A friend of a friend in Turkey (who is Turkish) had this to say: " What happened today:
- A group of ~50 mostly medium rank military officers tried to topple Erdogan's government. As of now, it looks like the attempt has failed.
- A number of government officials, including President Erdogan and Prime Minister Yildirim, spoke to the media saying the coup attempt was staged by military officers that are affiliated with Gulen movement.
- Erdogan called people to take to the streets and stand against the coup. People reacted strongly and took over the streets. Within a couple hours police forces took control and restored the order in most places. People walked on top of tanks and chanted against the coup. Also, several high rank military officers from different parts of Turkey strongly expressed their opposition against the coup and sided with the government.
- To reiterate: It looks like it was NOT the secular military officers who tried to topple the government. It seems it was mostly medium rank officers who were affiliated with the Gulen movement, which is an islamist movement. However, Gulen movement rejects this claim.
- Another popular theory is that this coup was a hoax staged by Erdogan to increase his popularity. Whether this is true or not, it will certainly serve for that purpose. People are concerned that Erdogan will use this coup attempt to start a witch hunt against all opposition and Turkey is on the verge of an even more authoritarian period."
He went on to say that the opposition to the coup was near universal across left and right.
I had wondered if the timing of this, had it been the secularist military officers, was connected to Brexit. Despite what people on here say/think, the strongest support for Turkey joining the EU is/was the UK. It's also a US foreign policy goal, which may well be why Britain has been backing it so strongly. Without the UK, I think it's a dead idea now. I can't see Erdogan being able to negotiate any sort of deal that brings Turkey into the EU, but I think he will end up stronger and more authoritarian after this.
Strange one. Didn't see it coming and I doubt anyone did... Erdogan is a madman though, but I dunno about what the military's motivation is... could be ok, but I doubt it
Issue is, is that a coup needs civilian support.
There are as many people who love and follow Erdogan religiously as those who hate him.
Thats not true though SHG they will be allowed in and it won't be in a generation within the next ten to 15 yrs they will be in, they are not taking refugees for nothing and they are not Pissing assad off for nothing either
Nothing like a bit of scaremongering eh.
Well someone needs to keep parroting Gove's lies, now that the great man himself has run into a bit of difficulty
A friend of a friend in Turkey (who is Turkish) had this to say: " What happened today:
- A group of ~50 mostly medium rank military officers tried to topple Erdogan's government. As of now, it looks like the attempt has failed.
- A number of government officials, including President Erdogan and Prime Minister Yildirim, spoke to the media saying the coup attempt was staged by military officers that are affiliated with Gulen movement.
- Erdogan called people to take to the streets and stand against the coup. People reacted strongly and took over the streets. Within a couple hours police forces took control and restored the order in most places. People walked on top of tanks and chanted against the coup. Also, several high rank military officers from different parts of Turkey strongly expressed their opposition against the coup and sided with the government.
- To reiterate: It looks like it was NOT the secular military officers who tried to topple the government. It seems it was mostly medium rank officers who were affiliated with the Gulen movement, which is an islamist movement. However, Gulen movement rejects this claim.
- Another popular theory is that this coup was a hoax staged by Erdogan to increase his popularity. Whether this is true or not, it will certainly serve for that purpose. People are concerned that Erdogan will use this coup attempt to start a witch hunt against all opposition and Turkey is on the verge of an even more authoritarian period."
He went on to say that the opposition to the coup was near universal across left and right.
My friend who lives in turkey also thinks that it may have all been managed by erdogan who she dislikes.
Reports of lynch mobs and soldiers being tortured and beheaded.
Thousands of soldiers and judges arrested.
US government appears to have at least known about the coup. One of the rebel refuelling bases was the one that the US uses for bombing raids in Syria and home to the US nukes on Turkish soil.
A friend of a friend in Turkey (who is Turkish) had this to say: " What happened today:
- A group of ~50 mostly medium rank military officers tried to topple Erdogan's government. As of now, it looks like the attempt has failed.
- A number of government officials, including President Erdogan and Prime Minister Yildirim, spoke to the media saying the coup attempt was staged by military officers that are affiliated with Gulen movement.
- Erdogan called people to take to the streets and stand against the coup. People reacted strongly and took over the streets. Within a couple hours police forces took control and restored the order in most places. People walked on top of tanks and chanted against the coup. Also, several high rank military officers from different parts of Turkey strongly expressed their opposition against the coup and sided with the government.
