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England Cricket 2022
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What you have said makes sense. Would bairstow opening and keeping cause him problems?Addick Addict said:Fantastic innings by Pant today but when he was on just 18, Buttler missed a regimental stumping off Moeen that would have made the score 70-4. Pant went on to make 125 not out. Sangakkara was asked by Nasser what he thought of the miss and he said that he felt that Buttler hadn't cleared his mind from thinking as a captain rather than a keeper which was the job at hand. Since he took the job of skipper, Buttler's scores have been 0-4-18-30-4 & 60 and even today's innings was ended somewhat prematurely with a questionable shot.
I now not only believe that Buttler cannot captain, keep and open (as I said before) but I don't think he can successfully captain, keep and be prolific with the bat wherever he is in the order. Something will give in a lot of games and he needs to give the gloves to someone else or relinquish the captaincy. Dhoni was unique in being able to do all three but then he was, habitually, the final batting course and not the main one. Payne panicked at a vital time when trying to do just two main jobs. Sangakkara and McCullum both gave one of them up.
Buttler was honest enough to admit his mistake cost us dear in his post match speech. I hope that he's equally honest enough to admit that the work load, mentally, is just too much. Either Bairstow or Salt should take the gloves out of the two that might be playing or Buttler gives the captaincy to someone else.1 -
or perhaps we give Buttler some time to grown into the role ?1
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First of all thank you to those others who LOL'd my comment above. I'm really appreciative of them because I am well down on LOLs and do worry that I'm not as funny as I am liked. So thank you once again.Todds_right_hook said:
What you have said makes sense. Would bairstow opening and keeping cause him problems?Addick Addict said:Fantastic innings by Pant today but when he was on just 18, Buttler missed a regimental stumping off Moeen that would have made the score 70-4. Pant went on to make 125 not out. Sangakkara was asked by Nasser what he thought of the miss and he said that he felt that Buttler hadn't cleared his mind from thinking as a captain rather than a keeper which was the job at hand. Since he took the job of skipper, Buttler's scores have been 0-4-18-30-4 & 60 and even today's innings was ended somewhat prematurely with a questionable shot.
I now not only believe that Buttler cannot captain, keep and open (as I said before) but I don't think he can successfully captain, keep and be prolific with the bat wherever he is in the order. Something will give in a lot of games and he needs to give the gloves to someone else or relinquish the captaincy. Dhoni was unique in being able to do all three but then he was, habitually, the final batting course and not the main one. Payne panicked at a vital time when trying to do just two main jobs. Sangakkara and McCullum both gave one of them up.
Buttler was honest enough to admit his mistake cost us dear in his post match speech. I hope that he's equally honest enough to admit that the work load, mentally, is just too much. Either Bairstow or Salt should take the gloves out of the two that might be playing or Buttler gives the captaincy to someone else.
@tod@Todds_right_hook I should stress that this is not so much about the results (although his form is linked to them) but how doing all three jobs is so incredibly hard to do and how it might be impacting on Buttler's own performances.
The issue is more the captaincy, how it affects Buttler's performance with the gloves and how the mental strain of doing those two jobs at the same time then, potentially, might impact on his batting. My son who was, during the Covid outbreak, put on standby to keep for the Kent 1st XI had to, on occasions, captain and keep (and even open in the same game) for club and county. He hated doing it because he says the temptation was always to be thinking ahead - of what was happening in the game overall and what to do the next ball or at the end of the over with both field and bowling changes - rather than concentrating on the ball about to be delivered. Sangakkara stated, as I say, that Buttler has to differentiate and separate the two jobs in the field.
Bairstow and Buttler have both successfully opened the batting and kept. They haven't had to skipper too. Therein lies the problem.
Looking forward to those LOLs from others. Can't get enough of them as I say.
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Certainly an idea. Concentration was a definite issue when he kept in Test matches before he was, eventually, dropped so why do you think that he will "grow into the role"?billysboots said:or perhaps we give Buttler some time to grown into the role ?
