I avoid this thread like the plague, makes my blood pressure skyrocket, and I don't have as much time as some to compose lengthy responses to opinions I consider flawed. I took a chance and checked it out this time because of recent events that could well change the outcome of the election now that it's become so close. The choice between “The Crude” and “The Crook” is coming down to the wire, and it's a brave person who would bet the family allowance on the outcome. I stopped participating in the this thread because my view was that of the minority, and I found that a civilized discussion was impossible, posters were so invested in their points of view that rather than discuss an opposing point of view they would ridicule and be insulting. Fair enough, if the opinions of a former South-East Londoner, who has now lived in the U.S. For 44 years have no value to others of a similar background, I am happy to let things play out and keep my opinions to myself.
What is not acceptable to me, and I would hope not acceptable to other posters on CL, is any post that singles out a group of people for insult, whether it be an ethnic group, a nationality or whatever else and calls them stupid. Aren't there always objections on the”Jokes” thread if there's a joke that singles out the “Irish” for instance? So having been here as long as I have, my family, my friends, and my work colleagues are all Americans. I will therefore press the abuse button any time I see a group of people insulted the way I did today, isn't that what the button is for?
Yet presumably you find it acceptable, at least enough to vote for him, that Trump singles out Muslims and Mexicans as reasons for most of America's ills and also holds some pretty distasteful views about Women?
You are putting words in my mouth, that's not acceptable either. I don't condone a lot of what Trump has said or done, but we can't survive another 4 years of Obama's policies which is what we would get with the corrupt Clinton. Obviously. if either party had nominated a more ordinary candidate the election would be settled by now. We have a 20 trillion dollar deficit, growing (I am told) by 1.4 billion dollars a day. More of the same won't fix that, Clinton will be more of the same. Washington needs a shake-up, that's why Trump was nominated and that's why people who don't particularly like him, or even dislike him, have and will vote for him. The voters see the graft and "pay for play" that goes on in Washington, I see it first hand as I live in the area. When I see Clinton on TV I want to throw a brick through it, she provokes that response in many, including Democrats. We will see how the latest investigation of her by the FBI plays out, it's not just a Republican tactic, and if the DOJ weren't corrupt she'd likely be in jail already. Trying times here.
I avoid this thread like the plague, makes my blood pressure skyrocket, and I don't have as much time as some to compose lengthy responses to opinions I consider flawed. I took a chance and checked it out this time because of recent events that could well change the outcome of the election now that it's become so close. The choice between “The Crude” and “The Crook” is coming down to the wire, and it's a brave person who would bet the family allowance on the outcome. I stopped participating in the this thread because my view was that of the minority, and I found that a civilized discussion was impossible, posters were so invested in their points of view that rather than discuss an opposing point of view they would ridicule and be insulting. Fair enough, if the opinions of a former South-East Londoner, who has now lived in the U.S. For 44 years have no value to others of a similar background, I am happy to let things play out and keep my opinions to myself.
What is not acceptable to me, and I would hope not acceptable to other posters on CL, is any post that singles out a group of people for insult, whether it be an ethnic group, a nationality or whatever else and calls them stupid. Aren't there always objections on the”Jokes” thread if there's a joke that singles out the “Irish” for instance? So having been here as long as I have, my family, my friends, and my work colleagues are all Americans. I will therefore press the abuse button any time I see a group of people insulted the way I did today, isn't that what the button is for?
Yet presumably you find it acceptable, at least enough to vote for him, that Trump singles out Muslims and Mexicans as reasons for most of America's ills and also holds some pretty distasteful views about Women?
You are putting words in my mouth, that's not acceptable either. I don't condone a lot of what Trump has said or done, but we can't survive another 4 years of Obama's policies which is what we would get with the corrupt Clinton. Obviously. if either party had nominated a more ordinary candidate the election would be settled by now. We have a 20 trillion dollar deficit, growing (I am told) by 1.4 billion dollars a day. More of the same won't fix that, Clinton will be more of the same. Washington needs a shake-up, that's why Trump was nominated and that's why people who don't particularly like him, or even dislike him, have and will vote for him. The voters see the graft and "pay for play" that goes on in Washington, I see it first hand as I live in the area. When I see Clinton on TV I want to throw a brick through it, she provokes that response in many, including Democrats. We will see how the latest investigation of her by the FBI plays out, it's not just a Republican tactic, and if the DOJ weren't corrupt she'd likely be in jail already. Trying times here.
The campaigns on either side are probably at the height of interest throughout American history. You can blame allegationsagai a and social media on that.
The truth is, most people are simply not educated enough. I'm not excluding myself from that suggestion. I myself could do a lot more thorough research on political topics as a whole in general The reason why I don't or have not is because it's a subject that doesn't particularly rock my world, as an individual. I also have quite a fuzzy memory, so if something feels boring, it's not going to stick. I wish that was not the case for myself, as everyone needs a heads up on the people they choose to vote for, otherwise you don't know what your even ordering on the menu.