- To reiterate: It looks like it was NOT the secular military officers who tried to topple the government. It seems it was mostly medium rank officers who were affiliated with the Gulen movement, which is an islamist movement. However, Gulen movement rejects this claim.
- Another popular theory is that this coup was a hoax staged by Erdogan to increase his popularity. Whether this is true or not, it will certainly serve for that purpose. People are concerned that Erdogan will use this coup attempt to start a witch hunt against all opposition and Turkey is on the verge of an even more authoritarian period."
He went on to say that the opposition to the coup was near universal across left and right.
My friend who lives in turkey also thinks that it may have all been managed by erdogan who she dislikes.
I think Erdogan is more of an opportunist and constantly turns negative events to his advantage. It would not be a surprise if he knew about the potential coup. Arresting and removing so many judges suggests that he has had this list ready a long time.
Erdogan will use the events to cement his power and is becoming more and more of a dictator. He has little respect for democracy. He lost the elections last year and responding by restarting the civil war with the Turkish Kurds and won the subsequent election.
In Turkey he has shut down opposition newpapers, beaten and imprisoned journalists. Built himself a huge presidential palace. The writing is on the wall in terms of his aim to ensure his own domination of the country.
Erdogan is not that that bothered about Isis or Daesh. He is more concerned about the Kurds both Turkish and Syrian.
The Syrian Kurds were strong enough to control the Syrian / Turkish border on the Syrian side but Erdogan prevented this. This kept open a supply route for Isis/Daesh. Erdogan has allowed Daesh to operate in his country and this led to the bombing of Kurds on a Kurdish demonstation in Turkey. Erdogan is more concerned about the Syrian Kurds forming an automonous area which would he thinks would encourage the Turkish Kurds to press for autonomy similar to the Iraqi Kurds. IHe has stopped access to the Americans to use a base to bomb Daesh in his quest try and put pressure on the Americans to deport Guleb, who Erodgan is trying to blame for the attempted coup.
Erdogan has allowed the migrants from Syria to flow through to Europe to put pressure on the EC on Turkey joining the EC. He has no concern in using other people's misery to support his own political aims.
Erogan is not a good man and no good will come of the present situation.
I'm far from a conspiracy nut, but I think it's clear that this was organised - or rather, facilitated - by Erdogan. Turkey has a history of military coups; 5 since 1960. Yet this one was the first to fail?
The obvious signs are that the Private Eye had awareness of the rumours of an upcoming Turkish coup, and that within hours of the coup failing 2.7k judges had been identified and sacked.
Erdogan's response to the coup was impressively fast; not only identifying those responsible - but identifying them in great numbers within hours. At the moment there are over 14,000 individuals who have been sacked or detained:
What makes these numbers even more interesting are the sheer number of very senior military personnel; at ranks which surely would've involved them with previous successful coups.
Yet at no point did they think to sieze the media, or.. Shoot down Ergodan's plane whilst it was in Turkish airspace and Turkish military jets participating in the coup were in-flight.
Some soldiers have claimed that they were acting under the impression that they were participating in a military exercise. Obviously those who fired upon civilians were not under any such illusion though.
For a military coup to succeed though, the aggression towards civilians was clearly detrimental and also curious. Once again: turkey has had 5 military coups in the last 56 years; this wouldn't have been alien to the population nor would it have been difficult to grasp by those 100+ senior officers involved.
Then look at the news today:
- Turkey is going to "review its relationship with the US" - Turkey is going to looking at reinstating the death penalty due to popular demand - Turkish Civil Servants are now banned from leaving the country - Entire ministries have been sacked.
This wasn't a quick response to weather through the eye of the storm, these individuals would've taken months to compile lists of - and changes to the law and foreign policy would also take time to consider.
When we take a look at Turkey's current predicament and their borders: it's been well known (hell, Vice wrote an article on it FFS) that the attitudes to foreign fighters travelling via Turkey was far from intimidating. There's stories of soldiers swapping sunglasses for passage, and easily identified gaps in the security that locals would share with curious foreigners. This doesn't happen in a country that is taking their security seriously. Then again, was a stronger ISIS a good way of keeping the Kurds in check? They were known to be profiteering off of smuggled ISIS oil after all.
The worry is that there were some very nasty people denouncing the coup, including pro Al Qaeda individuals. Amongst which there's a certain Mohammed Islambouli, who had been plotting a 9/11 during the late 90s and was exiled from Egypt after being sentenced to death. This is sadly the calibre of man Turkey is currently providing safety for.
