Because he ain't good enough, hardly broke into the hamsters first team, and has stagnated since leaving,
Scott Parker was stagnating in our reserves until he was 20/21.
Jordan, Joe and Morgan are playing first team football in an average championship side and none are anywhere NEAR as good as poyet was when he was playing for us last season. Your comments make no sense.
I'm not sure I'm having that Cousins or Gomez are "nowhere near" as good as Poyet was last season. I don't know if his development has stagnated at West Ham, quite frankly I'm not sure how it's possible to say, but I think there's a bit of revisionism going on. He was a very good player and I was gutted to lose him for free but not nearly as gutted as I'd be if Gomez (or Cousins for that matter) left this summer.
I think if there's revisionism going in its coming from you. You're bonkers. Check out the end of season statbank for last year mate. I'm afraid to say Cousins is still significantly short of the left Poyet was this time last year.
He's gone, he's left, he's moved on, he's made his bed and he has to lie in it, he has shuffled off his Charlton coil, he is an ex Addick.
He might have played earlier if the Spiv bros weren't skint and not able to pay the first team appearance money set out in his contract. Hence why he played as soon as RD arrived.
He might have signed a new longer contract if the spiv bros weren't skint and so let his and quite a few other VALUABLE contracts run down. Too late by the time RD arrived, Powell and then Riga left and he saw the £££ and chance to be on MOTD every week.
But they didn't so he didn't and so we move on.
He'll be back on loan next season anyway and we'll see what we missed. FACT
But it wasn't a wanky excuse was it? The way Charlton was being run at the time was an absolute farce. Infact, did we even have a manager at the time?!
We let ourselves down by not getting his contract sorted earlier.
Exactly, the way he performed in the first team may have surprised the fans, but there is no way it would have surprised the coaches who had seen him in training.
Why did we wait until he was playing first team football and getting MOTM awards left, right and centre to offer him a contract, if we had that much faith in him we would have done it before he broke into the first team.
We showed no faith in him, so why should he show
CAFC Dave just explained it to you Paulie - do him the courtesy of reading what he says before spouting off again.
how is anything I put there against what CAFC Dave said, I was agreeing with cafctom, who was disagreeing with dave's point about a wanky excuse.
once again I would like to no why u singled me out, when it was cafctom who originally disagreed with dave about the wanky excuse and yet its me who you decide to start arguing with.
how about you do me the courtesy of reading things properly
Well firstly you agreeing with someone who is disagreeing, is you also disagreeing (if you see what I mean) and secondly, you trotted out the same tired BS comparing the real world's wages to football, and at the same time calling people liars or mugs who disagree with your opinion. How much ruder do you want to get? CAFC Dave had put you straight on that, and you just brushed over it as if he had said nothing at all?
I also didn't pick you up on not finishing your sentence as it was clear that missing words were going to be [so why should he show] faith in us. That Dave had explained with:
"If I had been brought through and trained at my company from such a young age and asked to sign a new contract to enable them to get a better return on their investment in me then I wouldn't just run down my contract and make up some wanky excuse about the manager."
I have never pulled you up on ANYTHING before, but this time I don't appreciate being called a liar or a mug because I would have shown some loyalty for exactly the reasons Dave gave.
I'm confused Paulie, you apparently didn't reply before due to the fear of being kicked off Charlton Life when CAFCFAN and NLA offered good points about Poyet's career no progressing but now you're back replying with a different argument. So nothing to do with you having no answer to the argument and to why if Poyet had progressed so much was his Huddersfield loan spell so unsuccessful? Me thinks you have a Messi like Man crush on young Diego.
Because he ain't good enough, hardly broke into the hamsters first team, and has stagnated since leaving,
Scott Parker was stagnating in our reserves until he was 20/21.
Jordan, Joe and Morgan are playing first team football in an average championship side and none are anywhere NEAR as good as poyet was when he was playing for us last season. Your comments make no sense.
I'm not sure I'm having that Cousins or Gomez are "nowhere near" as good as Poyet was last season. I don't know if his development has stagnated at West Ham, quite frankly I'm not sure how it's possible to say, but I think there's a bit of revisionism going on. He was a very good player and I was gutted to lose him for free but not nearly as gutted as I'd be if Gomez (or Cousins for that matter) left this summer.
I think if there's revisionism going in its coming from you. You're bonkers. Check out the end of season statbank for last year mate. I'm afraid to say Cousins is still significantly short of the left Poyet was this time last year.
