There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
I don't think that is unfair at all, especially if you are a regular visitor to this thread and therefore party to Golfie's comments here.
If a journalist asked a leading Brexit politician whether Brexit could "ravage" the value of personal pension pots he would froth at the mouth and screech "there, Project Fear again"
Would he not?
All that said, there was a smiley, as the main goal was to gently wind Golfie up.
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
The ballot paper merely asked voters if they wanted to 'Leave the European Union' - there was no discussion of how this was to be done and I don't remember any debate re hard or soft Brexit. I'm assuming voters thought it was a simple process and that all the planning was in place.
No need to read anymore. This in a nutshell for me.
I've said many times on here there was just a simple Yes / No on the ballot paper with no hard, soft or crispy around the edge options. I assumed (along with quite a few others I would imagine) that the Governnent had looked into what "to leave the EU" meant & that it was, in fact, possible. I didn't expect the day after for the PM to open a drawer & take out a folder marked " instructions on how to leave the EU".....for it seems its what Cameron left TM to do.
It will take a heck of a long time before I vote Tory again. Certainly wont be voting Labour.....and as the Lib Dems want us to stay its either UKIP or an Independent / monster raving loony party.
As the old saying goes, "Assumption is the Mother of all fuck ups."
First of all, the government did not plan on leaving the European Union, they campaigned to stay in it but lost.
It was incumbent on Farage, Johnson et al to explain HOW they were going to leave the EU and untangle 40 years of complex trade deals in about two years once Article 50 was invoked.
From what I could see they never explained how they would do it at all, just spouted a whole bunch of bullshit about how easy it would be and how the NHS was going to get 350 million extra quid per week once the UK left the EU and just enough people fell for it.
Of course, the problem is that they now have to deliver the undeliverable and reality is going to hit them - and the UK as a whole - square in the bollocks come next March.
It is becoming increasingly obvious that the EU themselves are determined to make an example of the UK to prevent anyone else from trying to break off in the future.
So, the UK has two options, take the hard Brexit and suffer horrendous economic and political shock or, go to the EU with its tail between its legs and beg to be taken back into the fold and admit the whole things was a complete debacle.
The EU are clearly not that interested in a compromise option and you can't really blame them as it doesn't really benefit them to offer it.
Sorry, but it wasn't incumbent on any particular individual to day How wr should
One question you don't see asked is that if this organisation is so difficult to leave....why would one want to be a part of it in the first place?!
because no-one knew when joining how difficult it was to leave. Also, we joined when there were only 7 other countries & it was the "Common Market".
I reckon Trump was right......we should sue them for mis-representation. (joke)
You don't think it was incumbent on the leader of the single issue party pushing for independence from the EU to set out how things would work in practical terms if we voted for his party?
It's academic anyway because many of those behind Brexit told us exactly how to achieve it. They told us, back then, to be like Norway...
I notice that the Brexit blame game has started in earnest with Liam Fox saying its the EU’s fault negotiations are going badly because of their intransigence.
This from the man that says a “no deal” is now 60/40 on the back of saying in 2016 that a deal with the EU would be “the easiest in human history”
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
I don't think that is unfair at all, especially if you are a regular visitor to this thread and therefore party to Golfie's comments here.
If a journalist asked a leading Brexit politician whether Brexit could "ravage" the value of personal pension pots he would froth at the mouth and screech "there, Project Fear again"
Would he not?
All that said, there was a smiley, as the main goal was to gently wind Golfie up.
I am sure the public love journalists and Ifa's in equal measure. Only marginally ahead of estate agents and used car salesman.
if you honestly believe that a "project fear" exists, you're an idiot. It's the same as people who believe theres some wild conspiracy going on to SMEAR (tm) corbyn or that theres a fake news conspiracy to stop us all from falling in love with trump.
All use the exact same tactic of trivialising criticism in order to hide their "side's" incompetence or, worse, hide the more sinister bits of policy behind.
I notice that the Brexit blame game has started in earnest with Liam Fox saying its the EU’s fault negotiations are going badly because of their intransigence.
This from the man that says a “no deal” is now 60/40 on the back of saying in 2016 that a deal with the EU would be “the easiest in human history”
Moron
Insulting to the vast majority of decent morons to be compared to Liam Fox.
I notice that the Brexit blame game has started in earnest with Liam Fox saying its the EU’s fault negotiations are going badly because of their intransigence.
This from the man that says a “no deal” is now 60/40 on the back of saying in 2016 that a deal with the EU would be “the easiest in human history”
Moron
Insulting to the vast majority of decent morons to be compared to Liam Fox.
And there was me (he said, subtly reaching for his coat), thinking that he was signing off his message.... as me.
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
don't worry, I can handle myself on here.
The comment on the pensions thread was purely to suggest there were different scenarios to think about when transferring out of a secured final salary scheme into a defined contribution scheme. Investment markets being the main one. I purely picked Brexit as possibly being a factor to think about in such a case. I wasn't saying it would be a bad thing, merely just something to add into the mix.
Just remember what happened after the vote on June 2016. The FTSE soared the very next day & has climbed around 15% since.
