Time to get rid of this 4-4-2 formation, not good enough to play two in midfield. We weren't good enough to play it last season.
3-5-2 or 4-5-1 is the way forward with the current team we have. We played 4-5-1 last season in most away games. Yes its a very negative formation and we rarely won by more than the odd goal playing it but it got us results.
The game reminded me a bit of the home game against Forest last season and if Boro were sharper up front we cold have been really embarrassed today. It did not look like a fixture between two teams in the same division and thank goodness Borough did not get out of second gear and were content to play an exhibition match of neat short passing along the ground while we lumbered about like a Sunday league team. .
Pitiful gulf in class against a team that will probably not make the play offs.
Even more worrying than the poor quality was the jaded, lethargic, lacklustre approach and the fact they our best and players from last season (Wiggins, Solly, Kermogant and Jackson ) were very poor. Early days but very worried about Gower who looked immobile and very predicable.
We had a League 1 midfield last season and it looks worse this year. Stephens made some truly class interventions for about 10 mins then disappeared for the rest of the game. He is probably our best hope which is also a worry.
Just joined today eh ? Lay off CP, he is trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear.
is it only at Charlton that the manager is ecempt from criticism after a performance like that ?
He got plenty of plaudits after our good run last season.
I have been plenty vocal about mistakes CP makes. No one is exempt from constructive supportive criticism. It would not surprise me if owners of our club would try to deflect criticism on the state of the club away from themselves.
CP is not perfect but he finds a way. I ain't gonna join your bandwagon mate.
Couldn't go today as I'm away in Valencia. Managed to tune into BBC2 for final score - the reporter said it was a woeful game lacking any real skill or quality, he really didn't have anything to say....
It's been said before, but Palace lost their first two games last season...
The three substitutes improved the performance from utterly terrible to merely bad. There is absolutely no pace in the team that started today except for Harriot, who is still raw and inexperienced. Of course there is more to the game than merely speed, but though some of the passing was not bad, the Boro players had as much time as they liked to stroll over and nick the ball mid-pass.
I won't blame Powell for all the performances, I am sure his team talk was not 'go and f*** it all up as often as possible, boys' but the players and the formation looked second best within 15-20 minutes and we never looked close to parity until changes were made. Church and Wilson would both start next time out if it was down to me.
Look, we all know that the club needs new investors (pdq by today's showing) so are we really surprised by today's performance/result, surely we all realise that we punched beyond ourselves at the end of last season, Powell has obviously had extremely limited resources but I would far rather us "muddle through" than sign players that we can't afford that could then jeapordise us further. As a fan it is unbelievably frustrating watching performances like that but I am confident that Chris will guide us through, but, it will be tight.
'Boro had the formation that we struggle to play against. A 4-4-1-1 formation has caused us problems in the past when playing 4-4-2..the Notts County game we lost a couple of years ago for example.
Having Varga just behind the main-man allowed him to cut off the supply line from defence to midfield, which basically cut out Gower's best strength-something Leadbitter did well too. Also note that Gower was a regular for Swansea in a more 4-5-1/4-3-3 formation which allowed him more freedom in the middle than he gets in a 4-4-2.
Due to 'Boro's pressing up the pitch, we had no option but to lump it long or diagonally, which failed for the majority of the match. Our best chance came, when we finally got it to feet in this case Harriott where he was allowed to run against Richardson and get a cross in.
Mustapha Carayol was superb, not seen someone dominate Solly/Wiggins like that since Zaha.
Charlton: Overall, worst i've seen us play in ages. Not seen Solly/Kermo/Morro etc..have a bad game like that in a while. Wouldn't mind seeing Cousins get an opportunity soon, just to freshen up things in midfield, I know he is inexperienced, but like Harriott did last season, I feel he could offer something different.
I knew it was all going to go pear shaped when Red, Red, Robin was relegated to a muted 10 second afterthought just as they were about to kick off. Since I Was Young is perfectly acceptable as a chant BUT NOT AS A VIRTUAL REPLACEMENT FOR RED, RED ROBIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now I've got that off my chest to the match.
