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Should the Notting Hill Carnival continue in it's present form ?

124

Comments

  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    edited September 2016
    Algarveaddick said:

    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    Well it had been going nearly 30 years by then, so you must have known it was local, even if it has expanded since? I live across the road from a pub that was a quiet locals place, then empty for years. Now it is open until 4AM and is one of "the places to be" for the youth of Albufeira. I accept that I bought a house opposite a pub, and paid the going rate for a house opposite a pub. And that's 6 nights a week 52 weeks of the year, not 3 days in 365.
    Your partner must be afraid to go out with all the sexual assaults and stabbings going on.
  • Big_Bad_World
    Big_Bad_World Posts: 5,859
    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    It might have been an idea to say that you moved in a year before the carnival started as you'll now be blamed for knowing it existed and should have put you off moving there.

    It's all your own fault, obviously :wink:
  • sillav nitram
    sillav nitram Posts: 10,164
    Algarveaddick said:

    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    Well it had been going nearly 30 years by then, so you must have known it was local, even if it has expanded since? I live across the road from a pub that was a quiet locals place, then empty for years. Now it is open until 4AM and is one of "the places to be" for the youth of Albufeira. I accept that I bought a house opposite a pub, and paid the going rate for a house opposite a pub. And that's 6 nights a week 52 weeks of the year, not 3 days in 365.
    I may have known about it but having not gone to it, didn't realise what a nightmare it is.

    And it's typical of people who don't live in the area to say it's ok, for mindless arse holes and thugs to run amok!
  • sillav nitram
    sillav nitram Posts: 10,164
    Ps, I'm not necessarily saying that about you, algarve.
  • stonemuse
    stonemuse Posts: 34,002
    sillav nitram said:

    Ps, I'm not necessarily saying that about you, algarve.

    You don't know him mate :wink:
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,315
    I'm here now! You can all relax
  • ValleyGary
    ValleyGary Posts: 37,979
    Leuth said:

    I'm here now! You can all relax

    image
  • charltonbob
    charltonbob Posts: 8,258
    Covered End said:

    I have felt for a long time, that something needs to be done to reduce the violence and protect the people who attend to enjoy themselves, which are of course the vast majority.

    It seems akin to many demonstrations. It all starts off peacefully and wonderful and then it gets "infected" by the unruly mob, who have less chance of being apprehended with all the people around.

    This year Scotland Yard made 454 arrests across the two days of the Bank Holiday street party, including 45 attacks on police and 88 knife-related incidents.

    Metropolitan Police Federation chairman Ken Marsh claimed that rank-and-file officers “dread” the event, the biggest of its kind in Europe, in which they are treated as “professional punchbags”.

    There are suggestions that the festival could be held in Hyde Park, an all ticket affair, where attendees are searched beforehand.

    Ok, it won't be quite the same, but surely a better idea, that the revellers can revel, without the risk of being robbed and assaulted ?

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/singer-who-was-stabbed-at-notting-hill-carnival-we-cant-let-a-crazed-minority-ruin-it-a3336686.html

    Says it all really
  • Lincsaddick
    Lincsaddick Posts: 32,348
    at the very least it gives da gangstas a chance to let of steam in a defined and controlled space
  • cabbles
    cabbles Posts: 15,255
    Only just opened this thread

    2 things

    The carnival is just a knock off version of Lewisham People's day and secondly I agree with @ValleyGary and @Greenie Junior , but let's do a combination of the two and bomb it with susan boyle's shit
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  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    edited September 2016
    charltonbob said:

    Covered End said:

    I have felt for a long time, that something needs to be done to reduce the violence and protect the people who attend to enjoy themselves, which are of course the vast majority.

    It seems akin to many demonstrations. It all starts off peacefully and wonderful and then it gets "infected" by the unruly mob, who have less chance of being apprehended with all the people around.

    This year Scotland Yard made 454 arrests across the two days of the Bank Holiday street party, including 45 attacks on police and 88 knife-related incidents.

    Metropolitan Police Federation chairman Ken Marsh claimed that rank-and-file officers “dread” the event, the biggest of its kind in Europe, in which they are treated as “professional punchbags”.

    There are suggestions that the festival could be held in Hyde Park, an all ticket affair, where attendees are searched beforehand.

    Ok, it won't be quite the same, but surely a better idea, that the revellers can revel, without the risk of being robbed and assaulted ?

