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Post-match Thread: Charlton v Plymouth | Boxing Day 2020
Comments
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Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worse
I dont mind you commenting on how optimistic I am at times, but lets kindly drop the bullshit8 -
MuttleyCAFC said:
It was a tongue in cheek response to a previous comment. There isn't one way, there are different options. But square pegs in round holes when it isn't forced on you might not be the right one.Callumcafc said:MuttleyCAFC said:Simple solution. Start them both then.
Did you want Bowyer to match them up in a 3-5-2 like Curbs said or do you want him to play both luxury players? There's no way Williams and Maddison can play together in a central midfield three.
I do think that if you know you have better players, it is normally a good idea to match up. Maybe Bowyer rates the players less than I do.I agree re: Pratley at centre back next to Pearce. I personally would've started Deji today.Pushing Maatsen forward to inject much needed pace into midfield made sense to me and wouldn't mind seeing Bowyer trying it again, especially if Doughty and Smyth are unavailable.I could see the logic behind trying Matthews on the left side - he's supposedly capable over there but turns out he has no left foot. If Bowyer tries it again I'll be baffled.3 -
MuttleyCAFC said:It wasn't that Matthews was terrible, it is more that Maatson is a better left back and we are not short of midfield options.All the talk the last couple of weeks is that we have no pace in midfield. Maatsen is the only (currently) available option that can go some way towards fixing that.Of all of Bowyer's questioned selections today, that one was the one that I can't find fault with.5
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Have to disagree here. Pratley was all over the place.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win9 -
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.3 -
He does but he doesn't seem confident using it. He put in a superb left footed cross in the first half that Chuks (I think) couldn't quite get to but it opened them right up.Callumcafc said:Thought Steve Brown did an excellent job of summarising our limitations today. Such a disjointed performance and so many misplaced passes under little to no pressure.Disappointing results lately but finding it hard to be as upset about it as others appear to be. I must still be riding the takeover high but dropped points just aren’t bothering me. Still 84 more points available between now and the summer and we are still within touching distance of automatics.We have a whole transfer window coming up where we can strengthen properly for the first time in years.
Matthews at left back was worth trying but I’d rather not see it again - the bloke has no left foot.
If we are still playing this badly in February/March then I’ll start asking more questions but right now we’re flying under the radar and one run of good form will propel us forward.2 -
I didn’t mind it either, it was the non selection of the second choice LB that made it worse.Callumcafc said:MuttleyCAFC said:It wasn't that Matthews was terrible, it is more that Maatson is a better left back and we are not short of midfield options.All the talk the last couple of weeks is that we have no pace in midfield. Maatsen is the only (currently) available option that can go some way towards fixing that.Of all of Bowyer's questioned selections today, that one was the one that I can't find fault with.2 -
It is equally about whom we have played. 10 points in 8 games v teams averaging 16.5 place in a league of 24 is relegation form if you ask me.stoneroses19 said:
My maths is pretty shoddy, so apologies in advance if I’ve got it wrong, but 10 points every 8 games isn’t relegation form.Athletico Charlton said:10 points from 8 games including failing to beat Burton, Plymouth, Gillingham, MKDons, Shrewsbury and Swindon is RELEGATION form.
We won't go down of course but there is no positive spin on this, it is a dreadful run.
Needs to turn around fast, we are not as good as our last L1 squad but the L1 line up this season is poor and we should be doing way better even with our injuries.
Pratley is not a CB and it has been very obvious for weeks.1 -
He was better in the second half, but positionally was very suspect in the first half. The dangerous free kick he gave away just outside the box (for which he mysteriously again wasn't booked) came when he followed the Plymouth attacker virtually to the half way line before being outrun as the attacker closed in on goalChunes said:
Have to disagree here. Pratley was all over the place.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
And for their 1st goal I've no idea where was when the ball came into the box0 -
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?3 - Sponsored links:
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I like the way he says "We". Still loves Charlton not wet spam.Wheresmeticket? said:Come on Curbs, time for you to come back. You know you want to.3 -
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).4 -
The manager is a key area that needs strengtheningMendonca In Asdas said:Thought that was a shocking performance, lucky to get a point.