In all honesty Boro were the better side today and, as Mowbray said, controlled the game for long periods. Whether that was because they are genuinely a good side or it was down to pretty well all our players having an off day I don't know. The end result either way though was nil points as they say in the Eurovision Song Contest!
I find it hard to think of any players who enhanced or played to their best today other than perhaps Dervite and Harriott.
The rest were two bob frankly. Jackson going off at halftime didn't help but even before that it wasn't great.
Kermorgant looked a shadow of his normal self and that was both before and, unsurprisingly, after his knock in the second half. As for Solly he looked nothing like a Premiership full back today and these two in form are instrumental to any success we've had.
Moses would have been proud of our midfield today as it parted like the Red Sea on numerous occasions to allow various profligate, fortunately for us, Boro players to take pot shots at Hamer.
I arrived happy and optimistic with my eldest daughter and left hoping and praying that there are 3 worse teams than us in this division. On the form shown today that is open to conjecture.
The one bright spot, other than my eldest daughter coming, was meeting March 51 again and Jimmy 85 for the first time now that they have joined us savages in the Covered End Upper.
People keep saying about Yanns weight?!? I sit in north upper so can't pass judgement. But do people really think he's had one too many burgers? Or did he just have a bad day at the office? Surely the job of Lawrence Bloom is to prevent them getting tubby. I can't imagine him being a lot heavier than last year!? Maybe it's just match sharpness?
Faversham, I agree that if you sign 2 strikers a few days before the season starts and have most of your squad on contracts that run out next Summer then today's performance isn't really a surprise. I hope I'm wrong but it's beginning to look like the owners' piss poor management of the player contracts is affecting us on the pitch.
We were poor today but I saw worse last season. Great teamwork and graft got us out of trouble last time. Can Chris do it again given the contract situation? I have my doubts.
Let's hope the owners see the folly of letting their investment getting relegated and either sell at a sensible price or put more money in.
I'm not pinning much hope on Sordell. If he's any good why have Bolton let him out on a season long loan? If its because he hasn't settled oop North then he didn't exactly look like full of the joys of spring today. I've seen him play for he U21's and the Olympic team and he's never impressed me. Never seen someone put in so little effort. My worry is that the agreement with Bolton is that he plays.
On the plus side I'm impressed with Church and think he's going to be a very decent acquisition.
I'm not pinning much hope on Sordell. If he's any good why have Bolton let him out on a season long loan? If its because he hasn't settled oop North then he didn't exactly look like full of the joys of spring today. I've seen him play for he U21's and the Olympic team and he's never impressed me. Never seen someone put in so little effort. My worry is that the agreement with Bolton is that he plays.
Were you the bloke sitting above me moaning at Sordell when he didn't run after a ball like a headless chicken even though he was coming from an offside position?
I'm not pinning much hope on Sordell. If he's any good why have Bolton let him out on a season long loan? If its because he hasn't settled oop North then he didn't exactly look like full of the joys of spring today. I've seen him play for he U21's and the Olympic team and he's never impressed me. Never seen someone put in so little effort. My worry is that the agreement with Bolton is that he plays.
On the plus side I'm impressed with Church and think he's going to be a very decent acquisition.
I hope you are right about Church. I however think Sordell will score goals once he's settled in and the team provide him with some decent service. I really want to believe in Church but I think we are going to see a lot of running and effort but not much end product.
Faversham, I agree that if you sign 2 strikers a few days before the season starts and have most of your squad on contracts that run out next Summer then today's performance isn't really a surprise. I hope I'm wrong but it's beginning to look like the owners' piss poor management of the player contracts is affecting us on the pitch.
We were poor today but I saw worse last season. Great teamwork and graft got us out of trouble last time. Can Chris do it again given the contract situation? I have my doubts.
Let's hope the owners see the folly of letting their investment getting relegated and either sell at a sensible price or put more money in.
