Someone posted in the same thread "The Aussies have pulled out lack of funding".
Not according to Gerard just now. By the sounds of all the rumours you’d think Dalman must be ahead though. Have no other info at the moment.
Of course the Aussies don't have the funding, otherwise they would have bought the Club two years ago.
Be honest, you don’t have any evidence to make this claim, do you?
I would suggest that they have their price and terms for purchase and will not shift from it.
I would further suggest that the reason we have not got new owners lies firmly with Roland, and not with the Aussies, or any of the professional businessmen, that have tried.
That's the point though...what sensible business people would buy a football club these days....none in terms of a pure business decision.
Most clubs are loss making season to season
Ways to make money owning clubs in modern football appear to be limited to:
1) buy one of the few profit generating (I imagine) super clubs like Barcelona, Madrid etc
2) Invest own money or leverage the purchase and future investment against your own private company charging interest gambling at seeing a return by getting to the top flight and cashing in by someone willing to gamble on taking it to the next level ie champion's league ...very low odds and an increasingly competitive league extend these odds
3) asset stripping/ land sale - unlikely and commercial property investment would yield a greater return without anywhere near the same amount of headaches as doing it at a living breathing football clubs.
So if football clubs aren't bought on business decisions that leaves you with owners whose rationale for buying and funding is:
1) passion for that particular club...ie local boy done well...rare as hens teeth in England now the level of wealth required
2) ego trippers - the Tan types
3) genuine decent types like Leicester's late owner who will invest in the concept and the town and its people....even rarer than point 1
4) lunatics who see a new rule like FFP to be exploited and spend years stubbornly trying to instil a failed experiment and protracted sale (mentioning no names)
5) consortia of random investors sold on a return that will soon become apparent doesn't exist a la Kevin Cash
6) Man city types who have so much perpetual wealth they can take tens of millions of losses for seasons on end until an equilibrium is reached and the balance tilts so they can then buy the trophies in perpetuity- rare again
Any sensible business person would not buy a club as a sensible investment alone.
And whether their motivations and objectives are aligned with the supporters and what is good for the long and short term future of that club appears to be incidental on an increasing basis across the English game.
The Aussies have a plan to help develop Australian players so perhaps you could consider adding that sort of criteria to your list.
I think you also ignore that very few make decisions based solely on economic sense. We buy new cars, go on nice holidays, give money to charities etc etc.
The very rich buy massive yachts, private planes, fleets of expensive cars, houses all over the world that are staffed and maintained at huge losses. You have to make sure your rivals know how rich you are and keep upping the stakes.
Really successful entrepreneurs enjoy the game of making money. Owning a football club is also a good game. The best at the game win big, and also enjoy the whole ownership thing.
Of course. Let's hope the objectives of our next owners whomever they are aligned with ours.
Re the developing Aussie talent is there real scope for that in terms of work permit limitations and home grown requirements? (Not even sure if such requirements even still exist).
I don't think constructive sceptism/ caution is necessarily unhealthy and that questioning potential owner's motives and capabilities is taboo (providing it's not attacking the messenger) particularly given our recent ownership history.
Not being Duchatelet does not automatically equate to being better for Charlton and the proof will be in what unfolds once we're bought.
Whilst like all of us I hope our next owners will be good and at least not as bad as the current one I don't subscribe to the anyone else is automatically better given we probably all thought his purchase and the Jiminez ownership were positive in the early days.
Wasn’t expecting to cause such a stir. A couple of you need to calm down a bit.
For info, Murphy sometimes calls me, and I haven’t called him for three weeks.
I sent him a Whats App last night, because of all the rumours flying around, asking if they’d pulled out. He said they haven’t.
And that’s it.
To be honest I’m pretty bored with all the transfer talk, and I don’t even have a preference as to who buys the club. If the Aussies don’t have funding to buy the club and run it properly for five years I’d rather someone else did. But as Henry said, we don’t really know the facts at the current time.
We’ve heard good and bad things about Dalman, but he has genuine relevant experience in high level football, and clearly isn’t another spiv - but he is what you’d call a football man. Wouldn’t be disappointed at all if he bought the club.
Appreciate you posting what you hear James.
What negative things have we heard about Dalman btw? For me he looks a sound choice.
Well I think we learnt that his full name is an anagram for something disturbing ...hem mental mad . Something like that.
If only it were hen mental mad. I’d see that as a sign.
The biggest problem I can see with the Australians, is the complexity of the consortium.
Every time the make up of the consortium changes, the paperwork to the EFL changes. Then the EFL start doing their "Fit and Proper Persons" checks, (and we all should be aware what a joke that is. See Blackpool, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.) Then, someone pulls out of the consortium, the Aussies hunt around for new members, and they then resubmit a new list to the EFL.