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/singer-who-was-stabbed-at-notting-hill-carnival-we-cant-let-a-crazed-minority-ruin-it-a3336686.html

    Says it all really
    Well apparently it doesn't & it must be seen as acceptable to some, if nothing needs to change.

    I often wonder what the people who defend these sort of criminal activities would say if one of their friends or family were sexually assaulted or stabbed. Would that be acceptable to them or should something be done to try and prevent it ?
  • Garrymanilow
    Garrymanilow Posts: 13,169
    Algarveaddick said:

    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    Well it had been going nearly 30 years by then, so you must have known it was local, even if it has expanded since? I live across the road from a pub that was a quiet locals place, then empty for years. Now it is open until 4AM and is one of "the places to be" for the youth of Albufeira. I accept that I bought a house opposite a pub, and paid the going rate for a house opposite a pub. And that's 6 nights a week 52 weeks of the year, not 3 days in 365.
    I'll quite happily accept that there's going to be noise and loads of people. I'll accept that one weekend a year I have to put up with a carnival, that's only fair. What I won't accept is the streets around me being filled with piss, mountains of rubbish and chicken bones in the street. There's a vast difference between accepting you live near a place where there will be events and accepting people treating your area like a literal toilet. There's just no need for it
  • cafcdave123
    cafcdave123 Posts: 11,491
    Algarveaddick said:

    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    Well it had been going nearly 30 years by then, so you must have known it was local, even if it has expanded since? I live across the road from a pub that was a quiet locals place, then empty for years. Now it is open until 4AM and is one of "the places to be" for the youth of Albufeira. I accept that I bought a house opposite a pub, and paid the going rate for a house opposite a pub. And that's 6 nights a week 52 weeks of the year, not 3 days in 365.
    so if the pub you speak of started having the crimes that NHC attracts you would be absolutely fine?

    i know there are people getting molested, mugged and stabbed over the road but fuck me, the house was cheap...
  • Algarveaddick
    Algarveaddick Posts: 21,153
    cafcdave123 said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    Well it had been going nearly 30 years by then, so you must have known it was local, even if it has expanded since? I live across the road from a pub that was a quiet locals place, then empty for years. Now it is open until 4AM and is one of "the places to be" for the youth of Albufeira. I accept that I bought a house opposite a pub, and paid the going rate for a house opposite a pub. And that's 6 nights a week 52 weeks of the year, not 3 days in 365.
    so if the pub you speak of started having the crimes that NHC attracts you would be absolutely fine?

    i know there are people getting molested, mugged and stabbed over the road but fuck me, the house was cheap...
    How much can you exaggerate in one post? 246 people were arrested out of a million for that kind of thing. The NHC was subject to that kind of behaviour before Sillav moved there, it hasn't just started this weekend.
  • Algarveaddick
    Algarveaddick Posts: 21,153
    Covered End said:

    charltonbob said:

    Covered End said:

    I have felt for a long time, that something needs to be done to reduce the violence and protect the people who attend to enjoy themselves, which are of course the vast majority.

    It seems akin to many demonstrations. It all starts off peacefully and wonderful and then it gets "infected" by the unruly mob, who have less chance of being apprehended with all the people around.

    This year Scotland Yard made 454 arrests across the two days of the Bank Holiday street party, including 45 attacks on police and 88 knife-related incidents.

    Metropolitan Police Federation chairman Ken Marsh claimed that rank-and-file officers “dread” the event, the biggest of its kind in Europe, in which they are treated as “professional punchbags”.

    There are suggestions that the festival could be held in Hyde Park, an all ticket affair, where attendees are searched beforehand.

    Ok, it won't be quite the same, but surely a better idea, that the revellers can revel, without the risk of being robbed and assaulted ?

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/singer-who-was-stabbed-at-notting-hill-carnival-we-cant-let-a-crazed-minority-ruin-it-a3336686.html

    Says it all really
    Well apparently it doesn't & it must be seen as acceptable to some, if nothing needs to change.

    I often wonder what the people who defend these sort of criminal activities would say if one of their friends or family were sexually assaulted or stabbed. Would that be acceptable to them or should something be done to try and prevent it ?
    Who is defending "these sort of criminal activities"? I don't see anyone at all defending criminal activity? Defending the rights of hundreds of thousands of people to have a good time peacefully in the way they want to, without letting a very small minority spoil it isn't the same thing at all.

