My support has been conditional on results, winning is good medicine against my hostility towards Guy Luzon. At just over 1.5 points per game so far it is OK. To achieve success you need very nearly 2 points per game which is what I am expecting henceforth.
Watford, Middlesbrough, Bournemouth, Norwich, Derby etc arent successful in your eyes (given they all are on less than 2 points per game)?
My support has been conditional on results, winning is good medicine against my hostility towards Guy Luzon. At just over 1.5 points per game so far it is OK. To achieve success you need very nearly 2 points per game which is what I am expecting henceforth.
Watford, Middlesbrough, Bournemouth, Norwich, Derby etc arent successful in your eyes (given they all are on less than 2 points per game)?
Watford and Middlesbrough are doing OK, 'cause as you can see I said 'just under' two points average per match.
Yeah I know where you're coming from, and he is getting results.
However I have to come to terms with some other stuff (and it is probably only me) and allegations including:
Luzon's SL coach at the time (de Saart) on the BBC interview when the new regime first took over, saying how Charlton's relationship with SL will play out. The video of Luzon dissing Riga in March last year, where he also was diffident, to say the least, about Charlton, and then saying in his introductory press conference here, that oh yes he knew all about Charlton because of the SL/CAFC tie up from January 2014. Peeters intimating the writing was on the wall for him as soon as Luzon got sacked at SL. The Israeli blogger telling us about the Peeters/Luzon switch ages in advance of it happening, coupled with Luzon having a relative on the Israeli FA, and Dahan as his agent there. The leak turned out to be true. Jimmy Stone saying that Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job ages before he got it. Mrs Luzon following Charlton ages before the Luzon 'fair and open' interview shenanigans. The manner of his appointment. The work permit issue. ...and less importantly wondering why SL fans were so antagonistic and he was described in Belgium as a clown.
Now stacked against those things I have written above, I have to line up winning matches as a positive.
So I admit I have not got past the list I have written above, but others have, and it is my personal journey to resolve those matters. It is also a problem for me that I am taking the above background as a whole rather than in bite sized chunks. Sorry about that, but that's the way it is for me.
Yeah I know where you're coming from, and he is getting results.
However I have to come to terms with some other stuff (and it is probably only me) and allegations including:
Luzon's SL coach at the time (de Saart) on the BBC interview when the new regime first took over, saying how Charlton's relationship with SL will play out. The video of Luzon dissing Riga in March last year, where he also was diffident, to say the least, about Charlton, and then saying in his introductory press conference here, that oh yes he knew all about Charlton because of the SL/CAFC tie up from January 2014. Peeters intimating the writing was on the wall for him as soon as Luzon got sacked at SL. The Israeli blogger telling us about the Peeters/Luzon switch ages in advance of it happening, coupled with Luzon having a relative on the Israeli FA, and Dahan as his agent there. The leak turned out to be true. Jimmy Stone saying that Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job ages before he got it. Mrs Luzon following Charlton ages before the Luzon 'fair and open' interview shenanigans. The manner of his appointment. The work permit issue. ...and less importantly wondering why SL fans were so antagonistic and he was described in Belgium as a clown.
Now stacked against those things I have written above, I have to line up winning matches as a positive.
So I admit I have not got past the list I have written above, but others have, and it is my personal journey to resolve those matters. It is also a problem for me that I am taking the above background as a whole rather than in bite sized chunks. Sorry about that, but that's the way it is for me.
Seth enjoy the moment. My old Millwall supporting neighbour once told me that being a football supporter was “tantamount to masochism”. He’d supported Millwall for 60 years and could only remember about 3 months of glory. The rest was close to misery. The sort of comment you would expect from a Millwall supporter but that probably applies to most football fans. Witness the angst from Arsenal fans towards Arsene Wenger as they crash out of the champions league. We’ve had our own dire moments and will have more in the future. Worry and argue about R.D. Luzen and K.M. if you must, but we Charlton supporters will be here long after they have disappeared and been forgotten.