But it wasn't a wanky excuse was it? The way Charlton was being run at the time was an absolute farce. Infact, did we even have a manager at the time?!
We let ourselves down by not getting his contract sorted earlier.
Exactly, the way he performed in the first team may have surprised the fans, but there is no way it would have surprised the coaches who had seen him in training.
Why did we wait until he was playing first team football and getting MOTM awards left, right and centre to offer him a contract, if we had that much faith in him we would have done it before he broke into the first team.
We showed no faith in him, so why should he show
CAFC Dave just explained it to you Paulie - do him the courtesy of reading what he says before spouting off again.
how is anything I put there against what CAFC Dave said, I was agreeing with cafctom, who was disagreeing with dave's point about a wanky excuse.
once again I would like to no why u singled me out, when it was cafctom who originally disagreed with dave about the wanky excuse and yet its me who you decide to start arguing with.
how about you do me the courtesy of reading things properly
Well firstly you agreeing with someone who is disagreeing, is you also disagreeing (if you see what I mean) and secondly, you trotted out the same tired BS comparing the real world's wages to football, and at the same time calling people liars or mugs who disagree with your opinion. How much ruder do you want to get? CAFC Dave had put you straight on that, and you just brushed over it as if he had said nothing at all?
I also didn't pick you up on not finishing your sentence as it was clear that missing words were going to be [so why should he show] faith in us. That Dave had explained with:
"If I had been brought through and trained at my company from such a young age and asked to sign a new contract to enable them to get a better return on their investment in me then I wouldn't just run down my contract and make up some wanky excuse about the manager."
I have never pulled you up on ANYTHING before, but this time I don't appreciate being called a liar or a mug because I would have shown some loyalty for exactly the reasons Dave gave.
I was not being rude far from it, I used his wages as an example, it may not be real world to you and me, but to him it is my point about the wages are we all no there is no such thing as loyalty in football anymore, its a clear fact and if you are being offered double you wages elsewhere, you would take it, and I stick by what I said if you say you would not take it you are a liar or a mug.
if you have a family and can honestly say you would not take the higher offer, then a few months/years later you have a serious accident and can no longer work, you are putting your family's future at risk.
I don't think that's at all rude just a the way life is
I will never agree with your view point that he is a judas and unloyal and you will never agree with my view point that I have no issue with him leaving for his family and his career
He might have played earlier if the Spiv bros weren't skint and not able to pay the first team appearance money set out in his contract. Hence why he played as soon as RD arrived.
But it wasn't a wanky excuse was it? The way Charlton was being run at the time was an absolute farce. Infact, did we even have a manager at the time?!
We let ourselves down by not getting his contract sorted earlier.
Exactly, the way he performed in the first team may have surprised the fans, but there is no way it would have surprised the coaches who had seen him in training.
Why did we wait until he was playing first team football and getting MOTM awards left, right and centre to offer him a contract, if we had that much faith in him we would have done it before he broke into the first team.
We showed no faith in him, so why should he show
CAFC Dave just explained it to you Paulie - do him the courtesy of reading what he says before spouting off again.
how is anything I put there against what CAFC Dave said, I was agreeing with cafctom, who was disagreeing with dave's point about a wanky excuse.
once again I would like to no why u singled me out, when it was cafctom who originally disagreed with dave about the wanky excuse and yet its me who you decide to start arguing with.
how about you do me the courtesy of reading things properly
Well firstly you agreeing with someone who is disagreeing, is you also disagreeing (if you see what I mean) and secondly, you trotted out the same tired BS comparing the real world's wages to football, and at the same time calling people liars or mugs who disagree with your opinion. How much ruder do you want to get? CAFC Dave had put you straight on that, and you just brushed over it as if he had said nothing at all?
I also didn't pick you up on not finishing your sentence as it was clear that missing words were going to be [so why should he show] faith in us. That Dave had explained with:
"If I had been brought through and trained at my company from such a young age and asked to sign a new contract to enable them to get a better return on their investment in me then I wouldn't just run down my contract and make up some wanky excuse about the manager."
I have never pulled you up on ANYTHING before, but this time I don't appreciate being called a liar or a mug because I would have shown some loyalty for exactly the reasons Dave gave.
I was not being rude far from it, I used his wages as an example, it may not be real world to you and me, but to him it is my point about the wages are we all no there is no such thing as loyalty in football anymore, its a clear fact and if you are being offered double you wages elsewhere, you would take it, and I stick by what I said if you say you would not take it you are a liar or a mug.
if you have a family and can honestly say you would not take the higher offer, then a few months/years later you have a serious accident and can no longer work, you are putting your family's future at risk.
