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Post-match Thread: Charlton v Plymouth | Boxing Day 2020

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Comments

  • I’m sorry but Matthews at LB didn’t work for me. Every time he got into a good position he had to check in on his right, so unbalanced and please move Pratley back into midfield, we miss his know how and break up play.

    We look bang average against bang average teams and keep giving them head starts and way back into games we should be comfortable in. We need to stop leaking goals.
  • At the start of the season i would have been devastated had West Brom poached Bowyer. Not sure i would now.
  • Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
    Spot on. Would love to know why.

    Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals. 
    When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.

    When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
    Sorry, I must have missed the memo from the EFL that we can't play the 2 together. Silly me. 
  • edited December 2020
    Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
    Spot on. Would love to know why.

    Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals. 
    When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.

    When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
    Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over Oshilaja

    Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not

    Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen

    Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!

    And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
    I'll wait for that elusive win then because currently all I'm seeing is draws & defeats. 2 wins in 8. It seems like a win with a Bowyer team is akin to the luck of the draw. 
  • It wasn't that Matthews was terrible, it is more that Maatson is a better left back and we are not short of midfield options.

    All the talk the last couple of weeks is that we have no pace in midfield. Maatsen is the only (currently) available option that can go some way towards fixing that.

    Of all of Bowyer's questioned selections today, that one was the one that I can't find fault with.
    I agree. No problem playing Maatsen in midfield -  just tjen make sure the left back is left footed. Purrington is more than ok there. Not the best, but I'd rather a left footed left back than a right footed right back there. 

    I sometimes wonder if Bowyer just does it for effect, because there is no other logical explanation. 

  • Nothing wrong with this squad for league one whatsoever.

    Look at the pedigree and quality of Lincoln’s squad..... and then ask whether Bowyer would be taking them to the top of the division when he’s struggling to make the play offs with a squad consisting of the likes of Maddison, Aneke, Williams, Watson, Matthews, Maatsen, Gunter, Shinnie, JFC, Famewo, Amos, Pratley.


    Nail on the head. Give this man a promote. 




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  • edited December 2020
    No one will be worried about playing us at the moment 
    Quite. All opposing managers have to do is  say to their players...." go at them from the start & score an early goal "

    Not sure of the exact number of games (think it's about 33) that we've failed to win after going 1 down. Last time was the play off final. Thought today we were going to finally break the hoodoo, but sadly wasn't to be. 
  • Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
    Spot on. Would love to know why.

    Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals. 
    When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.

    When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
    Sorry, I must have missed the memo from the EFL that we can't play the 2 together. Silly me. 
    They can but I don’t think so in a midfield four. Maybe both on the wings but then you’ve only got one up front.

    We got overrun in the middle today with only one of them playing - you simply can’t rely on them both of them in there.
  • Apart from the 2nd half against Wimbledon I've not seen us play well yet this season. We've got too many average players, I'd argue none of this squad would get a starting place in a championship side.

    Still January coming up, a couple of good additions along with Famewo and Innis back fit we can really push on in the 2nd half of the season 
    Nothing wrong with this squad for league one whatsoever.

    Look at the pedigree and quality of Lincoln’s squad..... and then ask whether Bowyer would be taking them to the top of the division when he’s struggling to make the play offs with a squad consisting of the likes of Maddison, Aneke, Williams, Watson, Matthews, Maatsen, Gunter, Shinnie, JFC, Famewo, Amos, Pratley.

    They are more than good enough to get out of this division. Throw a couple of new signings in, plus Doughty, Inniss etc to come back for the run in.

    Bowyer surely can’t afford not to go up automatically and I don’t think Sandgaard will stand for it.
    This, plus the salary cap, is why I don't think the January window will make us a drastically different team. We have a good squad of players, and Bowyer keeps picking ineffective sides that get overrun in midfield, don't put pressure on the ball, and struggle to keep possession outside of their own third. 
  • Having poorly managed a poor vets side for years, I can relate to many of Bowyer's formation and positional choices. When you no longer have a big bastard centre back, or anyone who can move at faster than a brisk walking pace available, you tend to try players in a different position each week in the hope that something works. That is exactly how the approach seemed to me yesterday.

    The shape, set-up and players' positions just seems to be mostly wrong lately. I get the feeling the players aren't enjoying playing our cautious style of football, being played out of position, or that some of them are being singled out for criticism. Consequently, they are playing with a lack of the belief and confidence needed to win games consistently at any level. 

    There appeared to have been a clear the air meeting before the Wimbledon game, because we played much more positively (even in the first half) and were on the front foot for most of the game. I think a lot of that was as a result of having Maddison and Williams on the pitch for more of the game than usual, and you could see how delighted all the other players were when Jonny scored.
    This should have been the platform to kick-start our season, so to subsequently drop Williams for the whole Swindon game, then not play the two of them together yesterday was, along with the bizarre positional choices, bloody awful decision making by Bowyer. He is feeling the pressure of expectation from the fans and our owner and is struggling to cope. I reckon he would really benefit from some guidance to help him come up with a clear plan going forward. Otherwise our season is going to end in disappointment.

    Which vets side you managed 
  • edited December 2020
    What worries me as well is that he doesn't seem to see what is going on half the time. Now Williams wasn't brilliant but in the first half he was our best midfielder as Curbs pointed out. Second half he was still trying to inject energy though less successfully. Then Bowyer mentions that he wasn't having the best of games. There were quite a few having worse games, why single Williams out although he did do it more positively than usual. If I was Williams I wouldn't be happy with that.