Instead of
"sirloin steak....£15.99" it just says
"Eat this, believe me .....£15.99"
conflicted with
"No she's wrong she has terrible judgement eat this instead.....£15.98"
Donald trump uses the "not so clued up audience" this to his advantage and this is why he has a large loyal following.
He's telling people what is what. THEY may not have a f*cking clue to begin with. It's like a cult.
I think Hilary and Trump are both as equally impressive, strange and horrible beings, that have made mistakes but have found a way to convince their way to the top.
Trump has got people talking about him. He has said things that people can relate to - speaking on their level within live audiences. Whether or not what he actually says is correct or believable. He has engaged with his audience. A lot of people see through this of course.
He seems very sure of himself. People love and want power, they want to be able to freely speak their mind. It's an opportunity to mirror a leader. Throwing your personal frustrations against something that may not even be that bad to begin with. 17 trillion in debt, apparently.
*I wrote a lot more on this post that would have made a lot more sense of the post as a whole. The draft of that didn't save and I can't remember exactly what I said* Bit annoying.
Just to be clear. If I was American I would vote Clinton!
Are there people on this forum seriously in support of Trump?
Except for our very few American-based posters though, it really makes not the tiniest bit of difference what ANYONE thinks on here about either of them. Personally the real issue that worries me is that whilst on our side of the pond condemnation of Trump is practically universal (and totally correctly so as far as I'm concerned) there's something about the political situation in the US that means that not only has Trump just kept going and going and going, mistake after error after scandal after faux pas, all the despicable things he's done and said, he might still win.
That's not saying all Trump supporters are idiots or wrong or anything of the sort, if for whatever reason they truly think Trump is the right choice it's their right to make that call. But no matter what the result is on the night, the situation will NOT be solved. The issues will not go away. Sooner or later the whole thing is going to blow up and when it does it is going to end badly for just about everyone.
It might not make much difference what people think, but I guess it's alarming to know that there are people over here who would vote for him given the opportunity.
Just to balance out the Hillary email issue, with the FBI hoping that they'll get charges this time, you do realise that Trump is due in court after the election.
Over the trump university scam.
And that this is just the latest scam in which he has been involved. Usually he pays for them to go away or files for bankruptcy but I'm not sure that he will get away with that this time if he is president.
Honestly, the only reason that trump hasn't "endangered national security" is that he hasn't been in a position to do so. Hillary had a private email server but trump would probably tweet out national secrets just to prove a point in some argument with a "celebrity".
But I understand how he has reached this stage.
Firstly, you have about 40% of the electorate on each side who will vote republican and democrat every election regardless of who is there. The key battle is over the remaining 20%.
Then you have the fact that he was the only person on the republican side who came out and said that America wasn't great, but he would make it great again. People sat and took notice because 1. You don't say America isn't great and 2. America hasn't been great for them and they needed someone to turn to.
After that he played a blinder. He's been mocked for his lack of policies and plans but that is just what has kept his appeal so high. He's going to make things great again but let you, the electorate, fill in the blanks so that it fits your personal story. If he starts saying x will be improved or y will then he could push voters away because they will feel disenfranchised again. Keep it generic so that everyone will believe that you'll help them.
Then give them a common enemy. Start off with the current establishment as it is always easier to say the grass is greener on the other side (#draintheswamp). The blame external factors for the ills people face, give them a scapegoat, rile them up and say you'll deal with the scapegoat (Mexicans and the wall, Islam and the skittles/banning entry based on religion).
As Hilary represents the establishment it's easy for him to create this whole situation around her being crooked Hilary. That started even before he stepped up in the primaries as republicans have been trying to undermine the next democrat candidate for years. The emails and foundation issues just play into this perfectly.
What we have to remember is that there are a lot of people in America who have been stomped all over by the government for years and are looking for someone to help them up. Trump represents the antithesis of everything that has caused them hardship for years and years. He will make their America great again, he said it, and at this stage he offers them more hope than the status quo. We might not believe it, but they do and there are a lot of people who have fallen down the cracks in the states and are looking for that little sliver of light that someone still offers them a chance.
Also, keep in mind that we will view Hilary more positively over here as she is closer to our ideals than trump. American politics are far further to the right than ours, but the democrats are more liberal than the republicans.
Are there people on this forum seriously in support of Trump?
I'm not a political animal at all.....it mostly bores me intensely.......but given that millions of Americans are in support of him, why would you think that nobody on here would?
Are there people on this forum seriously in support of Trump?
I'm not a political animal at all.....it mostly bores me intensely.......but given that millions of Americans are in support of him, why would you think that nobody on here would?
Because there are vast differences between British people and American people. I'm not going to use any particular adjectives to describe those millions of Americans in support of Trump as I gather some people on this thread previously got upset about that, but they're different to us to say the least.
I heard the first sensible person talking about this election last night, it was a woman from Texas and she said "Vote? Why vote for the lesser of two evils?"
Whoever wins I can see it going horribly wrong and their deputy having to take over so you may as well vote for the running mate not the candidate.
Are there people on this forum seriously in support of Trump?