No chance of getting promoted without strengthening in key areas.1 -
I've already voiced my concern that Bowyer surely isnt starting Deji because he potentially could be off in January to free up wagescafcfan1990 said:
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).
I think it would be a good question to raise to Lee (@LouisMend?) as to why Deji isnt getting much game time
Of course it could also be down to the fact that Oshilaja isnt doing enough in training compared to Pratley
If you cant do it there, can you honestly be relied upon to produce the required performance when it matters in a game?
3 -
Some players are better trainers than others. It doesn't always equate to performances on the pitch.ForeverAddickted said:
I've already voiced my concern that Bowyer surely isnt starting Deji because he potentially could be off in January to free up wagescafcfan1990 said:
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).
I think it would be a good question to raise to Lee (@LouisMend?) as to why Deji isnt getting much game time
Of course it could also be down to the fact that Oshilaja isnt doing enough in training compared to Pratley
If you cant do it there, can you honestly be relied upon to produce the required performance when it matters in a game?6 -
Fair enough, perhaps we need to know more. If it’s down to training then I’m definitely concerned because that’s quite a few players “not doing enough in training”. For me that blame is with Bows, why can’t he motivate them, particularly as we’re talking about players who were here last season. So much for improving players!ForeverAddickted said:
I've already voiced my concern that Bowyer surely isnt starting Deji because he potentially could be off in January to free up wagescafcfan1990 said:
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).
I think it would be a good question to raise to Lee (@LouisMend?) as to why Deji isnt getting much game time
Of course it could also be down to the fact that Oshilaja isnt doing enough in training compared to Pratley
If you cant do it there, can you honestly be relied upon to produce the required performance when it matters in a game?2 -
Asked that today, typing it up nowForeverAddickted said:
I've already voiced my concern that Bowyer surely isnt starting Deji because he potentially could be off in January to free up wagescafcfan1990 said:
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).
I think it would be a good question to raise to Lee (@LouisMend?) as to why Deji isnt getting much game time
Of course it could also be down to the fact that Oshilaja isnt doing enough in training compared to Pratley
If you cant do it there, can you honestly be relied upon to produce the required performance when it matters in a game?9 -
10 points from 8 games simply isn't good enough especially given how supposedly weak most of our opponents were.
D Plymouth
D Swindon
W Wimbledon
D Shrewsbury
L MK Dons
W Ipswich
L Burton
D Gillingham
We're just very average and disorganised.
6 -
Yeah that is definitely a question to raise, is it the players just not caring enough? - In which case they need to piss off what with the Salary Cap in place as we can afford passengers even less than previouslycafcfan1990 said:
Fair enough, perhaps we need to know more. If it’s down to training then I’m definitely concerned because that’s quite a few players “not doing enough in training”. For me that blame is with Bows, why can’t he motivate them, particularly as we’re talking about players who were here last season. So much for improving players!ForeverAddickted said:
I've already voiced my concern that Bowyer surely isnt starting Deji because he potentially could be off in January to free up wagescafcfan1990 said:
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).
I think it would be a good question to raise to Lee (@LouisMend?) as to why Deji isnt getting much game time
Of course it could also be down to the fact that Oshilaja isnt doing enough in training compared to Pratley
If you cant do it there, can you honestly be relied upon to produce the required performance when it matters in a game?
If it is with Bowyer then yeah thats where he does deserve the criticism
If Mendez can stop being a teasing minx and type quicker then we may well know more1 -
Feels to me like Bowyer is trying to be too clever with his selection and needs to go back to basics. Play players in correct positions and stick to a simple formation. If that doesn't work then maybe we're just not good enough.12
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I feel this too. I think we are part of the problem too, as he is probably too proud to go back to basics in case it proves us right.
The thing is, if he gets his defence right, we will still win the League. If teams are scoring 0 to 1 goals against us, they will generally lose. He can hopefully sort it out in January and we should be up there.
