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Charlton / L1 - January 2019 Transfer Rumours (ed, deadline day starts p98)

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  • Don't know why some think Bowyer will change formation. He's said he sees Parker playing alongside Taylor. If that doesn't work Igor or RHF will get a chance. He'll only switch if none of those combinations are working for us. He's clearly not a fan of a lone striker, at least at this level.

    We have a way of playing and options in every position, while we lack wide options to play with two wingers. What we're missing is a definite first choice partner for Taylor, but we'll get a better idea of who that should be over the next few games.
  • Possibly square pegs in round holes but 4-4-1-1 looks our best option on paper now

    Back 5 picks itself

    Fosu LM
    Bielek CM
    Cullen CM
    Aribo RM (just so he plays)
    Williams ACM

    Taylor

    Vetokele on the bench to switch to a 4-4-2.

    Hate the January window and hate Roland

    Aribo, Bielik, Cullen
    Williams, Reeves/Fosu
    Taylor

    Looks tasty to me, and we’ve got;

    Lapslie, Pratley, Morgan
    Parker, Reeves/Fosu
    Vetokele

    As back up, I think we’ve seen a lot weaker times under Roland.
    We tried 4-3-2-1 for the best part of a season and it was shite, that isn’t going to miraculously change
  • Sorry, Bowyer and Gallen have to take some responsibility. To put all their efforts into getting just one striker after already releasing players was naive. It was obvious after the Peterborough game we needed another striker, even an average one. A week later we’ve lost Grant and not replaced him let alone added another. We have an owner who won’t invest in the team anymore because of his cronies making catastrophic player recruitment decisions in the past. We’re still an unbalanced squad because of those decisions. What a disaster Vetokele has been, out of form, always injured, expensive and on a ludicrously long contract. Bowyer must look at him everyday and think what I could get with his wages. But despite our desperate plight with the owner Bowyer and Gallen should have done better in this window. They had the money for wages sitting there ready to go. Unfortunately those wages are still sitting there this morning and the team is considerably weaker than it was a week ago considering how our rivals all strengthened up front.

    Harsh. I doubt very much they had any choice in when players were released, and Bowyer’s dropped enough hints in his interviews that he was being effed about.
  • As much of a concern is that Bowyer wasn’t able to secure his targets. Talk of a list of five or six. Potentially a striker purchased plus a loan for if not an upgrade on Grant then at least a decent experienced player. What we ended up with was Grant, Clarke and Ajose all leaving with only the acquisition of Josh Parker who looks like he’s going to need broad shoulders. I wish him all the luck in the world but he’s not the player we hoped for is he. Top six is still on the cards but top two is just not doable with the top teams all signing players and maintaining their squad strength. Can see Bowyer getting an offer during the summer from the Championship and who would blame him for jumping ship.

    Duchatelet wouldn’t care one jot.
  • supaclive said:



    The owner loses 4m in the next 4 months.
    .

    Except he hasn’t.

    Monthly losses are now down to half that and the sale of Grant, offloading of Clarke and Ajose effectively covers the spend till the summer.

    With Konsa and Lookman, he hasn’t actually lost money on Charlton for years.

    He’s just giving Bowyer the absolute minimum now to work with.
    RD can cover any losses - I have no idea why he hangs on to Charlton other than spite or a ridiculous determination to achieve his inflated asking price.

    Boycotts might touch owners at other clubs but they haven't moved him. I have no idea what will persuade the stubborn fool to leave.

    He continually sabotages the club to reduce its value whilst still expecting to sell it at an exorbitant price. Wtf goes on inside his head?

    If we don't get promoted this season and we have a mass exodus of players then it seems unlikely Bowyer and JJ will want to stick around.

    The only consolation is RD can't live forever....
  • cafc-west said:

    Bit underwhelmed but no point in moaning - it is what it is...but assume we can still sign an out-of-contract player and/or a loan as we have 1 loan space. Not sure on the EFL loan rules - can we still loan a player??