I'm not a political animal at all.....it mostly bores me intensely.......but given that millions of Americans are in support of him, why would you think that nobody on here would?
Because there are vast differences between British people and American people. I'm not going to use any particular adjectives to describe those millions of Americans in support of Trump as I gather some people on this thread previously got upset about that, but they're different to us to say the least.
A bit of a generalisation there eh?
Not having a dig but I would have thought that there would still be plenty of British people supporting Trump over Clinton if (shiver...) we had to make the same decision.
Comments
For a start.
Must do better.
The truth is, most people are simply not educated enough. I'm not excluding myself from that suggestion. I myself could do a lot more thorough research on political topics as a whole in general The reason why I don't or have not is because it's a subject that doesn't particularly rock my world, as an individual. I also have quite a fuzzy memory, so if something feels boring, it's not going to stick.
I wish that was not the case for myself, as everyone needs a heads up on the people they choose to vote for, otherwise you don't know what your even ordering on the menu.
Instead of
"sirloin steak....£15.99" it just says
"Eat this, believe me .....£15.99"
conflicted with
"No she's wrong she has terrible judgement eat this instead.....£15.98"
Donald trump uses the "not so clued up audience" this to his advantage and this is why he has a large loyal following.
He's telling people what is what. THEY may not have a f*cking clue to begin with.
It's like a cult.
I think Hilary and Trump are both as equally impressive, strange and horrible beings, that have made mistakes but have found a way to convince their way to the top.
Trump has got people talking about him. He has said things that people can relate to - speaking on their level within live audiences. Whether or not what he actually says is correct or believable.
He has engaged with his audience. A lot of people see through this of course.
He seems very sure of himself. People love and want power, they want to be able to freely speak their mind. It's an opportunity to mirror a leader. Throwing your personal frustrations against something that may not even be that bad to begin with.
17 trillion in debt, apparently.
*I wrote a lot more on this post that would have made a lot more sense of the post as a whole. The draft of that didn't save and I can't remember exactly what I said*
Bit annoying.
Just to be clear. If I was American I would vote Clinton!
I'll make Charlton great again, I know I will, nobody will make Charlton great like I will."
That's not saying all Trump supporters are idiots or wrong or anything of the sort, if for whatever reason they truly think Trump is the right choice it's their right to make that call. But no matter what the result is on the night, the situation will NOT be solved. The issues will not go away. Sooner or later the whole thing is going to blow up and when it does it is going to end badly for just about everyone.
Besides we had people on here actually vote Labour at last general election.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/secret-recordings-fueled-fbi-feud-in-clinton-probe-1478135518?mod=trending_now_1
Over the trump university scam.
And that this is just the latest scam in which he has been involved. Usually he pays for them to go away or files for bankruptcy but I'm not sure that he will get away with that this time if he is president.
Honestly, the only reason that trump hasn't "endangered national security" is that he hasn't been in a position to do so. Hillary had a private email server but trump would probably tweet out national secrets just to prove a point in some argument with a "celebrity".
But I understand how he has reached this stage.
Firstly, you have about 40% of the electorate on each side who will vote republican and democrat every election regardless of who is there. The key battle is over the remaining 20%.
Then you have the fact that he was the only person on the republican side who came out and said that America wasn't great, but he would make it great again. People sat and took notice because 1. You don't say America isn't great and 2. America hasn't been great for them and they needed someone to turn to.
After that he played a blinder. He's been mocked for his lack of policies and plans but that is just what has kept his appeal so high. He's going to make things great again but let you, the electorate, fill in the blanks so that it fits your personal story. If he starts saying x will be improved or y will then he could push voters away because they will feel disenfranchised again. Keep it generic so that everyone will believe that you'll help them.
Then give them a common enemy. Start off with the current establishment as it is always easier to say the grass is greener on the other side (#draintheswamp). The blame external factors for the ills people face, give them a scapegoat, rile them up and say you'll deal with the scapegoat (Mexicans and the wall, Islam and the skittles/banning entry based on religion).
As Hilary represents the establishment it's easy for him to create this whole situation around her being crooked Hilary. That started even before he stepped up in the primaries as republicans have been trying to undermine the next democrat candidate for years. The emails and foundation issues just play into this perfectly.
What we have to remember is that there are a lot of people in America who have been stomped all over by the government for years and are looking for someone to help them up. Trump represents the antithesis of everything that has caused them hardship for years and years. He will make their America great again, he said it, and at this stage he offers them more hope than the status quo. We might not believe it, but they do and there are a lot of people who have fallen down the cracks in the states and are looking for that little sliver of light that someone still offers them a chance.
Also, keep in mind that we will view Hilary more positively over here as she is closer to our ideals than trump. American politics are far further to the right than ours, but the democrats are more liberal than the republicans.
Whoever wins I can see it going horribly wrong and their deputy having to take over so you may as well vote for the running mate not the candidate.
Not having a dig but I would have thought that there would still be plenty of British people supporting Trump over Clinton if (shiver...) we had to make the same decision.