He's obviously a consummate politician, a leader, a figure without sleaze and a man of great authority and social conscience. The sort of leader we could really pull together behind.
Now he's finished his term in the US can we get Obama over here please?
Why? I'm led to believe his policies (and him) are both hated and rated over their. He's hardly been a 100% success so what is the justification?
I'm sure SD could explain better than me, but I thought he was being hamstrung by a Republican majority in the Senate. For instance, I think Obama was working on a major climate change deal but Congress wouldn't even agree that climate change is a real thing.
Yes since 2010, when he was two years into office, he's been working with a Republican house and since 20...14 I think, a Republican Senate. All sense of cross-party cooperation has broken down. It started early, in 2009, when all Republicans in Congress announced as he was driving over to Capital Hill that they would, in party unison, vote against the bill. At the time I thought it was too small a package, still do. But it's worth noting that he came in with an ~8.9% unemployment rate, and he's leaving with it at 4.9%. Unemployment rates are not the be-all-end-all, they don't look at those outside of the workforce or at real wages, and wages are only starting to recover after the 2009 crash, but he undoubtedly stopped the bleeding.
He has also tried to raise taxes on the rich, and he did succeed in creating one new tax bracket, for those above ~450k at a level of 37.5% federal tax.
It's also worth noting that the president cannot write or formally propose legislation--but he drives an agenda which Democratic congressmen put into bills.
Regarding Leuth's healthcare claim, ummm, kind of. I have a lot of problem with Obamacare, the biggest of which is that it expanded the private sector in healthcare and has lead to further record profits for healthcare companies. Meanwhile, the costs to everyone has gone up (myself included). And the quality of care hasn't improved, and there is seemingly no provision for how to improve it in this country--another thing I've had an absolutely terrible time with over the last two years. The whole thing is something I could go into at essay length.
He's not a perfect president, yes he's more hawkish than I would prefer, including some of our more covert interventions in places like Pakistan and Yemen. But he is a good leader with a social conscious that he's really found in his last term.
Would love to hear what Limey thinks though, I know his feelings are completely different. Want to hear the policies he doesn't like and/or have hurt him.
The irony that the election will be lost by Trump, by Latino voters in Florida, Nevada and potentially Arizona isn't lost on me.
It's pretty funny as well
Latinos and women will, I think, be the two major voting blocs who ensure Hillary Clinton is the next President. Let's also not forget Florida and North Carolina.
It's weird, it's almost like if you don't insult people you might have more appeal...
The irony that the election will be lost by Trump, by Latino voters in Florida, Nevada and potentially Arizona isn't lost on me.
It's pretty funny as well
Latinos and women will, I think, be the two major voting blocs who ensure Hillary Clinton is the next President. Let's also not forget Florida and North Carolina.
It's weird, it's almost like if you don't insult people you might have more appeal...
NC early voting looks weirdly down for African American's, been quiet a bit of voter suppression by the GOP and the Trump Campaign, so NC is toss up, but I reckon Clinton will get to 315 ECV
The irony that the election will be lost by Trump, by Latino voters in Florida, Nevada and potentially Arizona isn't lost on me.
It's pretty funny as well
Latinos and women will, I think, be the two major voting blocs who ensure Hillary Clinton is the next President. Let's also not forget Florida and North Carolina.
It's weird, it's almost like if you don't insult people you might have more appeal...
NC early voting looks weirdly down for African American's, been quiet a bit of voter suppression by the GOP and the Trump Campaign, so NC is toss up, but I reckon Clinton will get to 315 ECV
True, although the Latino vote is up, and early polling places in North Carolina have been reduced which leads nicely on to:
Now he's finished his term in the US can we get Obama over here please?
Why? I'm led to believe his policies (and him) are both hated and rated over their. He's hardly been a 100% success so what is the justification?
I cannot recommend enough the repeats they are currently showing of Inside Obamas White House on BBC2 at the mo'. Watched it when first on and watching it again through the lense of the current campaign now.