How long would you give him? Til after the World Cup in three months time and decide then if he should continue?0 -
I think he has a chance of growing into the role as he hasn’t had a run at doing all of the roles so far In his career for any length of time. As far as the concentration goes We aren’t talking a five day test here are we, when he is having to keep all day.As a novice wearing all of the hats surely he can learn from his mistakes and put them right. I am sure the Eoin Morgan didnt get everything right when he took the captaincy on the white ball team over ?With all due respect to your son, if anyone was going to make a success if wearing all of the hats in a match , I would imagine that Jos Buttler with his wealth of international experience would be in a much better position to do so.0
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Certainly you can learn from making the wrong cricketing decisions. Buttler will, probably reflect on whether he should have brought back his main strike bowler, Topley, for example, for one last burst instead of leaving him three short? As Morgan probably did but he didn't have the gloves to worry about too. I'm not so sure that you can get over concentration issues, if it isn't part of your make up in the first place, especially for 300 balls when something is happening the whole time and you have to think about captaincy too. That's almost three and a half hours without a proper break not two hours as it is in Test cricket when he wasn't even full time captain.billysboots said:I think he has a chance of growing into the role as he hasn’t had a run at doing all of the roles so far In his career for any length of time. As far as the concentration goes We aren’t talking a five day test here are we, when he is having to keep all day.As a novice wearing all of the hats surely he can learn from his mistakes and put them right. I am sure the Eoin Morgan didnt get everything right when he took the captaincy on the white ball team over ?With all due respect to your son, if anyone was going to make a success if wearing all of the hats in a match , I would imagine that Jos Buttler with his wealth of international experience would be in a much better position to do so.
And of course I would expect Buttler, with as you say his wealth of experience, to do a better job than my son. But then my son isn't paid hundreds of thousands to do the job and if he misses an easy stumping it isn't going to cost us the World Cup. There is far more pressure and far more to think about too.
Time will tell and as we have three ODIs and three T20Is coming up in the next couple of weeks there will be plenty of opportunity for Buttler to cement his position as captain, keeper and batsman in the team. And for us to win the two series against South Africa as long as the team as a whole puts up a meaningful total for the bowlers to bowl at.0 -
News from the ICC and ECB and their draft proposals.
The proposal for at least the next four years is that international cricket will, in the main, be played in school term time
The Hundred will get three weeks right in the middle of the summer hols (August) with the England centrally contracted players being released for this as opposed to the smaller window this season for them to do so
By the end of the five year cycle the IPL will expand to 92 matches
Future tours programme will be dominated by global tournaments — there will be either a Champions Trophy, a 50-over World Cup or a T20 World Cup every year, while there will be a World Test Championship final every other year, as there is now. In 2024, a T20 World Cup will take place in West Indies and the United States in June — during the English summer.
England will play 42 Test matches across the five-year period, more than any other country, plus 44 one-day internationals and 52 T20s. However, they will not play a Test series in the Caribbean in this cycle — and until 2028 at the earliest — although there will be two short white-ball tours to the West Indies.
England’s proposed schedule: 2023-2027
2023
June/July Ashes series, five Tests. September Three ODIs, five T20s v New Zealand; 3 ODIs v Ireland. Oct-Nov World Cup — India. December Eight limited-overs matches v West Indies.2024
Jan/Feb Five Tests in India. May Three T20s v Pakistan. June T20 World Cup (West Indies/US) July Three home Tests v West Indies. Sept Three Tests v Sri Lanka. September Eight limited overs matches v Australia. October Three away Tests v Pakistan (away). Nov-Dec Three away Tests v New Zealand.2025
Jan-Feb Eight limited overs matches in India. Feb-March ICC Champions Trophy (Pakistan). June Three home ODIs v West Indies. June World Test Championship final. Jun-July Five home Tests v India. September Three ODIs, three T20s v South Africa, three T20s v West Indies. Oct-Nov Three ODIs, three T20s in New Zealand. Nov-Jan Five Tests v Australia.2026
January Three ODIs, three T20s in Sri Lanka. Feb T20 World Cup in India and Sri Lanka. June Three home Tests v New Zealand. July Three ODIs, five T20s v India. Aug-Sep Three home Tests v Pakistan. September Six limited overs matches v Sri Lanka. Oct-Nov Three ODIs, three T20s in Pakistan; three ODIs, three T20s in Australia. Dec-Feb Three Tests, three ODIs, three T20s in South Africa.2027
February Two Tests v Bangladesh0 -
I thought at the time .. Pant's on Fire !!1
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Have I read this right in September 2024 England will play on 23 of the 31 days of the month? That's mental.1
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That looks like the case though, by then, there will probably only be two or three who play Test and white ball and they will be rested accordingly. But it is a reflection of how the IPL which intrudes into April, May and some of June and the Hundred means that everything has to be shunted and truncated to accommodate those two.Cafc43v3r said:Have I read this right in September 2024 England will play on 23 of the 31 days of the month? That's mental.0 - Sponsored links:
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Three Tests in September against Sri Lanka will be a tough sell commercially. And why EIGHT ODIs against Australia?Cafc43v3r said:Have I read this right in September 2024 England will play on 23 of the 31 days of the month? That's mental.0 -
