Sometimes the darkest moments can prove to be turning points. Powell needs to clear his head, he's clutching at straws and picking the wrong one's. His principal when he first became manager was to play attractive attacking football. That was in the distant past. We will not create chances or score goals the way he currently plays. Harriot and Pritchard have been huge losses this season. Pritchard got our most assists last season. Their confidence is shattered and for that I blame Powell, the same (to a lessor extent) applies to Sordell and Green. Powell has certainly had bad luck with injuries (Solly & Yann) the dreadful pitch and lack of investment. But you make your own luck and at the moment he is not helping himself, us, or the team. He needs to go back to basics, best players in best positions, 4 4 2. If Jacko has to play, play him wide, don't mess with Cousins/Stephens. Two decent signings and Powell coming to his senses, will see us climbing the table. We've had some decent results and matched the best, we are not a million miles away from being a decent side.
Agree taking players off when not needing to shatters their confidence, even when a sub comes on makes a goal , scores a goal then are dropped or not even on the bench the next game .playing team mates out of position upsets the moral in a team , the players know who train well and deserve to play , no loyalty to all players only a select few . Man management issues.
IMO the biggest problem is that we don't seem to create enough chances.
No service.
Agree with this - Kermorgant can finish, Church can finish, albeit inconsistently, but they're lucky if they get one clear cut chance between them per game sometimes. A better striker than Church would help as he has missed 4 or 5 very good chances this season, but those misses alone would not see us in mid table safety had they been scored.
Stephens is a deeper lying playmaker type, Cousins is a shield, Jacko a goalscoring midfielder at his best but not a proper flair and vision type creative player. Harriott is horribly out of form, Green is horribly inconsistent bordering on totally ineffective, Wilson is a hard worker but not a creative player particularly, Evina is a left back, Stewart is in Leeds. Our most creative player in terms of actually laying on direct assists is Wiggins and he is a left back.
Even a really good new striker will be playing with an arm tied behind his back (to mix metaphors) if his arrival isn't coupled with some new attacking talent in midfield, imho.
Agree entirely. Very well said, especially your last paragraph.
Can I ask why your fans are having a go at Donny fans saying the Donny pitch is shit? Aren't they used to seeing grass on the surface? Do they expect all clubs to have water laying on the pitch? Or are they just making up excuses for not winning tonight?
We were utterly clueless the back four had very little cover in front of it with Cousins, bizarrely being played on right side of midfield, leaving Jacko - who was way off the pace tonight - trying to cover the gaps. We had absolutely no width, why on earth was Evina playing wide left, I just do not understand it, too many square pegs in round holes.
I have vigorously supported Chris Powell this season, but tonight I just could not understand what he thought he could achieve with that team selection. I cannot understand why the new owner has spent around £20million on buying the club only to see it get spunked on a relegation to division one through lack of investment in this transfer window for gods sake do something in the next three days St L. Reserves are not and will not be the answer in this competitive division.
Rarely have I left a game so down as I did after this one.
On train home. That was abysmal. My heart sank when I saw the team. I have regularly disagreed with Powell's decision's this season, he has been dealt a duff hand but he cannot be entirely blameless.
We have one pairing that works, Stephens and Cousins and once again they are split up to accomodate JJ who spent the game chasing shadows. His legs have gone sadly, I like the lad but he won't keep us up.
Make no mistake, whilst we made them look good, Donny were a poor side and could easily have beaten us by 6. We had one shot all game (miles over), our first clean tackle was in the 80th minute and we barely strung a pass together. Yann started well but gave up when we let in the second and I actually thought it was Church who was subbed at half time (partly because he did so little in the second half, partly because Evina did so little in the first). We have 4 new players in the squad but none deemed a sufficient improvement on what we have to make the starting 11 in a weakened side.
All 3 CB's were poor and Lennon looked like a CB playing his first ever pro game out of position.
We are in the mire and I am struggling to see how we turn it around. All well and good going for players now but how many will be excited about joining a team becoming entrenched in the bottom 3.
