....then there would have been fewer players challenging for the ball at previous set-pieces, and far more opportunities for the attackers to win the ball.
I don't even get outraged by it anymore. Think our last good performance was the 5-1 win in Croatia. Point away to Poland isn't that bad when we aren't that good.
Dreadful. International football at that level really is lower Premier League standard. Wish it had been played last night at 2 am and not a watchable 10pm. Nearly asleep during the game so bed now.
Carrick is overrated, gives the ball away a lot for someone who's supposed to be renowned for their passing abilities.
Main problem for me was a lack of pace in midfield, should have started with Oxlade-Chamberlain.
I think that was SG, over-rated, useless scouser. Dwelt on it, didn't carry it to change angles for passing. Gave it away or passed square to player already marked. World class? Living on reputation from 5+ years ago. Step up Mr Shelvey. We couldn't deal with their 4-3-3 and sat deeper than CAFC.
Shelvey, ( and this isn't a biased opinion as I never saw him play for Charlton) should start. Our midfield was woeful tonight. Carrick gave SO many balls away, and without any pressure from poland. Cleverley didn't do much better. I had the 'privilege' of watching England last Friday at Wembley, and Shelvey and the Ox,(Chamberlain) gave us outlets for positive quick passing football. We need to be more adventurous with our football.
I think the over the top criticism is a tad harsh. This is a team in transition, to just completely overhaul the team and replace them with inexperienced youngsters will never happen and probably isn't a wise move anyway.
Didn't play well but its still a point away at one of the stronger teams in the group and I'm sure I read had they won that would have been the best start to an England management career since Winterbottom.
I'm not going to defend the whole England set up though. I've said many times we simply do not have the depth of talent pool to choose from that other top nations do. That is the first and imo biggest problem that faces England. First, it's a numbers game, population wise we are tiny, we also don't have enough people playing the game, we don't have enough coaches and more important than that we don't have enough coaches teaching the right things.
Part of me also thinks it's a mental standpoint as being Brits. We want everything. We want the best league in the world. You can argue either way but the undoubted thing is the Premier league is one of the best. The reason it got to be this good is the number of foreign players we can attract due to the financial incentives on offer, therefore forcing English players out of the way. Investment at every level is not as much as it should be. Not only do we want that but we also want the England side to win. More often than not they do but then we moan that they aren't playing well.
Unfortunately, in the medium term at least, I can't see any of those things changing. Lets face it nothing has for nearly 50 years.
England's players are to part-fund a £50,000 money-back scheme for fans affected by Tuesday's postponed qualifier in Warsaw.
The match against Poland was cancelled because of a waterlogged pitch, but rescheduled for 16:00 BST on Wednesday.
Some 2,500 England fans travelled to Warsaw for Tuesday's original game.
"The team appreciate the support we receive away from home," captain Steven Gerrard said. "We know fans have spent money and taken time off work."
Meanwhile, the Football Association said its Polish counterpart would set up a ticket refund process for those unable to attend Wednesday's rearranged fixture in Warsaw.
"To claim a refund, members will be asked to send their ticket to The FA at Wembley," said a statement on the FA website. "We will then collate all the tickets and pass them back to the Polish FA.
England's players are to part-fund a £50,000 money-back scheme for fans affected by Tuesday's postponed qualifier in Warsaw.
The match against Poland was cancelled because of a waterlogged pitch, but rescheduled for 16:00 BST on Wednesday.
Some 2,500 England fans travelled to Warsaw for Tuesday's original game.
"The team appreciate the support we receive away from home," captain Steven Gerrard said. "We know fans have spent money and taken time off work."
Meanwhile, the Football Association said its Polish counterpart would set up a ticket refund process for those unable to attend Wednesday's rearranged fixture in Warsaw.
"To claim a refund, members will be asked to send their ticket to The FA at Wembley," said a statement on the FA website. "We will then collate all the tickets and pass them back to the Polish FA.
Wonder how many England armchair fans/moaners and media outlets will turn a blind eye to this great gesture?
If Charlton got a 1-1 draw in the manner in the way that England did today, there's no way there would be such over the top comments as there are today.
606 is actually infuriating to listen to after England matches, no idea why I bother listening to it.