I know its the Beeb so will be "biased, lefty twaddle, etc, etc" but it shows just how difficult a time he has had to manage through and the, frankly repulsive, nature of the Republicans and how they've attempted to thwart anything that seems remotely "progressive"...to my mind anyway.
He's obviously a consummate politician, a leader, a figure without sleaze and a man of great authority and social conscience. The sort of leader we could really pull together behind.
What Leuth said.
Fair enough I guess it's all about opinions and ultimately comes down to different people's perceptions.
I think if you'd asked a lot of people about Tony Blair back in the late 90's they would have spoken similarly highly of him, where as others (myself included) thought he was a c**t. I just don't think perceptions necessarily correlate with the job he would/could do (as time has proven imo in Blairs case) so find it strange to suggest you want him here (implying he would be a success) when the difference between the Country, people, culture etc is so different and his reputation in America depends on who you speak too.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
What you say is absolutely right but don't hold your breath though. One thing is for sure though. If Trump wins the election it will be a huge backward step for African Americans. All the gains that have been achieved over the past 60 years (believe it or not there have been significant gains) will be wiped out in more or less one go. I truly fear for things if that happens.
I don't think Trump will go away when (if) he loses the election. My only hope is that he incriminates himself so much that he steps too far and ends up in big trouble. That wouldn't surprise me at all. The trouble is, this will create a huge divide in America. There are a lot of Trump supporters out there.
I was reading an article yesterday that was saying this could be the third major social upheaval in America's history. The other two being the slave issue that led to the Civil War and the social issues that surrounded the Vietnam War and all the demonstrations and riots that were about in that era. The article said that since then American politics has taken a pretty much 'safe' route with generally status quo type (safe) politicians.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
The soul of Bobby Kennedy must be sobbing ;-(
God I'm still not over the death of Bobby Kennedy and it happened 18 years before I was born. There's a lot of lamenting about the death of JFK and what could have been. But his brother's death really changed Bobby for the better, and the man he was in '68, he could truly have been a unifier of this nation.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
The soul of Bobby Kennedy must be sobbing ;-(
God I'm still not over the death of Bobby Kennedy and it happened 18 years before I was born. There's a lot of lamenting about the death of JFK and what could have been. But his brother's death really changed Bobby for the better, and the man he was in '68, he could truly have been a unifier of this nation.
I'm old enough to remember both deaths. Jack was Jack - all charisma and charm. Bobby in '68 (and before as Jack's Attorney General) was, as they say, the last great hope and all since have been a pale imitation of a 'change for the good' agent. Maybe Obama could have made that difference had he been in control of Congress. We will never know.
I won't say last great hope because one should never say never, but how America, how the world, needs another Bobby Kennedy.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
What you say is absolutely right but don't hold your breath though. One thing is for sure though. If Trump wins the election it will be a huge backward step for African Americans. All the gains that have been achieved over the past 60 years (believe it or not there have been significant gains) will be wiped out in more or less one go. I truly fear for things if that happens.
I don't think Trump will go away when (if) he loses the election. My only hope is that he incriminates himself so much that he steps too far and ends up in big trouble. That wouldn't surprise me at all. The trouble is, this will create a huge divide in America. There are a lot of Trump supporters out there.
I was reading an article yesterday that was saying this could be the third major social upheaval in America's history. The other two being the slave issue that led to the Civil War and the social issues that surrounded the Vietnam War and all the demonstrations and riots that were about in that era. The article said that since then American politics has taken a pretty much 'safe' route with generally status quo type (safe) politicians.
All good points, and I will not be holding my breath.
There are certainly good and bad aspects to having pretty liberal libel/slander laws, and I fully expect Trump TV to push the envelope there.
It's a very good point about the third great upheaval. Were this something that was just lead by Trump, I might feel differently. But Trump has given a voice to opinions and divisions that have been at a simmer for quite some time. When you look at the Tea Party and birther movements (which are not the same, but both of which showed there is a LOT of anger in America), something has been brewing for a while.
There is a general desire to push back against the establishment across the Western world. Trump isn't your normal Presidential candidate, Brexit was a massive middle finger towards those in charge over here.
People aren't happy and this is how they're showing it.
