Bowyer and mercurial technical players is an uneasy match at the best of times and it's one of our great leader's truest failings that he can't seem to find space for outrageous talent
Outrageous talent? Sarr is comfortable at this level, Oztumer has found it harder. Good League 1 attacking midfielder for me.
Oztumer is an outrageous talent. I know it was non league, but I’ve never seen some one so outrageously on his own plane of talent when he was at dulwich hamlet. There’s a lot of good footballers at that level who simply won’t or didn’t make it for various reasons, sometimes not because of lack of ability. Oztumer was messi like at that level, he was so good. He lacks some obvious physical attributes that mean he’ll never quite take it to the highest level. But he is seriously talented with a football.
That was also 6-8 years ago and much further down the pyramid - he was in the Dulwich team that won the Isthmian Division One South in 2013. He certainly was something special, though, and he's done himself proud since then.
These days, and at a much higher level, while I think he's certainly a useful player to have, I think he is more suited to League One or below, where some of the old magic might come back!
Ozzie was unplayable against Forest at home. Never really been given a chance this season in my opinion.
I agree. I really think we missed a trick when Jonny got injured against Derby. We had the opportunity to bring Ozzie in to a side that was performing well and at that time we were only really missing Taylor and Williams to injury, it was a chance to give him a real run in the side. Instead we pushed Conor up and tried to fit Kayal and others in. By the time we did start to play him we were at the height of the injury crisis and he was often having to play in a midfield 3 that included Deji. He impressed at times and disappointed at others and then of course he got injured and we haven't seen to much of him sine.
For me his size does count against him in this division. In the games I've seen, he's been eased off the ball too easily as the average Championship player is bigger and quicker than their League One counterpart, where he would still be useful. A shame, as was excited when we signed him.
Agree entirely. He had a brilliant 25 minutes orchestrating the team against Forest at The Valley earlier in the season: quick feet, quick brain.
But lack of size and bulk soon counted against him. Brushed off the ball by bigger opponents. Would even struggle against the better teams in League One.
A strange signing. We in the Covered End have watched small players flop before. Nicky Ajose, anyone?
For me his size does count against him in this division. In the games I've seen, he's been eased off the ball too easily as the average Championship player is bigger and quicker than their League One counterpart, where he would still be useful. A shame, as was excited when we signed him.
Agree entirely. He had a brilliant 25 minutes orchestrating the team against Forest at The Valley earlier in the season: quick feet, quick brain.
But lack of size and bulk soon counted against him. Brushed off the ball by bigger opponents. Would even struggle against the better teams in League One.
A strange signing. We in the Covered End have watched small players flop before. Nicky Ajose, anyone?
Yes only those in the covered end have watched small players flop before?
Oztumer hasn't been a flop really, sure he's not fired on all cylinders at any stage yet, but he hasn't stunk the place out either.
Ajose was a one season wonder.
What about Lookman, what about Jay DaSilva, What about Chris Solly, What about Josh Cullen, What about Johnny Williams?
I could go on, these are only vaguely recent examples of short players that have played well for us. Even Tarique Fosu was decent on his day under Robinson.
If we keep going back you can look at Matt Holland or Kinsella or Mendonca or Parker.
Shorter players have largely done pretty well here.
One very small player who didn't flop at the valley was Jose Dominguez. It must have been 15-20 years ago but he absolutely destroyed us in a game that I think Tottenham won 4-1.
Bowyer and mercurial technical players is an uneasy match at the best of times and it's one of our great leader's truest failings that he can't seem to find space for outrageous talent
Outrageous talent? Sarr is comfortable at this level, Oztumer has found it harder. Good League 1 attacking midfielder for me.
Oztumer is an outrageous talent. I know it was non league, but I’ve never seen some one so outrageously on his own plane of talent when he was at dulwich hamlet. There’s a lot of good footballers at that level who simply won’t or didn’t make it for various reasons, sometimes not because of lack of ability. Oztumer was messi like at that level, he was so good. He lacks some obvious physical attributes that mean he’ll never quite take it to the highest level. But he is seriously talented with a football.
That was also 6-8 years ago and much further down the pyramid - he was in the Dulwich team that won the Isthmian Division One South in 2013. He certainly was something special, though, and he's done himself proud since then.
These days, and at a much higher level, while I think he's certainly a useful player to have, I think he is more suited to League One or below, where some of the old magic might come back!