Yes they don't last for 5 days, but captaining white ball cricket is really intensive, especially T20s where you don't give bowlers decent spells where things can settle into a rhythm. Often bowlers will have 1 over spells.0
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Stokes retires from ODIs. Sensible decision.1
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Is it 8 ODI's or a mixture of that and T20s? Possibly 3 and 5?killerandflash said:
Three Tests in September against Sri Lanka will be a tough sell commercially. And why EIGHT ODIs against Australia?Cafc43v3r said:Have I read this right in September 2024 England will play on 23 of the 31 days of the month? That's mental.1 -
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His body absolutely cannot handle playing all 3 formats. Hain, Salt, Vince, Malan, Smeed & Banton all could do a job so plenty of options thereAddick Addict said:Stokes retires from ODIs. Sensible decision.1 -
Could potentially open the door to Hales coming back? Although I doubt it0
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It's not only 3 formats, he does 3 things in 3 formats as well. I am not surprised but maybe a bit about the timing, its not the ideal time in the cycle to have to rebuild the white ball team. Although with the t20 and ODI world cup and the champions 🏆 is there ever a good time?Pelling1993 said:
His body absolutely cannot handle playing all 3 formats. Hain, Salt, Vince, Malan, Smeed & Banton all could do a job so plenty of options thereAddick Addict said:Stokes retires from ODIs. Sensible decision.1 -
An interesting choice to continue with T20s for England rather than ODIs. Easier on the body of course0
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I missed that he will continue playing t20s. I assume that might well be reviewed after the world cup in the autumn?killerandflash said:An interesting choice to continue with T20s for England rather than ODIs. Easier on the body of course1 - Sponsored links:
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Salt would be a good option because he could open which would then allow Bairstow to drop down the order and do the role that he does in both Tests and T20s for England. And if Buttler does decide to give up the gloves to concentrate on captaincy and batting then we have two keeping options in the side with Bairstow the most obvious one to do it by virtue of his batting position.1
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He hasn't bowled much recently, but we would miss his bowling option if we play a specialist batsman or a keeper in his place1
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any young all-rounders coming through that could take stokes' place?0
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Right call but absolutely gutted at the same time.2
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Darren Stevenskentaddick said:any young all-rounders coming through that could take stokes' place?4 -
That's something unique about English cricket, partially due to central contracts and also due to the interest in Test cricket we have, that many players, especially bowlers and all rounders will retire from white ball cricket to specialise in red ball cricket.Cafc43v3r said:
I missed that he will continue playing t20s. I assume that might well be reviewed after the world cup in the autumn?killerandflash said:An interesting choice to continue with T20s for England rather than ODIs. Easier on the body of course
You couldn't imagine if Broad or Anderson staying on past their mid 30s just playing Test cricket, rather than becoming T20 specialists like the likes of Malinga and Brett Lee in their later years.1 -
Even more mental actually:Cafc43v3r said:Have I read this right in September 2024 England will play on 23 of the 31 days of the month? That's mental.
”30 days hath September.”
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yep, another reason why we should keep central contracts at all costs.killerandflash said:
That's something unique about English cricket, partially due to central contracts and also due to the interest in Test cricket we have, that many players, especially bowlers and all rounders will retire from white ball cricket to specialise in red ball cricket.Cafc43v3r said:
I missed that he will continue playing t20s. I assume that might well be reviewed after the world cup in the autumn?killerandflash said:An interesting choice to continue with T20s for England rather than ODIs. Easier on the body of course
You couldn't imagine if Broad or Anderson staying on past their mid 30s just playing Test cricket, rather than becoming T20 specialists like the likes of Malinga and Brett Lee in their later years.0 -
Agreed. We would have to make a decision as to whether we play someone like Sam Curran for example if we do want that fourth seamer instead of Stokes. The other option if we go down the extra batsman route is to play two from Moeen/Livingstone/a Sam Curran type all rounder depending on the pitch. Though if everyone is fit then three strike bowlers of say Archer, Wood and Topley plus the spin of Rashid would mean that in normal circumstances we would only need to find 10 overs from Moeen and Livingstone.killerandflash said:He hasn't bowled much recently, but we would miss his bowling option if we play a specialist batsman or a keeper in his place0 -
Dont forget about Woakes who was the leader of this attack until v recently.Addick Addict said:
Agreed. We would have to make a decision as to whether we play someone like Sam Curran for example if we do want that fourth seamer instead of Stokes. The other option if we go down the extra batsman route is to play two from Moeen/Livingstone/a Sam Curran type all rounder depending on the pitch. Though if everyone is fit then three strike bowlers of say Archer, Wood and Topley plus the spin of Rashid would mean that in normal circumstances we would only need to find 10 overs from Moeen and Livingstone.killerandflash said:He hasn't bowled much recently, but we would miss his bowling option if we play a specialist batsman or a keeper in his place3