He has definitely shown me that he is nowhere near the manager I thought he was though. I can't remember ever being more disappointed as I thought he was a breath of fresh air when he came in.
He can get us promoted from this league but I'm beginning to think that this is his level.3 -
Agree on passengers. I think for me it’s just pure frustration seeing us playing Pratley with Deji on the bench. We all know we are missing Inniss and Famewo but he’s making himself look stupid. You just about get away with it if you win, you look a fool when it costs you.ForeverAddickted said:
Yeah that is definitely a question to raise, is it the players just not caring enough? - In which case they need to piss off what with the Salary Cap in place as we can afford passengers even less than previouslycafcfan1990 said:
Fair enough, perhaps we need to know more. If it’s down to training then I’m definitely concerned because that’s quite a few players “not doing enough in training”. For me that blame is with Bows, why can’t he motivate them, particularly as we’re talking about players who were here last season. So much for improving players!ForeverAddickted said:
I've already voiced my concern that Bowyer surely isnt starting Deji because he potentially could be off in January to free up wagescafcfan1990 said:
I’m assuming Deji would be better than Pratley because it’s his position. Pratley has filled a gap and done a job for the team but today wasn’t his first below par performance at CB. I’m reluctant to criticise him because he’s playing out of position.ForeverAddickted said:
You see I cannot understand how fans can instantly presume that Oshilaja and Purrington would do bettercafcfan1990 said:
That stroll played a major part in the goal though. If Bowyer doesn’t trust Deji to start a League 1 game there’s something seriously wrong there. He wasn’t particularly good last season but he has plenty of experience at this level and I’m presuming did well enough to catch the eye of Bows and/or Gallen.ForeverAddickted said:
Again though, apart from one brief moment where Pratley went for a Boxing Day stroll he didnt do anything wrongcafcfan1990 said:
Deji is a CB (a CB who Bowyer signed) and yet he thinks Pratley is a better option? That’s just odd, especially alongside Pearce as it’s slow. I do appreciate your optimism but I think Bowyer would have to murder your family for you to consider criticising him.ForeverAddickted said:
Dont worry if we lose when we start both it'll be because Pratley started over OshilajaCallumcafc said:
When Bowyer starts Maddison, people moan that he’s not starting Williams.golfaddick said:
Spot on. Would love to know why.BetterCallSaul said:Left back in midfield. Right back at left back. Centre mid at centre back. Perfectly decent centre back on the bench. Most creative midfielder on the bench. All that against one of the leakiest defences in the league. That is all
Also no good starting your best 2 strikers & then leaving the creative players (Maddison & Morgan) on the bench. We might be in a decent position with a game in hand but we should be so much higher up - probably 2nd. 4 points dropped in the last 2 games against teams that are in bad run of form & who are leaking goals.
When Bowyer starts Williams, people moan that he’s not starting Maddison.
Fans know that Bowyer has only picked the right team when we win, unfortunately they have the hindsight to know if we've won or not
Whereas Bowyer wont have that advantage before picking the team what'll actually happen
Because the opposition will come along with their own game plan!!
And lets not pretend, as even when the team sheet gets announced, the en mass comments will start saying Bowyer has got it wrong, even if we go on to win
You're right calling for Oshilaja but how do you know he's not going to make even more mistakes that are going to be even more costly?
That is why I'm reluctant to moan about the Manager's choices
Because we're able to sit here and complain that one choice was wrong, yet dont know if the other option was worseIf Deji played poorly im hoping the majority of fans would aim the criticism at the player, I certainly would.For me Bows is opening himself up for criticism. I cannot understand how you can defend Matthews playing at LB and Pratley at CB when Deji and Purrington were both available.If it’s true players aren’t training well enough to be picked I am massively concerned to be honest. It’s Lee Bowyers job to motivate this players, both in training and on the pitch. We’re not talking about 18 year olds here either. Last season he repeatedly spoke about effort and it came down to injuries, inexperience and a general lack of quality. I agreed with him and he had my sympathy due to budgets, off the pitch shit etc. This season there has been more criticism with regards to effort and that worries me.