Ultimately there's a man in control of Turkey who appears to have some very dark allegiances. A man who had just been the intended victim of one of the most comedically inept coups. A man who is gripping the media - both at gome and abroad - tight with an iron fist. A man who - with his rather impressively rapid response - has been the only one to gain anything from the coup which should be destroyed him..?
What does this mean for the EU and their agreements with Turkey over refugees? What does this mean for NATO, and their second largest member military? What does this mean for the political landscape of a region which is already entirely fucked?
There will be interesting times ahead I fear, but I suspect Turkey will be off the holiday destination list and joining the likes of Iran.
Reports of lynch mobs and soldiers being tortured and beheaded.
Thousands of soldiers and judges arrested.
US government appears to have at least known about the coup. One of the rebel refuelling bases was the one that the US uses for bombing raids in Syria and home to the US nukes on Turkish soil.
I'm only reporting what I'm seeing reported.
No good can come from this.
Indeed. I'm afraid this might be Erdogan's 'Reichstag Fire ' moment.
I'm far from a conspiracy nut, but I think it's clear that this was organised - or rather, facilitated - by Erdogan. Turkey has a history of military coups; 5 since 1960. Yet this one was the first to fail?
The obvious signs are that the Private Eye had awareness of the rumours of an upcoming Turkish coup, and that within hours of the coup failing 2.7k judges had been identified and sacked.
Erdogan's response to the coup was impressively fast; not only identifying those responsible - but identifying them in great numbers within hours. At the moment there are over 14,000 individuals who have been sacked or detained:
What makes these numbers even more interesting are the sheer number of very senior military personnel; at ranks which surely would've involved them with previous successful coups.
Yet at no point did they think to sieze the media, or.. Shoot down Ergodan's plane whilst it was in Turkish airspace and Turkish military jets participating in the coup were in-flight.
Some soldiers have claimed that they were acting under the impression that they were participating in a military exercise. Obviously those who fired upon civilians were not under any such illusion though.
For a military coup to succeed though, the aggression towards civilians was clearly detrimental and also curious. Once again: turkey has had 5 military coups in the last 56 years; this wouldn't have been alien to the population nor would it have been difficult to grasp by those 100+ senior officers involved.
Then look at the news today:
- Turkey is going to "review its relationship with the US" - Turkey is going to looking at reinstating the death penalty due to popular demand - Turkish Civil Servants are now banned from leaving the country - Entire ministries have been sacked.
This wasn't a quick response to weather through the eye of the storm, these individuals would've taken months to compile lists of - and changes to the law and foreign policy would also take time to consider.
When we take a look at Turkey's current predicament and their borders: it's been well known (hell, Vice wrote an article on it FFS) that the attitudes to foreign fighters travelling via Turkey was far from intimidating. There's stories of soldiers swapping sunglasses for passage, and easily identified gaps in the security that locals would share with curious foreigners. This doesn't happen in a country that is taking their security seriously. Then again, was a stronger ISIS a good way of keeping the Kurds in check? They were known to be profiteering off of smuggled ISIS oil after all.
The worry is that there were some very nasty people denouncing the coup, including pro Al Qaeda individuals. Amongst which there's a certain Mohammed Islambouli, who had been plotting a 9/11 during the late 90s and was exiled from Egypt after being sentenced to death. This is sadly the calibre of man Turkey is currently providing safety for.
Ultimately there's a man in control of Turkey who appears to have some very dark allegiances. A man who had just been the intended victim of one of the most comedically inept coups. A man who is gripping the media - both at gome and abroad - tight with an iron fist. A man who - with his rather impressively rapid response - has been the only one to gain anything from the coup which should be destroyed him..?
What does this mean for the EU and their agreements with Turkey over refugees? What does this mean for NATO, and their second largest member military? What does this mean for the political landscape of a region which is already entirely fucked?
There will be interesting times ahead I fear, but I suspect Turkey will be off the holiday destination list and joining the likes of Iran.
Though Iran, albeit slowly, appears to be moving in a different direction.
I have a vague notion that, following a, then, relatively rare bomb attack in the south east a couple of years ago Erdogan made a reasonably sectarian speech. His line was to associate being Turkish with being Sunni. Now, admittedly, Turkey is probably 80% Sunni, but he was talking about an attack in an area where many, including some of the victims, were Alevi (a Shia offshoot).
It's depressing to see how far Turkish civil society/democracy has regressed under Erdogan, and the worry is how much further it can travel along the path he has chosen.