This is a good post. I hope there IS a way for Chris to do it again, or try to, because what is the alternative at the moment? Chris needs his coaching team to support and help him even more if he is down about things, it's no good anybody shrugging their shoulders and saying 'what can you do?' I do think there is disappointment regarding investment, but there is also opportunity within our resources, both in selecting players, coaching...errrrm.....more, and choosing formations. Chris is not beyond criticism, and I think he may need to re-visit 4-5-1, as well as being a bit cooler with the more experienced players unless they deliver. However I believe Chris respects the guys he works with, and will ultimately try to get them going well, when replacing them is now not an option.
We looked like it was a first pre season friendly, players touches, basic passing and movement were shocking.
What was Hamer playing at for the goal?
Gower has the intention of going to any of our players to get the ball for a simple pass and to keep it ticking, but with no or little movement there was no one to off load it to. That and the fact it looked like to me he was shattered after 20 minutes, made him appear poor today.
Personally I think Green is an impact player and had a poor game. His corner kick aimed at goal which ended up behind the net summed him up for me today. Seeing Wilson come on as a potentially better option depressed me.
Nice to see Dale get involved for a little bit.
Sordell looks like he could be a pain but with the lack of service I don't think we will see it for a while, especially with this long ball nonsense which started straight away. Woodgate for them at the back was winning everything and competing well with Kermy, so why are players long balling it at Sordell in the air when Woodgate is marking him, a smaller and lesser threat in the air....
Dervitte I thought did well enough, Harriott showed when he is isolated in a 1 on 1 he is going to go past the man. The rest need to forget that performance, move themselves up a few gears and get some points on the board from the next 2 games.
Thought gower and dervite were two of the better players and seemed to be the only two who weren't determined to give the ball away at the first oportunity despite the lack of movement around them. Morrison in particular was guilty of playing too many aimless long balls.
Green worked hard and I think the criticism of his defensive efforts is a bit harsh but his decision to shoot instead of squaring it when we had men queuing up on the edge of the box was a shocker not to mention missing our best chance.
Gower was at fault for the goal trying to pass through there forward on edge of own box - p'ss poor
Comments
He got plenty of plaudits after our good run last season.
3-5-2 or 4-5-1 is the way forward with the current team we have. We played 4-5-1 last season in most away games. Yes its a very negative formation and we rarely won by more than the odd goal playing it but it got us results.
The game reminded me a bit of the home game against Forest last season and if Boro were sharper up front we cold have been really embarrassed today. It did not look like a fixture between two teams in the same division and thank goodness Borough did not get out of second gear and were content to play an exhibition match of neat short passing along the ground while we lumbered about like a Sunday league team. .
Pitiful gulf in class against a team that will probably not make the play offs.
Even more worrying than the poor quality was the jaded, lethargic, lacklustre approach and the fact they our best and players from last season (Wiggins, Solly, Kermogant and Jackson ) were very poor. Early days but very worried about Gower who looked immobile and very predicable.
We had a League 1 midfield last season and it looks worse this year. Stephens made some truly class interventions for about 10 mins then disappeared for the rest of the game. He is probably our best hope which is also a worry.
Poor poor performance
It would not surprise me if owners of our club would try to deflect criticism on the state of the club away from themselves.
CP is not perfect but he finds a way. I ain't gonna join your bandwagon mate.
It's been said before, but Palace lost their first two games last season...
We've got to keep believing!! :-)
I won't blame Powell for all the performances, I am sure his team talk was not 'go and f*** it all up as often as possible, boys' but the players and the formation looked second best within 15-20 minutes and we never looked close to parity until changes were made. Church and Wilson would both start next time out if it was down to me.
I just say it as I see it based on.performance. Too many of our fans put Powell on a pedestal.
Bournemouth were going to win this leauge.
Boro were a team in dissary, and were relegated,
6 points later, form in a line says !
'Boro had the formation that we struggle to play against. A 4-4-1-1 formation has caused us problems in the past when playing 4-4-2..the Notts County game we lost a couple of years ago for example.
Having Varga just behind the main-man allowed him to cut off the supply line from defence to midfield, which basically cut out Gower's best strength-something Leadbitter did well too. Also note that Gower was a regular for Swansea in a more 4-5-1/4-3-3 formation which allowed him more freedom in the middle than he gets in a 4-4-2.