Just want to check that its the same Purrington fans have been slating as being rubbish for the last season and a half, the same Oshilaja everyone thought was playing shit at the start of this season?
If Oshilaja plays against Hull then the fans calling for him to play surely have to take criticism if it goes wrong
Unfortunately that wont happen will it?No I don’t agree the fans should take the criticism. Like I said, Bowyer signed Deji as a CB. Are you not concerned that Bows now seems to think Pratley is a better bet? If that’s the case he’s worthless to the club (for the record I think he’s ok at this level).
I think it would be a good question to raise to Lee (@LouisMend?) as to why Deji isnt getting much game time
Of course it could also be down to the fact that Oshilaja isnt doing enough in training compared to Pratley
If you cant do it there, can you honestly be relied upon to produce the required performance when it matters in a game?
If it is with Bowyer then yeah thats where he does deserve the criticism
If Mendez can stop being a teasing minx and type quicker then we may well know moreEither way I agree with Talal, I think we need to go back to basics.3 -
I genuinely don't think it's about strengthening. It's about good coaching and management with the resources that are already at your disposal.Mendonca In Asdas said:Thought that was a shocking performance, lucky to get a point.
No chance of getting promoted without strengthening in key areas.1 -
Also, put your best crosser/shooter of the ball i.e. Maddison on the damm set pieces!10
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ForeverAddickted said:
Whose fault is it if we play both and still dont win?MuttleyCAFC said:Simple solution. Start them both then.
In a game of chance there are no guarantees but managers need to at least have a philosophy they want to go by.
I don't think it was an absolute turkey today but too many personal mistakes. (Again)
If the players are confused with their roles in the team then that can be down to the manager.
Ideally the players in form start games and Subs come on to make an impact and start the next match if they make a bigger impact than the players they replace.
Having players who struggle to go the distance is making it hard to play with any momentum from one half to the next let alone to play from one match to the next.
At Charlton its the other way round and in some ways that's because Aneke only seems to score when he comes on as sub
and Williams, who did some really good runs today but no end product when he starts.
I want Maddison to be used in an attacking way because he can score goals like he did today. make sure MM keeps getting the ball around the area in a free role. Let the water carriers fetch and carry.
Washington can score with some good strikes but the lovely ball from Marcus on the right ; he made a right Horlicks of.
It''s not the result which decides my players marks, but what each individual does during the whole game or their time on the pitch. Watson was poor for their first goal but did some good blocks during the game.
I saw some positives today but still so far from any consistently with the opposition now realising we are a soft touch at the back.1 -
So Bowyer just doesn't rate Deji then. Pratley has been decent at CB overall in my opinion, but not excellent and certainly not good enough to start over a recognised CB. Deji will probably be one we try to move in over the next few weeks.LouisMend said:1 -
We're not good it's true but our position in and around playoffs not a bad one at this stage. The squad is limited thanks to embargo and EFL cap constraints.2
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Thats fair enough - Pratley did make a mistake though and whilst Bowyer needs a settled back four he also needs to ensure that Oshilaja comes in if these mistakes become habit
Thanks @LouisMend I'll be in touch later in the week with the questions you need to ask Bowyer after the Hull game
4 -
I see Pratley as a useful player as he can certainly play centre half, unlike what I have seen of Gunter. But Pratley as a centre half is somebody you use in an emergency and hope you get away with it. Which you often will because he can do a job there.
Pratley's heading ability is below what a centre half's should be, he goes for everything, which can be fine in midfield, but a centre half needs to pick when he dives in.
For me, Deji should play over Pratley if he is fit. And we know he has a mistake in him. But he is a centre half. There is one position for Pratley or Watson. Pratley if you want to destroy and Watson if you want to build attacks through passing and composure. The game dictates what option you apply. Also, how you want to play. I'd edge towards Pratley, but healthy competition should be our friend here.8