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
don't worry, I can handle myself on here.
The comment on the pensions thread was purely to suggest there were different scenarios to think about when transferring out of a secured final salary scheme into a defined contribution scheme. Investment markets being the main one. I purely picked Brexit as possibly being a factor to think about in such a case. I wasn't saying it would be a bad thing, merely just something to add into the mix.
Just remember what happened after the vote on June 2016. The FTSE soared the very next day & has climbed around 15% since.
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
don't worry, I can handle myself on here.
The comment on the pensions thread was purely to suggest there were different scenarios to think about when transferring out of a secured final salary scheme into a defined contribution scheme. Investment markets being the main one. I purely picked Brexit as possibly being a factor to think about in such a case. I wasn't saying it would be a bad thing, merely just something to add into the mix.
Just remember what happened after the vote on June 2016. The FTSE soared the very next day & has climbed around 15% since.
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
I think that's a little unfair @PragueAddick to quote that out of context from the Pensions thread.
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
don't worry, I can handle myself on here.
The comment on the pensions thread was purely to suggest there were different scenarios to think about when transferring out of a secured final salary scheme into a defined contribution scheme. Investment markets being the main one. I purely picked Brexit as possibly being a factor to think about in such a case. I wasn't saying it would be a bad thing, merely just something to add into the mix.
Just remember what happened after the vote on June 2016. The FTSE soared the very next day & has climbed around 15% since.
I get the point you are trying to make but the FTSE did not "soar" the next day at all...
It dropped.
It's been a long while since I studied any economics but my understanding (and I might be wrong tbf), is, as already pointed out by @hoof_it_up_to_benty that the growth of the FTSE since Brexit is less due to increased confidence in the performance of the companies concerned and more to the drop in value of the pound. Hence, when it became clear that the FTSE 100 companies, who were earning more than 70% of their earnings outside the UK, we're going to benefit from "free" money due to the fall of the pound, their value went up.
It seems to me you're attributing a positive bounce in the FTSE to the Brexit decision when in effect it is a reaction to the very negative impact the decision had on our currency.
That's right. The FTSE 250 is a better measure of the performance of UK owned companies and it did not perform anything like as well as FTSE 100. Since the referendum most major markets globally have performed well too. And funny enough not because all the companies are rejoicing about Brexit.
There is another thread running devoted to pensions. There, an Independent Financial Adviser makes the following comment (with my emphasis in bold):
Transfer values have never been so good - but that doesn't mean you should transfer away your benefits into a PP that could be ravaged by Brexit over the next few years.
And the identity of this perceptive and alert IFA?
Why, none other than one of this thread's most resolute Brexiteers....
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
The ballot paper merely asked voters if they wanted to 'Leave the European Union' - there was no discussion of how this was to be done and I don't remember any debate re hard or soft Brexit. I'm assuming voters thought it was a simple process and that all the planning was in place.
No need to read anymore. This in a nutshell for me.
I've said many times on here there was just a simple Yes / No on the ballot paper with no hard, soft or crispy around the edge options. I assumed (along with quite a few others I would imagine) that the Governnent had looked into what "to leave the EU" meant & that it was, in fact, possible. I didn't expect the day after for the PM to open a drawer & take out a folder marked " instructions on how to leave the EU".....for it seems its what Cameron left TM to do.
It will take a heck of a long time before I vote Tory again. Certainly wont be voting Labour.....and as the Lib Dems want us to stay its either UKIP or an Independent / monster raving loony party.
Funny enough, I distinctly recall remainers everywhere - in the pub, on the tele, here on CL, telling people who intended to vote leave, over and over and over, of some of the potential pitfalls (we didn't know all of them at the time). As mentioned elsewhere, HM government told you their advice was to vote remain. You ignore it, and then blame them?
If you chose to ignore lots of people's advice, how can anyone be to blame but you?
The tory press, talking heads and brexiteers on here have been very free and easy with the term "traitor" when talking about remainers, or anybody who disagrees with their particular vision of brexit. All very quiet when it comes to the ever growing line of rich rats jumping ship, whilst all the time telling us how wonderful brexit will be.
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
The ballot paper merely asked voters if they wanted to 'Leave the European Union' - there was no discussion of how this was to be done and I don't remember any debate re hard or soft Brexit. I'm assuming voters thought it was a simple process and that all the planning was in place.
No need to read anymore. This in a nutshell for me.
I've said many times on here there was just a simple Yes / No on the ballot paper with no hard, soft or crispy around the edge options. I assumed (along with quite a few others I would imagine) that the Governnent had looked into what "to leave the EU" meant & that it was, in fact, possible. I didn't expect the day after for the PM to open a drawer & take out a folder marked " instructions on how to leave the EU".....for it seems its what Cameron left TM to do.
It will take a heck of a long time before I vote Tory again. Certainly wont be voting Labour.....and as the Lib Dems want us to stay its either UKIP or an Independent / monster raving loony party.
Funny enough, I distinctly recall remainers everywhere - in the pub, on the tele, here on CL, telling people who intended to vote leave, over and over and over, of some of the potential pitfalls (we didn't know all of them at the time). As mentioned elsewhere, HM government told you their advice was to vote remain. You ignore it, and then blame them?