Limey and SDA my thoughts are with you. Whichever way this thing goes I know one of you will be fleeing for your life on Wednesday morning. I hope you make it to safety before they come knocking. Godspeed.
Limey and SDA my thoughts are with you. Whichever way this thing goes I know one of you will be fleeing for your life on Wednesday morning. I hope you make it to safety before they come knocking. Godspeed.
Haha cheers, but whatever the outcome, we'll survive. I spent my formative years in opposition to the Bush administration, so if it comes to the Trump administration I'll at least be prepared. Shout out to Rob and Rossman92 as well who live here.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
The soul of Bobby Kennedy must be sobbing ;-(
God I'm still not over the death of Bobby Kennedy and it happened 18 years before I was born. There's a lot of lamenting about the death of JFK and what could have been. But his brother's death really changed Bobby for the better, and the man he was in '68, he could truly have been a unifier of this nation.
I'm old enough to remember both deaths. Jack was Jack - all charisma and charm. Bobby in '68 (and before as Jack's Attorney General) was, as they say, the last great hope and all since have been a pale imitation of a 'change for the good' agent. Maybe Obama could have made that difference had he been in control of Congress. We will never know.
I won't say last great hope because one should never say never, but how America, how the world, needs another Bobby Kennedy.
Amen.
I can't watch this without tearing up. Completely off the cuff, and this was a very wealthy white man speaking to to black folks in the midwest/south. He was arguably the last man to run for national office who truly loathed inequality and injustice.
This is one Elephant I won't be shedding a tear for when it gets taken down.
When he loses (and I'm assuming and hoping he will) the comedic fun will really start with him. He won't go away without making an even bigger prat of himself.
The influence he could potentially have with Trump TV, which he is rumored to be starting, might scare me more than what he could do as President. I think there's a real hope in this country that all of this nastiness is going to go away after the election, but I really fear we've let a genie out of the bottle and it can't be put back.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
The soul of Bobby Kennedy must be sobbing ;-(
God I'm still not over the death of Bobby Kennedy and it happened 18 years before I was born. There's a lot of lamenting about the death of JFK and what could have been. But his brother's death really changed Bobby for the better, and the man he was in '68, he could truly have been a unifier of this nation.
I'm old enough to remember both deaths. Jack was Jack - all charisma and charm. Bobby in '68 (and before as Jack's Attorney General) was, as they say, the last great hope and all since have been a pale imitation of a 'change for the good' agent. Maybe Obama could have made that difference had he been in control of Congress. We will never know.
I won't say last great hope because one should never say never, but how America, how the world, needs another Bobby Kennedy.
Amen.
I can't watch this without tearing up. Completely off the cuff, and this was a very wealthy white man speaking to to black folks in the midwest/south. He was arguably the last man to run for national office who truly loathed inequality and injustice.
Incredible speech. Sad that if the exact same words were said today by somebody else, that they would still resonate 100% with the vast majority of the population with regards to the 'current' US.
I'm don't think a politician would get the respect or chance to deliver it today to be honest. Not sure if that's because there is nobody close to an RFK out there or as a society we've just become more idiotic and reactionary.
had a quick google and couldn't find anything, when does the result get announced is it similar to here where they announce states? as they are counted.
Think it's awful how a country such as America are lumbered with these two no hopers. She's scum, as corrupt as they come and trump, he's just an absolute idiot. It's a lose lose for the US citizens in my opinion.
Saying that, every American I know are overwhelmingly in favour of Trump.
Comments
Now all someone has to do is remind Donald he's a Republican and it's rigged in his favour from the start!!! Tw@t!!!
He has also tried to raise taxes on the rich, and he did succeed in creating one new tax bracket, for those above ~450k at a level of 37.5% federal tax.
It's also worth noting that the president cannot write or formally propose legislation--but he drives an agenda which Democratic congressmen put into bills.
Regarding Leuth's healthcare claim, ummm, kind of. I have a lot of problem with Obamacare, the biggest of which is that it expanded the private sector in healthcare and has lead to further record profits for healthcare companies. Meanwhile, the costs to everyone has gone up (myself included). And the quality of care hasn't improved, and there is seemingly no provision for how to improve it in this country--another thing I've had an absolutely terrible time with over the last two years. The whole thing is something I could go into at essay length.
