I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
Or not tackling and the worst pass accuracy on the team on Saturday.
But he did tackle on Saturday. I was there and I saw him do it.
I don't think he had a particularly good game v Millwall but every one less than brilliant performance brings out the "Come in No 4 your time is up" posts.
As Ben18 said, if it's about one game put it on the post-match views thread rather than on here.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
Bikey looked a little less of his consistent, reliable self on Saturday. Buyens tried 2-3 hollywood balls that went out of play. Where is the bumped thread saying "they didn't have a great game on Saturday"?
Bikey looked a little less of his consistent, reliable self on Saturday. Buyens tried 2-3 hollywood balls that went out of play. Where is the bumped thread saying "they didn't have a great game on Saturday"?
So perhaps I was wrong to put it under this thread that I thought he had a quiet/poor game, lesson learned.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
.......... but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
But that isn't the case
My point there being that those jumping on others are being a bit overzealous, just because some may criticise his performance after a game doesn't warrant his staunch defenders to jump down their throats.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
.......... but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
But that isn't the case
My point there being that those jumping on others are being a bit overzealous, just because some may criticise his performance after a game doesn't warrant his staunch defenders to jump down their throats.
But other than Colin no one has there throat jumped upon
People just pointed out that JJ is still a good player, that he did make tackles (which he did) and that his time isn't, ITHO, up.
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
.......... but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
But that isn't the case
My point there being that those jumping on others are being a bit overzealous, just because some may criticise his performance after a game doesn't warrant his staunch defenders to jump down their throats.
But other than Colin no one has there throat jumped upon
People just pointed out that JJ is still a good player, that he did make tackles (which he did) and that his time isn't, ITHO, up.
That is all : - )
Out of curiosity Henry, and I will leave it after this because I respect your opinion and think it a very valid one, have you, or would you ever take to criticise JJ on here, if he has had a poor game?
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
.......... but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
But that isn't the case
My point there being that those jumping on others are being a bit overzealous, just because some may criticise his performance after a game doesn't warrant his staunch defenders to jump down their throats.
But other than Colin no one has there throat jumped upon
People just pointed out that JJ is still a good player, that he did make tackles (which he did) and that his time isn't, ITHO, up.
That is all : - )
Out of curiosity Henry, and I will leave it after this because I respect your opinion and think it a very valid one, have you, or would you ever take to criticise JJ on here, if he has had a poor game?
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
.......... but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
But that isn't the case
My point there being that those jumping on others are being a bit overzealous, just because some may criticise his performance after a game doesn't warrant his staunch defenders to jump down their throats.
But other than Colin no one has there throat jumped upon
People just pointed out that JJ is still a good player, that he did make tackles (which he did) and that his time isn't, ITHO, up.
That is all : - )
Out of curiosity Henry, and I will leave it after this because I respect your opinion and think it a very valid one, have you, or would you ever take to criticise JJ on here, if he has had a poor game?
Yes, I've already said he didn't have a particularly good game v Millwall.
What I don't do is make the huge and unfounded leap to one poor game = career over
I know it isn't always that reliable but whoscored reckon he didn't make a tackle yesterday. Can't say I remember any either. I've generally defended him in the past but I don't think it was a good performance from him. That's not to say I wouldn't want him playing the majority of games but some on here need to take the blinkers off.
He took at least 3 Millwall players out with hard challenges in the first half,the ref had a word with him after the third. Maybe his critics were struggling to get their blinkers off when that happened.
Does that make him a great player? Or a yard off the pace?
he got there as soon as he could.
I think that's the point. He's fouling quite a lot these days and it might just be because his timing has gone at this level. That said, he still does a great job defending corners (bangs those headers away at the near post) and could still get goals in tight games. His finishing ability is excellent and he takes a great number of his chances.
Yet it is the much younger Buyens who has been booked 6 times already, and so banned.