Yeah I know where you're coming from, and he is getting results.
However I have to come to terms with some other stuff (and it is probably only me) and allegations including:
Luzon's SL coach at the time (de Saart) on the BBC interview when the new regime first took over, saying how Charlton's relationship with SL will play out. The video of Luzon dissing Riga in March last year, where he also was diffident, to say the least, about Charlton, and then saying in his introductory press conference here, that oh yes he knew all about Charlton because of the SL/CAFC tie up from January 2014. Peeters intimating the writing was on the wall for him as soon as Luzon got sacked at SL. The Israeli blogger telling us about the Peeters/Luzon switch ages in advance of it happening, coupled with Luzon having a relative on the Israeli FA, and Dahan as his agent there. The leak turned out to be true. Jimmy Stone saying that Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job ages before he got it. Mrs Luzon following Charlton ages before the Luzon 'fair and open' interview shenanigans. The manner of his appointment. The work permit issue. ...and less importantly wondering why SL fans were so antagonistic and he was described in Belgium as a clown.
Now stacked against those things I have written above, I have to line up winning matches as a positive.
So I admit I have not got past the list I have written above, but others have, and it is my personal journey to resolve those matters. It is also a problem for me that I am taking the above background as a whole rather than in bite sized chunks. Sorry about that, but that's the way it is for me.
Yeah but what else has the Luzon ever not done for us?
Just checked out the statistics for the Millwall home vs Charlton league games only - extremely shocking (those of a sensitive nature please turn your eyes away)...
In the 90 years we have been playing them we have only won three at Millwall's ground. So if Luzon pulls this off - here's a legend in the making...
@seth plum So Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job sometime after he left Liege and everyone except Katrien Meire acknowledged that Peeters was at risk in December. I can live with that. Anyone disrespecting us in the past might be an issue but let's face it, we haven't exactly been a force for seven or eight years.
However I do agree that 1.8 points per game has to be the targe. Not just for Luzon but for the squad and the owner. It's not a major step up from what our squad can deliver but it's a big ask to deliver over 46 games...but the prize is worth the effort and investment - See you at Wembley!
@seth plum So Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job sometime after he left Liege and everyone except Katrien Meire acknowledged that Peeters was at risk in December. I can live with that. Anyone disrespecting us in the past might be an issue but let's face it, we haven't exactly been a force for seven or eight years.
However I do agree that 1.8 points per game has to be the targe. Not just for Luzon but for the squad and the owner. It's not a major step up from what our squad can deliver but it's a big ask to deliver over 46 games...but the prize is worth the effort and investment - See you at Wembley!
Luzon was disrespecting Riga and Charlton after his club had been interacting with us for over two months, then he turns up and intimates that he had a serious working relationship with us from the start of the Duchatelet regime here. Now what I accept is that once here (and he was looking for a job) he has grown to actually like it here, if for no other reason than it pays the bills. He has done a good footballing job in getting us results. I still find it irksome that his regard for us (albeit we were not a premier league 'force') was so dismissive at the same time his club were sending us players, but then he is happy to work at this forceless club, and then he pretended his regard for us had always been high. To Guy Luzon before he came here it seems like we were a job, but I expect our manager to see it as the job, which admittedly he might yet do. In the meantime we can agree that Guy Luzon should aim to get as near as dammit to two points per game so as to avoid tears at bedtime.
Guy Luzon is proving me wrong. He seems to have the players on his side and is producing a style of football that is more pleasing on the eye and is successful. I am yet to be convinced by RD and KM and I do not like the network concept or the way he was appointed. But I think it is time to swallow my pride and return to watch us play, as i am only hurting myself.
I will start going next season, but I haven't decided whether I should get a Season ticket or not. My Mojo is slowly returning helped by the plight of Millsmall.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of GL'S appointment, strictly on a football front you have to say so far so good, but the summer may prove to be make or brake Mr luzon.