Due to 'Boro's pressing up the pitch, we had no option but to lump it long or diagonally, which failed for the majority of the match. Our best chance came, when we finally got it to feet in this case Harriott where he was allowed to run against Richardson and get a cross in.
Mustapha Carayol was superb, not seen someone dominate Solly/Wiggins like that since Zaha.
Charlton: Overall, worst i've seen us play in ages. Not seen Solly/Kermo/Morro etc..have a bad game like that in a while. Wouldn't mind seeing Cousins get an opportunity soon, just to freshen up things in midfield, I know he is inexperienced, but like Harriott did last season, I feel he could offer something different.
I knew it was all going to go pear shaped when Red, Red, Robin was relegated to a muted 10 second afterthought just as they were about to kick off. Since I Was Young is perfectly acceptable as a chant BUT NOT AS A VIRTUAL REPLACEMENT FOR RED, RED ROBIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now I've got that off my chest to the match.
In all honesty Boro were the better side today and, as Mowbray said, controlled the game for long periods. Whether that was because they are genuinely a good side or it was down to pretty well all our players having an off day I don't know. The end result either way though was nil points as they say in the Eurovision Song Contest!
I find it hard to think of any players who enhanced or played to their best today other than perhaps Dervite and Harriott.
The rest were two bob frankly. Jackson going off at halftime didn't help but even before that it wasn't great.
Kermorgant looked a shadow of his normal self and that was both before and, unsurprisingly, after his knock in the second half. As for Solly he looked nothing like a Premiership full back today and these two in form are instrumental to any success we've had.
Moses would have been proud of our midfield today as it parted like the Red Sea on numerous occasions to allow various profligate, fortunately for us, Boro players to take pot shots at Hamer.
I arrived happy and optimistic with my eldest daughter and left hoping and praying that there are 3 worse teams than us in this division. On the form shown today that is open to conjecture.
The one bright spot, other than my eldest daughter coming, was meeting March 51 again and Jimmy 85 for the first time now that they have joined us savages in the Covered End Upper.
If we are going to play a 35 year old midfielder, we also need youth and energy to do the hard graft.
A suggestion for Barnsley. Play Cousins in the holding role, Gower in midfield, and Stephens in the advanced position behind Yann.
Yes 4-5-1 is more negative, but 4-4-2 clearly isn't working.
We were poor today but I saw worse last season. Great teamwork and graft got us out of trouble last time. Can Chris do it again given the contract situation? I have my doubts.
Let's hope the owners see the folly of letting their investment getting relegated and either sell at a sensible price or put more money in.
On the plus side I'm impressed with Church and think he's going to be a very decent acquisition.
Chris needs his coaching team to support and help him even more if he is down about things, it's no good anybody shrugging their shoulders and saying 'what can you do?'
I do think there is disappointment regarding investment, but there is also opportunity within our resources, both in selecting players, coaching...errrrm.....more, and choosing formations. Chris is not beyond criticism, and I think he may need to re-visit 4-5-1, as well as being a bit cooler with the more experienced players unless they deliver. However I believe Chris respects the guys he works with, and will ultimately try to get them going well, when replacing them is now not an option.
We looked like it was a first pre season friendly, players touches, basic passing and movement were shocking.
What was Hamer playing at for the goal?
Gower has the intention of going to any of our players to get the ball for a simple pass and to keep it ticking, but with no or little movement there was no one to off load it to. That and the fact it looked like to me he was shattered after 20 minutes, made him appear poor today.
Personally I think Green is an impact player and had a poor game. His corner kick aimed at goal which ended up behind the net summed him up for me today. Seeing Wilson come on as a potentially better option depressed me.
Nice to see Dale get involved for a little bit.
Sordell looks like he could be a pain but with the lack of service I don't think we will see it for a while, especially with this long ball nonsense which started straight away. Woodgate for them at the back was winning everything and competing well with Kermy, so why are players long balling it at Sordell in the air when Woodgate is marking him, a smaller and lesser threat in the air....
Dervitte I thought did well enough, Harriott showed when he is isolated in a 1 on 1 he is going to go past the man. The rest need to forget that performance, move themselves up a few gears and get some points on the board from the next 2 games.