Plenty of games to go and I won't give up, but many of the players looked like they had tonight
You give a brilliantly clear-eyed and level-headed assessment - and a damning indictment. While I wasn't at tonight's game, I have witnessed most of what you describe for the past season and a half. "We barely strung a pass together" is the root of our troubles. It has long been patently obvious that our players lack the technical skills to compete strongly in this division, yet their inability to get forward at all - by strength or design - asks searching questions of our coaching and preparation.
My take on it is that in the build up we have had Yann and Dale linked with going elsewhere, the whole team questioning where the gaffer is at the end of the season - ultimately the score is terrible but are we really surprised?
Get the manager and players signed up and then let's sort this out please.
Just got in .... M1 and M25 roadworks slowed us down but not too bad a journey home Writing without reading Utter fucking crap , it was a real pathetic performance beyond patheticness Donny cruised past us and didn't have to get out of 2nd gear We're carrying too many players , Evina wow wow wow shocking , is he George Weahs moody fake footballer cousin ? NO cos that fella is better Pie and a pint £5 in the Belle Vue bar at the ground was lovely and had a tasty chicken wrap in the ground (diet on hold for a day) We offered nothing as an attacking threat , I don't think the Donny keeper had a save to make Jacko tried his heart out but to no a avail his legs aren't what they were Cousins is getting worse and worse he makes Ray Wilkins look uber positive Lennon was poor early on but improved later on I genuinely fear for us because I don't know what can be done to salvage our season We have a decent enough first 11 10 and Church but there is no depth and with injuries and suspensions we're only heading one way unless the Duch digs deep SCP (yes he will always be Sir Chris to me) got it wrong tonight big time with Evina and Lennon on the left only one of the two should have started but admittedly he's juggling pieces to a jigsaw that don't actually fit Going up to Wigan and brainwashing my son in to thinking losing 5-0 to the FA Cup holders isn't a bad thing
Oh and palace are 14th five points above relegation ........ This is a nightmare
Alnwick Wilson morro wood wiggins Green cousins stephens Harriott Sordell Kermorgant
Please let that be our starting lineup. (When Wilson is back).
The one thing our team has had since SCP came in was togetherness, that has been lost this season through contract issues and quality players leaving without replacement and I think all of these loans coming in are the nail in the coffin of the togetherness.
Can I ask why your fans are having a go at Donny fans saying the Donny pitch is shit? Aren't they used to seeing grass on the surface? Do they expect all clubs to have water laying on the pitch? Or are they just making up excuses for not winning tonight?
Really ? I thought your pitch was top notch and that has nothing to do with how crap our pitch currently is Good grub at Donny anyway
Both teams took a while to get started could tell it was 2 teams low on confidence both look shakey in possession, Donny was a poor side which because of our basic mistakes and our game plan they grew in confidence and they was in control when we went to ten men.
At one point of the game I focused on our players instead of the game, there was no organistion, no communication, no encouragement like they don't even know each other and sadly the same from the bench CP just leaned against the Dugout arms crossed.
What I was concerned with is that to me Donny looked slow, we had no players willing to run at them use the width out wide, we decided to cross the ball from our half way line up to Kermorgant who wasn't even in their box half the time to win the ball against 2 very strong centre halfs.
We hit and hope in the final third, a number of players were working hard but lack of quality and poor decision making never was going to trouble Donny. Someone has to see when something isn't working and change it but CP doesn't Alnwick every kick they won possession and kept it for 5 mins while we chase shadows, why can't we play it out from the back and though the midfield? We was so narrow made it easy to defend against.
Our midfield have to create chances for our strikers to score we have no width or depth on the pitch and the lack of movement players not showing for the ball just didn't want to play is what upset me most.