Yeah it was further down the pyramid, but he was playing with and against decent footballers (some of whom have made the step up to being pro since) but he was streets and streets ahead of everyone. To the point where it was slightly embarrassing.
For me his size does count against him in this division. In the games I've seen, he's been eased off the ball too easily as the average Championship player is bigger and quicker than their League One counterpart, where he would still be useful. A shame, as was excited when we signed him.
Agree entirely. He had a brilliant 25 minutes orchestrating the team against Forest at The Valley earlier in the season: quick feet, quick brain.
But lack of size and bulk soon counted against him. Brushed off the ball by bigger opponents. Would even struggle against the better teams in League One.
A strange signing. We in the Covered End have watched small players flop before. Nicky Ajose, anyone?
He was quality v Sheffield Weds til he got injured
I'd like to see him on the bench. I'd say he's probably more worthwhile having there than McGeady or Davidson. He's shown flashes but whether it's down to the role he's given, his diminutive stature, or whatever, he does seem to struggle to impose himself on the game. Given space by the opposition he's a clear threat, but too easily snuffed out. He's not a million miles different to Williams - probably more of a goal threat - but Williams, despite being a tiddler himself, just has that extra half yard of pace and a knack of being able to get on the ball and win free kicks etc. Ozzy doesn't quite have the same knack of staying involved in matches. I think Bowyer rates him, he was after him in January 2019 remember as well as last summer, but I think he also knows we're in scrap right now and wants a few warriors in the team and I don't think anyone could argue Ozzy is a warrior.
Didnt have a pre-season because of what was happening at Bolton, well behind on fitness, and when he has played, he hasn’t ever got a run in the team.
It’s difficult for any player to come in out from the cold, who isn’t match fit, to really make an impact, especially when they’re unlikely to be used again so soon after.
He has of course had his injuries as well. His lack of height could be an issue when we aren’t the biggest team. You won’t want to have Cullen, Morgan, Williams, McGeady, and Oztumer all in the squad at once, someone has to miss out.
Maybe the lockdown also hasn’t been kind to him and would’ve benefited from training regularly with football specific. It’s been a tough couple of years for him.
Excellent League One player who will score double figures each year. Unable to prove his worth in Championship at both Bolton and us. Never had a run of games or fitness to actually do that.
Despite his small stature, Oztumer has some special qualities, touch, vision, quick brain ..... and both Dulwich and Walsall built their sides around him, providing the platform for him to perform. And reaped the rewards, especially with their goalscoring.
At Charlton, we haven't seen that - he is just another player to rotate in Bowyer's gameplan and systems; the team isn't especially set up for him to thrive.
As said by someone above, Ozzie hasn't even had a proper run in the side; precious little chance to build match fitness and expression - so of course, we haven't really yet seen him at the top of his game.
At Walsall, they played to his abilities: for example, he was uprooting trees with his goalscoring - he had a free-er role, able to exploit space and make late unmarked runs into the box, slippery in possession, winning penalties and scoring goals.
Okay, it's a tighter game in the Championship but Bowyer doesn't use him like that. Ozzie is just another cog in the wheel, within the gameplan and team effort.
Yet we're crying out for flair and especially goals.
I think he’s a great player - would like to see him given a run but if bowyer feels ‘safer’ with more experienced championship players like McGeady for the vital run in then fair enough
Was on our books as a kid but let go at 16 because he's only 5ft 3in. Was a writeup about him in this weeks South London Press. Banged in loads of goals for Dulwich Hamlet. Heard for the brother of another Turkish player who was let go (the injured guy) that Smallwall might be interested in him.
The above quote is from 2013. He's still 5' 3'' and little seems to have changed with regards to our opinion of him. If he was too lightweight and not suited to the physical game, why were we chasing him for so long? LB has only given him 90 minutes once which suggests that he has had major doubts all along too. So why sign him?
Other short players have been mentioned, but they are all significantly taller than Oztumer. Even Messi is a several inches taller
Which isn't to say Oztumer can't do a job, but his lack of involvement on the pitch is a mystery to me, as he is creative AND has a good shot from distance, thus giving us something different in matches where we've looked VERY predictable in attack
Needs to start next game, I reckon - we need someone who can do something different in the final third and whatever it is we're trying to do in attack clearly isn't working. More of a goal threat than Jonny and McGeady and should improve set-piece delivery too. I'd surround him with big units and one 'striker' ahead of him and tell him to get on the ball, play wherever he wants and be unpredictable. Because Lord knows, that's a quality we're sorely lacking.