I don't think that's at all rude just a the way life is
He might have played earlier if the Spiv bros weren't skint and not able to pay the first team appearance money set out in his contract. Hence why he played as soon as RD arrived.
I will never agree with your view point that he is a judas and unloyal and you will never agree with my view point that I have no issue with him leaving for his family and his career
He's gone, he's left, he's moved on, he's made his bed and he has to lie in it, he has shuffled off his Charlton coil, he is an ex Addick.
He might have played earlier if the Spiv bros weren't skint and not able to pay the first team appearance money set out in his contract. Hence why he played as soon as RD arrived.
He might have signed a new longer contract if the spiv bros weren't skint and so let his and quite a few other VALUABLE contracts run down. Too late by the time RD arrived, Powell and then Riga left and he saw the £££ and chance to be on MOTD every week.
But they didn't so he didn't and so we move on.
He'll be back on loan next season anyway and we'll see what we missed. FACT
Fact Henry? Did K.M. say at the Bromley supporters meeting that Bob did not want him back at Charlton. Implying that possibility he had been offered/ wanted to return?
Look at Cousins when he needlessly gives away possession 3-4 times a game and try telling me Poyet would makes the same errors. Whether Poyet has progressed or declined is a separate issue, but for me the Poyet we saw last season is a notch or two above Cousins in technique alone and pretty much any other midfielder we've produced since Parker.
Of course many here don't want to admit that, but then again the MOTM stats from last year show exactly how good he was. The whole "but he didn't have much competition" argument doesn't rub for me - he was just quality in every game he played.
That's not to say players didn't move for money, of course they did often illegal though but there was less incentive and a much smaller differential between clubs.
Look at Cousins when he needlessly gives away possession 3-4 times a game and try telling me Poyet would makes the same errors. Whether Poyet has progressed or declined is a separate issue, but for me the Poyet we saw last season is a notch or two above Cousins in technique alone and pretty much any other midfielder we've produced since Parker.
Of course many here don't want to admit that, but then again the MOTM stats from last year show exactly how good he was. The whole "but he didn't have much competition" argument doesn't rub for me - he was just quality in every game he played.
Different players though. Cousins is the kind of player who you expect to give the ball away more. He's dynamic, throws himself around the pitch and tries to drive the ball forward. He plays a very aggressive game and that will result in him losing possession more. He still loses it more than he should but he's improving. Poyet plays a slow passing game where he sits a lot deeper to give himself time and only ventures up the pitch with the play ahead of him. Their styles would complement each other well in a team and I don't think it's really fair to compare them on passing. Both very good young players.
I witnessed poyet give the ball away on numerous occasions last season, and in very dangerous positions on the pitch, it's part and parcel of the game and part of their education, it never detracted from the good he done as I don't think it gave away a goal at the time
I witnessed poyet give the ball away on numerous occasions last season, and in very dangerous positions on the pitch, it's part and parcel of the game and part of their education, it never detracted from the good he done as I don't think it gave away a goal at the time
I am sure there was one game last season after which he felt compeled to apologise for his performance.
He won't have improved his footballing capability by not playing in the last 9 months but he has improved his net wealth.
I witnessed poyet give the ball away on numerous occasions last season, and in very dangerous positions on the pitch, it's part and parcel of the game and part of their education, it never detracted from the good he done as I don't think it gave away a goal at the time
I am sure there was one game last season after which he felt compeled to apologise for his performance.
He won't have improved his footballing capability by not playing in the last 9 months but he has improved his net wealth.
GB.
Brighton away-it cost a goal I seem to recall. Although there were others who were worse on the day.
But it wasn't a wanky excuse was it? The way Charlton was being run at the time was an absolute farce. Infact, did we even have a manager at the time?!
We let ourselves down by not getting his contract sorted earlier.
Exactly, the way he performed in the first team may have surprised the fans, but there is no way it would have surprised the coaches who had seen him in training.
Why did we wait until he was playing first team football and getting MOTM awards left, right and centre to offer him a contract, if we had that much faith in him we would have done it before he broke into the first team.