Bad night. Team selection from Powell was a strange one for me playing with Cousins and Evina out of position on both flanks. Yet again it seems the balance of the midfield goes out of the window to accommodate Jackson in the centre. Cousins and Stephens are IMO are our best central midfield pairing and should start in the centre. Doncaster are a poor side and a better side would have put more than 3 past us tonight. We just seemed to give up 2nd half and accept defeat. Unless we can bring in some real quality up front I can only see one thing at the end of the season. Relegation.
I am far from a tactical expert but when I saw the team this morning I thought it looked like they would have lined up as a 3-5-2 as that would have had all players in a more natural position. But reading this it is obvious I was wrong.
I have avoided being critical of CP but it does seem that he got his team selection wrong last night with too many players out of position. He also seems to be a manager that likes a long look at new players rather than throwing them straight into the side.
Curbs, after this sort of run, would always "go back to basics". Sounds to me that Charlton need to be a bit more adventurous now, but have we got the players to do it? And will we have them by the end of the week?
What a bad day this was. It has all been said above and I have no idea what is going to happen next. Bad day, Bad selections, Bad management. And like Airman said above, this just all feels so unnecessary. Fuck it!!
Relegation does seem inevitable. The transfer window is proving to be a nightmare - potentially we could lose a couple of our better players, to be replaced by relatively unknown foreign players. Experience has shown that the majority of foreign players take time to bed in, and often do not have the stomach for a relegation battle.
The current squad is just not good enough with too many very average players and, despite the two FA Cup wins, confidence seems fragile within the squad.
So where do we go from here?
Like many, when the new owner surfaced, I was optimistic that he would get the club stabilised and in a position to push up rather than down.
However, his strategy would not appear to be in the best interests of Charlton Athletic Football Club. Owning a clutch of clubs and moving players around europe between those clubs would seem to be in the best interests of Mr Duchatelet as he seeks to turn a profit from the whole, rather than the one. 'The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few - or the one' is a quote from a film, and seems rather apt in describing our predicament. I feel that his strategy is just a business experiment and if he detects a flaw in his thinking, then I suspect he will not be slow in ditching it - leaving us, and some of the other clubs he owns, in a far worse position than when he acquired us/them.
It is difficult to have any short term optimism. Events over the next three days will, hopefully, provide a clearer indication of his intentions.
However, if we lose some of our better players, and replace them with unknown players from his stable of teams, our worst fears may well be realised and our own feelings of negativity justified.
Think that was a worse result than any of us could have expected. I'm in a camp where I can see that CP has not been backed by previous owners and we have a poor squad BUT he doesn't help himself with wierd team selections and strange tactics. He should listen to himself and stick to his preferred 4-4-2. Breaking up the Cousins/Stephens partnership is non sensical and square pegs in round holes never work. Accommodating Jackson is a mistake too. We moan that Church is crap but we don't create anywhere near enough chances. There is a lot wrong and it's going to take a lot of sorting out.
Agreed. Bizarre team selection! Can't defend that.
Thanks Seth and RedMidland - good work. We couldn't manage even a single shot on target (BBC stats) - and not for the first time this season. That kind of weakness is inexcusable in professional football at any level. I have to ask this question again: What the hell goes on at Sparrows Lane on Mondays to Fridays?
Stop asking the same question and go down there and see for yourself.
Read all the 'knee jerk' reactions on the match thread last night (yes it was bad but come-on) and I was surprised at the team set-up myself. It made me wonder if Powell was being a bit clever! He would know that playing the youngsters at the back (Lennon and Evina) was asking for trouble and leaving Wood on the bench - also maybe splitting up the mid-field pairing would leave gaps.
If its obvious to us - then it's probably obvious to him. So - maybe he was using it to make a (risky) point to the owners and taking the hit to drive home the point that (I suspect he's been making as loudly as he can) we lack quality, cover, creativeness and firepower. Combine that with a de-motivated 'workforce' and you've got problems. Maybe he thought this 'demonstration' might force some action more than all the words that may have already been said. Pure speculation.
