My loft is very well insulated and we have cavity wall insulation. Will these clowns let me drive through for my next hospital appointment? We should get water cannons out to move them! Saw one of their lot on This Morning arguing with Suzanna Reid and Richard Madeley the other day. Seemed quite dim.
We know direct action has far more of an effect than writing strongly worded letters however its a balancing act. Clearly blocking a main arterial road like the M25 or its junctions whilst the intentions may be honourable is never going to win wider support for your cause.
That said I had no idea about why the government aren't insulating houses I assume this is sheltered accommodation/low income homes or is this a call to arms for the government to subsidise insulation m for everyone
We know direct action has far more of an effect than writing strongly worded letters however its a balancing act. Clearly blocking a main arterial road like the M25 or its junctions whilst the intentions may be honourable is never going to win wider support for your cause.
That said I had no idea about why the government aren't insulating houses I assume this is sheltered accommodation/low income homes or is this a call to arms for the government to subsidise insulation m for everyone
Here in France you can get it done for €1. It ain't a scam, it's a genuine offer from the government and I know quite a few people who've had it done.
Direct action of course can have more of an effect than letters, but I personally don't see the correlation between blocking roads and house insulation. Imo it's the wrong action to take for the thing you are representing.
Nuclear weapons / Parts for dodgy power plants being delivered - Picket the gates, chain yourself to fences and block roads. Among others
Achieve better house insulation - Campaigne / Get a petition started (What is it, 300k signatures and it has to be debated up in Parliament?) / Get yourself educated on the subject and pass info on to people through leaflets etc.
People are saying, "yeah but we are talking about it"; look back through the posts. I can't see anyone talking about the exact reason why they were protesting, eccept "house insulation". Okay, what about it? Pretty certain not one of those protesters know one thing about insulation. Whether it's the materials that are most environmentally friendly, those that are most affecting, or those that are most economical, or which type is all 3? Yet they're sitting there blocking a road for it.....
I lose all respect for protesters when they stop the general public going about their business, the moment it happened for me was a protester being interviewed live on LBC a few years ago at an ongoing Heathrow protest, all planes were stopped etc. When asked by the presenter if he had any sympathy for people who could now possibly not travel to job interviews, sick relatives or a parents funeral, the rather crass response was “depends how important you think your mums funeral is”
Serious amount of what aboutery on here. No change ever happens without disruption. Disruption causes inconvenience. Think of all those poor shop owners whose windows got smashed by the Suffragettes. There is a separate debate to be had about the class privilege of these protestors - if this disruption was being done by a more working class group I can guarantee that the batons would be out and the police would not be holding back. That said, when the petrol tankers had rolling blockades against Blair, the cops were pretty hands off then too. And anyone who thinks the govt are doing anywhere near enough about climate change has not been paying attention. Yeah, I know China and other places need to do more, but we can only do things where we have some influence. And the only government we can currently influence is the British.
Protests, like terrorism are effective only if 'the general public' are inconvenienced or at very worst, suffer terribly. If the protesters stood by the side of the road waving banners and chanting slogans no-one would take a lot of notice, and posts like this with a big response would not be published.
Serious amount of what aboutery on here. No change ever happens without disruption. Disruption causes inconvenience. Think of all those poor shop owners whose windows got smashed by the Suffragettes. There is a separate debate to be had about the class privilege of these protestors - if this disruption was being done by a more working class group I can guarantee that the batons would be out and the police would not be holding back. That said, when the petrol tankers had rolling blockades against Blair, the cops were pretty hands off then too. And anyone who thinks the govt are doing anywhere near enough about climate change has not been paying attention. Yeah, I know China and other places need to do more, but we can only do things where we have some influence. And the only government we can currently influence is the British.
What else can the government do that is achievable in what space of time? So that's achievable in the context of affordability - practicality - effectiveness.
5k views and 210 posts on a football forum which main purpose is to discuss a floundering league one team.
Whether you like it or not (and I tend to feel it's much more counter productive) - I expect those who are protesting will probably consider that the outcome they exactly wanted.
Just don't understand this argument - the majority of people talking about it seem to be slaggin em off, rather than talking about getting their insulation done.