He's not a perfect president, yes he's more hawkish than I would prefer, including some of our more covert interventions in places like Pakistan and Yemen. But he is a good leader with a social conscious that he's really found in his last term.
Would love to hear what Limey thinks though, I know his feelings are completely different. Want to hear the policies he doesn't like and/or have hurt him.
No matter who the Americans vote for, everyone loses.
It's pretty funny as well
It's weird, it's almost like if you don't insult people you might have more appeal...
Do you want the Megalomaniac Donald Trump any where near a button which could mean the end of the world or World war 3, which would be the same thing.
The only irony is that it won't be aimed at Russia !
Nine ways the election is rigged but not against Donald Trump:
https://theintercept.com/2016/11/06/nine-ways-the-u-s-voting-system-is-rigged-but-not-against-donald-trump/
I know its the Beeb so will be "biased, lefty twaddle, etc, etc" but it shows just how difficult a time he has had to manage through and the, frankly repulsive, nature of the Republicans and how they've attempted to thwart anything that seems remotely "progressive"...to my mind anyway.
bbc.co.uk/programmes/b074g0gt
I think if you'd asked a lot of people about Tony Blair back in the late 90's they would have spoken similarly highly of him, where as others (myself included) thought he was a c**t. I just don't think perceptions necessarily correlate with the job he would/could do (as time has proven imo in Blairs case) so find it strange to suggest you want him here (implying he would be a success) when the difference between the Country, people, culture etc is so different and his reputation in America depends on who you speak too.
There are positives in this. I do think Americans as a whole need to understand how blue collar workers are living and to confront some of the things that are said and done within our country (just saw a picture of a shirt at a Trump Rally that said "Rope. Tree. Journalist").
Putting my Marxist ushanka on, we need to find a way to help these people whom our economy has left behind. Manufacturing jobs are long gone and not coming back, so we need to retrain a lot of our workforce, and have some really difficult conversations about jobs and education in our country. We need to understand that we have a permanent underclass, that we have people working multiple jobs at minimum wage who live at or above that poverty line. 1/5 Americans are at or above the poverty line. That's ridiculous. And what I hope this election will teach us is that not all of them are single black mothers with three kids living in the inner cities.
I don't think Trump will go away when (if) he loses the election. My only hope is that he incriminates himself so much that he steps too far and ends up in big trouble. That wouldn't surprise me at all. The trouble is, this will create a huge divide in America. There are a lot of Trump supporters out there.
I was reading an article yesterday that was saying this could be the third major social upheaval in America's history. The other two being the slave issue that led to the Civil War and the social issues that surrounded the Vietnam War and all the demonstrations and riots that were about in that era. The article said that since then American politics has taken a pretty much 'safe' route with generally status quo type (safe) politicians.
I won't say last great hope because one should never say never, but how America, how the world, needs another Bobby Kennedy.
There are certainly good and bad aspects to having pretty liberal libel/slander laws, and I fully expect Trump TV to push the envelope there.
It's a very good point about the third great upheaval. Were this something that was just lead by Trump, I might feel differently. But Trump has given a voice to opinions and divisions that have been at a simmer for quite some time. When you look at the Tea Party and birther movements (which are not the same, but both of which showed there is a LOT of anger in America), something has been brewing for a while.
People aren't happy and this is how they're showing it.
I can't watch this without tearing up. Completely off the cuff, and this was a very wealthy white man speaking to to black folks in the midwest/south. He was arguably the last man to run for national office who truly loathed inequality and injustice.
Incredible speech. Sad that if the exact same words were said today by somebody else, that they would still resonate 100% with the vast majority of the population with regards to the 'current' US.
I'm don't think a politician would get the respect or chance to deliver it today to be honest. Not sure if that's because there is nobody close to an RFK out there or as a society we've just become more idiotic and reactionary.
It's a lose lose for the US citizens in my opinion.
Saying that, every American I know are overwhelmingly in favour of Trump.