Seth. GL is an employee not a supporter. He has no real love for us or Standard. He is a football coach in a profession where one minute here, next minute gone. He says the right things at the right time to suit the situation. Just like I dare say you would do in your job. Job is the right word. That's not to say he doesn't desperately want to succeed every game. If he does his star rises in his chosen profession and bigger jobs will follow. It's called professionalism. I'm sure that Charlton Athletic are his 100% focus until he's somewhere else. Just like any other football coach.
As a real supporter I am very happy for this to be exactly the case.
It was a long journey from mid-table FAPL down to League 1 and it has taken a fair bit of time and cash to make two steps back - promotion from League 1 and then moving towards being a top 8 team. Hopefully Luzon and Staprix backing help us take the next step into the top six. I can understand if fans take exception to the turbulence and change of the last 14 months but I think we're in a good place now. If Luzon does his stuff in the last eight games then it's down to others to deliver an uplift and a squad fit for 2015-16.
Seth. GL is an employee not a supporter. He has no real love for us or Standard. He is a football coach in a profession where one minute here, next minute gone. He says the right things at the right time to suit the situation. Just like I dare say you would do in your job. Job is the right word. That's not to say he doesn't desperately want to succeed every game. If he does his star rises in his chosen profession and bigger jobs will follow. It's called professionalism. I'm sure that Charlton Athletic are his 100% focus until he's somewhere else. Just like any other football coach.
As a real supporter I am very happy for this to be exactly the case.
Yes and evidence for me that Charlton Athletic are his 100% focus, is if he delivers despite his chameleon qualities. I have said from the outset that I agree with Luzon that we like to win. As a character he would undoubtedly not like me, and there are aspects of his character judging by what has been exposed to us which I don't like at all. You describe it as being a professional, fair enough, I see it more like Luzon is a functionary whose job is to deliver results. I certainly don't expect him to make excuses, and blame others as he does here:
Three things happened to turn this season around 1. Tony Watt arrived and we had the extra striker we have needed all season 2. Eagles,Johnson and Diarra arrived and we had the experience in depth we have needed all season 3. Luzon played 4-4-2 with two strikers and two proper wingers, a system which has enabled almost every player to play to their strengths
Give the management credit for all the above, but also ask why when it was obvious what the problems were, why it took so long to sort out.
Three things happened to turn this season around 1. Tony Watt arrived and we had the extra striker we have needed all season 2. Eagles,Johnson and Diarra arrived and we had the experience in depth we have needed all season 3. Luzon played 4-4-2 with two strikers and two proper wingers, a system which has enabled almost every player to play to their strengths
Give the management credit for all the above, but also ask why when it was obvious what the problems were, why it took so long to sort out.
4. Bulot returned and was played by a coach who knew what he could do 5. Henderson came back from injury.
What's done is done but we need decent cover and / or proper use of the loan market to realise our potential in 2015-16. It all costs money but the value add to our squad pays for it and even just a 25% crack at the FAPL makes more sense than 14th place.
Three things happened to turn this season around 1. Tony Watt arrived and we had the extra striker we have needed all season 2. Eagles,Johnson and Diarra arrived and we had the experience in depth we have needed all season 3. Luzon played 4-4-2 with two strikers and two proper wingers, a system which has enabled almost every player to play to their strengths
Give the management credit for all the above, but also ask why when it was obvious what the problems were, why it took so long to sort out.
All good points but I don't think you are building into your summary just how well our players are performing and how they have all seemed to have bought into Luzon's ethos. He has had praise from several senior players and well of course the results speak for themselves.
It's just my humble opinion but so far I don't think Luzon has put a foot wrong.
Seth sets out all the reasons why we don't necessarily like him, and I agree with those reasons.
I think he is arrogant, isn't worried what fans think and his main concern is keeping his job. That means a focus on winning for RD and if he keeps RD happy he keeps the fans happy.
So Seth, don't feel guilty you need to like him to support his actions on the field, just take what he's delivering and enjoy.