Where is the money and try that on many buildings such as those 150 yrs old. Apart from the loft. Many methods cause damp because buildings need to breath. Mine has air bricks below the damp course like many. They should never be blocked. Dozy demand in many ways.
Technology is a crazy thing! You can insulate around air bricks by cutting the insulation with a saw!!!! Crazy, I know!!
5k views and 210 posts on a football forum which main purpose is to discuss a floundering league one team.
Whether you like it or not (and I tend to feel it's much more counter productive) - I expect those who are protesting will probably consider that the outcome they exactly wanted.
I would say quite the opposite. There is absolutely no debate whatsoever on here about climate change and the need for drastic and speedy action (bar the odd climate change sceptic post)...what there is is 8 pages of people with the hump at their days being significantly disrupted....magnify that across the thousands affected in the past couple of days by this group and the result is that you have jut pissed off and alienated thousands of people....most of whom are already very sympathetic and concerned to the cause and supportive of progressive action.
I very much doubt anyone will be rushing out to get insulation as a result of this. If anything it is an own goal as it gives those in power a narrative to play the cliche "look at those doogooder tree hugger types" and laugh off future policy and action with support for the masses who have a notable history of being manipulated to vote against their best interests particularly in today's media influence/ culture war arena.
Protestors hearts and brains are in the right place but this sort of action wont win the hearts and minds of the public, most of whom are deeply concerned already about the impending climate catastrophe. But this just turns people off and turns them to the same cognitive dissonance that leads to voting against interests in other areas as we've seen over past 30 years or so.
Bang the drum but do it the right way like many of the elements of the XR protests last summer that were peaceful and unintrusive in Trafalgar square and Whitehall for a week and sent a very powerful message and caused many of us to really stop and think, rather than just causing joe public aggro which causes them to not even want to listen to the message no matter how important it is to be heard.
Or form a really appealing and well funded political movement to approach it democratically or a combo of both.
The motorway stuff is all very sixth form student/ Rik out of the young ones and does very little to send the message and other than just subdue it in the abyss of ill feeling it generates and gives the media and elements of those in power the ammunition to ensure that they can continue to be lacklustre.
Hugely important issue that affects all of us and our future generations but the messaging needs a rethink despite obvious best intentions because it ironically appears to be counterproductive to the movement's aims.
Tell that to the peoe who missed medical appointments or were trapped with babies needing to be fed or important deliveries. Heart's and minds in entirely the wrong place .
Sure, I agree and probably should have said hearts in right places rather than also brains in that intentions clearly good but their actions ill thought out and repercussions of them achieving little other than anger or distress people you cite.
5k views and 210 posts on a football forum which main purpose is to discuss a floundering league one team.
Whether you like it or not (and I tend to feel it's much more counter productive) - I expect those who are protesting will probably consider that the outcome they exactly wanted.
I would say quite the opposite. There is absolutely no debate whatsoever on here about climate change and the need for drastic and speedy action (bar the odd climate change sceptic post)...what there is is 8 pages of people with the hump at their days being significantly disrupted....magnify that across the thousands affected in the past couple of days by this group and the result is that you have jut pissed off and alienated thousands of people....most of whom are already very sympathetic and concerned to the cause and supportive of progressive action.
I very much doubt anyone will be rushing out to get insulation as a result of this ...... etc
Hugely important issue that affects all of us and our future generations but the messaging needs a rethink despite obvious best intentions because it ironically appears to be counterproductive to the movement's aims.
We're all discussing it, aren't we?
It's not even about getting people to "support" the cause. Just getting publicity to the cause. This sort of protest has only one aim: to get their protest highlighted by the media.
It becomes a major news story; people discuss on social media = result: public awareness. We're all discussing it, aren't we?
I don't think we are discussing 'it' we're discussing the idiot protesters.
You think that's all?
People have also been discussing insulation, global warming and impact of climate change. It's been in newspapers, television, radio and social media.
Whether you agree with the methods or not, it's achieved what it set out to do: To get awareness of environmental issues in the media.