    We can only get an out of contract player.
  • Agreed, we have a strong defence and midfield. However, we have been almost entirely reliant on the front two for our goals. Half of those goals have now gone and we'll miss Taylor for 2 more games (and probably another 2) due to suspension. I would love Vetokele to burst back with the form we originally witnessed but I'm afraid that is just wishful thinking. He'll no doubt return too quickly and then get another injury. There's a hell of a reliance on Josh Parker suddenly producing the form that seems to have eluded him thoughout his career but with better service, decent coaching and playing alongside Taylor, he may surprise us. The fact that this is a Bowyer/Gallen signing gives me more hope than had Robinson done so with an hour of the window remaining. The cameo last week from RHF also offers some promise and I suspect he'll start tomorrow. But overall, when you rely on just 2 players to get the vast majority of your goals and you then sell one of those you need a quality replacement and Bowyer has not been supported in this regard. I just hope there has been some penalty taking practice in training this week as this could be key.

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  • I wonder if Fosu might be tried as a striker. Indeed I'd want to play him tomorrow, seeing that he got a hattrick in the same fixture last year.

    Agree. It's time he stepped up and got his season going.
  • I'm not sure what point you are trying to make @CAFCBourne. I reckon there must have been a budget there. Without knowing the salary structures on simple headcount, incomings x 4 this window, Purrington, Maxwell, Williams, Parker versus outgoings x 5 Steer, Ajose, Clarke, Ward and Grant. Therefore I don't think budget was the issue.

    Whilst some may be inclined to lay blame at the doors of Bowyer and Gallen, for me they are still well in credit, it was a gamble that never came off :disappointed: .
  • So whats the best outcome now?

    (1) We hope Parker is up to speed (wont have trained with the rest yet) so Recco will no doubt start on Saturday, possibly Igor if we're lucky

    (2) We hope that the Fleetwood game gets called off due to the weather, gives Parker and Igor more time to get ready for the Southend game, only downside is we wont have Taylor for the Blackpool game

    I doubt Igor even broke into a sweat in that U23 game, and I'd be amazed if he ever scores for us again, waste of space.
  • edited February 2019

    Possibly square pegs in round holes but 4-4-1-1 looks our best option on paper now

    Back 5 picks itself

    Fosu LM
    Bielek CM
    Cullen CM
    Aribo RM (just so he plays)
    Williams ACM

    Taylor

    Vetokele on the bench to switch to a 4-4-2.

    Hate the January window and hate Roland

    Aribo, Bielik, Cullen
    Williams, Reeves/Fosu
    Taylor

    Looks tasty to me, and we’ve got;

    Lapslie, Pratley, Morgan
    Parker, Reeves/Fosu
    Vetokele

    As back up, I think we’ve seen a lot weaker times under Roland.
    We tried 4-3-2-1 for the best part of a season and it was shite, that isn’t going to miraculously change
    No we didn’t, we tried Karl Robinson, there’s a big big difference, there’s more than likely some successful teams that play that formation.

    You best give Klopp a bell he played;

    Wijnaldum, Keita
    Shaqiri, Firmino, Mane
    Salah

    The other night and has done many times this season.
  • I actually hope LB walks away

    That would be a real statement of what a shit show this is.

    More hoping it's 'our' Aussies going to Notts County to reopen proper bids for the club.

    If we don't go up and the squad evaporates maybe Bow will go then, but all still to play for at the moment.
  • Possibly square pegs in round holes but 4-4-1-1 looks our best option on paper now

    Back 5 picks itself

    Fosu LM
    Bielek CM
    Cullen CM
    Aribo RM (just so he plays)
    Williams ACM

    Taylor

    Vetokele on the bench to switch to a 4-4-2.

    Hate the January window and hate Roland

    Aribo, Bielik, Cullen
    Williams, Reeves/Fosu
    Taylor

    Looks tasty to me, and we’ve got;

    Lapslie, Pratley, Morgan
    Parker, Reeves/Fosu
    Vetokele

    As back up, I think we’ve seen a lot weaker times under Roland.
    We tried 4-3-2-1 for the best part of a season and it was shite, that isn’t going to miraculously change
    For the next two games, it looks the best option until Taylor and Parker can be in tandem.

    4-2-3-1 was Robinson's choice but when Big Josh Magennis was the 1 you will always struggle as we relied so much on Holmes and then Fosu to score. Crazy not to have 4 strikers of at least a good League 1 standard to rotate but While Duchatelet is the owner it's the norm.
  • edited February 2019

    supaclive said:



    The owner loses 4m in the next 4 months.
    .