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I find it a circular argument when it comes to JJ. I was very critical of him a few seasons back because I felt he was being played in a role that exposed us in central midfield, and we weren't seeing the consistency he had in league one.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
I disagree.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
What about player threads that are bumped after one of them has a good game though? Or should we make a thread for JJ titled "JJ had a bad game on Saturday (not the come in no 4 your time is up) thread"?
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
And I said the majority haven't so seems you are agreeing with me.
.......... but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
But that isn't the case
My point there being that those jumping on others are being a bit overzealous, just because some may criticise his performance after a game doesn't warrant his staunch defenders to jump down their throats.
But other than Colin no one has there throat jumped upon
People just pointed out that JJ is still a good player, that he did make tackles (which he did) and that his time isn't, ITHO, up.
That is all : - )
Out of curiosity Henry, and I will leave it after this because I respect your opinion and think it a very valid one, have you, or would you ever take to criticise JJ on here, if he has had a poor game?
Yes, I've already said he didn't have a particularly good game v Millwall.
What I don't do is make the huge and unfounded leap to one poor game = career over
I thought he did okay on Saturday, not a good performance, but not a bad one either. I think that could be said about most of our players that day.......
Jackson might be a good leader but his actual play just doesn't really do a lot. Coquelin is now a must start at CM and Buyens is quicker, better defensively and a better passer than Jackson to play next to him.
I know no one is slagging Buyens but some people have said in the past that he needs a rest etc... seems to tire quickly BUT thats two games he's missed now and weve lost them both just saying...
Thought he had a poor game today but he's still in credit for everything he's done for our club, this may be his last season as a regular starter though.
Jackson still has a role to play but for me he should be being subbed on, not off. He came off today because we needed to push forward and pressurise, he cannot do that anymore. He'll hustle and harry and fight his massive heart out in the middle of the pitch but getting from one end to the other is not his forte.
I would quite like to see him in in a role like Harriot played today, a midfielder supporting a striker. He's decent in the air, can still pick passes and mixes it up with bigger, stronger players with ferocity, I daresay he'll be there to pounce on second balls/weak clearances again if he doesn't have to run 60 yards to get there. Let Coquelin and Buyens do the grunt work and let him loose in the final third.
Jackson still has a role to play but for me he should be being subbed on, not off. He came off today because we needed to push forward and pressurise, he cannot do that anymore. He'll hustle and harry and fight his massive heart out in the middle of the pitch but getting from one end to the other is not his forte.
I would quite like to see him in in a role like Harriot played today, a midfielder supporting a striker. He's decent in the air, can still pick passes and mixes it up with bigger, stronger players with ferocity, I daresay he'll be there to pounce on second balls/weak clearances again if he doesn't have to run 60 yards to get there. Let Coquelin and Buyens do the grunt work and let him loose in the final third.
I've often felt the same actually; he could be good at feeding a striker or two - linking up with them and connecting them to the midfield.
Harriott's role relies on pace though; that was clear today. Harriott made some classy runs that I don't think Jacko would've made; however I think Jacko would've buried one of those chances. (I'm thinking of the one where Igor cut back and gave a short cross which Harriott couldn't reach)
Also thought he had a poor game today, not done my ratings yet but really can't remember him making much of a positive impact on the match. As usual chased the long shadows but was off the pace and trademark short passes back to Fox which will inflate his passing success rate.
It's a difficult one because he does provide vital leadership I don't think we had seen from anyone on the pitch since Curbs and not having that leadership was a big factor in our well documented drop to League 1.
He reminds me a lot of Michael Vaughan when he was England cricket captain getting clean bowled out for 2 runs from 30 balls then playing the block afterwards that he should have done. Vaughan's form as a batsman while captain was woeful in particular the latter years of his career but was widely regarded as worthy of a place in the team just for his captaincy skills. A bit like Jacko.
I feel Jacko still has a role to play in the squad we need his leadership but it needs to be in a role coming off the bench now when Buyens is back from injury.
Comments
JJ was never fast so he had no pace to lose.