We showed no faith in him, so why should he show
CAFC Dave just explained it to you Paulie - do him the courtesy of reading what he says before spouting off again.
how is anything I put there against what CAFC Dave said, I was agreeing with cafctom, who was disagreeing with dave's point about a wanky excuse.
once again I would like to no why u singled me out, when it was cafctom who originally disagreed with dave about the wanky excuse and yet its me who you decide to start arguing with.
how about you do me the courtesy of reading things properly
Well firstly you agreeing with someone who is disagreeing, is you also disagreeing (if you see what I mean) and secondly, you trotted out the same tired BS comparing the real world's wages to football, and at the same time calling people liars or mugs who disagree with your opinion. How much ruder do you want to get? CAFC Dave had put you straight on that, and you just brushed over it as if he had said nothing at all?
I also didn't pick you up on not finishing your sentence as it was clear that missing words were going to be [so why should he show] faith in us. That Dave had explained with:
"If I had been brought through and trained at my company from such a young age and asked to sign a new contract to enable them to get a better return on their investment in me then I wouldn't just run down my contract and make up some wanky excuse about the manager."
I have never pulled you up on ANYTHING before, but this time I don't appreciate being called a liar or a mug because I would have shown some loyalty for exactly the reasons Dave gave.
if you are being offered double you wages elsewhere, you would take it, and I stick by what I said if you say you would not take it you are a liar or a mug.
I've just accepted a new job at about a 30% reduction on what my current pay is, because it offers better career development. While I work my notice, it's being suggested around me that when they replace me they'll have to offer about 20-30% more to a new person than they currently pay me.
But it wasn't a wanky excuse was it? The way Charlton was being run at the time was an absolute farce. Infact, did we even have a manager at the time?!
We let ourselves down by not getting his contract sorted earlier.
Exactly, the way he performed in the first team may have surprised the fans, but there is no way it would have surprised the coaches who had seen him in training.
Why did we wait until he was playing first team football and getting MOTM awards left, right and centre to offer him a contract, if we had that much faith in him we would have done it before he broke into the first team.
We showed no faith in him, so why should he show
CAFC Dave just explained it to you Paulie - do him the courtesy of reading what he says before spouting off again.
how is anything I put there against what CAFC Dave said, I was agreeing with cafctom, who was disagreeing with dave's point about a wanky excuse.
once again I would like to no why u singled me out, when it was cafctom who originally disagreed with dave about the wanky excuse and yet its me who you decide to start arguing with.
how about you do me the courtesy of reading things properly
Well firstly you agreeing with someone who is disagreeing, is you also disagreeing (if you see what I mean) and secondly, you trotted out the same tired BS comparing the real world's wages to football, and at the same time calling people liars or mugs who disagree with your opinion. How much ruder do you want to get? CAFC Dave had put you straight on that, and you just brushed over it as if he had said nothing at all?
I also didn't pick you up on not finishing your sentence as it was clear that missing words were going to be [so why should he show] faith in us. That Dave had explained with:
"If I had been brought through and trained at my company from such a young age and asked to sign a new contract to enable them to get a better return on their investment in me then I wouldn't just run down my contract and make up some wanky excuse about the manager."
I have never pulled you up on ANYTHING before, but this time I don't appreciate being called a liar or a mug because I would have shown some loyalty for exactly the reasons Dave gave.
if you are being offered double you wages elsewhere, you would take it, and I stick by what I said if you say you would not take it you are a liar or a mug.
I've just accepted a new job at about a 30% reduction on what my current pay is, because it offers better career development. While I work my notice, it's being suggested around me that when they replace me they'll have to offer about 20-30% more to a new person than they currently pay me.
Diego looked good with poor players around him. There's the argument to say that better players would have made him look better, but you could also say that he wouldn't have looked as special if others were technically better. We were on the back foot at the time for most games so he saw a lot of the ball.
It's a bit like standing next to your ugly mate at the bar to make yourself look better.
I'd question whether he's as good as Buyens (not talking about 'potential', just at this stage). I certainly wouldn't want the judas back either way, however well people feel they can justify his actions.
I agree with this 100%
Can either of you honestly say if you was being offered 5k a week(for arguments sake) at your current employer, but someone else offered you 10k a week, with better facilities that you would say no to the 10k out of loyalty.
If you say you would you are either
1- A Liar 2- A mug who does not care about providing for their family in the future if something happens to you and you can't bring a wage in
Hmm. Not sure what to make of that post. I have been offered significant pay increases to leave my current employer. I have a young family and am fortunate enough to live reasonably comfortably on my current salary relatively speaking. I am not lying so can only assume you think I am a mug which I find offensive!
Everyone's always talking about this golden era when footballers wouldn't move clubs for a higher wage... When was this exactly?