The difference is that, unlike CP, he probably will not have much credit built up with fans to carry him through difficult times.
I only post under one username here. I have stated why I feel the way I do about Guy Luzon pretty clearly, if anybody wants to point out flaws or contradictions in what I write please do, I am prepared to acknowledge when I am wrong.
Seth sets out all the reasons why we don't necessarily like him, and I agree with those reasons.
I think he is arrogant, isn't worried what fans think and his main concern is keeping his job. That means a focus on winning for RD and if he keeps RD happy he keeps the fans happy.
So Seth, don't feel guilty you need to like him to support his actions on the field, just take what he's delivering and enjoy.
The difference is that, unlike CP, he probably will not have much credit built up with fans to carry him through difficult times.
Have to disagree about arrogant. He's no Alan Pardew for sure.
His statements are nearly always about his players and he deflects questions about what he has done.
Whether that is just for the press and he is arrogant elsewhere I don't know.
After a poor start in terms of results (the method of appointment isn't down to him, the work permit issue irrelevant IMHO) the team and results have improved.
Is he the messiah? No, not yet. People were hailing Peeters as God's gift and even the third best manager in our history after his good start remember.
A good run at the end of a season isn't the same as keeping a team at the top of the table over a whole season or a number of seasons when every game matters. We are already in post-season mode as seen by the Blackburn game and Wilson being allowed to go.
Next season will be the real test. I for one hope he's here to take it and passes with flying colours. Like the original poster said 100% support.
Yeah, I don't think he has come across all that arrogant in any interviews I've seen/read. A lot of self-confidence to be sure, a lot of self-belief even in times when everyone else has less faith in him which can look a lot like arrogance but it's not quite the same thing. He's never once tried to take credit for turning things around from a 5-0 walloping to several 3-0 victories in quick succession - he's always given the kudos to the players.
Full support from me. The network is shite, but Luzon's alright..
Why's it shite?
We've been given some real pony but it seems the standard from SL has gone up and without it I don't think quality players like TBH, Bulot, Buyens and Watt would be here.
Comments
Yeah I know where you're coming from, and he is getting results.
However I have to come to terms with some other stuff (and it is probably only me) and allegations including:
Luzon's SL coach at the time (de Saart) on the BBC interview when the new regime first took over, saying how Charlton's relationship with SL will play out.
The video of Luzon dissing Riga in March last year, where he also was diffident, to say the least, about Charlton, and then saying in his introductory press conference here, that oh yes he knew all about Charlton because of the SL/CAFC tie up from January 2014.
Peeters intimating the writing was on the wall for him as soon as Luzon got sacked at SL.
The Israeli blogger telling us about the Peeters/Luzon switch ages in advance of it happening, coupled with Luzon having a relative on the Israeli FA, and Dahan as his agent there. The leak turned out to be true.
Jimmy Stone saying that Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job ages before he got it.
Mrs Luzon following Charlton ages before the Luzon 'fair and open' interview shenanigans.
The manner of his appointment.
The work permit issue.
...and less importantly wondering why SL fans were so antagonistic and he was described in Belgium as a clown.
Now stacked against those things I have written above, I have to line up winning matches as a positive.
So I admit I have not got past the list I have written above, but others have, and it is my personal journey to resolve those matters. It is also a problem for me that I am taking the above background as a whole rather than in bite sized chunks.
Sorry about that, but that's the way it is for me.
Seth enjoy the moment. My old Millwall supporting neighbour once told me that being a football supporter was “tantamount to masochism”.
He’d supported Millwall for 60 years and could only remember about 3 months of glory. The rest was close to misery.
The sort of comment you would expect from a Millwall supporter but that probably applies to most football fans.
Witness the angst from Arsenal fans towards Arsene Wenger as they crash out of the champions league.
We’ve had our own dire moments and will have more in the future.
Worry and argue about R.D. Luzen and K.M. if you must, but we Charlton supporters will be here long after they have disappeared and been forgotten.