He is one of the older players and it makes sense to sub him off sometimes to bring on fresh legs
Sometime he will lose his place in the first time and be replaced. That is no great wisdom as that happens to every player.
What is strange is that some have been predicting, and in some case wishing and hoping, that this would happen for at least three seasons now.
It was because he was Powell's favourite we were told.
Yet there he is. Still captain, still starting under Riga and now Peeters. Still doing his job, still coming up with the odd goal, still working hard and pulling the team along, still tackling and still passing.
I don't think he had a particularly good game v Millwall but every one less than brilliant performance brings out the "Come in No 4 your time is up" posts.
As Ben18 said, if it's about one game put it on the post-match views thread rather than on here.
Based on his performances and goals, leadership etc I am happy to admit that I was wrong to be so vehement in my criticism, so have, over time, tried to take a more balanced approach.
He's done so many great things for this club.
However, I definitely do not feel it is a case of hoping/wishing for his time to come to an end or for him to have a bad game. I genuinely feel that in the same way you say people are waiting for him to have a poor game, some of our support never want to criticise him.
Or if he is criticised, then there seems to be an immediate phalanx ready to abolish any contrary opinion.
I get that the title of this thread was on balance probably unfair (given the contribution JJ has, and continues to make). But he's not immune from criticism. I thought he was terrible at home to Wolves this season and they seemed to play through him with ease.
Overall I'm happy to admit I was wrong in my earlier criticism, he is a great player who has done well for us. But I also feel there is a slightly 'blinkered' opinion when it comes to his performances
Come on be sensible about it, the majority of the comments made since Saturday are not about wanted him dropped completely but it seems those who want to defend it are reading something different.
I don't see any blinkers other than those that slate him when he has a poor game and then disappear when he scores the winning goal. Again. That's not aimed at you but it is very tiresome
I don't read anyone saying "he's great, he must start every game for everymore".
What I read is people saying "he's not finished and still has a lot to offer" when a thread whose title is writing him off is bumped yet again.
SOME people have been wishing him gone or should I say Colinsams has been.
or people could just comment on his performance on the post match views or score him on the player ratings.
Why use this thread and then be surprised that people disagree "that his time is up"?
SOME of the comments have been about him being dropped/past it/etc and they have been added to a thread about his time being up so hardly a surprise that those that see his value point out his worth.
You said But that isn't the case
People just pointed out that JJ is still a good player, that he did make tackles (which he did) and that his time isn't, ITHO, up.
That is all : - )
What I don't do is make the huge and unfounded leap to one poor game = career over
Went to shite when he went off.
We lost the midfield completely, coincidence of course.
Every header from defence was reached by an Ipswich player first after Jacko came off, with the CM's nowhere to be seen ...
He offers nothing at all though ...
Personally I think we need to replace Jackson next year, there's no creativity in him at all. Coquelin was our main cm today.
I would quite like to see him in in a role like Harriot played today, a midfielder supporting a striker. He's decent in the air, can still pick passes and mixes it up with bigger, stronger players with ferocity, I daresay he'll be there to pounce on second balls/weak clearances again if he doesn't have to run 60 yards to get there. Let Coquelin and Buyens do the grunt work and let him loose in the final third.
Harriott's role relies on pace though; that was clear today. Harriott made some classy runs that I don't think Jacko would've made; however I think Jacko would've buried one of those chances. (I'm thinking of the one where Igor cut back and gave a short cross which Harriott couldn't reach)
It's a difficult one because he does provide vital leadership I don't think we had seen from anyone on the pitch since Curbs and not having that leadership was a big factor in our well documented drop to League 1.
He reminds me a lot of Michael Vaughan when he was England cricket captain getting clean bowled out for 2 runs from 30 balls then playing the block afterwards that he should have done. Vaughan's form as a batsman while captain was woeful in particular the latter years of his career but was widely regarded as worthy of a place in the team just for his captaincy skills. A bit like Jacko.
I feel Jacko still has a role to play in the squad we need his leadership but it needs to be in a role coming off the bench now when Buyens is back from injury.