That was a very poor performance by England, lucky to get a draw. To put it in a Charlton context and we played that badly at this level, which we have done then we all would be worrried about are ability to stay in this division, as we are. Many of us have expressed doubts about are squads quality, well the same can be applied to England. The Poles looked the better footballers in that match, and that should be a concern.
England's players are to part-fund a £50,000 money-back scheme for fans affected by Tuesday's postponed qualifier in Warsaw.
The match against Poland was cancelled because of a waterlogged pitch, but rescheduled for 16:00 BST on Wednesday.
Some 2,500 England fans travelled to Warsaw for Tuesday's original game.
"The team appreciate the support we receive away from home," captain Steven Gerrard said. "We know fans have spent money and taken time off work."
Meanwhile, the Football Association said its Polish counterpart would set up a ticket refund process for those unable to attend Wednesday's rearranged fixture in Warsaw.
"To claim a refund, members will be asked to send their ticket to The FA at Wembley," said a statement on the FA website. "We will then collate all the tickets and pass them back to the Polish FA.
This is impressive, good to see the players chipping in.
If only the Polish FA could have spent a few pounds (lets say £10) on training someone to press the 'Close Roof' button
England's players are to part-fund a £50,000 money-back scheme for fans affected by Tuesday's postponed qualifier in Warsaw.
The match against Poland was cancelled because of a waterlogged pitch, but rescheduled for 16:00 BST on Wednesday.
Some 2,500 England fans travelled to Warsaw for Tuesday's original game.
"The team appreciate the support we receive away from home," captain Steven Gerrard said. "We know fans have spent money and taken time off work."
Meanwhile, the Football Association said its Polish counterpart would set up a ticket refund process for those unable to attend Wednesday's rearranged fixture in Warsaw.
"To claim a refund, members will be asked to send their ticket to The FA at Wembley," said a statement on the FA website. "We will then collate all the tickets and pass them back to the Polish FA.
Wonder how many England armchair fans/moaners and media outlets will turn a blind eye to this great gesture?
If Charlton got a 1-1 draw in the manner in the way that England did today, there's no way there would be such over the top comments as there are today.
606 is actually infuriating to listen to after England matches, no idea why I bother listening to it.
erm yes there would. If we got a draw away at a poorer team and gave away possesion that cheaply, then people wouldnt be happy.
im usually on your side of the fence when it comes to england and think people go way over the top, but last night was a slightly worrying performance i think as it was no improvement at all on the Ukraine game, perhaps even worse.
four main concerns....we have no natural big forward that allows rooney to drop deep. defoe cannot play up on his own. then theres the fact we have no natural left midfielder. poor old ashley cole was on his own as cleverley done his natural thing of drifting inside. glen johnson is a terrible defender and shouldnt be picked on his 'going forward capabilities', hes the wrong side pretty much every single time. and finally our ball retention is woeful. when we make a 5 yard pass, its looks panicky and there is no movement at all. so all that happens is theres small passes until someone either makes a mistake, a hollywood ball goes out for a throw or its given away cheaply.
England's players are to part-fund a £50,000 money-back scheme for fans affected by Tuesday's postponed qualifier in Warsaw.
The match against Poland was cancelled because of a waterlogged pitch, but rescheduled for 16:00 BST on Wednesday.
Some 2,500 England fans travelled to Warsaw for Tuesday's original game.
"The team appreciate the support we receive away from home," captain Steven Gerrard said. "We know fans have spent money and taken time off work."
Meanwhile, the Football Association said its Polish counterpart would set up a ticket refund process for those unable to attend Wednesday's rearranged fixture in Warsaw.
"To claim a refund, members will be asked to send their ticket to The FA at Wembley," said a statement on the FA website. "We will then collate all the tickets and pass them back to the Polish FA.
Wonder how many England armchair fans/moaners and media outlets will turn a blind eye to this great gesture?
If Charlton got a 1-1 draw in the manner in the way that England did today, there's no way there would be such over the top comments as there are today.
