aprenticeship as manager to refine his tactics. I'd like our finances sorted first.
Am I the only fan who doesn't want promotion next year? I'd like to see ST base up to 23k+ first so we don't have hordes of non-CAFC fans turning up to see other sides. I'd like to see kids integarated to assess if they are the next Solly. I'd like to see CP do a full aprenticeship as manager to refine his tactics. I'd like our finances sorted first.
Harvey Weed Puller, wouldn't worry about it too much. Won't get promoted with what we currently have. Need some investment. However shouldn't go down either. Your're on the right track regarding youth policy and think that Paul Hart could be the most shrewd appointment we've made in recent times.
Another post based on the invention of someones mind. Show me one piece of evidence that all is not right at our club - evidence not hearsay, not conjecture, not coincidence but hard solid evidence.
Since you live even further from the Valley than I do, may I enquire as to how you can be so sure about the situation, that you can gratuitously insult your fellow Charlton fans who suggest otherwise? Whom exactly do you accuse of "inventions"? What motivations might they have for this? And why didn't the same people behave this way during the previous close season?
Reading these posts gives me food for thought. The ONLY threat to Chris Powells job must surely be abject relegation, not failing to get promoted. Even if we're relegated I would still think long and hard, very long and very hard, before Chris Powell is removed from his post. If there is anybody with any power and authority within the club who thinks removing Chris under any circumstances other than relegation with, I dunno, 30 points, then they will have no credibility at all with me. I also think the wider football world would be astonished if a bloke that delivers 101 points in our best season for ages were to get sacked.
Know where you're coming from , Seth, but when has an owner worried what the fans think when it comes to dismissing a manager ? Countless instances of the "gaffer" being given his P45 after a relative handful of matches in charge, to the consternation & puzzlement of that "football world " you mention.Some owners, allegedly " know best " .....
99.99% of the Charlton faithful would be apoplectic if SCP was to be moved on after the success of last season, especially if results appeared to be suffering from lack of investment for additional squad players. I'm not suggesting that the players we have onboard at this moment in time are incapable of achieving success in the forthcoming season but there are never any guarantees of course and who knows how soon an owner's finger might be twitching over that " red card"....Especially if he is hell bent on immediate promotion.
A nightmare scenario for us all, but we know SO little of our "owner(s) " plans or intentions.
Hold on it was our new owners that appointed SCP! It was the old lot who appointed Dowie, Les Reed, Pardew and Parky etc
Suddenly after appointing a brilliant manager, building an excellent squad, getting a wonderful promotion and then spending lots of money to reinforce the academy, we're worried about their intentions, that he's looking for an excuse to sack SCP? Dear oh dear...
You might as well say "it would be terrible if he agreed a ground share with Millwall, changed our name to Greenwich Allstars and our strip to red and blue stripes, but we know little about our owners"
It's funny really - this debate now seems to have morphed into one revolving around how quickly our ambitious board member wants to get into the prem and what he may or may not do to achieve that- the Gliksten's were in charge for years and if they'd have shown an ounce of that ambition in their last 30, we may not have ended up in the mess we were in by the mid 80's. Relax everyone. We are on the up. Nothing wrong with forming a well intentioned trust mind you but i do think that people should be excited about where we are headed rather than imagining the worst.
I think the fears of most are whether we're gonna be gifted money from mysterons(imo they're looking for a free bet) to get there or mortgaged up/rack some unfriendly debts up as we carry on and that is where the scary doomsday scenario may eventually occur ala pompey, rangers .... With murray and co we were pretty sure they were prepared to burn their money with friendly debt chasing their tail with crap appointment/decision after Lord Curbs was allowed to leave the building..... Which they did until they ran out of money to donate to the Charlton charitable cause Guessing here but to be able to punt this sort of thing you need to be prepared to lose £10/20m and if you're prepared to lose that you gotta be worth £30/40m unless you're crazy and wanna wipe yourself out(goldberg/simon jordan) , I don't think TJ has that kind of dough and would be prepared to put it on the line , hopefully he can find a sicko that is !
pompey is a problem case though - a decrepid ground that needs sorting out or a new one - thats where we were 30 years ago - we don't have that huge hurdle for potential investors to get over and our crowd base is proven now - this is why i don't worry - there will always be somebody willing to step in now is my view. That may be madness given Rangers situationa s well but i'm happy with that madness. Even if we ended up being relegated out of the league, we will still exist and always bounce back - i'll go for the high risk strategy - it's not my money and it's far more entertaining to watch.