    Except he hasn’t.

    Monthly losses are now down to half that
    and the sale of Grant, offloading of Clarke and Ajose effectively covers the spend till the summer.

    With Konsa and Lookman, he hasn’t actually lost money on Charlton for years
    .

    He’s just giving Bowyer the absolute minimum now to work with.
    It’s unlikely this is true and it may not even be what De Turck is claiming. The club had an operating loss of about £14m in the last published accounts. There has been no significant increase in revenue, in fact it has probably fallen.

    Working blind, until we see the 17/18 accounts, it is hard to see how it is possible to take out £8m (out of £21m in 16/17) in costs to get to half a million a month. My best guess is that it if £6m a year (pre Grant) is the actual projected loss then it includes windfall contingent transfer payments, which are one-offs and don’t reduce the ongoing operating loss, ie affect the structural health of the business.

    The player sales in 16/17 just about covered the operating loss but Duchatelet lost a shedload of money on Charlton in 15/16 (£13.5m announced), will have done so in 17/18 (£10m has been bandied around) and currently stands to lose money in 18/19 unless he unloads significant further players for fees before June 30th.
  • This is probably covered elsewhere, but how many players are out of contract at the end of the season?
  • supaclive said:

    Bowyers took a gamble in that he had his sights set on the mystery loan player and it was all or nothing on getting him.

    Gallen said it would run late so they must have had an element of doubt as the quotes earlier in the day said we was in a good position left a nagging doubt we was 100% certain.

    unfortunately Bow and Gals gamble this time didn't pay off as it has previously with the likes of Cullen.

    Leaving the loan signing so late gave us no option to look elsewhere but I do believe there was a budget there to use should we have been able to secure

    Don't blame Bowyer and Gallen- they were put in an unworkable situation by the.owner.

    They won't come out and slag him off publically......yet!
    I'm not slagging them off, far from it ultimately they took a gamble on getting this striker in on loan and didn't achieve it.

    It happens we move on, its a kick but we've suffered more more set backs than any other team this season and still they have found a formation style to be competitive.
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  • Possibly square pegs in round holes but 4-4-1-1 looks our best option on paper now

    Back 5 picks itself

    Fosu LM
    Bielek CM
    Cullen CM
    Aribo RM (just so he plays)
    Williams ACM

    Taylor

    Vetokele on the bench to switch to a 4-4-2.

    Hate the January window and hate Roland

    Aribo, Bielik, Cullen
    Williams, Reeves/Fosu
    Taylor

    Looks tasty to me, and we’ve got;

    Lapslie, Pratley, Morgan
    Parker, Reeves/Fosu
    Vetokele

    As back up, I think we’ve seen a lot weaker times under Roland.
    We tried 4-3-2-1 for the best part of a season and it was shite, that isn’t going to miraculously change
    No we didn’t, we tried Karl Robinson, there’s a big big difference, there’s more than likely some successful teams that play that formation.

    You best give Klopp a bell he played;

    Wijnaldum, Keita
    Shaqiri, Firmino, Mane
    Salah

    The other night and has done many times this season.
    True, Robinson's build up was too slow for it to work. However in Taylor we have one of the most complete strikers you could get in League 1, yet Bowyer isn't keen on using him as a lone striker.

    Why is that?

    That style of football is a lot harder to get right at this level.

    Players aren't as well rounded, very few of our midfielders are capable of 10+ goals and 10+ assists. Without that where are the goals coming from?

    The diamond gives a balance between being able to play out from the back, as the DM is there to get the ball from the back four. You also have the option of going more direct, as the striker and AM are close enough to link up with each other, win second balls etc.
  • Will Grigg transfer to Sunderland still not actually confirmed by the EFL.


    Sunderland AFC

    @SunderlandAFC
    JR: ‘It’s well documented that we had a bid accepted for Will Grigg very late last night, and my understanding is that it looks like that will all go ahead. We are waiting for FA approval. Over the next hour or so we should get confirmation of that.’
  • Parker was Plan B.
    Mo Eisa was Plan A.