Serious amount of what aboutery on here. No change ever happens without disruption. Disruption causes inconvenience. Think of all those poor shop owners whose windows got smashed by the Suffragettes. There is a separate debate to be had about the class privilege of these protestors - if this disruption was being done by a more working class group I can guarantee that the batons would be out and the police would not be holding back. That said, when the petrol tankers had rolling blockades against Blair, the cops were pretty hands off then too. And anyone who thinks the govt are doing anywhere near enough about climate change has not been paying attention. Yeah, I know China and other places need to do more, but we can only do things where we have some influence. And the only government we can currently influence is the British.
The suffragettes did a lot worse than just smashing windows!
5k views and 210 posts on a football forum which main purpose is to discuss a floundering league one team.
Whether you like it or not (and I tend to feel it's much more counter productive) - I expect those who are protesting will probably consider that the outcome they exactly wanted.
Just don't understand this argument - the majority of people talking about it seem to be slaggin em off, rather than talking about getting their insulation done.
Where is the money and try that on many buildings such as those 150 yrs old. Apart from the loft. Many methods cause damp because buildings need to breath. Mine has air bricks below the damp course like many. They should never be blocked. Dozy demand in many ways.
Technology is a crazy thing! You can insulate around air bricks by cutting the insulation with a saw!!!! Crazy, I know!!
Yeh! Think of all that hi tech insulated cladding that went up at high rise blocks like Grenfell Tower to improve their U values.
Serious amount of what aboutery on here. No change ever happens without disruption. Disruption causes inconvenience. Think of all those poor shop owners whose windows got smashed by the Suffragettes. There is a separate debate to be had about the class privilege of these protestors - if this disruption was being done by a more working class group I can guarantee that the batons would be out and the police would not be holding back. That said, when the petrol tankers had rolling blockades against Blair, the cops were pretty hands off then too. And anyone who thinks the govt are doing anywhere near enough about climate change has not been paying attention. Yeah, I know China and other places need to do more, but we can only do things where we have some influence. And the only government we can currently influence is the British.
The suffragettes did a lot worse than just smashing windows!
The church in my village was burned down in 1914 by suffragettes, doubtless off their faces on Chardonnay. (A tradition maintained to this very day by the pissed women of Wargrave)
Comments
We know direct action has far more of an effect than writing strongly worded letters however its a balancing act. Clearly blocking a main arterial road like the M25 or its junctions whilst the intentions may be honourable is never going to win wider support for your cause.
That said I had no idea about why the government aren't insulating houses I assume this is sheltered accommodation/low income homes or is this a call to arms for the government to subsidise insulation m for everyone
Direct action of course can have more of an effect than letters, but I personally don't see the correlation between blocking roads and house insulation. Imo it's the wrong action to take for the thing you are representing.
Nuclear weapons / Parts for dodgy power plants being delivered - Picket the gates, chain yourself to fences and block roads. Among others
Achieve better house insulation - Campaigne / Get a petition started (What is it, 300k signatures and it has to be debated up in Parliament?) / Get yourself educated on the subject and pass info on to people through leaflets etc.
People are saying, "yeah but we are talking about it"; look back through the posts. I can't see anyone talking about the exact reason why they were protesting, eccept "house insulation". Okay, what about it? Pretty certain not one of those protesters know one thing about insulation. Whether it's the materials that are most environmentally friendly, those that are most affecting, or those that are most economical, or which type is all 3? Yet they're sitting there blocking a road for it.....
There is a separate debate to be had about the class privilege of these protestors - if this disruption was being done by a more working class group I can guarantee that the batons would be out and the police would not be holding back. That said, when the petrol tankers had rolling blockades against Blair, the cops were pretty hands off then too.
And anyone who thinks the govt are doing anywhere near enough about climate change has not been paying attention. Yeah, I know China and other places need to do more, but we can only do things where we have some influence. And the only government we can currently influence is the British.
Genuine question as I genuinely don't know.
People have also been discussing insulation, global warming and impact of climate change.
It's been in newspapers, television, radio and social media.
Whether you agree with the methods or not, it's achieved what it set out to do:
To get awareness of environmental issues in the media.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffragette_bombing_and_arson_campaign
What's that?.......
“Iceberg! Iceberg!”
”Oh do pipe down, old boy. I’m trying to enjoy the band!”