Things may get interesting today, with some questions being answered via leaked documents; WikiLeaks is set to release 300,000 emails and 500,000 documents relating to Turkey.
Coincidentally, they're struggling to do so because they're coming under sustained attack - and appear to be pointing the finger towards the Turkish government at this point:
21,000 teachers sacked today, 1,500 heads of universities also. What the hell is going on over there and how is the country meant to function properly?
21,000 teachers sacked today, 1,500 heads of universities also. What the hell is going on over there and how is the country meant to function properly?
WTF have teachers got to do with a coup organized by senior military officers? This is all getting very unsavoury.
A round up of today's news, which sees warnings from the EU and NATO regarding Turkish relations, Ergodan continue his purge of the public sector, and the beginning of what appears to be tighter media control.
21,000 teachers sacked today, 1,500 heads of universities also. What the hell is going on over there and how is the country meant to function properly?
WTF have teachers got to do with a coup organized by senior military officers? This is all getting very unsavoury.
Insubordinate chalking on blackboards probably. Or aggressive register taking. Or badly sewn leather elbow patches.
21,000 teachers sacked today, 1,500 heads of universities also. What the hell is going on over there and how is the country meant to function properly?
WTF have teachers got to do with a coup organized by senior military officers? This is all getting very unsavoury.
Insubordinate chalking on blackboards probably. Or aggressive register taking. Or badly sewn leather elbow patches.
I'd guess that it's an attempt to remove the secular influence from the classrooms, ensuring that the next generation is properly indoctrinated.
Comments
" What happened today:
- A group of ~50 mostly medium rank military officers tried to topple Erdogan's government. As of now, it looks like the attempt has failed.
- A number of government officials, including President Erdogan and Prime Minister Yildirim, spoke to the media saying the coup attempt was staged by military officers that are affiliated with Gulen movement.
- Erdogan called people to take to the streets and stand against the coup. People reacted strongly and took over the streets. Within a couple hours police forces took control and restored the order in most places. People walked on top of tanks and chanted against the coup. Also, several high rank military officers from different parts of Turkey strongly expressed their opposition against the coup and sided with the government.
- To reiterate: It looks like it was NOT the secular military officers who tried to topple the government. It seems it was mostly medium rank officers who were affiliated with the Gulen movement, which is an islamist movement. However, Gulen movement rejects this claim.
- Another popular theory is that this coup was a hoax staged by Erdogan to increase his popularity. Whether this is true or not, it will certainly serve for that purpose. People are concerned that Erdogan will use this coup attempt to start a witch hunt against all opposition and Turkey is on the verge of an even more authoritarian period."
He went on to say that the opposition to the coup was near universal across left and right.
I can't see Erdogan being able to negotiate any sort of deal that brings Turkey into the EU, but I think he will end up stronger and more authoritarian after this.
Or was it 8 years?
Lost track of all the lies?
Yeah I am
Reports of lynch mobs and soldiers being tortured and beheaded.
Thousands of soldiers and judges arrested.
US government appears to have at least known about the coup. One of the rebel refuelling bases was the one that the US uses for bombing raids in Syria and home to the US nukes on Turkish soil.
I'm only reporting what I'm seeing reported.
No good can come from this.
If Ian Hislop was aware, then I'm fairly sure the Turkish Government were as well.
There really isn't going to be a lot of independent civil society left functioning in a while.
As some commentators have been saying for a while, there's been a slow motion coup against the modern Turkish secular state on the go for a while.
Erdogan will use the events to cement his power and is becoming more and more of a dictator. He has little respect for democracy. He lost the elections last year and responding by restarting the civil war with the Turkish Kurds and won the subsequent election.
In Turkey he has shut down opposition newpapers, beaten and imprisoned journalists. Built himself a huge presidential palace. The writing is on the wall in terms of his aim to ensure his own domination of the country.
The Syrian Kurds were strong enough to control the Syrian / Turkish border on the Syrian side but Erdogan prevented this. This kept open a supply route for Isis/Daesh. Erdogan has allowed Daesh to operate in his country and this led to the bombing of Kurds on a Kurdish demonstation in Turkey. Erdogan is more concerned about the Syrian Kurds forming an automonous area which would he thinks would encourage the Turkish Kurds to press for autonomy similar to the Iraqi Kurds. IHe has stopped access to the Americans to use a base to bomb Daesh in his quest try and put pressure on the Americans to deport Guleb, who Erodgan is trying to blame for the attempted coup.