When I saw the team last night my heart sank. We are now a million miles away from what always was, knowing your best team. Years ago you could name the team before you got to the Ground, only disturbed by injuries. Last night we had a Manager and players almost out of contract, forming a rag, tag, and bobtail outfit heading for relegation while Roland 'Nero' stood and watched. Heaven help us on Saturday and my personal admiration for anyone planning to make it to Wigan.
Alnwick Wilson morro wood wiggins Green cousins stephens Harriott Sordell Kermorgant
Please let that be our starting lineup. (When Wilson is back). .
thing is CP was just one player away from being able to field that side last night. Instead of shuffling it all around bringing in Fox to replace Wiggins would have sorted it. Instead it's about five unenforced changes. Jackson in, Cousins to the right, Evina on the left, Lennon (a CB) at left back etc. Stick to 4 4 2 and pick square pegs in square holes not round one's. To not have a single shot on target is a disgrace. Reinforces for me one of the reasons why I've given up on away games the last two seasons. I don't mind losing but at least give it a go.
I'm fuckin furious mate, more than the result, I have never slagged off Lennon or Piggott and the geezer ain't got the balls to apologise or retract it.
No, you DID cast doubt on Lennon! If you read the player scores the fans who were there ranked him higher than Evina, so I rest my case. I will accept that you've not commented on Piggot but I'm not the only one who noticed that you've been making snide comments against the blooding of Academy players here, so you're the one in the dock here. What about making a statement to clarify your position vid a vis the Academy instead of lashing out on those of us who've noticed this? Comment on the scoring, huh?
In other news... I really hope the FA come down hard on Millwall after tonight, a beer bottle and endless objects was thrown at Kirkland, Millwall player goes down with a head injury in the box some of our players are trying to get the refs attention but in a scramble they score.....but I would've take a point before the game but gutted because we should've won it as Llera hit the bar a minute before they made it 1-1.
Hope they go down, horrible club.
we don't care let us get on with our mourning thank you
If we go down it will be the most unnecessary relegation in the history of the club. But we will have to see what the next few days brings. It can be turned round with a little investment and if that is not forthcoming I don't really understand the point of RD buying the club in the first place.
Comments
I have vigorously supported Chris Powell this season, but tonight I just could not understand what he thought he could achieve with that team selection. I cannot understand why the new owner has spent around £20million on buying the club only to see it get spunked on a relegation to division one through lack of investment in this transfer window for gods sake do something in the next three days St L. Reserves are not and will not be the answer in this competitive division.
Rarely have I left a game so down as I did after this one.
Get the manager and players signed up and then let's sort this out please.
In Avram we do NOT trust
Writing without reading
Utter fucking crap , it was a real pathetic performance beyond patheticness
Donny cruised past us and didn't have to get out of 2nd gear
We're carrying too many players , Evina wow wow wow shocking , is he George Weahs moody fake footballer cousin ? NO cos that fella is better
Pie and a pint £5 in the Belle Vue bar at the ground was lovely and had a tasty chicken wrap in the ground (diet on hold for a day)
We offered nothing as an attacking threat , I don't think the Donny keeper had a save to make
Jacko tried his heart out but to no a avail his legs aren't what they were
Cousins is getting worse and worse he makes Ray Wilkins look uber positive
Lennon was poor early on but improved later on
I genuinely fear for us because I don't know what can be done to salvage our season
We have a decent enough first
1110 and Church but there is no depth and with injuries and suspensions we're only heading one way unless the Duch digs deepSCP (yes he will always be Sir Chris to me) got it wrong tonight big time with Evina and Lennon on the left only one of the two should have started but admittedly he's juggling pieces to a jigsaw that don't actually fit
Going up to Wigan and brainwashing my son in to thinking losing 5-0 to the FA Cup holders isn't a bad thing
Oh and palace are 14th five points above relegation ........ This is a nightmare
40% 13th-21st ...........60% RELEGATION
Wilson morro wood wiggins
Green cousins stephens Harriott
Sordell Kermorgant
Please let that be our starting lineup. (When Wilson is back).