606 is actually infuriating to listen to after England matches, no idea why I bother listening to it.
erm yes there would. If we got a draw away at a poorer team and gave away possesion that cheaply, then people wouldnt be happy.
im usually on your side of the fence when it comes to england and think people go way over the top, but last night was a slightly worrying performance i think as it was no improvement at all on the Ukraine game, perhaps even worse.
four main concerns....we have no natural big forward that allows rooney to drop deep. defoe cannot play up on his own. then theres the fact we have no natural left midfielder. poor old ashley cole was on his own as cleverley done his natural thing of drifting inside. glen johnson is a terrible defender and shouldnt be picked on his 'going forward capabilities', hes the wrong side pretty much every single time. and finally our ball retention is woeful. when we make a 5 yard pass, its looks panicky and there is no movement at all. so all that happens is theres small passes until someone either makes a mistake, a hollywood ball goes out for a throw or its given away cheaply.
Do we need a big forward? It looks to me like Roy is trying to play a more passing game, I know it's hard to tell from last night. At the very least its a more possession based game than we are used to. To be successful at international level that is the way to go imo. However, will the players be patient enough with it? Most of them aren't used to that style. And will the fans/press be patient enough? I fear not.
Also I wouldn't have Rooney starting, I think we play much better without him. He isn't disciplined enough to play in a team that is focussed on retaining possession. I know most won't agree with me on this and I know no England manager will have the balls to drop him so it is a bit of a moot point.
Comments
Point away to Poland isn't that bad when we aren't that good.
Main problem for me was a lack of pace in midfield, should have started with Oxlade-Chamberlain.
We should still get to Brazil 2014 but displays like this will certainly dampen the hype and expectations (potentially)
Just seemed very slow on the ball and shaky in defence.
Didn't play well but its still a point away at one of the stronger teams in the group and I'm sure I read had they won that would have been the best start to an England management career since Winterbottom.
I'm not going to defend the whole England set up though. I've said many times we simply do not have the depth of talent pool to choose from that other top nations do. That is the first and imo biggest problem that faces England. First, it's a numbers game, population wise we are tiny, we also don't have enough people playing the game, we don't have enough coaches and more important than that we don't have enough coaches teaching the right things.
Part of me also thinks it's a mental standpoint as being Brits. We want everything. We want the best league in the world. You can argue either way but the undoubted thing is the Premier league is one of the best. The reason it got to be this good is the number of foreign players we can attract due to the financial incentives on offer, therefore forcing English players out of the way. Investment at every level is not as much as it should be. Not only do we want that but we also want the England side to win. More often than not they do but then we moan that they aren't playing well.
Unfortunately, in the medium term at least, I can't see any of those things changing. Lets face it nothing has for nearly 50 years.
The match against Poland was cancelled because of a waterlogged pitch, but rescheduled for 16:00 BST on Wednesday.
Some 2,500 England fans travelled to Warsaw for Tuesday's original game.
"The team appreciate the support we receive away from home," captain Steven Gerrard said. "We know fans have spent money and taken time off work."
Meanwhile, the Football Association said its Polish counterpart would set up a ticket refund process for those unable to attend Wednesday's rearranged fixture in Warsaw.
"To claim a refund, members will be asked to send their ticket to The FA at Wembley," said a statement on the FA website. "We will then collate all the tickets and pass them back to the Polish FA.
If Charlton got a 1-1 draw in the manner in the way that England did today, there's no way there would be such over the top comments as there are today.
606 is actually infuriating to listen to after England matches, no idea why I bother listening to it.
Many of us have expressed doubts about are squads quality, well the same can be applied to England. The Poles looked the better footballers in that match, and that should be a concern.
If only the Polish FA could have spent a few pounds (lets say £10) on training someone to press the 'Close Roof' button
im usually on your side of the fence when it comes to england and think people go way over the top, but last night was a slightly worrying performance i think as it was no improvement at all on the Ukraine game, perhaps even worse.
four main concerns....we have no natural big forward that allows rooney to drop deep. defoe cannot play up on his own. then theres the fact we have no natural left midfielder. poor old ashley cole was on his own as cleverley done his natural thing of drifting inside. glen johnson is a terrible defender and shouldnt be picked on his 'going forward capabilities', hes the wrong side pretty much every single time. and finally our ball retention is woeful. when we make a 5 yard pass, its looks panicky and there is no movement at all. so all that happens is theres small passes until someone either makes a mistake, a hollywood ball goes out for a throw or its given away cheaply.
Also I wouldn't have Rooney starting, I think we play much better without him. He isn't disciplined enough to play in a team that is focussed on retaining possession. I know most won't agree with me on this and I know no England manager will have the balls to drop him so it is a bit of a moot point.