    Eaves was a pipe dream, because Scully was only going to let him go for 1.5 to 2 million because he didn't want to loose a player under contract on the cheap and had proved his worth at Gillingham over the last 12 months.

    I didn't think it would take too much to get O'Shea or Norwood from Bury and Tranmere but maybe they weren't on our radar ?

    More likely he didnt want to lose the man whose goals will probably keep them in the Division and would rather see him go for a free with them as a League One club rather than a League Two team without him (Of course that might happen but he's showing ambition rather than resignation) - Shame we dont have an owner who doesnt have the same approach instead of always wanting a bit more money
  • Cafc43v3r said:

    Cafc43v3r said:

    Cafc43v3r said:

    Cafc43v3r said:

    Holmes was a bang average league 1 player who bizarrely was capable of trying the outrageous. Probably to the detriment of the team and his all round effectiveness. When it worked it looked fantastic, but how many times did he try it.

    He had to try the outrageous because of the shit around him, especially under Slade.

    We should know doubt move on as I am sure a few will be on here to say shortly, but you have a short memory if you don't remember what he did for us in the 18 months he was here.
    If he was so good, how comes he has only played a handful of games above league 1 in his career. I admit I could be wrong, but every championship manager over the last, what 5 years?
    But your arguing he was a bang average League 1 player, now you are referring to the Championship. Holmes was far above average in our side, and was a late bloomer.
    OK I'll phrase it another way, how many time did Holmes finish above average, mid table, in league one? If he was a late bloomer, he didn't bloom for long did he, signing for Oxford and Gillingham says bang average. If he had signed for Barnsley or Sunderland, that would hint at above average wouldn't it?
    What a ridiculous comment. Holmes's ability could clearly be seen on the pitch. Class player.
    I'll ask again, if he is/was so good has he never played for an above average league 1 club, a part from a hand full of games at Sheffield United?
    He started his career very late? It's a silly point and you know it. You're trying to correlate ability with League position when no real relationship exists. There are too many variables.

    On the basis of your theory, Matt Le Tissier was a bang average Premier League player.
  • Any chance of a free agent coming in? some decent ones available Jay Simpson, Gounongbe, Anchiebe
  • edited February 2019
    IR94 said:

    Any chance of a free agent coming in? some decent ones available Jay Simpson, Gounongbe, Anchiebe

    I think Gallen is quoted somewhere that suggest this too.
  • So 24 players and we can name what 16 is it per match

    So 8 players on between 1k and 4K per week that can’t be picked so at best 32k a month or worst 120k a month of players who are not playing but we have to keep paying

    We are a third division club losing money like mad with a shit cunt owner

    However as a business you can’t win so you have to balance the books some how

    We’ve lost Grant and no one should blame Grant for going

    And if him going pays towards the wage bill then we have to suck it up and accept it

    Agreed, and I also agree with your earlier post about wanting him out and then complaining that he doesn't splash the cash. I have said this myself recently.

    But he owns a club he wants to sell and we are in the promotion hunt. He just pocketed 1.5 mil for Grant, he could show a tiny bit of ambition.

    The crazy thing is although we are suffering as a fanbase, it would surely help him sell the club! Spend another 500k including wages until the summer, get promoted and it will add 5mil on to whatever someone wants to pay for the club!
    We don’t know he pocketed it

    For all we know Bowyer could’ve been told shift of some of the sick note baggage and one of the strikers both who can command a wage

    And it wi release enough to get the cover at full back , Johnny Williams , keep cullens wage and I will let you get a second striker but you must use Recco

    Now as fans that’s not good enough we want bigger better signings than we let go

    However it ain’t realistic and we want RD out and he has us for sale

    So that’s our lot and we have to put up with it and so does bow
    Let’s be realistic. He always wanted the Grant money and will take any other money that comes in to offset the operating loss he has himself inflated through mismanagement. Unless he is willing to sell the club for a realistic price he is responsible for the fact that he has to bear the continuing loss.