The one thing our team has had since SCP came in was togetherness, that has been lost this season through contract issues and quality players leaving without replacement and I think all of these loans coming in are the nail in the coffin of the togetherness.
Without that we are going down.
Our players are not champ quality:
Alnwick - lower champ
Hamer - upper L1 (potential)
Solly - upper champ
Wilson - mid L1
Morro - lower champ
Wood - lower champ
Dervite - mid L1
Wiggins - mid champ
Evina - L2
Green - mid L1
Pritch - mid L1
Cousins - Mid Champ (potential)
Stephens - mid champ
Gower - L1
Hughes - L2
Jackson - mid L1
Harriott - mid L1 (potential)
Kerm - upper Champ
Church - mid L1
Sordell - Champ potential but pony at the moment.
So all in all where does that leave us?
I'm afraid it's RELEGATION.
I thought your pitch was top notch and that has nothing to do with how crap our pitch currently is
Good grub at Donny anyway
At one point of the game I focused on our players instead of the game, there was no organistion, no communication, no encouragement like they don't even know each other and sadly the same from the bench CP just leaned against the Dugout arms crossed.
What I was concerned with is that to me Donny looked slow, we had no players willing to run at them use the width out wide, we decided to cross the ball from our half way line up to Kermorgant who wasn't even in their box half the time to win the ball against 2 very strong centre halfs.
We hit and hope in the final third, a number of players were working hard but lack of quality and poor decision making never was going to trouble Donny. Someone has to see when something isn't working and change it but CP doesn't Alnwick every kick they won possession and kept it for 5 mins while we chase shadows, why can't we play it out from the back and though the midfield? We was so narrow made it easy to defend against.
Our midfield have to create chances for our strikers to score we have no width or depth on the pitch and the lack of movement players not showing for the ball just didn't want to play is what upset me most.
Doncaster are a poor side and a better side would have put more than 3 past us tonight. We just seemed to give up 2nd half and accept defeat. Unless we can bring in some real quality up front I can only see one thing at the end of the season. Relegation.
Alnwick
Morro Dervite Wood SCP
Green Cousins Stephens Harriott
Kermorgant Euell
I have avoided being critical of CP but it does seem that he got his team selection wrong last night with too many players out of position. He also seems to be a manager that likes a long look at new players rather than throwing them straight into the side.
Curbs, after this sort of run, would always "go back to basics". Sounds to me that Charlton need to be a bit more adventurous now, but have we got the players to do it? And will we have them by the end of the week?
The current squad is just not good enough with too many very average players and, despite the two FA Cup wins, confidence seems fragile within the squad.
So where do we go from here?
Like many, when the new owner surfaced, I was optimistic that he would get the club stabilised and in a position to push up rather than down.
However, his strategy would not appear to be in the best interests of Charlton Athletic Football Club. Owning a clutch of clubs and moving players around europe between those clubs would seem to be in the best interests of Mr Duchatelet as he seeks to turn a profit from the whole, rather than the one. 'The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few - or the one' is a quote from a film, and seems rather apt in describing our predicament. I feel that his strategy is just a business experiment and if he detects a flaw in his thinking, then I suspect he will not be slow in ditching it - leaving us, and some of the other clubs he owns, in a far worse position than when he acquired us/them.
It is difficult to have any short term optimism. Events over the next three days will, hopefully, provide a clearer indication of his intentions.
However, if we lose some of our better players, and replace them with unknown players from his stable of teams, our worst fears may well be realised and our own feelings of negativity justified.
If its obvious to us - then it's probably obvious to him. So - maybe he was using it to make a (risky) point to the owners and taking the hit to drive home the point that (I suspect he's been making as loudly as he can) we lack quality, cover, creativeness and firepower. Combine that with a de-motivated 'workforce' and you've got problems. Maybe he thought this 'demonstration' might force some action more than all the words that may have already been said. Pure speculation.
stood and watched. Heaven help us on Saturday and my personal admiration for anyone planning to make it to Wigan.