It's funny really - this debate now seems to have morphed into one revolving around how quickly our ambitious board member wants to get into the prem and what he may or may not do to achieve that- the Gliksten's were in charge for years and if they'd have shown an ounce of that ambition in their last 30, we may not have ended up in the mess we were in by the mid 80's. Relax everyone. We are on the up. Nothing wrong with forming a well intentioned trust mind you but i do think that people should be excited about where we are headed rather than imagining the worst.
Interesting comment, because you and I seem to have access to similar sources, yet I am not as confident as you about the way ahead. I'd like to see clearer signs that the budget adds up for the coming season, what that implies for the squad, and what expectations the Board have based on that squad. Right now it seems transfer activity has frozen up completely. (which isn't all bad, Chris Solly is still a Charlton player).
Hold on it was our new owners that appointed SCP! It was the old lot who appointed Dowie, Les Reed, Pardew and Parky etc
Suddenly after appointing a brilliant manager, building an excellent squad, getting a wonderful promotion and then spending lots of money to reinforce the academy, we're worried about their intentions, that he's looking for an excuse to sack SCP? Dear oh dear...
You might as well say "it would be terrible if he agreed a ground share with Millwall, changed our name to Greenwich Allstars and our strip to red and blue stripes, but we know little about our owners"
Again, while you point out some relevant facts, you cannot resist digging out another poster, can you?
Perhaps Fanny should have pointed out that a key player in the boardroom team that did all these good things was Peter Varney, and his stabilising influence is no longer there.
Prague I just find the constant negativity frustrating, when the current owners don't deserve it, as there do seem to be people here who have decided they are shifty/suspicious and are looking for reasons to criticise them, when they've been highly successful and mainly made very good decisions.
I would also point out that Peter Varney was one of the key parties who brought in the new owners, he knows all about them and if they were untrustworthy, surely wouldn't have worked with their bid?
I don't have a business brain at all but can anyone tell me why Michael Slater is still with us ? It was assumed rightly or wrongly that MS was in place as a front for Kevin Cash who as I understand it has now walked. Is MS only hanging around until a buyer for KC's share of the club can be found and it is that sale / purchase which is rumoured by some to be the one TJ is seeking now. Can we expect MS to be replaced as Chairman in the near future and in fact do we think TJ is looking to out or just new investment to replace Cash's money. Is TJ a front for another party or has he invested his own money but in the hope of piggy backing off the other big investor ? I'm sure some of you will think the answers to the above questions are widely known but I have read so much over the last weeks I would be grateful for some clarity.
Nobody can say for certain that Cash is involved. The very fact that Slater is here suggests he is. Nobody can say for certain that Cash has jogged. But if he has I would say that Slats won't be far behind.
As he is the main voice piece of the board these days then maybe he's hanging around to hand the reins over to somebody else's voice piece. It would really put the wind up on here if he just disappeared without a word.
SHG, sorry but I can't offer clarity but you do ask some very pertinant questions.
My take based only on the info given on CL is that MS is KCs beard.
MS will stay on the board until all of KCs investement over the past 18 months is re-couped.
TJ will either find a new investment partner to replace KC, sell up completely or carry on without other money. The last would mean balancing the books.
Which will it be? No idea but I'd guess 1 is more likely now and TJs choice but the longer the situation continues 2 becomes more possible.
I think the fears of most are whether we're gonna be gifted money from mysterons(imo they're looking for a free bet) to get there or mortgaged up/rack some unfriendly debts up as we carry on and that is where the scary doomsday scenario may eventually occur ala pompey, rangers .... With murray and co we were pretty sure they were prepared to burn their money with friendly debt chasing their tail with crap appointment/decision after Lord Curbs was allowed to leave the building..... Which they did until they ran out of money to donate to the Charlton charitable cause Guessing here but to be able to punt this sort of thing you need to be prepared to lose £10/20m and if you're prepared to lose that you gotta be worth £30/40m unless you're crazy and wanna wipe yourself out(goldberg/simon jordan) , I don't think TJ has that kind of dough and would be prepared to put it on the line , hopefully he can find a sicko that is !
Noone knows whether the mystery minority shareholders still give Slaters backer, whoever he is, a contolling interest over Jiminez and his backers! Hence Slater still being in situ.
Another post based on the invention of someones mind. Show me one piece of evidence that all is not right at our club - evidence not hearsay, not conjecture, not coincidence but hard solid evidence.
Errrm. Well the loss of Peter Varney and Steve Kavanagh (already discussed to death) might just constitute a little bit of hard solid evidence.
Hard solid evidence that is in no way linked to the stupid speculation about Powell's job prospects based on next season's performance,. Ridiculous.
Comments
It depends on what is meant by "ambition". If Jiminez was an extremely rich investor in his own right, and was able to fund a large transfer and salary budget for this season, then that would be a legitimate ambition which we could all get excited about.