    Some people drink and drive and people die because of their actions, should all cars be banned?
  • colthe3rd
    colthe3rd Posts: 8,486
    Once again the solution must be to punish the many because of the actions of the few. Surely the way to go about this is to stop violent crime, easier said than done I know but the fact is the vast majority that go to this do so for a good time. Let's suppose that the terrible hooliganism made a return to football. Would the answer be to shutdown football? How would all of us feel about that? Yet that's what many on here seem to be suggesting to do for carnival.
  • cafcdave123
    cafcdave123 Posts: 11,491
    Algarveaddick said:

    cafcdave123 said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    sillav nitram said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    When did you move there?

    1992.
    Well it had been going nearly 30 years by then, so you must have known it was local, even if it has expanded since? I live across the road from a pub that was a quiet locals place, then empty for years. Now it is open until 4AM and is one of "the places to be" for the youth of Albufeira. I accept that I bought a house opposite a pub, and paid the going rate for a house opposite a pub. And that's 6 nights a week 52 weeks of the year, not 3 days in 365.
    so if the pub you speak of started having the crimes that NHC attracts you would be absolutely fine?

    i know there are people getting molested, mugged and stabbed over the road but fuck me, the house was cheap...
    How much can you exaggerate in one post? 246 people were arrested out of a million for that kind of thing. The NHC was subject to that kind of behaviour before Sillav moved there, it hasn't just started this weekend.
    so if the pub you speak of had its customers being arrested for carrying WMD's whilst the owner ran an international pedophile ring, like we have seen at NHC, you would just be grateful the house was cheap?

    seriously, what i was getting at was lost in the post.

    i very much doubt that the NHC pre 1992 had seen the crime that the last 5 years alone have seen, so saying you knew of the downfalls when you moved there is, in all honesty, complete bollox
  • Algarveaddick
    Algarveaddick Posts: 21,153
    Sorry Dave, it used to be worse.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/5275542.stm
  • The_Organiser
    The_Organiser Posts: 3,999
    colthe3rd said:

    Once again the solution must be to punish the many because of the actions of the few. Surely the way to go about this is to stop violent crime, easier said than done I know but the fact is the vast majority that go to this do so for a good time. Let's suppose that the terrible hooliganism made a return to football. Would the answer be to shutdown football? How would all of us feel about that? Yet that's what many on here seem to be suggesting to do for carnival.

    No but draconian measures have been brought in for all those attending - not just 'the minority'.

    Don't ban it necessarily but bring in the required measures for those attending.
  • Algarveaddick
    Algarveaddick Posts: 21,153
    http://www.met.police.uk/foi/pdfs/disclosure_2016/february_2016/2015090001643.pdf
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  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    Algarveaddick said:

    Covered End said:

    charltonbob said:

    Covered End said:

    I have felt for a long time, that something needs to be done to reduce the violence and protect the people who attend to enjoy themselves, which are of course the vast majority.

    It seems akin to many demonstrations. It all starts off peacefully and wonderful and then it gets "infected" by the unruly mob, who have less chance of being apprehended with all the people around.

    This year Scotland Yard made 454 arrests across the two days of the Bank Holiday street party, including 45 attacks on police and 88 knife-related incidents.

    Metropolitan Police Federation chairman Ken Marsh claimed that rank-and-file officers “dread” the event, the biggest of its kind in Europe, in which they are treated as “professional punchbags”.

    There are suggestions that the festival could be held in Hyde Park, an all ticket affair, where attendees are searched beforehand.

    Ok, it won't be quite the same, but surely a better idea, that the revellers can revel, without the risk of being robbed and assaulted ?

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/singer-who-was-stabbed-at-notting-hill-carnival-we-cant-let-a-crazed-minority-ruin-it-a3336686.html

    Says it all really
    Well apparently it doesn't & it must be seen as acceptable to some, if nothing needs to change.

    I often wonder what the people who defend these sort of criminal activities would say if one of their friends or family were sexually assaulted or stabbed. Would that be acceptable to them or should something be done to try and prevent it ?
    Who is defending "these sort of criminal activities"? I don't see anyone at all defending criminal activity? Defending the rights of hundreds of thousands of people to have a good time peacefully in the way they want to, without letting a very small minority spoil it isn't the same thing at all.