No one has talked about a golden age in around 100 posts on this thread though Chunes, and I see that others have answered your question anyway...
A lot of references to the idea that footballers aren't loyal anymore. On this thread and many like it. Which implies a golden age when they were loyal.
I'm told they were, more than 52 years ago. But as there was a wage cap, it's actually not possible to say that players didn't move clubs for more money, because they weren't offered any. You can't put it down to club loyalty when there was nothing to test that loyalty.
No player should be loyal imo, in a time when football has gone insane wages wise, loyalty is something that you either have inside you or you don't however when a player shows loyalty no matter what happens from then on fans appreciate respect and love the player for it,
Footballers are all in football for the love of the game they love the adoration from the fans and they need it to perform,
It's a double edge sword I will always defend and give gratitude to any player that gives loyalty out of respect to our club and to the fans regardless of where they end up playing and for who (except the two obvious clubs)
But players and fans can not get the hump when they are questioned and given abuse for not showing or leaving loyalty to be questioned, Jonjo, jenkinson, bowyer never will get slated by me because they showed bucket loads of respect and loyalty to our club, parker, poyet, Murphy and the like I have no time for it have no interest in their career or their futures and enjoy any lows they have as much as I enjoyed the highs they gave us
Comments
He might have played earlier if the Spiv bros weren't skint and not able to pay the first team appearance money set out in his contract. Hence why he played as soon as RD arrived.
He might have signed a new longer contract if the spiv bros weren't skint and so let his and quite a few other VALUABLE contracts run down. Too late by the time RD arrived, Powell and then Riga left and he saw the £££ and chance to be on MOTD every week.
But they didn't so he didn't and so we move on.
He'll be back on loan next season anyway and we'll see what we missed. FACT
I also didn't pick you up on not finishing your sentence as it was clear that missing words were going to be [so why should he show] faith in us. That Dave had explained with:
"If I had been brought through and trained at my company from such a young age and asked to sign a new contract to enable them to get a better return on their investment in me then I wouldn't just run down my contract and make up some wanky excuse about the manager."
I have never pulled you up on ANYTHING before, but this time I don't appreciate being called a liar or a mug because I would have shown some loyalty for exactly the reasons Dave gave.
my point about the wages are we all no there is no such thing as loyalty in football anymore, its a clear fact
and if you are being offered double you wages elsewhere, you would take it, and I stick by what I said if you say you would not take it you are a liar or a mug.
if you have a family and can honestly say you would not take the higher offer, then a few months/years later you have a serious accident and can no longer work, you are putting your family's future at risk.
I don't think that's at all rude just a the way life is
I will never agree with your view point that he is a judas and unloyal
and you will never agree with my view point that I have no issue with him leaving for his family and his career
Did K.M. say at the Bromley supporters meeting that Bob did not want him back at Charlton.
Implying that possibility he had been offered/ wanted to return?
Of course many here don't want to admit that, but then again the MOTM stats from last year show exactly how good he was. The whole "but he didn't have much competition" argument doesn't rub for me - he was just quality in every game he played.
Bosman was another landmark.
That's not to say players didn't move for money, of course they did often illegal though but there was less incentive and a much smaller differential between clubs.
If it's being at a club in a higher division on bigger wages then Poyet's career has progressed.
If it's playing first team football then you could certainly say that Poyet has stagnated.
However if you try and measure it in terms of pure footballing ability, then it's hard to tell as we are all in no position to really judge that.
Perhaps it's a combination of all the factors above.
He won't have improved his footballing capability by not playing in the last 9 months but he has improved his net wealth.
GB.
Am I a liar or a mug?
Thanks.
I'm told they were, more than 52 years ago. But as there was a wage cap, it's actually not possible to say that players didn't move clubs for more money, because they weren't offered any. You can't put it down to club loyalty when there was nothing to test that loyalty.
Footballers are all in football for the love of the game they love the adoration from the fans and they need it to perform,
It's a double edge sword I will always defend and give gratitude to any player that gives loyalty out of respect to our club and to the fans regardless of where they end up playing and for who (except the two obvious clubs)
But players and fans can not get the hump when they are questioned and given abuse for not showing or leaving loyalty to be questioned, Jonjo, jenkinson, bowyer never will get slated by me because they showed bucket loads of respect and loyalty to our club, parker, poyet, Murphy and the like I have no time for it have no interest in their career or their futures and enjoy any lows they have as much as I enjoyed the highs they gave us