The biggest problem I can see with the Australians, is the complexity of the consortium.
Every time the make up of the consortium changes, the paperwork to the EFL changes. Then the EFL start doing their "Fit and Proper Persons" checks, (and we all should be aware what a joke that is. See Blackpool, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.) Then, someone pulls out of the consortium, the Aussies hunt around for new members, and they then resubmit a new list to the EFL.
And the whole palalaver starts all over again...
Me too.
It is a real concern for me that if the faces are changing so often before the sale what about after.
No way is It Murphy’s baby he is just the frontman of a poor band
I can tell you it is.
if it is we are in more trouble than ever because on the supermarket scale of money he is lidl at best
i would be shocked if you are right there
I think we may be getting some wires crossed here. When I said it is his baby I mean that he was on board from conception and he has and I'm guessing still is having a big say on the strategy of the project. He told me as much when I spoke to him. For that reason, as I said to HI, he would have first hand knowledge of those that have committed financially, the money available and the prices being asked to pay.
At no point did I say he was the one with the financial clout.
No way is It Murphy’s baby he is just the frontman of a poor band
I can tell you it is.
if it is we are in more trouble than ever because on the supermarket scale of money he is lidl at best
i would be shocked if you are right there
Could be way off beam here but by “Murphys baby” I take that to mean that it’s his idea. His plan. His blueprint to make it work. That’s a long way from saying it’s his money although no doubt he would invest what he could afford.
Also never quite understood why any investor after having read the prospectus in which it states “to elevate the club to the EPL” would not think that the aim was going to be costly and not achievable without a serious financial commitment. Anything less than a serious financial commitment would be like flushing your money down the pan. Certainly Muir is a serious businessman and won’t have been hoodwinked by anyone to think that achieving the goals can be done on the cheap regardless of how good your business plan is. I’m assuming that other money people are equally as astute.
No way is It Murphy’s baby he is just the frontman of a poor band
I can tell you it is.
if it is we are in more trouble than ever because on the supermarket scale of money he is lidl at best
i would be shocked if you are right there
I think we may be getting some wires crossed here. When I said it is his baby I mean that he was on board from conception and he has and I'm guessing still is having a big say on the strategy of the project. He told me as much when I spoke to him. For that reason, as I said to HI, he would have first hand knowledge of those that have committed financially, the money available and the prices being asked to pay.
At no point did I say he was the one with the financial clout.
Apologies in that context he is without A doubt as you describe
If I had sent my wife out to buy Charlton she would have had it done and dusted in a day - she wouldn't be able to afford it and probably wouldn't have looked at the price tag, but that has never stopped her in the past ......
With all this takeover is immanent again bollox I wondered to myself when the next fans forum is.......?? tomorrow I hear you cry - now there's a surprise.
With all this takeover is immanent again bollox I wondered to myself when the next fans forum is.......?? tomorrow I hear you cry - now there's a surprise.
Yes, because Dalman and the Aussies have the fans’ forum at the top of their agenda and managing the room is a massive priority for Duchatelet, the masterful media strategist. Or perhaps not...
@nth london addick as a perennial dismisser of the Aussies financial abilities, could you kindly explain why and how you are so sure? Ta
As I said earlier, their website touting for investors is a decent clue.
Is it though?? If that’s all he’s got to go on, that’s flaky at best. You can never have too much money. It’s certainly not an indicator that they haven’t got enough to proceed
@nth london addick as a perennial dismisser of the Aussies financial abilities, could you kindly explain why and how you are so sure? Ta
As I said earlier, their website touting for investors is a decent clue.
Is it though?? If that’s all he’s got to go on, that’s flaky at best. You can never have too much money. It’s certainly not an indicator that they haven’t got enough to proceed
But how can you then tell that investor, just say for example, when Charlton get promoted to the Premier League, and the consortium sells for an enormous profit: "Sorry, but we didn't use any of your money, so you get none of the profits."?
@nth london addick as a perennial dismisser of the Aussies financial abilities, could you kindly explain why and how you are so sure? Ta
As I said earlier, their website touting for investors is a decent clue.
Is it though?? If that’s all he’s got to go on, that’s flaky at best. You can never have too much money. It’s certainly not an indicator that they haven’t got enough to proceed
They were also aggressively looking for investors after initially filing EFL paperwork, once again suggesting funds were not in place.
I have no idea of NLAs sources but I very much doubt he'd just make stuff up for a laugh.
@nth london addick as a perennial dismisser of the Aussies financial abilities, could you kindly explain why and how you are so sure? Ta
As I said earlier, their website touting for investors is a decent clue.