    Bowyer, Jackson, Gallen and others are doing their best to keep the situaton afloat but that old bastard, his stooge Murray and anyone else who defends him are destroying the club. He doesn’t get an ounce of sympathy from me.
    There’s no sympathy from me but as a club we have an owner who won’t put money in and we are hemorrhaging money

    So what is the solution

    Have more than a squad of 24 that are all on less money than our highest earners and therefor not of any real quality or manage a team sheet and wage bill

    Like it or not football clubs are businesses and they have to be run like one in virtually all ways

    Losing Grant is shit

    Losing Taylor or Pearce I don’t rate Bauer personally but loads do and losing one of them would’ve been catastrophic

    So if we lost grant and got Williams a full back a keeper and kept taylor Pearce Bauer Cullen

    Then the book balance is understandable

    Recco gets a chance now and maybe just maybe he will take it we are third division not premier and we give our kids a chance in this league (so the cunt can sell them so he doesn’t have to fund as much of the wages ) who knows what may happen


    Realistically what else can happen


    He could sell the club.
    It’s for sale you know that I know that we both know that the asking price ain’t the issue

    But your answer doesn’t solve the problem whilst it’s not sold so what do we do ?

    The clubs a business and the business had to fund its self to a degree because the owner had stopped funding it

    So what should have happened



    What is the issue if not the asking price?

    So many interested parties come and gone just because the Belgian turd wants too much money.
    The fee was agreed that’s why the EFL had the docs

    All the time people show him in this way that the price is acceptable he won’t reduce it


    Saying sell the club when we can all see it’s not happening doesn’t solve the real problem of balancing the sheets

    We lost Grant it’s shit but I’d have lost him over any of the others first
    And Roland knows that the sheets will be even less balanced in The Championship.
  • DOUCHER said:

    I am told that bowyer will get all the money from the sale - if it happens - and ultimately it is bowyers call - he could say no but then you would have a player on your hands who has just lost out on over 3 times the wages he is currently being offered - the wages offered are at the top limit of the wage structure - the alternative is to bring in 2 strikers and i back gallen and bowyer to get this right when they bring in the replacements. If they can't get what they think is right with regards to replacements then i doubt they will let him go and may instead take the deal from rangers which involves him staying but only goes through in the summer if he isn't injured. Not all done and dusted yet

    Hypocritical coming from you. You have posted a shed load of stuff that never happened.
    Hardly. Airman only posts once he has corroborated information and it's usually put out with a proviso. The fact that it doesn't all come to pass is simply because that's what happens. Big difference between that and people speculating, repeating early info as their own etc.
  • bromdog said:

    IR94 said:

    Any chance of a free agent coming in? some decent ones available Jay Simpson, Gounongbe, Anchiebe

    I think Gallen is quoted somewhere that suggest this too.
    Not the position we need, but Joe Ledley for example was released by Derby so that he could find a new club. Hopefully, there will be a decent striking option available too
  • Cafc43v3r said:

    Cafc43v3r said:

    So 24 players and we can name what 16 is it per match

    So 8 players on between 1k and 4K per week that can’t be picked so at best 32k a month or worst 120k a month of players who are not playing but we have to keep paying

    We are a third division club losing money like mad with a shit cunt owner

    However as a business you can’t win so you have to balance the books some how

    We’ve lost Grant and no one should blame Grant for going

    And if him going pays towards the wage bill then we have to suck it up and accept it

    Agreed, and I also agree with your earlier post about wanting him out and then complaining that he doesn't splash the cash. I have said this myself recently.

    But he owns a club he wants to sell and we are in the promotion hunt. He just pocketed 1.5 mil for Grant, he could show a tiny bit of ambition.

    The crazy thing is although we are suffering as a fanbase, it would surely help him sell the club! Spend another 500k including wages until the summer, get promoted and it will add 5mil on to whatever someone wants to pay for the club!
    We don’t know he pocketed it

    For all we know Bowyer could’ve been told shift of some of the sick note baggage and one of the strikers both who can command a wage

    And it wi release enough to get the cover at full back , Johnny Williams , keep cullens wage and I will let you get a second striker but you must use Recco

    Now as fans that’s not good enough we want bigger better signings than we let go

    However it ain’t realistic and we want RD out and he has us for sale

    So that’s our lot and we have to put up with it and so does bow
    Let’s be realistic. He always wanted the Grant money and will take any other money that comes in to offset the operating loss he has himself inflated through mismanagement. Unless he is willing to sell the club for a realistic price he is responsible for the fact that he has to bear the continuing loss.