But late to the party but I'd try to shoehorn him into the side somehow just for his set pieces alone. We are so crap at corners & free kicks he must be worth a try.....and he always seems to have a goal in him.
But late to the party but I'd try to shoehorn him into the side somehow just for his set pieces alone. We are so crap at corners & free kicks he must be worth a try.....and he always seems to have a goal in him.
Good idea, put him at the far post from corners and let him out jump the defenders a foot taller
But late to the party but I'd try to shoehorn him into the side somehow just for his set pieces alone. We are so crap at corners & free kicks he must be worth a try.....and he always seems to have a goal in him.
Good idea, put him at the far post from corners and let him out jump the defenders a foot taller
I remember Oztumer scoring a goal in League one from a header for Walsall. A daisy cutter of a cross was headed in with not a defender in sight ?
But late to the party but I'd try to shoehorn him into the side somehow just for his set pieces alone. We are so crap at corners & free kicks he must be worth a try.....and he always seems to have a goal in him.
Good idea, put him at the far post from corners and let him out jump the defenders a foot taller
I remember Oztumer scoring a goal in League one from a header for Walsall. A daisy cutter of a cross was headed in with not a defender in sight ?
Comments
These days, and at a much higher level, while I think he's certainly a useful player to have, I think he is more suited to League One or below, where some of the old magic might come back!
But lack of size and bulk soon counted against him. Brushed off the ball by bigger opponents. Would even struggle against the better teams in League One.
A strange signing. We in the Covered End have watched small players flop before. Nicky Ajose, anyone?
Oztumer hasn't been a flop really, sure he's not fired on all cylinders at any stage yet, but he hasn't stunk the place out either.
Ajose was a one season wonder.
What about Lookman, what about Jay DaSilva, What about Chris Solly, What about Josh Cullen, What about Johnny Williams?
I could go on, these are only vaguely recent examples of short players that have played well for us. Even Tarique Fosu was decent on his day under Robinson.
If we keep going back you can look at Matt Holland or Kinsella or Mendonca or Parker.
Shorter players have largely done pretty well here.
Didnt have a pre-season because of what was happening at Bolton, well behind on fitness, and when he has played, he hasn’t ever got a run in the team.
It’s difficult for any player to come in out from the cold, who isn’t match fit, to really make an impact, especially when they’re unlikely to be used again so soon after.
He has of course had his injuries as well. His lack of height could be an issue when we aren’t the biggest team. You won’t want to have Cullen, Morgan, Williams, McGeady, and Oztumer all in the squad at once, someone has to miss out.
Maybe the lockdown also hasn’t been kind to him and would’ve benefited from training regularly with football specific. It’s been a tough couple of years for him.
Excellent League One player who will score double figures each year. Unable to prove his worth in Championship at both Bolton and us. Never had a run of games or fitness to actually do that.
At Charlton, we haven't seen that - he is just another player to rotate in Bowyer's gameplan and systems; the team isn't especially set up for him to thrive.
As said by someone above, Ozzie hasn't even had a proper run in the side; precious little chance to build match fitness and expression - so of course, we haven't really yet seen him at the top of his game.
At Walsall, they played to his abilities: for example, he was uprooting trees with his goalscoring - he had a free-er role, able to exploit space and make late unmarked runs into the box, slippery in possession, winning penalties and scoring goals.
Okay, it's a tighter game in the Championship but Bowyer doesn't use him like that. Ozzie is just another cog in the wheel, within the gameplan and team effort.
Yet we're crying out for flair and especially goals.
The above quote is from 2013. He's still 5' 3'' and little seems to have changed with regards to our opinion of him. If he was too lightweight and not suited to the physical game, why were we chasing him for so long? LB has only given him 90 minutes once which suggests that he has had major doubts all along too. So why sign him?
Which isn't to say Oztumer can't do a job, but his lack of involvement on the pitch is a mystery to me, as he is creative AND has a good shot from distance, thus giving us something different in matches where we've looked VERY predictable in attack
I remember Oztumer scoring a goal in League one from a header for Walsall.
A daisy cutter of a cross was headed in with not a defender in sight ?
Against Charlton at the Valley.
https://www.cafc.co.uk/news/view/5f88652ac184c/erhun-oztumer-joins-bristol-rovers-on-season-long-loan