Patently, that is not the case. Were he that rich, he would for a start still be at Newcastle, probably having ousted Ashley. He has never been that rich and it is fair to say that his business outlook isnt as good as it was. That is simply a general observation based on the known fact that his business is built on property development and dealing, and focused on Spain. Nobody with that business profile is doing well compared with four years ago.
Despite the remarkable effort of Norwich and Southampton, it is a damn tall order to get straight through this division. One reason is the -disgraceful, I use that word again - distribution of TV money where those relegated form the Prem have an even bigger amount to spend compared with the rest . If 'ambition' means expecting to get promoted, without having anything like the financial firepower of Blackburn, then that places an impossible burden of expectation on the manager. And that should be a matter of great concern to all of us.
I also think the wider football world would be astonished if a bloke that delivers 101 points in our best season for ages were to get sacked.
99.99% of the Charlton faithful would be apoplectic if SCP was to be moved on after the success of last season, especially if results appeared to be suffering from lack of investment for additional squad players. I'm not suggesting that the players we have onboard at this moment in time are incapable of achieving success in the forthcoming season but there are never any guarantees of course and who knows how soon an owner's finger might be twitching over that " red card"....Especially if he is hell bent on immediate promotion.
A nightmare scenario for us all, but we know SO little of our "owner(s) " plans or intentions.
TJ didn't sack him then so why sack him now?
Well the loss of Peter Varney and Steve Kavanagh (already discussed to death) might just constitute a little bit of hard solid evidence.
99.99% of the Charlton faithful would be apoplectic if SCP was to be moved on after the success of last season, especially if results appeared to be suffering from lack of investment for additional squad players. I'm not suggesting that the players we have onboard at this moment in time are incapable of achieving success in the forthcoming season but there are never any guarantees of course and who knows how soon an owner's finger might be twitching over that " red card"....Especially if he is hell bent on immediate promotion.
A nightmare scenario for us all, but we know SO little of our "owner(s) " plans or intentions.
Hold on it was our new owners that appointed SCP! It was the old lot who appointed Dowie, Les Reed, Pardew and Parky etc
Suddenly after appointing a brilliant manager, building an excellent squad, getting a wonderful promotion and then spending lots of money to reinforce the academy, we're worried about their intentions, that he's looking for an excuse to sack SCP? Dear oh dear...
You might as well say "it would be terrible if he agreed a ground share with Millwall, changed our name to Greenwich Allstars and our strip to red and blue stripes, but we know little about our owners"
With murray and co we were pretty sure they were prepared to burn their money with friendly debt chasing their tail with crap appointment/decision after Lord Curbs was allowed to leave the building..... Which they did until they ran out of money to donate to the Charlton charitable cause
Guessing here but to be able to punt this sort of thing you need to be prepared to lose £10/20m and if you're prepared to lose that you gotta be worth £30/40m unless you're crazy and wanna wipe yourself out(goldberg/simon jordan) , I don't think TJ has that kind of dough and would be prepared to put it on the line , hopefully he can find a sicko that is !
Hold on it was our new owners that appointed SCP! It was the old lot who appointed Dowie, Les Reed, Pardew and Parky etc
Suddenly after appointing a brilliant manager, building an excellent squad, getting a wonderful promotion and then spending lots of money to reinforce the academy, we're worried about their intentions, that he's looking for an excuse to sack SCP? Dear oh dear...
You might as well say "it would be terrible if he agreed a ground share with Millwall, changed our name to Greenwich Allstars and our strip to red and blue stripes, but we know little about our owners"
Again, while you point out some relevant facts, you cannot resist digging out another poster, can you?
Perhaps Fanny should have pointed out that a key player in the boardroom team that did all these good things was Peter Varney, and his stabilising influence is no longer there.
I just find the constant negativity frustrating, when the current owners don't deserve it, as there do seem to be people here who have decided they are shifty/suspicious and are looking for reasons to criticise them, when they've been highly successful and mainly made very good decisions.
I would also point out that Peter Varney was one of the key parties who brought in the new owners, he knows all about them and if they were untrustworthy, surely wouldn't have worked with their bid?
As he is the main voice piece of the board these days then maybe he's hanging around to hand the reins over to somebody else's voice piece. It would really put the wind up on here if he just disappeared without a word.
My take based only on the info given on CL is that MS is KCs beard.
MS will stay on the board until all of KCs investement over the past 18 months is re-couped.
TJ will either find a new investment partner to replace KC, sell up completely or carry on without other money. The last would mean balancing the books.
Which will it be? No idea but I'd guess 1 is more likely now and TJs choice but the longer the situation continues 2 becomes more possible.