Erdogan has allowed the migrants from Syria to flow through to Europe to put pressure on the EC on Turkey joining the EC. He has no concern in using other people's misery to support his own political aims.
Erogan is not a good man and no good will come of the present situation.
The obvious signs are that the Private Eye had awareness of the rumours of an upcoming Turkish coup, and that within hours of the coup failing 2.7k judges had been identified and sacked.
Erdogan's response to the coup was impressively fast; not only identifying those responsible - but identifying them in great numbers within hours. At the moment there are over 14,000 individuals who have been sacked or detained:
- 3,000+ judges
- 8,000+ police officers
- 3,500+ soldiers
- 100+ generals and admirals
What makes these numbers even more interesting are the sheer number of very senior military personnel; at ranks which surely would've involved them with previous successful coups.
Yet at no point did they think to sieze the media, or.. Shoot down Ergodan's plane whilst it was in Turkish airspace and Turkish military jets participating in the coup were in-flight.
Some soldiers have claimed that they were acting under the impression that they were participating in a military exercise. Obviously those who fired upon civilians were not under any such illusion though.
For a military coup to succeed though, the aggression towards civilians was clearly detrimental and also curious. Once again: turkey has had 5 military coups in the last 56 years; this wouldn't have been alien to the population nor would it have been difficult to grasp by those 100+ senior officers involved.
Then look at the news today:
- Turkey is going to "review its relationship with the US"
- Turkey is going to looking at reinstating the death penalty due to popular demand
- Turkish Civil Servants are now banned from leaving the country
- Entire ministries have been sacked.
This wasn't a quick response to weather through the eye of the storm, these individuals would've taken months to compile lists of - and changes to the law and foreign policy would also take time to consider.
When we take a look at Turkey's current predicament and their borders: it's been well known (hell, Vice wrote an article on it FFS) that the attitudes to foreign fighters travelling via Turkey was far from intimidating. There's stories of soldiers swapping sunglasses for passage, and easily identified gaps in the security that locals would share with curious foreigners. This doesn't happen in a country that is taking their security seriously. Then again, was a stronger ISIS a good way of keeping the Kurds in check? They were known to be profiteering off of smuggled ISIS oil after all.
The worry is that there were some very nasty people denouncing the coup, including pro Al Qaeda individuals. Amongst which there's a certain Mohammed Islambouli, who had been plotting a 9/11 during the late 90s and was exiled from Egypt after being sentenced to death. This is sadly the calibre of man Turkey is currently providing safety for.
Ultimately there's a man in control of Turkey who appears to have some very dark allegiances. A man who had just been the intended victim of one of the most comedically inept coups. A man who is gripping the media - both at gome and abroad - tight with an iron fist. A man who - with his rather impressively rapid response - has been the only one to gain anything from the coup which should be destroyed him..?
What does this mean for the EU and their agreements with Turkey over refugees? What does this mean for NATO, and their second largest member military? What does this mean for the political landscape of a region which is already entirely fucked?
There will be interesting times ahead I fear, but I suspect Turkey will be off the holiday destination list and joining the likes of Iran.
I have a vague notion that, following a, then, relatively rare bomb attack in the south east a couple of years ago Erdogan made a reasonably sectarian speech. His line was to associate being Turkish with being Sunni. Now, admittedly, Turkey is probably 80% Sunni, but he was talking about an attack in an area where many, including some of the victims, were Alevi (a Shia offshoot).
It's depressing to see how far Turkish civil society/democracy has regressed under Erdogan, and the worry is how much further it can travel along the path he has chosen.
Coincidentally, they're struggling to do so because they're coming under sustained attack - and appear to be pointing the finger towards the Turkish government at this point:
It did all seem a bit too convenient for Erdogan.
- There are still 14 Naval Ships missing after the coup.
- An additional 25 Special Forces soldiers and 2 helicopters are also missing..
- John Kerry has warned Turkey that they could lose their NATO membership.
- Police searched a NATO base housing nuclear weapons in connection with the coup.
- Despite the EU warning Ergodan that reinstating the death penalty will bar Turkish membership, Ergodan has refused to rule it out - leaving the decision to parliament.
- As discussed above, the purge has continued and is now hitting the education sector.
- In response to Wikileaks claiming to be in possession of around 800,000 documents pertaining to Turkey's government, they've been hit with a sustained DDoS attack.
- Ergodan's grip on the media has tightened, with the revocation of 24 radio and TV licenses.
- Turkish press are reporting Ergodan is set to make an important announcement tomorrow.