    Bowyer, Jackson, Gallen and others are doing their best to keep the situaton afloat but that old bastard, his stooge Murray and anyone else who defends him are destroying the club. He doesn’t get an ounce of sympathy from me.
    There’s no sympathy from me but as a club we have an owner who won’t put money in and we are hemorrhaging money

    So what is the solution

    Have more than a squad of 24 that are all on less money than our highest earners and therefor not of any real quality or manage a team sheet and wage bill

    Like it or not football clubs are businesses and they have to be run like one in virtually all ways

    Losing Grant is shit

    Losing Taylor or Pearce I don’t rate Bauer personally but loads do and losing one of them would’ve been catastrophic

    So if we lost grant and got Williams a full back a keeper and kept taylor Pearce Bauer Cullen

    Then the book balance is understandable

    Recco gets a chance now and maybe just maybe he will take it we are third division not premier and we give our kids a chance in this league (so the cunt can sell them so he doesn’t have to fund as much of the wages ) who knows what may happen


    Realistically what else can happen


    He could sell the club. He could have sold it in 2015, 2016, 2017 and 2018. He chooses not to do so because he wants too much money.
    He could have also appointed a yes man manager in the summer, sold BFG, not signed Taylor, disband the u23s etc etc he didn't.

    Because Roland is an arse doesn't make everything he does bad. This isn't aimed at you @Airman Brown it just happens to be your tweet I am quoting. The RD situation is similar to a reverse of the Corbyn attack dogs on twitter, no one can give him any credit for anything with out being attacked on here. Everything that goes wrong is his fault. I am waiting for someone to suggest he stopped Bristol City signing another striker tbh.
    I don’t really understand your point. He is damaging the club (his asset) every week he remains and now he has allowed a situation which makes its future still more precarious because the chances of promotion have been reduced. In lieu of any executive management that is entirely down to him.

    I agree that the detail of what happens in the transfer window is not necessarily down to him. It may even be that Bowyer and Gallen misjudged the situation, because after all they are not vastly experienced in transfer dealings and have no one around them who is as support. But I do know that maximising the team’s chances of automatic promotion is in everyone’s interest, including Duchatelet.

    Since Eisa was a loan deal there is no evidence that he was prepared to invest even a couple of hundred thousand of the Grant cash in making that outcome more likely. Instead his priority was evidently to claw back more of this season’s operating loss. That is foolish, in my view, and the fact that he hasn’t done other foolish things such as those you mention doesn’t change that.

    There is a real risk that the club falls off a cliff at the end of the season and if that happens he will lose out financially as well as us losing out as fans. Be very clear, the club cannot cut its way to break even. There is no equilibrium point. It can only bleed itself to death.
    I agree totally with everything you said, but isn't the real, current, football issue that we don't have an owner who is prepared to pump 10s of millions of pounds into the club. Not the fact that the owner is RD?

    Yes lots of things in his gift aren't right, no fit for purpose ceo for 5 years doesn't help, no director of football, the lack of day to day managment etc. As you say we can't break even, outside of the prem, under any circumstances.

    If he sold tomorrow, as fans, we would actually want a new owner that INCREASED the annual losses in the short term, to maybe reduce them in the medium term, to possibly even make a small profit somewhere down the line. Not a lot to ask is it.
    Fair questions. I've worked in biz all my life so I 'm certainly not one of those fans of any club who think there's a magic money tree. And I also accept that Fan ownership is almost impossible unless virtually every club has the same system, as in Germany.

    As to what an owner should actually do right now, it's difficult to give a business-like answer when the key numbers are shrouded in mystery. What we do know is that AFCW have a total running cost budget of £4m, while Andy Holt I think says his budget is half that. We on the other hand keep being told that RD 'pumps ina Million a month'. Despite @Airman Brown best efforts nobody really knows the true running costs at present but it sounds like they might be £8m. So if you look at the recent Accrington game from a business POV, your conclusion must surely be that the money is being deployed incompetently.

    Of course it's going to take time for a new owner to make it more sustainable, but what we are getting mad about here is that one way to get there is to increase revenue. how? By getting promotion of course. And he has just shafted that prospect. It makes no sense.
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Roland Out Forever!