    Some people drink and drive and people die because of their actions, should all cars be banned?
    I didn't say ban it. I said make it safer for the attendees by ticketing it & putting it in Hyde Park.

    The same as we endeavour to reduce drink driving by breathalysing people and making it a criminal offence. We don't just say to the drink drivers, "carry on that's fine".
  • Algarveaddick
    Algarveaddick Posts: 21,153
    Covered End said:

    Algarveaddick said:

    Covered End said:

    charltonbob said:

    Covered End said:

    I have felt for a long time, that something needs to be done to reduce the violence and protect the people who attend to enjoy themselves, which are of course the vast majority.

    It seems akin to many demonstrations. It all starts off peacefully and wonderful and then it gets "infected" by the unruly mob, who have less chance of being apprehended with all the people around.

    This year Scotland Yard made 454 arrests across the two days of the Bank Holiday street party, including 45 attacks on police and 88 knife-related incidents.

    Metropolitan Police Federation chairman Ken Marsh claimed that rank-and-file officers “dread” the event, the biggest of its kind in Europe, in which they are treated as “professional punchbags”.

    There are suggestions that the festival could be held in Hyde Park, an all ticket affair, where attendees are searched beforehand.

    Ok, it won't be quite the same, but surely a better idea, that the revellers can revel, without the risk of being robbed and assaulted ?

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/singer-who-was-stabbed-at-notting-hill-carnival-we-cant-let-a-crazed-minority-ruin-it-a3336686.html

    Says it all really
    Well apparently it doesn't & it must be seen as acceptable to some, if nothing needs to change.

    I often wonder what the people who defend these sort of criminal activities would say if one of their friends or family were sexually assaulted or stabbed. Would that be acceptable to them or should something be done to try and prevent it ?
    Who is defending "these sort of criminal activities"? I don't see anyone at all defending criminal activity? Defending the rights of hundreds of thousands of people to have a good time peacefully in the way they want to, without letting a very small minority spoil it isn't the same thing at all.

    Some people drink and drive and people die because of their actions, should all cars be banned?
    I didn't say ban it. I said make it safer for the attendees by ticketing it & putting it in Hyde Park.

    The same as we endeavour to reduce drink driving by breathalysing people and making it a criminal offence. We don't just say to the drink drivers, "carry on that's fine".
    See your point CE. I just think it ceases to be "Carnival" if you turn it into "Party in the Park".
  • cafcdave123
    cafcdave123 Posts: 11,491
    Algarveaddick said:

    Sorry Dave, it used to be worse.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/5275542.stm

    well in that case, saying you knew of the downfalls when you moved there is, in all honesty, anything but complete bollox...
  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    Leuth said:

    I'm here now! You can all relax

    Just waiting for Prague, as he was so quick to tell us about the 4 England fans arrested in Bratislava.

    He's bound to want to condemn the 454 arrests at the carnival :wink:
  • colthe3rd
    colthe3rd Posts: 8,486
    So put it in the park, so they can charge £60 a ticket? Plus whatever error astronomical amounts for food and drink? I also don't think that would please the residents around there given they've already kicked off about the events that already take place. The one thing I do like about carnival is that it is independent, we don't need another commercialised event in the city.

    It's also debateable about whether that would actually sort the problem or just move it on. Plenty of the "festivals" in London still ha e crime and arrests taking place. Look at the trouble at Finsbury Park a couple of years back.
  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    edited September 2016
    Why would they charge £60 a ticket ? It's self entertainment.
    It should be free or a token £5, as you should have massive savings elsewhere.
  • colthe3rd
    colthe3rd Posts: 8,486
    I was exaggerating but there's no way they'd allow it to happen for free. Someone would look to make money on the event. I also think it's just another way of punishing those that go to have a good time.
  • SantaClaus
    SantaClaus Posts: 7,652
    My experience of the carnival is that the mood goes south in the early evening of the second day. The organisers/police need to concentrate on sorting it out at that point. Maybe a free daytime street party can be held in conjunction with a ticketed/regulated evening spin off.
  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUatH8zI6Qc
  • Riscardo
    Riscardo Posts: 2,337
    soapboxsam said:

    "Following the amount of black people that wish to stab each other, I am surprised the black lives matter mob haven't asked for it to be banned indefinitely".

    why don't Black lives matter tackle the problem of black on black stabbings and murders ?




    Honestly

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