In the 90 years we have been playing them we have only won three at Millwall's ground. So if Luzon pulls this off - here's a legend in the making...
So Luzon was manoeuvring for the Charlton job sometime after he left Liege and everyone except Katrien Meire acknowledged that Peeters was at risk in December. I can live with that.
Anyone disrespecting us in the past might be an issue but let's face it, we haven't exactly been a force for seven or eight years.
However I do agree that 1.8 points per game has to be the targe. Not just for Luzon but for the squad and the owner. It's not a major step up from what our squad can deliver but it's a big ask to deliver over 46 games...but the prize is worth the effort and investment -
See you at Wembley!
Now what I accept is that once here (and he was looking for a job) he has grown to actually like it here, if for no other reason than it pays the bills. He has done a good footballing job in getting us results.
I still find it irksome that his regard for us (albeit we were not a premier league 'force') was so dismissive at the same time his club were sending us players, but then he is happy to work at this forceless club, and then he pretended his regard for us had always been high. To Guy Luzon before he came here it seems like we were a job, but I expect our manager to see it as the job, which admittedly he might yet do.
In the meantime we can agree that Guy Luzon should aim to get as near as dammit to two points per game so as to avoid tears at bedtime.
I am yet to be convinced by RD and KM and I do not like the network concept or the way he was appointed. But I think it is time to swallow my pride and return to watch us play, as i am only hurting myself.
I will start going next season, but I haven't decided whether I should get a Season ticket or not. My Mojo is slowly returning helped by the plight of Millsmall.
As a real supporter I am very happy for this to be exactly the case.
Some grips need getting
Hopefully Luzon and Staprix backing help us take the next step into the top six.
I can understand if fans take exception to the turbulence and change of the last 14 months but I think we're in a good place now.
If Luzon does his stuff in the last eight games then it's down to others to deliver an uplift and a squad fit for 2015-16.
1. Tony Watt arrived and we had the extra striker we have needed all season
2. Eagles,Johnson and Diarra arrived and we had the experience in depth we have needed all season
3. Luzon played 4-4-2 with two strikers and two proper wingers, a system which has enabled almost every player to play to their strengths
Give the management credit for all the above, but also ask why when it was obvious what the problems were, why it took so long to sort out.
5. Henderson came back from injury.
What's done is done but we need decent cover and / or proper use of the loan market to realise our potential in 2015-16. It all costs money but the value add to our squad pays for it and even just a 25% crack at the FAPL makes more sense than 14th place.
It's just my humble opinion but so far I don't think Luzon has put a foot wrong.
Full Support from me and i was one of the first to bitch about his appointment.
One difference is that I consistently praise Guy Luzon when we win.
I think he is arrogant, isn't worried what fans think and his main concern is keeping his job. That means a focus on winning for RD and if he keeps RD happy he keeps the fans happy.
So Seth, don't feel guilty you need to like him to support his actions on the field, just take what he's delivering and enjoy.
The difference is that, unlike CP, he probably will not have much credit built up with fans to carry him through difficult times.
ColinSethHis statements are nearly always about his players and he deflects questions about what he has done.
Whether that is just for the press and he is arrogant elsewhere I don't know.
After a poor start in terms of results (the method of appointment isn't down to him, the work permit issue irrelevant IMHO) the team and results have improved.
Is he the messiah? No, not yet. People were hailing Peeters as God's gift and even the third best manager in our history after his good start remember.
A good run at the end of a season isn't the same as keeping a team at the top of the table over a whole season or a number of seasons when every game matters. We are already in post-season mode as seen by the Blackburn game and Wilson being allowed to go.
Next season will be the real test. I for one hope he's here to take it and passes with flying colours. Like the original poster said 100% support.
We've been given some real pony but it seems the standard from SL has gone up and without it I don't think quality players like TBH, Bulot, Buyens and Watt would be here.
Oh and Luzon is far from arrogant.