Is it though?? If that’s all he’s got to go on, that’s flaky at best. You can never have too much money. It’s certainly not an indicator that they haven’t got enough to proceed
I asked about that a few weeks ago, and it's nothing to do with current financing, it's potentially for future financing opportunities, further down the line. I believe Sunderland have just accepted new investment, for example. How it works exactly, I have no idea. Not ‘aggressively’ seeking backing though.
Also, as has been mentioned, GM is the man behind the consortium, but he's not an investor as far as I'm aware. Never asked tbh, but always assumed not. He does all the negotiating.
@nth london addick as a perennial dismisser of the Aussies financial abilities, could you kindly explain why and how you are so sure? Ta
As I said earlier, their website touting for investors is a decent clue.
Is it though?? If that’s all he’s got to go on, that’s flaky at best. You can never have too much money. It’s certainly not an indicator that they haven’t got enough to proceed
They were also aggressively looking for investors after initially filing EFL paperwork, once again suggesting funds were not in place.
I have no idea of NLAs sources but I very much doubt he'd just make stuff up for a laugh.
Which is why I asked NLA. He has been so adamant I assume he has some concrete evidence
No way is It Murphy’s baby he is just the frontman of a poor band
I can tell you it is.
if it is we are in more trouble than ever because on the supermarket scale of money he is lidl at best
i would be shocked if you are right there
Could be way off bream here but by “Murphys baby” I take that to mean that it’s his idea. His plan. His blueprint to make it work. That’s a long way from saying it’s his money although no doubt he would invest what he could afford.
Also never quite understood why any investor after having read the prospectus in which it states “to elevate the club to the EPL” would not think that the aim was going to be costly and not achievable without a serious financial commitment. Anything less than a serious financial commitment would be like flushing your money down the pan. Certainly Muir is a serious businessman and won’t have been hoodwinked by anyone to think that achieving the goals can be done on the cheap regardless of how good your business plan is. I’m assuming that other money people are equally as astute.
Fawaz Al-Hawasi... well in many respects I am glad he never came that close to buying us from Roland. With the Forest fans hating him and now this story about him taking their 1959 FA Cup trophy as his own personal possession:
Comments
Re the developing Aussie talent is there real scope for that in terms of work permit limitations and home grown requirements? (Not even sure if such requirements even still exist).
I don't think constructive sceptism/ caution is necessarily unhealthy and that questioning potential owner's motives and capabilities is taboo (providing it's not attacking the messenger) particularly given our recent ownership history.
Not being Duchatelet does not automatically equate to being better for Charlton and the proof will be in what unfolds once we're bought.
Whilst like all of us I hope our next owners will be good and at least not as bad as the current one I don't subscribe to the anyone else is automatically better given we probably all thought his purchase and the Jiminez ownership were positive in the early days.
Every time the make up of the consortium changes, the paperwork to the EFL changes. Then the EFL start doing their "Fit and Proper Persons" checks, (and we all should be aware what a joke that is. See Blackpool, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.) Then, someone pulls out of the consortium, the Aussies hunt around for new members, and they then resubmit a new list to the EFL.
And the whole palaver starts all over again...
i would be shocked if you are right there
When I said it is his baby I mean that he was on board from conception and he has and I'm guessing still is having a big say on the strategy of the project. He told me as much when I spoke to him.
For that reason, as I said to HI, he would have first hand knowledge of those that have committed financially, the money available and the prices being asked to pay.
At no point did I say he was the one with the financial clout.
Also never quite understood why any investor after having read the prospectus in which it states “to elevate the club to the EPL” would not think that the aim was going to be costly and not achievable without a serious financial commitment. Anything less than a serious financial commitment would be like flushing your money down the pan. Certainly Muir is a serious businessman and won’t have been hoodwinked by anyone to think that achieving the goals can be done on the cheap regardless of how good your business plan is. I’m assuming that other money people are equally as astute.
"It's easy to become a millionaire as an owner of a football club..."
"You have to start as a billionaire, though!"
Apologies in that context he is without A doubt as you describe
as a perennial dismisser of the Aussies financial abilities, could you kindly explain why and how you are so sure? Ta
With all this takeover is immanent again bollox I wondered to myself when the next fans forum is.......?? tomorrow I hear you cry - now there's a surprise.
I only wish he could.
I have no idea of NLAs sources but I very much doubt he'd just make stuff up for a laugh.
Also, as has been mentioned, GM is the man behind the consortium, but he's not an investor as far as I'm aware. Never asked tbh, but always assumed not. He does all the negotiating.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/jun/25/nottingham-forest-demand-former-owner-return-replica-of-1959-fa-cup-fawaz-al-hasawi
So many bat-sh!t crazy people involved in football, I hope we get Dalman, someone who seems to understand the game and what is required to succeed.