    This season, Bowyer has only one tactic that works for him. That is built around solid defence. Losing our centre halves, both of whom have been outstanding has been a massive blow. He hasn't been able to adapt to it but with a window, he has a chance to put that right. Famewo probably needs to be sent back if he is going to be out for too long.

    If Bowyer can get the defence stronger, we will start going on runs, but he has shown to me, not just this season but the end of last too, that he is not good enough as a manager to take us to the promised land. I say that, because this time last year, I though he was. He can still get us promoted this and if the Hull game does go ahead, it is the sort of game where we counter punch, that we can win.
  • edited December 2020
    I know this statement will not be popular on here, but I think Pardew was a more than decent manager. With us, he completely lost his way for a number of reasons, some not of his doing and he reached a point where he went. He didn't seem capable of getting it back and needed a reset.

    I see similarities with Bowyer. He seems to have lost his way but fortunately for him, it is in an extremely poor league, where we have a squad capable of going up. Maybe it is going to be easier for him to find his way back. He certainly isn't maximising his squad at the moment and he doesn't seem to know his best team. He doesn't currently show any signs of finding it but the window may help.

    If I was Sandgaard, I would say to Bowyer that after the next five games I expect us to be firmly in the play off positions and stay there pushing for the automatics through the remainder of the season. That should be how he saves his job and is the least we should expect with the squad we have. If we slip out of that, we need to find somebody who can do better.
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  • Talal said:
    Matthews really wasn't THAT bad, in fact I thought he largely did fine. Was certainly no Solly at left back type of performance where he was scared to venture over halfway. 
    No, he wasn't THAT bad, but it was a totally unnecessary change. Ask anyone who is predominantly one footed which side they would like to play on & I bet 100% of them will say on the side they use to kick a ball. Anyone who has played the game knows that. Currently we have 3 defenders who  are predominately left footed (Maartsen, Purrington & Pearce)......so why put a right footed player at left back. It is basic stuff. Matthews might have played ok there but playing someone who is naturally left footed gives you more options.....such as taking on their opponent, going past them & getting in a cross. There was one moment in the 1st half when Matthew's put in a "cross" with the outside of his right foot because he naturally can't cross with his left. It was laughable. He did try a cross with his left ONCE & although it was ok it was hardly awe inspiring. 

    I really do wonder if some posters on here have ever played the fecking game. 
    I don't disagree and said it doesn't make sense to move Maatsen (if Purrington not playing) on the match thread. Just think comments like Matthews has been a liability are OTT. 
  • As on many occasions before Injury to important players has put us on a points dropping run.
    we should be top of the league or certainly second.
    if our two best defenders Akin and Ryan has played for the last 5 games we would not have dropped 6 points.
    if Thomas wants promotion then we need reinforcements or we will NOT go up.

    Yes we could also do with a striker but leaking Goals especially late ones is our problem.
    i think Marcus Maddison is now coming on form and Smyth is back, so the defence is still the Key area.
    i am certain that both Lee Bowyer and TS realise this like most of our real fans do 👍
  • I know this statement will not be popular on here, but I think Pardew was a more than decent manager. With us, he completely lost his way for a number of reasons, some not of his doing and he reached a point where he went. He didn't seem capable of getting it back and needed a reset.

    I see similarities with Bowyer. He seems to have lost his way but fortunately for him, it is in an extremely poor league, where we have a squad capable of going up. Maybe it is going to be easier for him to find his way back. He certainly isn't maximising his squad at the moment and he doesn't seem to know his best team. He doesn't currently show any signs of finding it but the window may help.

    If I was Sandgaard, I would say to Bowyer that after the next five games I expect us to be firmly in the play off positions and stay there pushing for the automatics through the remainder of the season. That should be how he saves his job and is the least we should expect with the squad we have. If we slip out of that, we need to find somebody who can do better.
    We’re in 6th place, I don’t fully understand why Bowyer is in a position of having to save his job. I believe we’ve spent more time in a play off position than not this season. Have some long term confidence in the bloke and not be looking to sack him the moment we spend 2 weeks in 7th. 
    I expect certain fans are feeling that way because even in the games we win we never look particularly fluid or dominant. As much as I look forward to it each week, it's been really difficult watching Charlton play this year - even in our little winning run.

    I think we will still finish top 6 under Bows, and will no doubt go on another winning run again soon, but I honestly think that with the players we have at our disposal we should be playing a lot better football. 
  • edited December 2020
    LB is properly winding me up this season but is surely nowhere near having to save his job. 

    TS has said the aim for the season is play-offs.
  • I’m sure I read somewhere that Chuks was a booking away from suspension so after yesterday’s yellow card, anyone know if he misses the Hull game?
  • If we slip out because we are not playing games, fair enough. But if the team slides down, we need to have ambition for the season. Bowyer should get promoted with that side and I am simply saying I expect it. I have been saying that for a while. 

    If some of you are happy with what has been dished up lately in a piss poor league, fair enough. I don't think it is unreasonable not to be. Especially as some of our issues seem to be self inflicted.
    It’s not always about being happy every week for a 46-game season, it’s about having the patience that when we draw back to back games 2-2, there’s not a meltdown and the same words of overreaction come out on here.
  • I’m sure I read somewhere that Chuks was a booking away from suspension so after yesterday’s yellow card, anyone know if he misses the Hull game?
    Yes he does... Its why I would have had him come off the bench yesterday instead of starting

    Sometimes you need to look at the bigger picture as Hull is the bigger game and both him and Gilbey only needed to get beyond that game without a booking to avoid suspension.

    Of course the Hull game could yet be called off in which case its the Accrington game that Gilbey needs to avoid being booked in
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