If you chose to ignore lots of people's advice, how can anyone be to blame but you?
Cameron told the world he was going to get concessions then got nothing. He then wrote a 1st past post ballot instead of a say 5% majority, with none of the various options of type of Brexit.
Brexiteers like Boris, JRM and others arrogantly assume that 100% of the 51.9% voted for a hard or no Brexit, despite them and many of the leavers promising we could leave and stay in Customs Union. Hence leaving without a soft option or stay would be against the will of the people.
This is the obvious point purposely missed by politicians going on about the will of the people. It is pretty safe to say that all those who voted remain would prefer a soft Brexit to a hard one, but it is also clear that a percentage of leavers would have wanted a soft Brexit. Polls since the vote bear this out, and the figures are too large to dismiss that the soft option is the will of the people.
Of course our democratic system is all about ignoring the will of the people so it is the instinct of politicians to totally ignore the preference of those who voted remain as if they don't exist. I'm sure most brexiters, beyond any doubt, wanted a hard brexit but that is only relevant if you are intent on ignoring the will of the people and ignoring everybody else.
The fact is the preference is clearly for a Norway type arrangement, and if you allow for margin of errors in polls, it is pretty clear the difference is too high for this not to be the case. I think this is yet another deceipt from hard leave politicians and this country will be divided for many years to come if a hard Brexit is forced on us!
The ballot paper merely asked voters if they wanted to 'Leave the European Union' - there was no discussion of how this was to be done and I don't remember any debate re hard or soft Brexit. I'm assuming voters thought it was a simple process and that all the planning was in place.
No need to read anymore. This in a nutshell for me.
I've said many times on here there was just a simple Yes / No on the ballot paper with no hard, soft or crispy around the edge options. I assumed (along with quite a few others I would imagine) that the Governnent had looked into what "to leave the EU" meant & that it was, in fact, possible. I didn't expect the day after for the PM to open a drawer & take out a folder marked " instructions on how to leave the EU".....for it seems its what Cameron left TM to do.
It will take a heck of a long time before I vote Tory again. Certainly wont be voting Labour.....and as the Lib Dems want us to stay its either UKIP or an Independent / monster raving loony party.
Funny enough, I distinctly recall remainers everywhere - in the pub, on the tele, here on CL, telling people who intended to vote leave, over and over and over, of some of the potential pitfalls (we didn't know all of them at the time). As mentioned elsewhere, HM government told you their advice was to vote remain. You ignore it, and then blame them?
If you chose to ignore lots of people's advice, how can anyone be to blame but you?
Cameron told the world he was going to get concessions then got nothing. He then wrote a 1st past post ballot instead of a say5% majority, with none of the various options of type of Brexit.
Comments
He says "could".
There are many variable scenarios and @golfaddick was providing a balanced answer on pension transfers. Off course the pound could tank with interest rates and gilt yields rising and transfer values could on the other side of the coin halve in value?
I don't recall Black Wednesday and the erm debacle being terribly smooth.
Maybe now is an excellent time to transfer if Armageddon is upon us. Transfer out for cash!!
If a journalist asked a leading Brexit politician whether Brexit could "ravage" the value of personal pension pots he would froth at the mouth and screech "there, Project Fear again"
Would he not?
All that said, there was a smiley, as the main goal was to gently wind Golfie up.
It's academic anyway because many of those behind Brexit told us exactly how to achieve it. They told us, back then, to be like Norway...
This from the man that says a “no deal” is now 60/40 on the back of saying in 2016 that a deal with the EU would be “the easiest in human history”
Moron
All use the exact same tactic of trivialising criticism in order to hide their "side's" incompetence or, worse, hide the more sinister bits of policy behind.
The comment on the pensions thread was purely to suggest there were different scenarios to think about when transferring out of a secured final salary scheme into a defined contribution scheme. Investment markets being the main one. I purely picked Brexit as possibly being a factor to think about in such a case. I wasn't saying it would be a bad thing, merely just something to add into the mix.
Just remember what happened after the vote on June 2016. The FTSE soared the very next day & has climbed around 15% since.
It dropped.
It's been a long while since I studied any economics but my understanding (and I might be wrong tbf), is, as already pointed out by @hoof_it_up_to_benty that the growth of the FTSE since Brexit is less due to increased confidence in the performance of the companies concerned and more to the drop in value of the pound. Hence, when it became clear that the FTSE 100 companies, who were earning more than 70% of their earnings outside the UK, we're going to benefit from "free" money due to the fall of the pound, their value went up.
It seems to me you're attributing a positive bounce in the FTSE to the Brexit decision when in effect it is a reaction to the very negative impact the decision had on our currency.
Anyway due to go abroad later this year has a difficult decision over when to change currency?
If you chose to ignore lots of people's advice, how can anyone be to blame but you?
Yet another rich ‘patriotic’ Brexiteer leaving his beloved homeland to avoid paying his taxes!
Talk about “do as I say and not as I do”.
It was incompetent.